Xamar was established by nomads

[hanif#]

Nope, he doesn't state that, anyone that knows a pinch of Arabic would be able to know, You can't prove reer samaale presence at the time either, xamar is well older than Samaale, you can't name who their supposed descendants would be .

Lool. Tell us what it is saying.

And as I told you I'm not Samaale and I don't care about him

 

[HabarSteven12]

Zero correlation whatsoever, he wasn't from any samaale clan , samaale's didn't reside in Muqdisho at the time and you've got no way to prove it. Local manuscripts written by natives take precedence over foreign eye witnesses, if what the travelers says agrees with the known history of muqdisho then it's taken simple as that. Banaadiri isn't an ethnic group, simply means people of Banaadir doesn't need to be mentioned because the whole coast was inhabited by banaadiris not specific areas just like how whole Swahili coast was inhabited by swahilis or whole bajuni coast was inhabited by bajunis

That source is incorrect, we don't need Italian sources to tell us about our alliances when we know it ourselves .

Yacquub is an alliance of
1- Reer Cali Imaam
2- Faqi Cali ( Shaanshi)
3-Abaakarow ( Hatimi)
4- Abdisamad

View attachment 306959
580 covers Yacquub alliance+ Ba Fadhal.
View attachment 306960

Same thing mentioned in Shariif Caydaruus book.

I said half of the 650 would be gibil cad as in the census the 650 covers reer sheekh and the seddex geedi which is an alliance of

1- Aadandheere ( Gibil Cad)
2- Indhoweyne (mixed confederacy)
3- Ba Sadiq (Gibil Cad)
4- Alaa-uddin ( Gibil Cad)
5 - Reer Cabdalla ( garjante)
6- Cawaale ( hawiye caye)
View attachment 306961

The same incorrect source you used doubts the gibil madow of seddex being of free origin ie saying they're not samaale which is incorrect.

I've clarified all the doubts now, don't want to see any hotep trying to claim otherwise , the census shows that gibil madow reer samaale's were infact lesser than other gibil madows.

Thank you for sharing this very well-detailed and comprehensive analysis. Brother, I advise you not to further engage with the individual you responded to. He is deliberately trying to waste your time. Someone of your caliber shouldn't be interacting with him. He will just keep disregarding your sources with the intention of making you upset. He is desperately trying to bait you.

Imam Shafi once said, "If a fool speaks to you, do not answer him, for the best answer is silence. If you speak to him, you have delighted him. If you leave him, he nearly dies in anguish.” The individual you responded to has a poor cognitive system, which affects his ability to understand complex academic literature and analyze historical sources with a critical eye. Allah says the truth will prevail, and falsehood is bound to perish.

 

[Zak12]

Local manuscripts written by natives take precedence over foreign eye witnesses,

Unlike the manuscripts, those eyewitness accounts are literal primary sources, the same kind that Habarsteven12 cries about having. There should be no question as to which source is more important. Those manuscripts are just collections of oral tales done several hundred years after the middle ages. They haven't been carbon dated, have no real authenticity beyond "dude trust me". You can't even find an English translation of Ayrudus' manuscripts because they are so irrelevant. No scholar either Somali or Ajnabi have used these in any serious study of Somali history and the only reason you are shilling them is because its the only thing that agrees with your narrative.

 

[Zak12]

Thank you for sharing this very well-detailed and comprehensive analysis. Brother, I advise you not to further engage with the individual you responded to. He is deliberately trying to waste your time. Someone of your caliber shouldn't be interacting with him. He will just keep disregarding your sources with the intention of making you upset. He is desperately trying to bait you.

Imam Shafi once said, "If a fool speaks to you, do not answer him, for the best answer is silence. If you speak to him, you have delighted him. If you leave him, he nearly dies in anguish.” The individual you responded to has a poor cognitive system, which affects his ability to understand complex academic literature and analyze historical sources with a critical eye. Allah says the truth will prevail, and falsehood is bound to perish.

Lmao, I caught you lying once about the meaning of Barbar you little mishling. Don't talk about truth.

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

Unlike the manuscripts, those eyewitness accounts are literal primary sources, the same kind that Habarsteven12 cries about having. There should be no question as to which source is more important. Those manuscripts are just collections of oral tales done several hundred years after the middle ages. They haven't been carbon dated, have no real authenticity beyond "dude trust me". You can't even find an English translation of Ayrudus' manuscripts because they are so irrelevant. No scholar either Somali or Ajnabi have used these in any serious study of Somali history and the only reason you are shilling them is because its the only thing that agrees with your narrative.

Sounds like cope from an envious lamagoodle , Aydarus's works has been translated into English obviously not the whole book but you'll see many citing it along with his son's book aswell, either way foreigners citing his works or not doesn't concern us. Banadiri sources are sufficient for banadiri history, you can worry about trying to decipher your Chinese whispers oral history.

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

Lool. Tell us what it is saying.

And as I told you I'm not Samaale and I don't care about him

It says the area was named Xamarweyne after it had been built. There's a reason "Weyne" was added to it, because of xamar already existing. Likewise jajab was added to xamar jajab centuries after the area was left in ruins.

 

[Zak12]

Sounds like cope from an envious lamagoodle , Aydarus's works has been translated into English obviously not the whole book but you'll see many citing it along with his son's book aswell, either way foreigners citing his works or not doesn't concern us. Banadiri sources are sufficient for banadiri history, you can worry about trying to decipher your Chinese whispers oral history.

I use the sources of credible scholars like Cassanelli, Njoku, and Trimingham to prove my claims as well as other reputable sources like Cambridge. You use random unverified manuscripts. We are not the same. You can continue coping about your people faking their history.

 

[Zak12]

Saylac was administered by Arabs until recently

Proof?

 

[hanif#]

It says the area was named Xamarweyne after it had been built.

So what? How does this contradict my claim?

There's a reason "Weyne" was added to it, because of xamar already existing.

What reason is that and how do you know Xamar was already existing and weyne was added to the name "Xamar" after it had been settled for yers/centuries? You are inventing fake theories at the spot.

 

[killerxsmoke]

What manuscripts is he even talking about?

random shit he pulled out from his ass

 

[attash]

Zero correlation whatsoever, he wasn't from any samaale clan , samaale's didn't reside in Muqdisho at the time and you've got no way to prove it. Local manuscripts written by natives take precedence over foreign eye witnesses, if what the travelers says agrees with the known history of muqdisho then it's taken simple as that. Banaadiri isn't an ethnic group, simply means people of Banaadir doesn't need to be mentioned because the whole coast was inhabited by banaadiris not specific areas just like how whole Swahili coast was inhabited by swahilis or whole bajuni coast was inhabited by bajunis

So manuscripts written hundreds of years after the fact are more reliable than a person recording what he saw with his own eyes? I don't understand what your obsession is with "reer samaale", I've already said it doesn't matter whether he was Samaale or not (by "Samaale", I assume you mean Maxaa tiri speakers), Ibn Battuta makes it very clear that he was from a Somali group. He said that the Sultan of Mogadishu was from a non Arab negro group that inhabited the lands between Zeila and Mogadishu, i.e. Somalis.

I brought you a direct first hand account of a person writing down what he saw with his own two eyes. If you are not convinced by this, I really don't know what to say to you at this point. Was Ibn Battuta hallucinating? Was he not able to tell the difference between a light skinned Arab and a dark skinned Somali? Was he not able to distinguish between Arabic and local Somali dialects? What is it?

That source is incorrect, we don't need Italian sources to tell us about our alliances when we know it ourselves .

Yacquub is an alliance of
1- Reer Cali Imaam
2- Faqi Cali ( Shaanshi)
3-Abaakarow ( Hatimi)
4- Abdisamad

View attachment 306959
580 covers Yacquub alliance+ Ba Fadhal.
View attachment 306960

Same thing mentioned in Shariif Caydaruus book.

I said half of the 650 would be gibil cad as in the census the 650 covers reer sheekh and the seddex geedi which is an alliance of

1- Aadandheere ( Gibil Cad)
2- Indhoweyne (mixed confederacy)
3- Ba Sadiq (Gibil Cad)
4- Alaa-uddin ( Gibil Cad)
5 - Reer Cabdalla ( garjante)
6- Cawaale ( hawiye caye)
View attachment 306961

The same incorrect source you used doubts the gibil madow of seddex being of free origin ie saying they're not samaale which is incorrect.

I've clarified all the doubts now, don't want to see any hotep trying to claim otherwise , the census shows that gibil madow reer samaale's were infact lesser than other gibil madows.

Thank you for bringing sources, I will do further research into this topic.

 

[killerxsmoke]

So manuscripts written hundreds of years after the fact are more reliable than a person recording what he saw with his own eyes? I don't understand what your obsession is with "reer samaale", I've already said it doesn't matter whether he was Samaale or not (by "Samaale", I assume you mean Maxaa tiri speakers), Ibn Battuta makes it very clear that he was from a Somali group. He said that the Sultan of Mogadishu was from a non Arab negro group that inhabited the lands between Zeila and Mogadishu, i.e. Somalis.

I brought you a direct first hand account of a person writing down what he saw with his own two eyes. If you are not convinced by this, I really don't know what to say to you at this point. Was Ibn Battuta hallucinating? Was he not able to tell the difference between a light skinned Arab and a dark skinned Somali? Was he not able to distinguish between Arabic and local Somali dialects? What is it?

Thank you for bringing sources, I will do further research into this topic.

are they still denying that when ibn Battuta was speaking of Berbera he was talking about Somalis??

 

[killerxsmoke]

ibn khaldun saying that somalis owned mogadishu, what more proof do u niggas need

Besides them one finds the Barbara, of which the poet Imru'u-l-Qays speaks in his verses. Islam is nowadays very extended among them. They have a town on the Indian ocean called Mogadishu, which is often visited by Muslim merchants.

 

[attash]

Thank you for sharing this very well-detailed and comprehensive analysis. Brother, I advise you not to further engage with the individual you responded to. He is deliberately trying to waste your time. Someone of your caliber shouldn't be interacting with him. He will just keep disregarding your sources with the intention of making you upset. He is desperately trying to bait you.

Imam Shafi once said, "If a fool speaks to you, do not answer him, for the best answer is silence. If you speak to him, you have delighted him. If you leave him, he nearly dies in anguish.” The individual you responded to has a poor cognitive system, which affects his ability to understand complex academic literature and analyze historical sources with a critical eye. Allah says the truth will prevail, and falsehood is bound to perish.

You're actually a very messed up person. You have been caught lying many times before, including in this thread where I exposed your contradictory claims over the ethnic composition of Zeila. And yet you chose to bring the diin into this and quote Imam Shafi'i AND the Quran itself!

Troll all you want to, but do not bring the diin into this. Do not cheapen the words of the ulama and do not cheapen Allah's word with your little games.

 

[attash]

are they still denying that when ibn Battuta was speaking of Berbera he was talking about Somalis??

Yes. They are so desperate that they denying direct eye-witness accounts. I have no words.

 

[killerxsmoke]

Yes. They are so desperate that they denying direct eye-witness accounts. I have no words.

@HabarSteven12 is trying so hard to avoid me lol, he ran away from me 3 times

 

[Yami]

Proof?

Zeila was a tributary of Mocha and administered by Arabs until Haji Sharmarke took control of the town in 1841.

Rayne, Henry (1921). Sun, sand and Somals; leaves from the note-book of a district commissioner in British Somaliland. Witherby, London. pp. 15–16.

 

[killerxsmoke]

Zeila was a tributary of Mocha and administered by Arabs until Haji Sharmarke took control of the town in 1841.

it was an ottoman territory

 

[Yami]

it was an ottoman territory

Yeah Mocha was under the Ottomans

 

[killerxsmoke]

Yeah Mocha was under the Ottomans

that doesn't mean Arab were ruling that part for a long time it was only when it was under ottoman control