Dr Osman Analysis - Democracy How To Implement In Somalia

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What sort of democracy should Somalia adopt? I personally am no fan of it and prefer a nomadic system(locally crafted system reflecting our culture, similar to what the UAE did) but it seems the will of the people is gravitating towards this system, so I am putting my mind to work trying to see how we can fit it into our country while making sure it addresses tribalism and unites people on ideology rather then clan by ensuring there is counter measures in the system to confront clannism.

I think we need to take key lessons from the past. In the 1960's our democracy had some major side effects, other then passing along power, we forget the huge amount of corruption that existed, 100s of clan parties, attempted coups, then a real coup, assassination of president, if we kept going on that system it was bound to collapse as there was already big holes already there. I think the main reason for the holes in the system was purely colonial. The colonials united us and when they left, well guess what there was no real factor uniting us any longer. The uniting factor holding us together the 'colonizers' weren't in the picture anymore and therefore we broke back down into age old institutions(tribalism) and turned on each other.

If we were didn't inherit a 'foreign system, parties, majority rules against consensus' and an 'alien structure of governance such as centralism', there wouldn't be that rat race of tribalism happening. The clans felt they lost their autonomy since the structure of government was centralized in mogadishu. They felt power, resources, decision making, etc wasn't be distributed according to consensual style politics which is how our nomads operate through a consensus(no clan basically dictates but reach common ground thru dialogue and consensus). But our system wasn't built on consensus, it was majority takes all, no dialogue, no consensus needed. Coupled with the fact the uniting factor uniting us was no longer around and a government structure that was highly centralized and against autonomy which is critical for a nomadic society their own self rule. I can see clearly why this system failed, it was inherently foreign and was working in counter to our own cultural back-drop.

Now I won't go into why im so anti democratic in this thread, I think everyone who reads my articles can clearly see that. I want to address how we can fit democracy into our culture and actually make it work, rather then re-hash the past systems and end up with similar results. I think a Somali democracy could work in theory. For example parties are limited to a certain number, all parties must be 4.5 composition or have equal number representation for each region of somalia, nomination of president will only occur after the election to counter anyone voting along tribal lines. Basically all Somalis will see is 2-3 parties all the same in terms of tribal/district composition only key difference between them will be idealogy. I think it is great no-one knowing who will lead the party until after the election. This can also allow for 4.5 to secretly work in the background and elect each tribe to the presidency on a rotation basis as to satisfy the nations tribes.

How will election results be decided? will it be majority rule or consensual? Do we want a system where mps run for seats in the districts and we just tally who won the most districts out of the 92 districts? This form of democracy is closer to our culture as it will represent the whole nation equally. For example each district gets 3 seats each. The party that wins that district gets those three votes towards their party in Mogadishu. Then at the end we can calculate which party won the most districts out of the 92 districts. This allows for national parties to have a 'weji qaran' and representative of the whole somalia people and not just 'large tribes' which is what happens in kenya unfortunately and why other tribes constantly riot.

We are of course are going to need counter measures in place, strict laws on corruption. For example stiff sentencing, name and shaming thru the media, party fines, criminal database system where culprit or party involved are black listed for life and all sectors in the country will need to run checks on any future employees. Somalia has the highest rate of corruption yet 0 are jailed for it. No punishment whatsoever!!! How can a country be serious about defeating corruption if there isn't a strict system in place to identify it through(auditing checks) and applying strict punishments where relevant when someone is found guilty of it. Singapore for example don't play around, it's automatic death penalty!!!

I mean don't get me wrong, I am no fan of this system, but since alot of people are we are going to have to look at ways that are not 'western' and more somali orientated to get it to fit into our culture and work with our culture rather then against it and identify weak points in the system that can be manipulated and cause the system to lose confidence in the people.

I honestly do not think the system is all that important, it's like a bed, I think the system is the bed sheet, the bed however is the constitution. If the constitution is weak or not reflecting our culture, the system(bed sheet) which sits on the constitution is going to crumble from within as their is no 'effective' check n balances. pointless!!!

The real issue in Somalia is a lack of constitution and check n balances that are REAL and ENFORCED not fake institutions like parliament, courts, govt, which are bribed like is happening in all our institutions. A constitution that restores trust by setting up audit mechanism on the government to ensure it's following the law and strict punishments if it's not. We need a psuedo american approach to our constitution where we address what happens in worst case scenario if the law is overlooked and our leaders abuse the system. This is where trust will be restored when people see tough steps taken for violators of the constitution like removal of their political mandate of govt, jailing the violator individually, financial fines, capital relocated, military options exercised by the states to over-throw the federal govt and restore their constitution, and if all fails just out right secession. You can reverse those same steps and apply it to the federal regions also to give the federal govt confidence the states abide by the constitution!!!

We need a very similar constitution to the USA...American southern states, after a bitter civil war knew there was no way to restore trust amongst the north and south if there wasn't a solution applied to allow for states to fight the govt if it breaks the constitution or if that fails to secede and leave before it ends up in another civil war or proxy nations take advantage of it and start causing friction in the land!!!

But that's just my opinion on the matter, I think due to a lack of check n balances that are 'real' in the constitution that can give somalis confidence if any clans play games, it won't be them winning but the clan who obeyed the system as they can exercise many options which I listed above!!!
 
I hope no1 takes this to mean I have a become a western democrat. I haven't but if the minds are so colonized, the only option I have left is to figure out a way to get their system to fit in with our culture so it actually lasts and doesnt collapse or live on fragile foundations!!!
 
It's funny how very few in this forum provide solutions, they are very quick to criticize the govt(dahir alasow approach) yet provide no damn solutions. This govt has told us, this is the time we put our minds together and come up with solutions as this is the best time we have ever had to actually see it through!!! I used to be very tribal also because I saw no hope in our leaders to actually do something about what's really affecting our nation but now that I do see the right leaders there, it's time we all contribute to solutions rather then just criticize them cause that is not constructive criticism but destructive as you are not replacing what your criticizing with and leaving a vaccum. It's best to stay silent if you can't offer a better alternative. I hate 4.5 but I stay silent on it because I do not see real better alternative if I didn't stay silent and just criticized it, That's destructive politics!!!
 

SirLancelLord

Reformation of Somaliland
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There's no point looking at others for a precedent to create a democratic system for your country, there's one closer to home that despite its setbacks has created a system that kinda works: I'm talking about Somaliland but straightaway I can sense the hate flowing in you upon the utterance of the term aside from all your hate look at the system they've build since 1993.

Somaliland has a hybrid system of governance combining traditional and western institutions. In a series of inter-clan conferences, culminating in the Borama Conference in 1993, a qabil (clan or community) system of government was constructed, which consisted of an Executive, with a President, Vice President, and legislative government; a bicameral Legislature; and an independent judiciary. The traditional Somali elderates (guurti) was incorporated into the governance structure and formed the upper house, responsible for managing internal conflicts. Government became in essence a "power-sharing coalition of Somaliland's main clans," with seats in the Upper and Lower houses proportionally allocated to clans according to a pre-determined formula. In 2002, after several extensions of this interim government, Somaliland finally made the transition to multi-party democracy, with district council elections contested by six parties

For its first twelve years, Somaliland had no political parties but instead followed more traditional clan-based forms of political organization. Political parties were introduced during the presidential elections and it was hoped that the recent parliamentary elections would help to usher in a representative system without allowing representation to be overtly clan-based.

District elections then held determined which parties were allowed to contest the parliamentary and presidential elections, where a party was required to demonstrate at least twenty percent of the popular vote from four out of the six regions. This was designed to ensure that parties would not organize around ethnic lines. Three parties were selected to submit presidential candidates: the United Democratic Peoples’ Party (UDUB), Kulmiye, and the Party for Justice and Welfare (UCID). On April 14, 2003, 488,543[citation needed] voters participated in the presidential elections, which ran more or less smoothly. The result was a slim eighty vote controversial victory for UDUB over the Kulmiye, complicated by allegations of ballot stuffing against the incumbent UDUB. Despite calls for the Kulmiye to form a rival government, the party’s leadership did not do so, instead choosing to abide by the Supreme Court ruling that declared UDUB’s victory. Despite minor demonstrations, the transition to the presidency of Dahir Riyale Kahin proceeded peacefully. A traditional system of governance consisted of clan elders who go by titles such as sultans, guurti or akils. They usually ordered the paying of diya, which is a payment system for any grievances, or dealt in arbitration matters.[2]
 

SuldaanGuled

Rag waa shaah dumarna waa sheeko.
You seem to be naive tbh what makes you think it will work now when it didn't in the past (post colonisation) ? all of you're advocating for is a top-down approach when the opposite approach is needed. Shacabka only gravitate to their needs not the system don't conflate the two. Qabyalad is inevitable it will always exist with us the solution is to contain it's negative impacts in the society.

If they failed to unite under islam they will most certainly fail to unite under any other banner, checks, balances, system etc are all dependent on people to work effectively so if the people aren't of good credibility whatever is dependent on them will not work. 4.5, political parties all lead to one thing more fractioning of the people whatever good has come from it is overshadowed by it's negative outcomes which outweigh it. People have lost trust in each other & unless that is fixed nothing will work. Superimposing alien ways of governance on such people is a disaster waiting to happen. it happened in the 60s,90s & it will happen in the future as well.

Why limit our options to democracy ? is it because you're convinced it's a better form of government or ?
 
Sri Lance, I thought about the percentage gained in each district and find it won't work cause a-lot of somali districts or regions as most are solely owned by a majority clan. That was the first thing that came to my mind to gain 30% or some figure for a political party at each region but I came across the problem most of the 18 regions are solely settled by a majority tribe and they can easily gain that figure!!!. SL system of including the clan elders is also not the best system, the clan elders should not get involved in politics but keep strictly in the rural matters!!! Infact joining politics is killing off their respect in rural areas but since the system is so strong in rural areas it really hasn't effected it that much untill a 'city' hand brings over its clan wars in the city to the nomads, which honestly is the only disturbance these folks ever had.

We should only ask the clan elders how to design a system that complements the culture, not have them actually involved!!! That is my two cents.

By the way suldanguled, I am with you bro, I am not interested in democracy but what can we do if the people are so gravitated towards it due to 'colonialism' and see no other viable system other then what the 'white man' taught them!!! the best me and you can do is at least design the system so it actually complements our cultures avoiding the pit traps of previous attempts!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

A sane man to an insane society must appear insane
Stay WOKE
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@DR OSMAN YOU'RE A SECULARIST GAAL.


Quran (33:36) - "It is not fitting for a Believer, man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Messenger to have any option about their decision."

Quran (18:26) - "Allah... makes none to share in His Decision and His Rule"

Quran (45:21) - "What! Do those who seek after evil ways think that We shall hold them equal with those who believe and do righteous deeds,- that equal will be their life and their death? Ill is the judgment that they make." Unbelievers are not equal to Muslims. This is dutifully reflected in Islamic law.

Quran (5:44) - "Whosoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed is among the disbelievers." A government run by "true" Muslims is a theocracy. Anything less, including democracy or secularism, is a sign of apostasy. This is why terrorists feel justified in their fight for an Islamic state.

Quran (39:9) - "Are those who know equal to those who know not?"

Quran (4:141) - "...And never will Allah grant to the unbelievers a way (to triumphs) over the believers." This is at odds with democracy, which allows anyone to serve in a position of power over others regardless of religious belief.

Quran (63:8) - "...might (power) belongs to Allah and to His messenger and to the believers;" ie. not to anyone else.

Quran (5:49) - "So judge between them by that which Allah hath revealed, and follow not their desires, but beware of them lest they seduce thee from some part of that which Allah hath revealed unto thee" Allah's Quran takes priority over the desires of the people. A democratic nation is by nature one that is not governed by Islamic law, meaning that a Muslim citizen would have divided loyalty. It's clear from this verse which side he must choose.

Quran (12:40) - "...Allah hath sent down no authority: the command is for none but Allah..." Sometimes translated as "None have the right to legislate except Allah."

Quran (4:123) - "Not your desires, nor those of the People of the Book (can prevail): whoever works evil, will be requited accordingly. Nor will he find, besides Allah, any protector or helper."

Quran (4:59) - "O you who believe! Obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority from among you..."Obedience is strictly limited to a government drawn from believers, not from the broader community. This verse has also been used to justify submission to autocratic rule, however oppressive it may by. As an Arab tradition put is: "tyranny is better than anarchy."

Quran (9:3) - "...Allah and his messenger are free from obligation to the unbelievers..." Muhammad used this "revelation" to dissolve a standing treaty and chase non-Muslims from their homes if they wouldn't accept Islam. This practice would be incompatible with democratic rule, in which everyone is considered equal.



Sahih Bukhari (88:219) - "Never will succeed such a nation as makes a woman their ruler."

Sahih Bukhari (89:251) - Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever obeys me, obeys Allah, and whoever disobeys me, disobeys Allah, and whoever obeys the ruler I appoint, obeys me, and whoever disobeys him, disobeys me."The ruler referred to here is the Caliph, who is appointed by Allah, not by popular election. Democratic rule has no legitimacy against the will of the Caliph who, as we see by chain of reference, has the authority of Allah.

At-Tirmidhi 169) - There is no obedience to anyone who is in disobedience to Allah
 
You seem to be naive tbh what makes you think it will work now when it didn't in the past (post colonisation) ? all of you're advocating for is a top-down approach when the opposite approach is needed. Shacabka only gravitate to their needs not the system don't conflate the two. Qabyalad is inevitable it will always exist with us the solution is to contain it's negative impacts in the society.

If they failed to unite under islam they will most certainly fail to unite under any other banner, checks, balances, system etc are all dependent on people to work effectively so if the people aren't of good credibility whatever is dependent on them will not work. 4.5, political parties all lead to one thing more fractioning of the people whatever good has come from it is overshadowed by it's negative outcomes which outweigh it. People have lost trust in each other & unless that is fixed nothing will work. Superimposing alien ways of governance on such people is a disaster waiting to happen. it happened in the 60s,90s & it will happen in the future as well.

Why limit our options to democracy ? is it because you're convinced it's a better form of government or ?
Your totally spot on. I have argued this point from day 1, but it doesn't seem a-lot of somalis understand this. We all know the root cause of our problem is one of trust. If there is no 'socially accepted' contract between a people, I am not sure how u can set up trust to flourish. For example in rural areas they say when two people marry, 'way xeero galeen' lol. Xeer is a social constract!!! That's only for two people that need some sort of sort contract that bestows on them rights yet expects responsibilities and if they fail to deliver on that, there must be a strict consequence applied. Exactly how they handle matters in rural areas, if there wasn't consequences applied for breaches of their 'xeer' it would never foster trust among clans as everyone will just get away with about anything they want. No nomad would be able to achieve his way of life seeking pasture and water resources if all the nomads in each district had no system of trust among themselves to faciliate free movement and sharing of resources like they did in BARI during the drought!!! None of that is feasible if there is no underlying system they all trust and do not doubt it.

I only disagree with one part on you, if we adopt a consequence style constitution that stipulates and enforces punishment for breaches they agree on, it will prevent breaches from happening. Without consequences I am not sure how you going to create confidence and trust among people who are very overtly suspicious of each other and agenda. The goal we want to achieve is resemble the peace and stability of the nomads, once we can get our city folks to enjoy that same level of peace and abide by the system, it's possible to achieve anything and move towards accelerated growth across the country in a very short time frame. When the nomads put peace among themselves thru their system, it allowed them to carry on pursuing their set goals. The only difference the city folks will have is their set goals will be 'development' and this will allow our people to stop fighting the system and head off and carry on development!!!
 
@DR OSMAN YOU'RE A SECULARIST GAAL.


Quran (33:36) - "It is not fitting for a Believer, man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Messenger to have any option about their decision."

Quran (18:26) - "Allah... makes none to share in His Decision and His Rule"

Quran (45:21) - "What! Do those who seek after evil ways think that We shall hold them equal with those who believe and do righteous deeds,- that equal will be their life and their death? Ill is the judgment that they make." Unbelievers are not equal to Muslims. This is dutifully reflected in Islamic law.

Quran (5:44) - "Whosoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed is among the disbelievers." A government run by "true" Muslims is a theocracy. Anything less, including democracy or secularism, is a sign of apostasy. This is why terrorists feel justified in their fight for an Islamic state.

Quran (39:9) - "Are those who know equal to those who know not?"

Quran (4:141) - "...And never will Allah grant to the unbelievers a way (to triumphs) over the believers." This is at odds with democracy, which allows anyone to serve in a position of power over others regardless of religious belief.

Quran (63:8) - "...might (power) belongs to Allah and to His messenger and to the believers;" ie. not to anyone else.

Quran (5:49) - "So judge between them by that which Allah hath revealed, and follow not their desires, but beware of them lest they seduce thee from some part of that which Allah hath revealed unto thee" Allah's Quran takes priority over the desires of the people. A democratic nation is by nature one that is not governed by Islamic law, meaning that a Muslim citizen would have divided loyalty. It's clear from this verse which side he must choose.

Quran (12:40) - "...Allah hath sent down no authority: the command is for none but Allah..." Sometimes translated as "None have the right to legislate except Allah."

Quran (4:123) - "Not your desires, nor those of the People of the Book (can prevail): whoever works evil, will be requited accordingly. Nor will he find, besides Allah, any protector or helper."

Quran (4:59) - "O you who believe! Obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority from among you..."Obedience is strictly limited to a government drawn from believers, not from the broader community. This verse has also been used to justify submission to autocratic rule, however oppressive it may by. As an Arab tradition put is: "tyranny is better than anarchy."

Quran (9:3) - "...Allah and his messenger are free from obligation to the unbelievers..." Muhammad used this "revelation" to dissolve a standing treaty and chase non-Muslims from their homes if they wouldn't accept Islam. This practice would be incompatible with democratic rule, in which everyone is considered equal.



Sahih Bukhari (88:219) - "Never will succeed such a nation as makes a woman their ruler."

Sahih Bukhari (89:251) - Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever obeys me, obeys Allah, and whoever disobeys me, disobeys Allah, and whoever obeys the ruler I appoint, obeys me, and whoever disobeys him, disobeys me."The ruler referred to here is the Caliph, who is appointed by Allah, not by popular election. Democratic rule has no legitimacy against the will of the Caliph who, as we see by chain of reference, has the authority of Allah.

At-Tirmidhi 169) - There is no obedience to anyone who is in disobedience to Allah
@DR OSMAN YOU'RE A SECULARIST GAAL.


Quran (33:36) - "It is not fitting for a Believer, man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Messenger to have any option about their decision."

Quran (18:26) - "Allah... makes none to share in His Decision and His Rule"

Quran (45:21) - "What! Do those who seek after evil ways think that We shall hold them equal with those who believe and do righteous deeds,- that equal will be their life and their death? Ill is the judgment that they make." Unbelievers are not equal to Muslims. This is dutifully reflected in Islamic law.

Quran (5:44) - "Whosoever does not judge by what Allah has revealed is among the disbelievers." A government run by "true" Muslims is a theocracy. Anything less, including democracy or secularism, is a sign of apostasy. This is why terrorists feel justified in their fight for an Islamic state.

Quran (39:9) - "Are those who know equal to those who know not?"

Quran (4:141) - "...And never will Allah grant to the unbelievers a way (to triumphs) over the believers." This is at odds with democracy, which allows anyone to serve in a position of power over others regardless of religious belief.

Quran (63:8) - "...might (power) belongs to Allah and to His messenger and to the believers;" ie. not to anyone else.

Quran (5:49) - "So judge between them by that which Allah hath revealed, and follow not their desires, but beware of them lest they seduce thee from some part of that which Allah hath revealed unto thee" Allah's Quran takes priority over the desires of the people. A democratic nation is by nature one that is not governed by Islamic law, meaning that a Muslim citizen would have divided loyalty. It's clear from this verse which side he must choose.

Quran (12:40) - "...Allah hath sent down no authority: the command is for none but Allah..." Sometimes translated as "None have the right to legislate except Allah."

Quran (4:123) - "Not your desires, nor those of the People of the Book (can prevail): whoever works evil, will be requited accordingly. Nor will he find, besides Allah, any protector or helper."

Quran (4:59) - "O you who believe! Obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority from among you..."Obedience is strictly limited to a government drawn from believers, not from the broader community. This verse has also been used to justify submission to autocratic rule, however oppressive it may by. As an Arab tradition put is: "tyranny is better than anarchy."

Quran (9:3) - "...Allah and his messenger are free from obligation to the unbelievers..." Muhammad used this "revelation" to dissolve a standing treaty and chase non-Muslims from their homes if they wouldn't accept Islam. This practice would be incompatible with democratic rule, in which everyone is considered equal.



Sahih Bukhari (88:219) - "Never will succeed such a nation as makes a woman their ruler."

Sahih Bukhari (89:251) - Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever obeys me, obeys Allah, and whoever disobeys me, disobeys Allah, and whoever obeys the ruler I appoint, obeys me, and whoever disobeys him, disobeys me."The ruler referred to here is the Caliph, who is appointed by Allah, not by popular election. Democratic rule has no legitimacy against the will of the Caliph who, as we see by chain of reference, has the authority of Allah.

At-Tirmidhi 169) - There is no obedience to anyone who is in disobedience to Allah
Excellent idea, now put that to practise rather then preaching. Go unite the islamists behind the quran and I will be the first to follow you. If only the islamist were one bloc and united behind this system it would give them 'credibility'. Just don't come to me or other somalis when you your own idealogy is fractured across hizbul islam-shabab-alitihaad-alictisaam-al islah-sadiq bil xaq or whatever they called and god knows what else is in store for them. These people do not believe in islam at all, they use it for political gain or they wouldn't be fractured along 'tribal or idealogical' lines themselves!!!

There is no reason why the islamist are fractured so bad since you share one book, it should only generate one group muslims not 100s. I can understand why democracy fractures people into parties cause people have different ideas, but islamism, there is only one idea it should never be more then 1 bloc. So nice try with your deflecting on me, islamist I think will need to be part of the solution but if they can't demonstrate how their idea will fit in with our culture, oh my will we encounter the same or more problem with this system also!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

A sane man to an insane society must appear insane
Stay WOKE
VIP
Excellent idea, now put that to practise rather then preaching. Go unite the islamists behind the quran and I will be the first to follow you. If only the islamist were one bloc and united behind this system it would give them 'credibility'. Just don't come to me or other somalis when you your own idealogy is fractured across hizbul islam-shabab-alitihaad-alictisaam-al islah-sadiq bil xaq or whatever they called and god knows what else is in store for them. These people do not believe in islam at all, they use it for political gain or they wouldn't be fractured along 'tribal or idealogical' lines themselves!!!
"just don't come at me and other Somalis when your own ideology is fractured"?


So you are admitting that you don't believe in Islam & that you're not a Muslim?
 
Do not worry islamist a thread is coming in the future regarding islam and the role religions plays, I still haven't gotten around to it as of late!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

A sane man to an insane society must appear insane
Stay WOKE
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Do not worry islamist a thread is coming in the future regarding islam and the role religions plays, I still haven't gotten around to it as of late!!!
So I am an Islamist terrorist fundamentalist insurgent now for merely quoting the Quran?

May Allah help us his slaves to see things as they are and not as they appear to be amiin ya rabb.
 
What sort of democracy should Somalia adopt? I personally am no fan of it and prefer a nomadic system(locally crafted system reflecting our culture, similar to what the UAE did) but it seems the will of the people is gravitating towards this system, so I am putting my mind to work trying to see how we can fit it into our country while making sure it addresses tribalism and unites people on ideology rather then clan by ensuring there is counter measures in the system to confront clannism.

I think we need to take key lessons from the past. In the 1960's our democracy had some major side effects, other then passing along power, we forget the huge amount of corruption that existed, 100s of clan parties, attempted coups, then a real coup, assassination of president, if we kept going on that system it was bound to collapse as there was already big holes already there. I think the main reason for the holes in the system was purely colonial. The colonials united us and when they left, well guess what there was no real factor uniting us any longer. The uniting factor holding us together the 'colonizers' weren't in the picture anymore and therefore we broke back down into age old institutions(tribalism) and turned on each other.

If we were didn't inherit a 'foreign system, parties, majority rules against consensus' and an 'alien structure of governance such as centralism', there wouldn't be that rat race of tribalism happening. The clans felt they lost their autonomy since the structure of government was centralized in mogadishu. They felt power, resources, decision making, etc wasn't be distributed according to consensual style politics which is how our nomads operate through a consensus(no clan basically dictates but reach common ground thru dialogue and consensus). But our system wasn't built on consensus, it was majority takes all, no dialogue, no consensus needed. Coupled with the fact the uniting factor uniting us was no longer around and a government structure that was highly centralized and against autonomy which is critical for a nomadic society their own self rule. I can see clearly why this system failed, it was inherently foreign and was working in counter to our own cultural back-drop.

Now I won't go into why im so anti democratic in this thread, I think everyone who reads my articles can clearly see that. I want to address how we can fit democracy into our culture and actually make it work, rather then re-hash the past systems and end up with similar results. I think a Somali democracy could work in theory. For example parties are limited to a certain number, all parties must be 4.5 composition or have equal number representation for each region of somalia, nomination of president will only occur after the election to counter anyone voting along tribal lines. Basically all Somalis will see is 2-3 parties all the same in terms of tribal/district composition only key difference between them will be idealogy. I think it is great no-one knowing who will lead the party until after the election. This can also allow for 4.5 to secretly work in the background and elect each tribe to the presidency on a rotation basis as to satisfy the nations tribes.

How will election results be decided? will it be majority rule or consensual? Do we want a system where mps run for seats in the districts and we just tally who won the most districts out of the 92 districts? This form of democracy is closer to our culture as it will represent the whole nation equally. For example each district gets 3 seats each. The party that wins that district gets those three votes towards their party in Mogadishu. Then at the end we can calculate which party won the most districts out of the 92 districts. This allows for national parties to have a 'weji qaran' and representative of the whole somalia people and not just 'large tribes' which is what happens in kenya unfortunately and why other tribes constantly riot.

We are of course are going to need counter measures in place, strict laws on corruption. For example stiff sentencing, name and shaming thru the media, party fines, criminal database system where culprit or party involved are black listed for life and all sectors in the country will need to run checks on any future employees. Somalia has the highest rate of corruption yet 0 are jailed for it. No punishment whatsoever!!! How can a country be serious about defeating corruption if there isn't a strict system in place to identify it through(auditing checks) and applying strict punishments where relevant when someone is found guilty of it. Singapore for example don't play around, it's automatic death penalty!!!

I mean don't get me wrong, I am no fan of this system, but since alot of people are we are going to have to look at ways that are not 'western' and more somali orientated to get it to fit into our culture and work with our culture rather then against it and identify weak points in the system that can be manipulated and cause the system to lose confidence in the people.

I honestly do not think the system is all that important, it's like a bed, I think the system is the bed sheet, the bed however is the constitution. If the constitution is weak or not reflecting our culture, the system(bed sheet) which sits on the constitution is going to crumble from within as their is no 'effective' check n balances. pointless!!!

The real issue in Somalia is a lack of constitution and check n balances that are REAL and ENFORCED not fake institutions like parliament, courts, govt, which are bribed like is happening in all our institutions. A constitution that restores trust by setting up audit mechanism on the government to ensure it's following the law and strict punishments if it's not. We need a psuedo american approach to our constitution where we address what happens in worst case scenario if the law is overlooked and our leaders abuse the system. This is where trust will be restored when people see tough steps taken for violators of the constitution like removal of their political mandate of govt, jailing the violator individually, financial fines, capital relocated, military options exercised by the states to over-throw the federal govt and restore their constitution, and if all fails just out right secession. You can reverse those same steps and apply it to the federal regions also to give the federal govt confidence the states abide by the constitution!!!

We need a very similar constitution to the USA...American southern states, after a bitter civil war knew there was no way to restore trust amongst the north and south if there wasn't a solution applied to allow for states to fight the govt if it breaks the constitution or if that fails to secede and leave before it ends up in another civil war or proxy nations take advantage of it and start causing friction in the land!!!

But that's just my opinion on the matter, I think due to a lack of check n balances that are 'real' in the constitution that can give somalis confidence if any clans play games, it won't be them winning but the clan who obeyed the system as they can exercise many options which I listed above!!!
Ego stroking.
 

Cognitivedissonance

A sane man to an insane society must appear insane
Stay WOKE
VIP
Why are you afraid to admit you're not a Muslim? Imagine if you're this shook online imagine how shook you will be when you go to Somalia and preach your secularism :chrisfreshhah:

ALLAHU AKBAR:rejoice:
ALLAHU AKBAR:rejoice:


ALLAHU AKBAR :rejoice:
 
"just don't come at me and other Somalis when your own ideology is fractured"?


So you are admitting that you don't believe in Islam & that you're not a Muslim?
I do not believe in political islam, that's all I will say!!! I feel when we die it's not about how big your khalifat was, it's more so about you standing before god as an 'individual' under shared equality across race, country, gender. This is why I argue for full rights for women. Women and Men are treated equally before god when they die, the only thing that differientiates them is is 'life results'. We should only differentiate people on 'results' also!!! But this a very long topic, I will get around to it. It will be Islam and it's rightful role in Somalia!!! Don't underestimate me, I do respect the ulama, they have alot of influence over the people, they have access to their ear in mosque. They will be addressed by me and how to get them won over!!!
 

Cognitivedissonance

A sane man to an insane society must appear insane
Stay WOKE
VIP
I do not believe in political islam, that's all I will say!!! I feel when we die it's not about how big your khalifat was, it's more so about you standing before god as an 'individual' under shared equality across race, country, gender. This is why I argue for full rights for women. Women and Men are treated equally before god when they die, the only thing that differientiates them is is 'life results'. We should only differentiate people on 'results' also!!! But this a very long topic, I will get around to it. It will be Islam and it's rightful role in Somalia!!! Don't underestimate me, I do respect the ulama, they have alot of influence over the people, they have access to their ear in mosque. They will be addressed by me and how to get them won over!!!
You can't pick and choose which part of Islam to follow its all or nothing & if you don't believe that legislation is only for Allah then you've committed shirk which is associating partners with Allah I hate to break it to you but you're a gaal:mybusiness:
 
You can't pick and choose which part of Islam to follow its all or nothing & if you don't believe that legislation is only for Allah then you've committed shirk which is associating partners with Allah I hate to break it to you but you're a gaal:mybusiness:
Listen you will need to wait untill I analyze this topic fully, you will understand my position!!! But it's not really about me anyways. It's about how to leave behind a working system for the people that will actually work. Please wait till I address this issue in the future, till then stick to topic.
 

Cognitivedissonance

A sane man to an insane society must appear insane
Stay WOKE
VIP
Listen you will need to wait untill I analyze this topic fully, you will understand my position!!! But it's not really about me anyways. It's about how to leave behind a working system for the people that will actually work. Please wait till I address this issue in the future, till then stick to topic.
The topic is about Somalia & last time I checked Somalia was 99.9% Muslim and I'm talking about the shariah which is the pillar & the foundation that our current constitution is based on so yes I am on topic.


You declared on this thread that you don't believe in political Islam and by saying that you acknowledged that ALLAH isn't the law giver Rather it's the people who decide What's law and that's shirk which is associating partners with Allah which takes one out the fold of Islam.




“Surely, His alone is the creation and the command; blessed is Allah, Lord of the worlds.” (7:54)

“He has legislated for you that religion which He commanded unto Noah, and that which We inspire in you (Muhammad), and that which We commanded unto Abraham and Moses and Jesus, saying: Establish the religion, and be not divided therein.” (42:13)
 
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