Map and classification of the Omo-Tana languages (the language group Somali is in), OC (Revised)

[Idilinaa]

I think my skepticism comes from the fact that If you look at the bulk of this list it becomes obvious that most of these lanaguges he's comparing in the omo-tana stuff are basically lamaguges that are right next to each other or would have been the source of slaves that are working in the jubba valley.


View attachment 376657



If you look at this picture and imagine the pre-oromo expansion range of these lanaguges then theyre basically the southern Ethiopia region which one of the prime sources of slaves .
View attachment 376658

I don’t agree with the Omo-Tana classification. There’s really no such thing as an “Omo-Tana language group” , these are simply closely related languages and dialects that branched off from a common source. Linguists such as M. Nuuh Ali and others have attributed the differences among them primarily to ecological separation and social interaction patterns that shaped their development over time.


The idea of a Southern Somali or Southern Ethiopian origin also makes little sense. It relies too heavily on the “least moves principle,” which assumes that the area with the greatest linguistic diversity must be the point of origin. However, this principle doesn’t hold true for many languages, Somali included.

As for the claim that slavery influenced dialect formation. I find that unconvincing as well. Some of the largest slave owners historically were Northern Somali speakers, not Southerners.

When people are adopted or assimilated into another community, they generally take on the language and dialect of that group; they don’t reshape or alter it significantly.

 

[Zak12]

which assumes that the area with the greatest linguistic diversity must be the point of origin.

That is a good point. For example its like claiming Semitic languages originated from Ethiopia as that branch is very diverse in that country.

Personally, I think the mere fact that Proto-Somalis had words for camel and used them is proof alone that they couldn't have come from the south. Not only are both that animal and the word geel itself heavily rooted to northern Somalia's environment, the only reason proto-Somalis managed to inhabit to much territory is because of camels.

 

[Idilinaa]

That is a good point. For example its like claiming Semitic languages originated from Ethiopia as that branch is very diverse in that country.

Personally, I think the mere fact that Proto-Somalis had words for camel and used them is proof alone that they couldn't have come from the south. Not only are both that animal and the word geel itself heavily rooted to northern Somalia's environment, the only reason proto-Somalis managed to inhabit to much territory is because of camels.

Very true.

When it comes to discussions about Somalis, it’s important to remember that many of the most popular narratives about our language, economy, or history often overlook basic common sense and contradict available evidence, largely due to bias. In other cases, people reach hasty conclusions based on insufficient data, rather than reserving judgment until more reliable information is available.

 

[Midas]

Very true.
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View attachment 376696


When it comes to discussions about Somalis, it’s important to remember that many of the most popular narratives about our language, economy, or history often overlook basic common sense and contradict available evidence, largely due to bias. In other cases, people reach hasty conclusions based on insufficient data, rather than reserving judgment until more reliable information is available.

The fundamental underpinning narrative about somali history is that were newcomers and that everything about us must have some external source.

The biggest problem with all the theories on somali migrations into the horn is that we have no evidence for somalis mixing with another pouplation. Even the yammnya who were the first indo-europeans who basically expanded all over Europe and due to a combination of disease and warfare were able to completely replace the earlier pouplations in Northern europe still show huge amounts of non-indoeuropean ancestry


But somalis somehow show no evidence of this.

 

[Idilinaa]

The fundamental underpinning narrative about somali history is that were newcomers and that everything about us must have some external source.

The biggest problem with all the theories on somali migrations into the horn is that we have no evidence for somalis mixing with another pouplation. Even the yammnya who were the first indo-europeans who basically expanded all over Europe and due to a combination of disease and warfare were able to completely replace the earlier pouplations in Northern europe still show huge amounts of non-indoeuropean ancestry


But somalis somehow show no evidence of this.

There is also no material and archeological evidence left behind to support that particular Somali migration theory, that they are new comers. Nor any substratum linguistically either of any other group pre-dating us in our current homeland.

As Herbert Lewis and Said Shidad pointed out while examining the textual records from ancient period to our modern era, the descriptions points to a basic population continuity.

 

[Midas]

There is also no material and archeological evidence left behind to support that particular Somali migration theory, that they are new comers. Nor any substratum linguistically either of any other group pre-dating us in our current homeland.

As Herbert Lewis and Said Shidad pointed out while examining the textual records from ancient period to our modern era, the descriptions points to a basic population continuity.

Plus we also have this massive geographical barrier called the danakil desert which is one of the one of tje hottest places on earth with Dalol having the highest avg temperature ever recorded on earth.
There was probably nobody living here for before the domestication of camels since it wasn't a place humans could survive .

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

This is how Christopher Ehret divides Oma Tana:
View attachment 376568

And this is how M Nuuh Ali divides Somali dialects
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I don't believe that there is any difference, at all, between the Somali spoken in Cadale and that spoken in Djibouti. There is no difference between the Somali of Ismaciil Cumar Geele and Xasan Sheekh Maxamuud. The differences are meaningless. Maxaa Tiri is one language that basically has no subdivisions that are linguistically meaningful.

 

[Thegoodshepherd]

I think it would be just simpler to assume that its somali influence on afar-saho.

I know it might seem like im being biased but I think one of the biggest fall outs from 20th century colonial historiography is how every similarity somalis share with another group of people is assumed to be a sign of that group influencencing somalis. Ive almost never seen anything written where the shared similarity is attributed to a somali origin

This is an important point since until the Oromo migrations Somalis were the largest Cushitic group, and had probably been the largest for a very long time.

But I think the biggest flaw in the omo tana theory is that why dont the somali galbeed dialects whidh border the other eastern cushtic lanaguges not retain these features or even a sign of them?

A study of the Gariire language of Ceel Kari would be very interesting. I wonder why no one has bothered to study the Gariire language?

 

[Midas]

This is an important point since until the Oromo migrations Somalis were the largest Cushitic group, and had probably been the largest for a very long time.



A study of the Gariire language of Ceel Kari would be very interesting. I wonder why no one has bothered to study the Gariire language?

We werent jusy the largest. We basically occupied the entire lowland region and it waa the bake mountains and the awash valley that formed the nautral borders for where somali inhabitantion stooped.

 

[Zak12]

We werent jusy the largest. We basically occupied the entire lowland region and it waa the bake mountains and the awash valley that formed the nautral borders for where somali inhabitantion stooped.


View attachment 376781

Our natural borders were the highlands to the west, gulf of aden to the north, the indian ocean to the east and lake tana to the south.

 

[Idilinaa]

I don't believe that there is any difference, at all, between the Somali spoken in Cadale and that spoken in Djibouti. There is no difference between the Somali of Ismaciil Cumar Geele and Xasan Sheekh Maxamuud. The differences are meaningless. Maxaa Tiri is one language that basically has no subdivisions that are linguistically meaningful.

All the dialect groups are part of one language because they share the same cultural history and branched out from a common origin. There is regional lexical and pronunciation differences in AF Maxaa Tiri . Like how Reer Waqooyi say "Suuli" and Reer Koonfuur say "Musquul" and so on. Even small differences in certain expressions and idioms as well.

Its in the same way there is lexical differences between different forms of English . Like an American might say "Sweater" and a British person might say "Jumper" etc.

 

[reer]

You are onto something because in some respects it could be the way around:

Rendille retains the x sound whereas as Af Maay doesn’t. It also present in Iraqw. The Arabic or saho/afar influence doesn’t make sense in this regard because Rendille are isolated from all those groups. I think Af Maay lost the sound when they became isolated from af mahaa speakers. Interestingly, it is what the two speakers use to differentiate themselves into “af Maxa” and” Maay”, a group who says X and a group who doesn’t. I don’t buy into the theory af Maxa was heavily influenced by Saho or Afar. Arabic (especially South Arabian needs to be researched more though).

@Shimbiris @Idilinaa

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[Midas]

Our natural borders were the highlands to the west, gulf of aden to the north, the indian ocean to the east and lake tana to the south.

What im really curious about is how long we've been a unified group inhabiting the somali pensiula for.
It was probaly before the domestication of camels since Its not like there's any part of somalia thats so inhospitable you would need a camel to live there.

We also seemed to seemed to be really good at breeding livestock thats incredibly selected for our environmental. Theres a reason somali sheep was used by crossbreeders worldwide.

 

[Idilinaa]

What im really curious about is how long we've been a unified group inhabiting the somali pensiula for.
It was probaly before the domestication of camels since Its not like there's any part of somalia thats so inhospitable you would need a camel to live there.

We also seemed to seemed to be really good at breeding livestock thats incredibly selected for our environmental. Theres a reason somali sheep was used by crossbreeders worldwide.

View attachment 376787

Somalis likely became unified as an ethnic group through trade and movement. We were in constant contact with one another and probably intermingled quite a lot across different regions.


You’re absolutely right about the camel adoption. I’ve mentioned before that the camel was a major technological advancement, comparable in impact to the wheel. Its adoption wasn’t primarily about survival, but rather economic efficiency. It greatly streamlined inland trade and facilitated expansion, making movement and exchange between communities much easier and more sustainable.

The Best Invention Since The Wheel​

The Best Invention Since The Wheel

www.notechmagazine.com

“Between the third and seventh centuries AD, the civilizations of the Near East and North Africa gave up wheeled vehicular transportation and adopted a more efficient and speedier way of moving goods and people: They replaced the wagon and cart with the camel. This deliberate rejection of the wheel in the very region of its invention lasted for more than one thousand years. It came to an end only when major European powers, advancing their imperialistic schemes for the Near East, reintroduced the wheel.”

“The camel as a pack animal was favored over wheeled transportation for reasons that become obvious when the camel is compared with the typical ox-drawn vehicle. The camel can carry more, move faster, and travel farther, on less food and water, than an ox. Pack animals need neither roads nor bridges, they can traverse rough ground and ford rivers and streams, and their full strength is devoted to carrying a load and not wasted on dragging a wagon’s deadweight. Once the camel and ox are compared, one wonders why the wheel was ever adopted in that region in the first place.”

 

[Midas]

You’re absolutely right about the camel adoption. I’ve mentioned before that the camel was a major technological advancement, comparable in impact to the wheel. Its adoption wasn’t primarily about survival, but rather economic efficiency. It greatly streamlined inland trade and facilitated expansion, making movement and exchange between communities much easier and more sustainable.

Something we dont appreciate enough is the complexity behind the somali nomadic lifestyle.

The aqal espcially when compared with the bedouin tent you find in the sahel and arabia is much more complex. The Bedouin tent is essential one giant mat held up with a few poles in the ground. Wheras thr aqal is this complicated wooden frame made with certain kinds of wooden that are spefically bent and interlocked into a certain shape.

 

[Idilinaa]

Something we dont appreciate enough is the complexity behind the somali nomadic lifestyle.

The aqal espcially when compared with the bedouin tent you find in the sahel and arabia is much more complex. The Bedouin tent is essential one giant mat held up with a few poles in the ground. Wheras thr aqal is this complicated wooden frame made with certain kinds of wooden that are spefically bent and interlocked into a certain shape.

View attachment 376836View attachment 376837

I don’t really believe Somalis were pastoralists in the same way as the Bedouin Arabs. Instead, they practiced a system known as transhumance , the seasonal movement and alternation of living between the plains and the plateaus, or other fixed locations depending on the time of year.

Transhumance - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

During the rainy seasons, the abundance of pastures, springs, wood, and grass made the inland plateaus ideal for more sustainable encampments. This is one reason why the Aqal is far more elaborate and durable than the typical Bedouin tents found in Arabia or the Sahara.

Somalis also used wooden planks and poles to build walls and support roofs in stone or brick-and-mortar houses, reflecting both the availability of timber and a developed woodworking tradition uncommon in arid pastoral cultures.

Men who would build boats/ships would also use them for building poles or planks to hold up the roof's and walls in stone/or the traditional mortar/brick houses called Baraako or Baraakoyin.

You can see it here in these old ruined buildings, with the wooden poles sticking out. Prolly was from the Damas tree.

I remember reading about Zayla’s population in the 1800s, and they built houses in a very similar way. In addition to the carish (thatched houses) that a groom would build with his friends, they also constructed stone or brick houses supported by wooden planks. These were called magdara, rather than baraako.

You can observe the same tradition continuing up until quite recently, even among Ogaden Somalis.

You can actually see this in the ruined medieval stone houses, where the roofs were supported by wooden poles , a clear continuation of that architectural style:

It ties back nicely to what you shared earlier about woodworking: It goes to show how central availability wood has been:

Somali nomads vs arab bedouins woodworking

@Shimbiris @Idilinaa @NidarNidar @Emir of Zayla @The alchemist @Mohamedamiin120 This is something that i just realized and was honesty blown away by. It occurred to me when I though about why somali nomads built our aqals out of wood versus the arab bedouins who use tents. Then it hit...

www.somalispot.com

 

[Midas]

I don’t really believe Somalis were pastoralists in the same way as the Bedouin Arabs. Instead, they practiced a system known as transhumance , the seasonal movement and alternation of living between the plains and the plateaus, or other fixed locations depending on the time of year.

Transhumance - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

During the rainy seasons, the abundance of pastures, springs, wood, and grass made the inland plateaus ideal for more sustainable encampments. This is one reason why the Aqal is far more elaborate and durable than the typical Bedouin tents found in Arabia or the Sahara.

Somalis also used wooden planks and poles to build walls and support roofs in stone or brick-and-mortar houses, reflecting both the availability of timber and a developed woodworking tradition uncommon in arid pastoral cultures.



I remember reading about Zayla’s population in the 1800s, and they built houses in a very similar way. In addition to the carish (thatched houses) that a groom would build with his friends, they also constructed stone or brick houses supported by wooden planks. These were called magdara, rather than baraako.
View attachment 376844


You can observe the same tradition continuing up until quite recently, even among Ogaden Somalis.
View attachment 376845

You can actually see this in the ruined medieval stone houses, where the roofs were supported by wooden poles , a clear continuation of that architectural style:
View attachment 376846

It ties back nicely to what you shared earlier about woodworking: It goes to show how central availability wood has been:

Somali nomads vs arab bedouins woodworking

@Shimbiris @Idilinaa @NidarNidar @Emir of Zayla @The alchemist @Mohamedamiin120 This is something that i just realized and was honesty blown away by. It occurred to me when I though about why somali nomads built our aqals out of wood versus the arab bedouins who use tents. Then it hit...

www.somalispot.com

View attachment 376847
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We definitely werent pastoralists in the sme way bedouins were. It also just occurred to me that somalis before we adopted the camels were likley even more sedentary since cattle can't migrate. Bronze age somalia was proably a far more centralized society than we realize. Cattle herding require far more water and grouo cooperation since a single individual cannot herd cattle by hihimself the way somebody could do with camels. The cattle also wouldn't have been able to migrate long distances which means people likely gathered around larger water sources .

 

[Idilinaa]

We definitely werent pastoralists in the sme way bedouins were. It also just occurred to me that somalis before we adopted the camels were likley even more sedentary since cattle can't migrate. Bronze age somalia was proably a far more centralized society than we realize. Cattle herding require far more water and grouo cooperation since a single individual cannot herd cattle by hihimself the way somebody could do with camels. The cattle also wouldn't have been able to migrate long distances which means people likely gathered around larger water sources .

I think there was probably always some kind of alternation between living in the plains and the plateaus, even in earlier periods.

Somalis continued to keep and herd cattle alongside camels, as well as horses and donkeys, which suggests that the adoption of the camel was primarily economic, a technological advancement aimed at maximizing trade and productivity, rather than a necessity for survival.

You can still see this pattern reflected in cattle-centric cultures around the world today, where seasonal mobility remains a key part of their lifestyle. Cattle do migrate, but they’re typically driven as herds into higher elevations during certain seasons.

A good parallel exists in ancient antiquity, particularly among the Greeks, who also had a pastoral economic base.

Although much of their land was green and wooded, it was not easily cultivable, classified as marginal land rather than arable land. In such environments, livestock animals became the main means of converting vegetation into usable energy and products:

To me they also point out something important when they say "The emerging evidence for pastoralism in antiquity as being associated primarily with the estates of the wealthy emphasizes the importance of its wealth-generating , rather than it's subsistence function"

This is an important point that’s often overlooked in both discourse and archaeology, where there’s a tendency perhaps due to bias, to assume that pastoralists were independent, subsistence-based, and economically simple, which isn’t what the evidence actually shows.

Past, present and future of pastoralism in Greece - Pastoralism

Pastoral farming has been a feature of the Greek scene since antiquity. The geomorphology of the area, climatic conditions and the prevailing systems of agricultural production in lowland regions at any given time have all been conducive to the development and preservation of this productive...

pastoralismjournal.springeropen.com

“The subject of keeping animals—often referred to as pastoralism—in the ancient world is one which has until relatively recently attracted little attention in comparison with the products of cultivation.”

“Even some very recent discussions of the ancient rural economy are almost entirely silent on the place of livestock in the exploitation of the landscape.”

“Until very recently, such discussions of animal husbandry in the ancient world as took place were dominated by a model of long-distance transhumance... [which] makes the implicit assumption that very little has changed over the last 2,500 years.”

“The model of pastoralism still generally in use among archaeologists tends to assume... that ancient herders were independent, subsistence-focused, and archaeologically invisible.”

“These assumptions are being challenged, as they have been recently.”

I even have to point this out when it comes to Somalis, both today and in the past , they generated a lot of wealth from their livestock and would convert them into trade goods and products.

The second thing they point out, which I often mention myself, is how pastoralism is tied or linked to the productivity of arable agriculture. When they say " A third reason for exploitation of animals is the need for manure to improve the soil fertility in arable agriculture and arboriculture: this provided by not only directly by animal grazing on agricultural land , but also through the spreading of manure collected from the folds of fields of agro-pastoralists, and even though its sale by pastoralists to agriculturalists"

You can see this among Somalis who lived in arable land zones , they also kept livestock while engaging in farming activities, and there was a mutual exchange system between them and the herders.

 

[Midas]

I think there was probably always some kind of alternation between living in the plains and the plateaus, even in earlier periods.

Somalis continued to keep and herd cattle alongside camels, as well as horses and donkeys, which suggests that the adoption of the camel was primarily economic, a technological advancement aimed at maximizing trade and productivity, rather than a necessity for survival.

You can still see this pattern reflected in cattle-centric cultures around the world today, where seasonal mobility remains a key part of their lifestyle. Cattle do migrate, but they’re typically driven as herds into higher elevations during certain seasons.

A good parallel exists in ancient antiquity, particularly among the Greeks, who also had a pastoral economic base.

View attachment 376871


Although much of their land was green and wooded, it was not easily cultivable, classified as marginal land rather than arable land. In such environments, livestock animals became the main means of converting vegetation into usable energy and products:

View attachment 376872


To me they also point out something important when they say "The emerging evidence for pastoralism in antiquity as being associated primarily with the estates of the wealthy emphasizes the importance of its wealth-generating , rather than it's subsistence function"

This is an important point that’s often overlooked in both discourse and archaeology, where there’s a tendency perhaps due to bias, to assume that pastoralists were independent, subsistence-based, and economically simple, which isn’t what the evidence actually shows.

Past, present and future of pastoralism in Greece - Pastoralism

Pastoral farming has been a feature of the Greek scene since antiquity. The geomorphology of the area, climatic conditions and the prevailing systems of agricultural production in lowland regions at any given time have all been conducive to the development and preservation of this productive...

pastoralismjournal.springeropen.com

I even have to point this out when it comes to Somalis, both today and in the past , they generated a lot of wealth from their livestock and would convert them into trade goods and products.

The second thing they point out, which I often mention myself, is how pastoralism is tied or linked to the productivity of arable agriculture. When they say " A third reason for exploitation of animals is the need for manure to improve the soil fertility in arable agriculture and arboriculture: this provided by not only directly by animal grazing on agricultural land , but also through the spreading of manure collected from the folds of fields of agro-pastoralists, and even though its sale by pastoralists to agriculturalists"

You can see this among Somalis who lived in arable land zones , they also kept livestock while engaging in farming activities, and there was a mutual exchange system between them and the herders.

My point is more about how that somali cattle herders due to the nature of cattle herding were less independent and group co-operation was more vital to survival. But with camels a single nomad could be far more self-sufficient and this likely lead to a decentralization of the society

 

[Idilinaa]

My point is more about how that somali cattle herders due to the nature of cattle herding were less independent and group co-operation was more vital to survival. But with camels a single nomad could be far more self-sufficient and this likely lead to a decentralization of the society

I don’t think decentralization had much to do with pastoralism or being nomadic. You actually showed that yourself in that thread on the Sahel , how many of those societies were organized under a kind of feudal structure.

The strangeness of somali nomads

Something I've been thinking about recently after reading about other nomadic societies to understand what's particular to our own. Is how weird and different we are compared to the others I've read about. The major other pastoral nomadic societies seem to be the sahelian and sahran nomads Of...

www.somalispot.com

In Somalia’s case, it has more to do with geography , the flat, open landscape combined with the long coastline naturally made us a trade-based society. That environment meant wealth and production were more dispersed rather than concentrated in one area or monopolized by a few. Communities were in constant contact and exchange with one another, fostering a more networked and decentralized social structure.

I think the Ancient Greek example I mentioned earlier is very comparable. They were also trade and commerce-oriented, while maintaining pastoralism as a rural economic base. They were divided into independent city-states that were loosely connected rather than unified under a single empire or centralized monarchy. Aristocratic elites often resisted any attempt by one ruler to establish lasting domination, preferring localized centers of power instead and greater autonomy.

Even though the ancient Greeks were divided into city-states and local centers, they all spoke the same language and shared a common religion and culture. They all existed in the same world and had a strong cultural and unified identity.

I believe even before the adoption of the camel, Somali society must have developed in a similar way.