Why isn’t PL leaving?

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

If I was Hawiye, I wouldn't care about Centralism either. Because let's face it, Hawiye people and businesses are focused on Mogadishu. Maybe it suits them to live under HSM's nepotistic family. To each their own!

Why do we have to be forced together like some conjoined, bipolar twin.

I'd rather live like the Arab states, and have security and trade pacts. Like a Somali 'Nato', but different countries. We even have different dialects like the Arabs, and historically Majeerteenia was a seperate kingdom. We love our freedom, some of you daydream about being under a Centralised militarised dictatorship.

 

[Zak12]

Djibouti is a foreign army base.
I am from DDSI myself, don't even get me started on that place.
And for all of NFD's development, it's still under foreign occupation.

The real issue you have with Puntland is qabyaalad. I don't mind it, just be upfront with it, the feeling is mutual.

Warya don't be dumb. The places I listed are far better than your clan state. No one cares about "foreign occupation" or bases when you live a much better life than other Somalis. By your logic PL is better than Japan or South Korea since those places are under American control.

I don't have any problems with Puntland so you are barking up the wrong tree. I just fine it funny how northerners how this weird superiority complex over being slightly better than the south.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Warya don't be dumb. The places I listed are far better than your clan state. No one cares about "foreign occupation" or bases when you live a much better life than other Somalis. By your logic PL is better than Japan or South Korea since those places are under American control.

I don't have any problems with Puntland so you are barking up the wrong tree. I just fine it funny how northerners how this weird superiority complex over being slightly better than the south.

Everywhere in Somalia is a 'clan state', especially Mogadishu.

It's not a 'superiority complex', the North-East is more peaceful and developed, not by accident, but because thousands died to make it that way. You guys have to sacrifice thousands to achieve the same thing. You should volunteer yourself, seeing as you claim to be patriotic.

 

[Zak12]

Everywhere in Somalia is a 'clan state', especially Mogadishu.

It's not a 'superiority' complex, the North-East is more peaceful and developed, not by accident, but because thousands died to make it that way. You guys have to sacrifice thousands to achieve the same thing. You should volunteer yourself, seeing as you claim to be patriotic.

Northeast is peaceful because it wasn't the area where the civil war started hence my previous post about centralism being bad. You guys also don't border Al Shabab's headquarters or main areas of operation, its easier to maintain peace when the south is basically a buffer zone against terrorism.

 

[Reformed J]

If I was Hawiye, I wouldn't care about Centralism either. Because let's face it, Hawiye people and businesses are focused on Mogadishu. Maybe it suits them to live under HSM's nepotistic family. To each their own!

Why do we have to be forced together like some conjoined, bipolar twin.

I'd rather live like the Arab states, and have security and trade pacts. Like a Somali 'Nato', but different countries. We even have different dialects like the Arabs, and historically Majeerteenia was a seperate kingdom. We love our freedom, some of you daydream about being under a Centralised militarised dictatorship.

Thankfully many are against him like Khayre, Sheikh Sharif, and AAW. They realize the whole issue is HSM tryna grab power by centralising the country beyond what the provisional constitution has provisioned; in order to enrich himself and associates. Somalia can only work as a decentralized confederation where most of the power is vested in each FMS doing their own thing, as SL and PL have been doing.

 

[ImAi]

I think I'm starting to believe the idea that Somalis suffer from main character syndrome because nothing else explains this silly desire to wanting to rule over their own little clan state. The world would never entertain the idea that Somalia should balkanise into multiple countries. There are countries with 10x the diversity and population of Somalia that are incapable of splitting into multiple countries yet Somalis think they can do it lmao.

7+ little Somalias that all have voting power in the UN is a fantasy befitting only the most khat ridden qabilist.

I’m not advocating for secession I’m just worried of where we are heading. I just see federalism with a central gov having slightly higher power is better than a complete centralism. Isn’t centralism what brought us here today? And we are definitely more qabilist than we were in the 60s/70s. How willl you assure that the next president that will have full control won’t be a full blown qabilist and start marginalizing X qabil?

 

[Zak12]

I’m not advocating for secession I’m just worried of where we are heading. I just see federalism with a central gov having slightly higher power is better than a complete centralism. Isn’t centralism what brought us here today? And we are definitely more qabilist than we were in the 60s/70s. How willl you assure that the next president that will have full control won’t be a full blown qabilist and start marginalizing X qabil?

Yep you are right. Centralism is what caused this mess in the first place. Its just hard to reconcile my dislike of FGS with my pro union stance. I wish there was a third option.

 

[Angelina]

Lol all of this is a classic case of my toolo is better than your toolo. Also, of course Xamar is going to be less peaceful than other parts since that is where the war broke out and where all the power was based in during the time of SB and before.

Anyways Reer Puntland can’t be delusional. It’s still a very poor and underdeveloped region and Xamar despite years of Kharxiis is leagues ahead of it, as is Hargesia.

Btw, I’m someone who is all for Federalism and if regions want to be independent, so be it. But don’t yap on like your areas have anything going for them.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Northeast is peaceful because it wasn't the area where the civil war started hence my previous post about centralism being bad. You guys also don't border Al Shabab's headquarters or main areas of operation, its easier to maintain peace when the south is basically a buffer zone against terrorism.

False.

Puntland was attacked numerous times during the civil war, starting with USC who attacked Galkacyo at night in the 90s. Thereafter, Hawiye "Islamists" attacked in the 1990s. From the 90s up to 2016, Hawiye were attacking Puntland. In addition, AlShabab tried to capture our land multiple times, even invading the coast from two different locations.

Puntland just manages to keep itself safe, despite all the attempts to destabilise us.

Please try to do some basic reading before making commentary.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Lol all of this is a classic case of my toolo is better than your toolo. Also, of course Xamar is going to be less peaceful than other parts since that is where the war broke out and where all the power was based in during the time of SB.

Anyways Reer Puntland can’t be delusional. It’s still a very poor and underdeveloped region and Xamar despite years of Kharxiis is leagues ahead of it, as is Hargesia.

Btw, I’m someone who is all for Federalism and if regions want to be independent, so be it. But don’t yap on like your areas have anything going for them.

LOL

Puntland was attacked numerous times during the civil war and after it. It was just two years ago, when a major AlShabab group was captured in Galkacyo.

Puntland is self-sufficient and safe, yes, we have the right to be proud of that. And we have the right to tell people from occupied regions to focus on their own affairs, as they are on the verge of becoming a UN trusteeship.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Thankfully many are against him like Khayre, Sheikh Sharif, and AAW. They realize the whole issue is HSM tryna grab power by centralising the country beyond what the provisional constitution has provisioned; in order to enrich himself and associates. Somalia can only work as a decentralized confederation where most of the power is vested in each FMS doing their own thing, as SL and PL have been doing.

I wish the Hawiye opposition luck in trying to curtail the psychopaths among them.

 

[Angelina]

False.

Puntland was attacked numerous times during the civil war, starting with USC who attacked Galkacyo at night in the 90s. Thereafter, Hawiye "Islamists" attacked in the 1990s. From the 90s up to 2016, Hawiye were attacking Puntland. In addition, AlShabab tried to capture our land multiple times, even invading the coast from two different locations.

Puntland just manages to keep itself safe, despite all the attempts to destabilise us.

Please try to do some basic reading before making commentary.

Many of the Alshaydaan belong to various tribes. In fact one of their leaders Gadooni was an Isaaq man. They even had foreign Militias as well. Also, a lot of their foot soldiers belong to langaab qabils.

 

[ImAi]

You are basically an expert I dont know why you keep saying ur not an expert... a little sus

Also I want to say that instead of seperating, the question should be if the government needs to be restarted. I dont know about Hassan Sheikh but Im pretty sure that guy isnt even in charge of things. Somalia is truly finished... Something big needs to happen.... Im labeling it the Big One....

The Big One will be happening any second now.

Tbh I dont even care if Puntland seperates, I dont see somalia getting any worse then it is now Its truly over everyone finished notta Nothing

Hahahaha I’m not but I’ve been reading a lot the past couple of months, wish I didn’t because now the thought of the country becoming even worse lives in the back of my head.

and yes I too feel like hassan is taking orders from someone else, that’s why his actions regarding what’s happening is confusing. He seems to be against it but he can’t pull the plug of cutting ties, maybe his masters are holding him back. Or his being diplomatic idk

 

[Angelina]

LOL

Puntland is self-sufficient and safe, yes, we have the right to be proud of that. And we have the right to tell people from occupied regions to focus on their own affairs, as they are on the verge of becoming a UN trusteeship.

Yes, you do that. You’re talking to someone who is very okay with Federalism and independence. But let’s be real, the impact of the war didn’t effect PL the way it did the capital which is where the war broke out. That is where the horrors were at an all time high due the fact that the wealth and the powers were concentrated in Xamar.

Pl isn’t any better. It’s a third world region with a lot of poverty relying on aid and remittance like anywhere else. Your family fled there the same way many from so called occupied regions did. Let’s be a bit humble.Also, When Abdullahi Yusuf was president. The South was probably at its worst.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Many of the Alshaydaan belong to various tribes. In fact one of their leaders Gadooni was an Isaaq man. They even had foreign Militias as well. Also, a lot of their foot soldiers belong to langaab qabils.

The issue is not that AlShabab is one tribe, the issue is that tribes from South-Central Somalia are too focused on fighting each other, instead of uniting against common-enemies; AlShabab and the need for foreign forces.

 

[Zak12]

False.

Puntland was attacked numerous times during the civil war, starting with USC who attacked Galkacyo at night in the 90s. Thereafter, Hawiye "Islamists" attacked in the 1990s. From the 90s up to 2016, Hawiye were attacking Puntland. In addition, AlShabab tried to capture our land multiple times, even invading the coast from two different locations.

Puntland just manages to keep itself safe, despite all the attempts to destabilise us.

Please try to do some basic reading before making commentary.

I never said PL was never attacked or never faced any threats, all Somali clans did. Its just the south has a much harder time due to being the ground zero where the war started as well as the place Al Shabab was born from. If Garowe or Hargeisa was the capital of Somalia before the civil war then the north would face the same issues the south is going through.

 

[Angelina]

The issue is not that AlShabab is one tribe, the issue is that tribes from South-Central Somalia are too focused on fighting each other, instead of uniting against common-enemies; AlShabab and the need for foreign forces.

Sis, the infighting isn’t as bad as people think it is. There has been tribal fighting in many parts of the Somali peninsula. From the Lasanood situation to various other issues. The biggest threat and those causing chaos have been Al shaydaan rather than qabil wars, especially in the Banadir region.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Yes, you do that. You’re talking to someone who is very okay with Federalism and independence. But let’s be real, the impact of the war didn’t effect PL the way it did the capital which is where the war broke out. That is where the horrors were at an all time high due the fact that the wealth and the powers were concentrated in Xamar.

Pl isn’t any better. It’s a third world region with a lot of poverty relying on aid and remittance like anywhere else. Your family fled there the same way many from so called occupied regions did. Let’s be a bit humble.

First of all, my family did not flee Puntland, we had to flee Mogadishu, just like all Daarood people who wanted to keep their lives, this was in 1991, before Puntland even existed. Puntland was created in 1998, as a response to this, as we needed a homeland, since we were not allowed to live in Mogadishu anymore.

In addition, USC troops, chased our people to Kismaayo and to Puntland, because they wanted to expand themselves, the same way they expanded into minority regions (Barawa, Marka etc,) which they occupy till this day. On top of fighting off USC, ICU and other criminal groups, we have been forced to host thousands of Somalis from South Somalia, who are fleeing conflict.

As for Puntland's economy, I never said that we are rich, but we are developing, and we are at the stage that our tax money is being used to build infrastructure.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Sis, the infighting isn’t as bad as people think it is. There has been tribal fighting in many parts of the Somali peninsula. From the Lasanood situation to various other issues. The biggest threat and those causing chaos have been Al shaydaan rather than qabil wars, especially in the Banadir region.

What I would like to see, is what Xawaadle have been doing, organising and freeing their land from Alshabab. They have tried their best, their neighbours need to emulate them.

 

[Angelina]

I never said PL was never attacked or never faced any threats, all Somali clans did. Its just the south has a much harder time due to being the ground zero where the war started as well as the place Al Shabab was born from. If Garowe or Hargeisa was the capital of Somalia before the civil war then the north would face the same issues the south is going through.

That is my point. You can’t compare a place that was the seat of power, wealth and the list continues which was also a place in which the war first broke out to a place that wasn’t even that developed during the time of SB and many people who were MJ ended up running to for a safe haven. It was hardly impacted.