Should Afro-Asiatic be disbanded?

[Prince Abubu]

I find the languages so disparate that they no longer bear any relationship with one another. Compare Somali and Hebrew, for instance. They share no grammatical or etymological link whatsoever. Indonesian and Tagalog or Spanish and Hindi have more connection. Even if AA is a legitimate grouping, it seems the languages separated so long ago, they can no longer be really called AA.

Just look at Hebrew and Arabic, for comparison.


Now compare the them to Somali words (ones that aren't Arabic loanwords).

 

[SOMALIKNIGHT]

Somali language is similar to the extinct Egyptian language which is why Somali is part of the Afro-Asiatic language family.

 

[Apollo]

Most languages within the same broader language family are not mutually intelligible. These classifications are merely for historical and anthropological reasons.

If common descent is proven linguistically then it is a language family. It doesn't matter how different these languages are.

Ironically, due to the massive influence of Arabic on most Afro-Asiatic languages (Berber, Hausa, Somali etc), they are actually converging back again rather than diverging.

 

[Prince Abubu]

Most languages within the same broader language family are not mutually intelligible. These classifications are merely for historical and anthropological reasons.

If common descent is proven linguistically then it is a language family. It doesn't matter how different these languages are.

Ironically, due to the massive influence of Arabic on most Afro-Asiatic languages (Berber, Hausa, Somali etc), they are actually converging back again rather than diverging.

They don't have to be mutually intelligible, otherwise they would just be dialects of the same language, rather than different languages. But there has to be some kind of grammatical and etymological link. For instance, the Arabic word for 'Star' is 'Najm'. The Somali word is 'Xiddig'. Now compare the English word 'Star' to the Hindi word 'tara' or Persian 'Sitareh'.

Loanwords don't count since they are just borrowing words from another language.

 

[Apollo]

They don't have to be mutually intelligible, otherwise they would just be dialects of the same language, rather than different languages. But there has to be some kind of grammatical and etymological link. For instance, the Arabic word for 'Star' is 'Najm'. The Somali word is 'Xiddig'. Now compare the English word 'Star' to the Hindi word 'tara' or Persian 'Sitareh'.

Loanwords don't count since they are just borrowing words from another language.

You seem like a lazy monolingual Anglophone who expects that language groupings suggest a high degree of intelligibility. Most of these language groupings are based on a handful of shared core vocab (it may sound completely different, but root consonants intact).

Also, the spread of Indo-European happened around the Bronze Age. The spread of Afro-Asiatic was around the early Neolithic.

Afro-Asiatic is a solid language family. Descent has been proven. Intelligibility has zero weight in this.

 

[Prince Abubu]

You seem like a lazy monolingual Anglophone who expects that language groupings suggest a high degree of intelligibility. Most of these language groupings are based on a handful of shared core vocab (it may sound completely different, but root consonants intact).

Also, the spread of Indo-European happened around the Bronze Age. The spread of Afro-Asiatic was around the early Neolithic.

Afro-Asiatic is a solid language family. Descent has been proven. Intelligibility has zero weight in this.

I think you don't get what I'm saying. I'm not saying that Afro-Asiatic languages have to resemble on another 100%. Nor am I saying it should be as obvious as the Indo-European languages. I'm saying that AA is so divergent, it might as well not be considered a language family anymore. It is the most divergent group, after Altaic (which is so divergent it's not even considered a language family anymore). Cushitic, for instance, should be treated like Japonic or Korean languages, i.e. language isolate that shares some characteristics with other AA languages. If AA was so solid, why is there so much disagreement over Omotic? You seem to hold old views on language groupings from 50-60 years ago.

 

[Apollo]

I think you don't get what I'm saying. I'm not saying that Afro-Asiatic languages have to resemble on another 100%. Nor am I saying it should be as obvious as the Indo-European languages. I'm saying that AA is so divergent, it might as well not be considered a language family anymore. It is the most divergent group, after Altaic (which is so divergent it's not even considered a language family anymore). Cushitic, for instance, should be treated like Japonic or Korean languages, i.e. language isolate that shares some characteristics with other AA languages. If AA was so solid, why is there so much disagreement over Omotic? You seem to hold old views on language groupings from 50-60 years ago.

Those Ching-Chong language groupings are bullshit. I looked into it and it seems like political nonsense caused the many groups, especially because of work done by universities in Korea, China and Japan.

Altaic seems legit despite the butthurt Japanese.

Sino-Tibetan, Austronesian, and Austroasiatic are likely one macro-group. They all seem to have haplogroup O as well..

All Native American languages are probably also just one macro-group (except for the Na-Dene languages - later Siberian migrants into the Americas).

 

[Prince Abubu]

Those Ching-Chong language groupings are bullshit. I looked into it and it seems like political nonsense caused the many groups, especially because of work done by universities in Korea, China and Japan.

Altaic seems legit despite the butthurt Japanese.

Are you saying Altaic is legit, and linguists from east East Asia are denying it out if political/racial tensions? Any proof?

Sino-Tibetan, Austronesian, and Austroasiatic are likely one macro-group. They all seem to have haplogroup O as well..

All Native American languages are probably also just one macro-group (except for the Na-Dene languages - later Siberian migrants into the Americas).

I think the first paragraph is a very bold statement. Also, DNA haplogroups don't always correspond to linguistic groups. An ethnic group can have many haplogroup origins. Just look at Ethiopia, most belong to E3b, J, T, A etc.

Btw, I looked at Amharic words and there's a surprising amount of Cushitic words in that language. Very sneaky.

 

[Apollo]

Are you saying Altaic is legit, and linguists from east East Asia are denying it out if political/racial tensions? Any proof?



I think the first paragraph is a very bold statement. Also, DNA haplogroups don't always correspond to linguistic groups. An ethnic group can have many haplogroup origins. Just look at Ethiopia, most belong to E3b, J, T, A etc.

Btw, I looked at Amharic words and there's a surprising amount of Cushitic words in that language. Very sneaky.

The original Afro-Asiatic population was high in haplogroup E1b1b1. This is absolutely an established fact, especially with the Natufian and Iberomaurusian data.

E1b1b1c-M123 spread Semitic from Egypt to the Levant and taught Barbarian J's and T's to speak Semitic.

As for Chadic. Their R1b comes from Mesolithic Italians who sneaked into Libya and picked up an Afro-Asiatic dialect and then fucked Nilotes too much to the point of becoming them autosomally.

 

[Jinchuriki]

I find the languages so disparate that they no longer bear any relationship with one another. Compare Somali and Hebrew, for instance. They share no grammatical or etymological link whatsoever. Indonesian and Tagalog or Spanish and Hindi have more connection. Even if AA is a legitimate grouping, it seems the languages separated so long ago, they can no longer be really called AA.

Just look at Hebrew and Arabic, for comparison.


Now compare the them to Somali words (ones that aren't Arabic loanwords).

Words are supposed to cognate.

In PIE
the word for horse is hwekos
in Greek its hippos
in Latin its Equus
In Sanskrit its Ashva
in Persian its Ashba

They don't sound similar that's how languages change.

In AA lets take a word "Place"
Arabic: Makan
Somali: Meel
Hebrew:Mkvm
Akkadian:Ashru
Aramiac:AeiSYM
Oromo: Kaaya
Afar:Araca

Words cognate, literally certain words in AA languages can be pass down to other languages that are not even related.

 

[Apollo]

Words are supposed to cognate.

In PIE
the word for horse is hwekos
in Greek its hippos
in Latin its Equus
In Sanskrit its Ashva
in Persian its Ashba

They don't sound similar that's how languages change.

In AA lets take a word "Place"
Arabic: Makan
Somali: Meel
Hebrew:Mkvm
Akkadian:Ashru
Aramiac:AeiSYM
Oromo: Kaaya
Afar:Araca

Words cognate, literally certain words in AA languages can be pass down to other languages that are not even related.

The Israeli Parliament is called the Knesset.

Whenever I hear it on the news I think of the word Kaniisad in Somali.

 

[Jinchuriki]

Btw, I looked at Amharic words and there's a surprising amount of Cushitic words in that language. Very sneaky.

That was due was due to the SA moving into Ethiopia an assimilated with the Agaw and Oromo and even sidamo.

 

[Prince Abubu]

Words are supposed to cognate.

In PIE
the word for horse is hwekos
in Greek its hippos
in Latin its Equus
In Sanskrit its Ashva
in Persian its Ashba

They don't sound similar that's how languages change.

In AA lets take a word "Place"
Arabic: Makan
Somali: Meel
Hebrew:Mkvm
Akkadian:Ashru
Aramiac:AeiSYM
Oromo: Kaaya
Afar:Araca

Words cognate, literally certain words in AA languages can be pass down to other languages that are not even related.

I know they don't sound the same. Even words that are the same can be spoken differently e.g. Denmark is Danmårk which in English literally means "Dane-March" i.e. the boundary of the Dane.

 

[Jinchuriki]

The Israeli Parliament is called the Knesset.

Whenever I hear it on the news I think of the word Kaniisad in Somali.

The Israeli parliament is a Jewish kanisaad.

 

[Jinchuriki]

I know they don't sound the same. Even words that are the same can be spoken differently e.g. Denmark is Danmårk which in English literally means "Dane-March" i.e. the boundary of the Dane.

Af Somali is going through a semtification process

 

[Prince Abubu]

The Israeli Parliament is called the Knesset.

Whenever I hear it on the news I think of the word Kaniisad in Somali.

Knesset is actually related to the word Kaniisad which comes from the Arabic word for church. The Semitic word actually means "place of meeting".

 

[Apollo]

Af Somali is going through a semtification process

Arabic is the Latin/Greek of the Afro-Asiatic world.

 

[Prince Abubu]

Af Somali is going through a semtification process

The funniest word in Somali is the name Kaahin, which means priest in Arabic and is etymologically related to the Hebrew name "Cohen".

 

[Apollo]

The funniest word in Somali is the name Kaahin, which means priest in Arabic and is etymologically related to the Hebrew name "Cohen".

Shlomo Kaahin Buurdahab.

Buursonkor (hint: FB CEO).

 

[Prince Abubu]

That was due was due to the SA moving into Ethiopia an assimilated with the Agaw and Oromo and even sidamo.

It would be interesting to see just how much of Amharic is still Cushitic. I think one of the Xabashi forumers on here had a dictionary on Ge'ez and showed some words if Cushitic origin.

Here it is, I think:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=WqkbGRnoSncC&printsec=frontcover&dq=geez+dictionary&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjs3dmBopzdAhULLsAKHU1dB4MQ6AEIKDAB#v=onepage&q=geez dictionary&f=false

Just looking at the first page and Ive already found a couple of Somali words "Bagga" means good, "3agr" means feet and "abar" meaning dry correspond to Somali Baga "good", "cago" means feet and "Abaar" meaing drought.