Dr Osman Analysis - Democracy How To Implement In Somalia

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Cognitivedissonance

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Cognitive lets cut a deal. U deal with criminal/family/religious aspect of islam and let us the traditionalist(nomad system supporters) deal with the horumar and argue about what direction the country will go in terms of development!!! Is that so hard for u to accept!!!
Allah is the best disposer of our affairs since Somalia is a Muslim country the shariah law will supersede any man made law fad ama ha fadin waa lugu fadsiin:ufdup:
 

DR OSMAN

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Cognitive the issues are not settled. The TRUE ulama in Somalia and Politicians agreed that 'horumar' related issues be left to politicians and 'legal and religious issues' be left to them. I still think this is not the best balance that is reflective of our culture. For example I do not want capital punishment in Somalia, it's just a waste, I prefer we use them as slaves to toil the land for their victims and live to suffer the torment they caused to the victim rather then just putting them to sleep with a bullet!!! I want to come up with more brutal forms of punishment then just jail sentences and getting a bed!!!

There is going to be huge clashes between the ultra religious and government especially when certain types of development enter the land. Like Nightclubs, Beach Resorts with bikinis, a new church. I will tanasul on the church, christianity isn't going to stimulate our economy beyond a damn church. But I wont tanasul on the developments that can create jobs for our people, heck if u don't want our people doing those jobs by that time we will have heaps of foreign labor in the land who will do it like they do in 'dubai'!!!!

Traditionalist and Religious Folks need to sit down under a tree observing the nomads in action and indhaha layska riddo on matters. If the religious folks stay out of the development story and let politicians handle it, I am willing to sacrifice religious freedom in the land even though I don't think it's right!!! islam is based on free will, qasab ma aha in diinta xoog loogu dhaqo dalka!!! But like I said I am willing to tanaasul on matters especially when I dont see much benefit in terms of economic stimulation.

If U fear people leaving islam, by then they won't cause we will be rich country and people will stick to their religion then cause people love where power/economics is!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

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Cognitive the issues are not settled. The TRUE ulama in Somalia and Politicians agreed that 'horumar' related issues be left to politicians and 'legal and religious issues' be left to them. I still think this is not the best balance that is reflective of our culture. For example I do not want capital punishment in Somalia, it's just a waste, I prefer we use them as slaves to toil the land for their victims and live to suffer the torment they caused to the victim rather then just putting them to sleep with a bullet!!! I want to come up with more brutal forms of punishment then just jail sentences and getting a bed!!!

There is going to be huge clashes between the ultra religious and government especially when certain types of development enter the land. Like Nightclubs, Beach Resorts with bikinis, a new church. I will tanasul on the church, christianity isn't going to stimulate our economy beyond a damn church. But I wont tanasul on the developments that can create jobs for our people, heck if u don't want our people doing those jobs by that time we will have heaps of foreign labor in the land who will do it like they do in 'dubai'!!!!

Traditionalist and Religious Folks need to sit down under a tree observing the nomads in action and indhaha layska riddo on matters. If the religious folks stay out of the development story and let politicians handle it, I am willing to sacrifice religious freedom in the land even though I don't think it's right!!! islam is based on free will, qasab ma aha in diinta xoog loogu dhaqo dalka!!! But like I said I am willing to tanaasul on matters especially when I dont see much benefit in terms of economic stimulation.

If U fear people leaving islam, by then they won't cause we will be rich country and people will stick to their religion then cause people love where power/economics is!!!
Yaa Allah we came from you and to you we shall return, you're the omnipotent the omnipresent the master of the day of judgement.


I pray to you my master & creator Allah the most benevolent the most wise to keep Somalia in a perpetual state of anarchy and poverty war and famine if they choose man made law over your divine law oh Allah the most compassionate please hail down fire & brimstone on Somalia especially Puntland if they choose any law man made laws that oppose your divine laws I pray to Allah to humiliate us in the worst way may we become a landless people occupied by Kenya & Ethiopia I pray to Allah place us in bondage like the Israelites for our disobedience to your will amiin yaa rabb thuma amiin.
 

Cognitivedissonance

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There's nothing left to discuss my views couldn't be clearer so let's agree to disagree to you your way and to me mine.
 

SuldaanGuled

Rag waa shaah dumarna waa sheeko.
Suldan, your trolling and that's all your doing. I responded to all ur points, u responded to none of mine!!!

1. Your quran INTERPRETATION is your OWN interpretation. So when u say the quran said it, I will say no some human interpreted it for u to suit his agenda, a salafist agenda. Why I say this, through-out all islamic caliphate islam was practised differently, proving it's always been about interpretation!!! Im proving my points with real world observations that u can see and ur still arguing, what else can I call u but a frickin troll!!!

2. You dont see what unites people, u only see what divides people. Gaal and Muslim all need to eat, drink, and shit. The earth and it's sustenance is the only thing that will unite them as both need it to survive. That's a shared goal. I WILL REPEAT SURVIVE. now u will say no its not important to survive, the quran is important. I can't help stupid. There is no quran if humans dies, no way to practise islam, etc. But u will repeat no no the quran is all we need, thats it, allahu akbar.

Now u post more copy n paste warrior, eat with 3 fingers, allahu akbar and that's what a muslim has been reduced today..these people are embarassing to the religion!!! I will never unite with u i dont care if ur muslim or not, i will unite with the person that respects the others freedom, equality, and justice.

Be very careful about identtiy politics. If identity politics is good why isnt saudi arabia helping somalis? it was the gaal who took u in and created all the diaspora and experts we have. If there was no gaal today, we would still be in camps in saudi arabia with no hope of restoring this failed nation!!! Always look at someone values and unite people based on that. The prophet send ppl to abyssinnia a gaal territory. It doesnt matter their gaal or not. What matters if they preserve core human values!!!

We should never unite with people just because they are africans or muslims, we must look at dhaqankoodu if it is the same as ours which truly allows freedom-equality-justice, u just have to observe our nomads!!!

Whatever your motives are it's clearly open for all to see, to each their own i say. There's no point to continue any further if you keep acting like this.
 

DR OSMAN

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Whatever your motives are it's clearly open for all to see, to each their own i say. There's no point to continue any further if you keep acting like this.
Incognistance, we agreed to disagree. We will let Somalis judge from now on. Politics is about development and earthly matters like construction, infrastructure, jobs, electricity, education, technology, medicine, etc. I can prove this also occurs in our nomadic culture, the nomad doesn't seek the imam about how to 'nurture his camels' or build his home or seek water and earthly matters. All these matters are earthly topics, how this conflicts with God, I don't know. Maybe in the future you can stop seeing your doctor and go see an imam for medicine, when building a house don't see a contractor but see an imam after-all.

At the end of the day to summ it up in short terms for u. Politics is about development, Religion is about god. Clear distinct separation are needed from both in my view. Don't get me wrong, I still think the islamist got way to much power in the constitution but it is something I am willing to tanaasul on, but on development and earthly matters HELL NO. I am not going to ask an imam to run that for me, it's not his area of expertise. As farole said there is the constitution to deal with our earthly matters and there is religious clerics to deal with religious matter. That's the end of it!!! There is no point me and u go back forth on this topic any further, we are not convince each other either way, we will just let somalis decide who speaks more sense me or you!!!

I think I do speak far more sense then your regurgiated interpretations from salafist with nothing for us to relate to with our own mind and see with our own eyes, do u know why u can't do that to relate to our minds and show us with our eyes? it's cause it's your OPINION only, it's not factual, because I reference everything I say with something they can observe with their eyes and ears.

I will do an ataturk on you salafist untill you know your damn role and stay within it. If u want to be involved in politics then by means your welcome, but convince the people how u will bring development, security, ideas to improve their lives, if u can't you won't be given the seat but will be fought as a saudi agent trying to cause instability for ulterior motives because u want something u have no expertise in.

Long live Puntland, Long Live Osman Maxamud
 

DR OSMAN

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Suldangeed, I think Somalis can judge themselves, your the man who said there isn't earthly matters? if somalis agree with that, then f*ck me ten ways to sunday
 

DR OSMAN

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Dont worry suldangeed, since the 1960s till now, we are going to be pumping out new generations of forward thinkers, freeing slaved minds like we did in the SYL days and created the SYL. Every generation of ours will be like this!!! It's a matter of time before we return to our rightful place in villa somalia.

By the way I haven't even presented my topic on islam and somalia, just wait for that!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

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Incognistance, we agreed to disagree. We will let Somalis judge from now on. Politics is about development and earthly matters like construction, infrastructure, jobs, electricity, education, technology, medicine, etc. I can prove this also occurs in our nomadic culture, the nomad doesn't seek the imam about how to 'nurture his camels' or build his home or seek water and earthly matters. All these matters are earthly topics, how this conflicts with God, I don't know. Maybe in the future you can stop seeing your doctor and go see an imam for medicine, when building a house don't see a contractor but see an imam after-all.

At the end of the day to summ it up in short terms for u. Politics is about development, Religion is about god. Clear distinct separation are needed from both in my view. Don't get me wrong, I still think the islamist got way to much power in the constitution but it is something I am willing to tanaasul on, but on development and earthly matters HELL NO. I am not going to ask an imam to run that for me, it's not his area of expertise. As farole said there is the constitution to deal with our earthly matters and there is religious clerics to deal with religious matter. That's the end of it!!! There is no point me and u go back forth on this topic any further, we are not convince each other either way, we will just let somalis decide who speaks more sense me or you!!!

I think I do speak far more sense then your regurgiated interpretations from salafist with nothing for us to relate to with our own mind and see with our own eyes, do u know why u can't do that to relate to our minds and show us with our eyes? it's cause it's your OPINION only, it's not factual, because I reference everything I say with something they can observe with their eyes and ears.

I will do an ataturk on you salafist untill you know your damn role and stay within it. If u want to be involved in politics then by means your welcome, but convince the people how u will bring development, security, ideas to improve their lives, if u can't you won't be given the seat but will be fought as a saudi agent trying to cause instability for ulterior motives because u want something u have no expertise in.

Long live Puntland, Long Live Osman Maxamud
Attaturk was a pawn in a grand chest game he was used to establish the cabals will secularism what you're pushing now a system that benefits the rich and powerful who can select whom ever they please to further their agenda to create George orwells nightmare a totalitarian system when he said & I quote "If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever. "



:idontlike:
 

DR OSMAN

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Attaturk was a pawn in a grand chest game he was used to establish the cabals will secularism what you're pushing now a system that benefits the rich and powerful who can select whom ever they please to further their agenda to create George orwells nightmare a totalitarian system when he said & I quote "If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever. "



:idontlike:
By the way im a traditionalist that is secularist because that's how the nomads are, are federal units(clan rule) with a secularized xeer with a few drops of religion in there for criminal matters, I don't want to see our government be any different!!! I will be slamming home a full article on islam and somalia within due time, don't rush me. It's a big topic in it's own right!!!

U raised your points bro, so has suldan, so have I. The matter is with somalis now to decide, there is no point going back n forth on the matter constantly!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

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By the way im a traditionalist that is secularist because that's how the nomads are, are federal units(clan rule) with a secularized xeer with a few drops of religion in there for criminal matters, I don't want to see our government be any different!!! I will be slamming home a full article on islam and somalia within due time, don't rush me. It's a big topic in it's own right!!!

U raised your points bro, so has suldan, so have I. The matter is with somalis now to decide, there is no point going back n forth on the matter constantly!!!
Tell me one time the Somali xeer system has ever superseded the Islamic shariah? The xeer system is subordinate to the shariah tas meel ku qoro boowe Ku seexo kuna soo toos ma garatey
 

DR OSMAN

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Tell me one time the Somali xeer system has ever superseded the Islamic shariah? The xeer system is subordinate to the shariah tas meel ku qoro boowe Ku seexo kuna soo toos ma garatey
Not exactly true, very delicate issue the matter, requires full article. But just to let u know, the xeer is used in conjunction with the shariah, if it's criminal issue they consult the shariah but if it's a earthly matter they use their 'consensus style politics basically their own minds' for example what to do when a trees are being cut, no rain, how to build aqal home, the process to use to get to frankincense, notice all earthly matters? they do not seek an imam or shariah for this cause it has no place in this matter . Just like it should have no place in Somali Federal Govt because the govt deals with the same earthly matters surrounding development, laws and rules regarding development(not regarding god), etc. Just like the nomad has laws and rules regarding earthly matters.

Farole was right, you just hate to admit it!!! There is xeer bin-adan and then there is xeer illahi, the two shouldn't even conflict or cross into each other territories!!! We need xeer and laws regarding how much ppl get paid for work, how business invest in the country, what sort of infrastructure standard they use, if we don't have SECULAR LAWS for this, it will be damn chaos. We cannot consult religious laws for this matter because SIMPLY, it has no place in it!!! Farole wa niin aad uu af xun and i remember him saying nimankan diimeed shaqadooda ha barteen!!!

The real ulama and somalis know the truth about the way Somalia will be shaped. It's these little saudi agent vermins with ulterior motives which I know what it is the problem. Don't u see them both the ulama and govt always condemning them as 'shayadiin'.

The real battle will be between the real ulama and govt when religion and development crosses each other path, It happened in Somaliland recently with the church!!! I mean honestly think deep about it. how is religion going to clash when a govt passes a telecommunication, business law, education law, all earthly matters!!! Which is what government deals in.

4 crucial areas is where I want settled and the real analyst.

1. Freedom of Religion(not as important but will determine how free we truly r). I argue free will is apart of islam and therefore shouldn't be a problem in terms of religion.
2. Development and how far it goes and what's acceptable (my important one, ill fight tooth n nail here)
3. Criminal matters(important also but not critical for me which code is adopted)
4. Morals(Im fighting tooth and nail here for gender equality). My argument is if allah treats man and woman equal in judgement day and judges based on results, we should also judge ppl on results.

Those are really the four areas that religion and secularism cross over on, the rest is all earthly and dunya related stuff which religion has no place in it to begin with so no clash at all!!!
 
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Cognitivedissonance

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Not exactly true, very delicate issue the matter, requires full article. But just to let u know, the xeer is used in conjunction with the shariah, if it's criminal issue they consult the shariah but if it's a earthly matter they use their 'consensus style politics basically their own minds' for example what to do when a trees are being cut, no rain, how to build aqal home, the process to use to get to frankincense, notice all earthly matters? they do not seek an imam or shariah for this cause it has no place in this matter . Just like it should have no place in Somali Federal Govt because the govt deals with the same earthly matters surrounding development, laws and rules regarding development(not regarding god), etc. Just like the nomad has laws and rules regarding earthly matters.

Farole was right, you just hate to admit it!!! There is xeer bin-adan and then there is xeer illahi, the two shouldn't even conflict or cross into each other territories!!! We need xeer and laws regarding how much ppl get paid for work, how business invest in the country, what sort of infrastructure standard they use, if we don't have SECULAR LAWS for this, it will be damn chaos. We cannot consult religious laws for this matter because SIMPLY, it has no place in it!!! Farole wa niin aad uu af xun and i remember him saying nimankan diimeed shaqadooda ha barteen!!!

The real ulama and somalis know the truth about the way Somalia will be shaped. It's these little saudi agent vermins with ulterior motives which I know what it is the problem. Don't u see them both the ulama and govt always condemning them as 'shayadiin'.

The real battle will be between the real ulama and govt when religion and development crosses each other path, It happened in Somaliland recently with the church!!! I mean honestly think deep about it. how is religion going to clash when a govt passes a telecommunication, business law, education law, all earthly matters!!! Which is what government deals in.

4 crucial areas is where I want settled and the real analyst.

1. Freedom of Religion(not as important but will determine how free we truly r). I argue free will is apart of islam and therefore shouldn't be a problem in terms of religion.
2. Development and how far it goes(my important one, ill fight tooth n nail here)
3. Criminal matters(important also)
4. Morals(Im fighting tooth and nail here for gender equality)

Those are really the four areas that religion and secularism cross over on, the rest is all earthly and dunya related stuff which religion has no place in it to begin with so no clash at all!!!
Save me the drivel and tell me when has the xeer system ever superseded the shariah you soother sayer magi stop casting spells it's a simple question which demands a simple answer.

 

DR OSMAN

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I did answer u, I am not going to repeat myself!!! the one's with half a brain understand, religion and politics don't even cross path except 4 areas. Freedom of religion, Criminal Code, Certain Developments, and morals !!!

They don't cross path anywhere else, it's not about who supercedes the other, they are not even related to each other, they operate in different issues!!! it's like saying the shariah supercedes medicine laws!! two different frickin issues, not correlated and won't ever come to a clash!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

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You're a gaal xeer illahay kulaha nacaalad ba kugu yaalo inkaar qaabe you and all your kind Ayan hersi types may you forever remain ostracised and shunned ridiculed and granted persona none grata rejected by all Muslim Somalis as a whole you're a treasonous bunch a scourge insidious turncoats.
 

DR OSMAN

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You're a gaal xeer illahay kulaha nacaalad ba kugu yaalo inkaar qaabe you and all your kind Ayan hersi types may he forever remain ostracised and shunned ridiculed and granted persona none grata by all Muslim Somalis you're a treasonous bunch a scourge insidious turncoats.
I know the emotions can build up when you have no response!!! Maybe we go for a sparring session so you can let out that aggression!!! But let somali decide who is making more sense here me or u!!! I think deep down u know you been owned
 

Cognitivedissonance

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I know the emotions can build up when you have no response!!! Maybe we go for a sparring session so you can let out that aggression!!! But let somali decide who is making more sense here me or u!!! I think deep down u know you been owned
You haven't answered none of the questions that I asked you likewise you haven't brought forward any evidence behind all your emotional outbursts it's purely driven by emotions whereas I have quoted sources & presented evidence to back up my argument.

I'll ask you again Darwinian when has the xeer system ever superseded the shariah the divine law:ulyin:
 

DR OSMAN

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You haven't answered none of the questions that I asked you likewise you haven't brought forward any evidence behind all your emotional outbursts it's purely driven by emotions whereas I have quoted sources & presented evidence to back up my argument.

I'll ask you again Darwinian when has the xeer system ever superseded the shariah the divine law:ulyin:
The islamist owned me!!! Purge me of my sins for being a traditionalist nomad supporter. PURGE ME HABIBI JUST PURGE ME:liberaltears:
 

Cognitivedissonance

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The islamist owned me!!! Purge me of my sins for being a traditionalist nomad supporter. PURGE ME HABIBI JUST PURGE ME:liberaltears:
HABIBI? Are you slyly implying Islam is Arab purge me kulaha I have no authority I'm merely a slave and a servant of the most benevolent only his will shall be done not mine
 
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