Prince of Lasanod
Eid trim pending
Enjoy your so called "analytical mind" when you're burning in the hell fire for eternity whilst she goes to Jannah inshallah. Now who is the genius?
Somali atheism on the rise
- Thread starter Bahal
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I'm not offended when people critique Islam, this happens all the time, be it Bill Maher or Christians trying to convert me. I just feel like people on this forum like to bash Islam from all angles under the guise of criticism, I feel that there is a certain manner you criticise any ideology in and I don't see that here, all I ever see is disrespect and it does get a little difficult to separate those who just want to hate Islam and those who genuinely have criticisms because you all come from the same place, if that makes sense? I can't tell the difference between a person who hates Islam and a person who wants to put in their two cents because you're both chanting "lmao!!111! this piece of shit doesn't even make sense"
Hadiths are a whole different thing, there are Muslims who don't even believe in them so why even talk about them? If you want to criticise Islam, criticise the Quran.
Last I checked, the only requirement to be an atheist was to not believe in a God...So in one sense you're right because I always felt that as though there was some higher power be it Allah or whoever, I just knew that there was a greater being even if I didn't believe in Islam. But the whole "analytical mind" aspect lmao, das kinda rood but it's also very stupid of you to say so I'll let you have it.
You've misunderstood me. I always knew that there were other interpretations of Islam but I just didn't stop to consider that they could be right because I was engulfed in how I thought Islam was, it wasn't until I actually studied my religion and read the Quran properly that I discovered the timeless beauty of Islam.
I really don't appreciate your demeaning tone, fucking fix it if you want to talk to me.
The_Cosmos
Pepe Trump
I'm sorry but you don't get to decide what constitutes a justified form of criticism, if you can't separate yourself from the religion you follow then it isn't on me when you feel offended. That's some childish nonsense. Hating Islam is also absolutely justified so long as one does not then associate that hate with Muslims. Islam and Muslims are two different things, one is a set of ideas and the other is made up of people. The problem is that you want others to not associate Islam with Muslims but you yourselves, can't even do that. You will see Muslims in London standing in the middle of town preaching about Islam and nobody finds that to be a terrible thing but as soon as the atheist exercises the sane right to criticise that faith as the Muslim has to spread it, you lot find it disrespectful. Plus, the way the Quran taunts the unbelievers with everlasting hell and spouts derogatory insults at them, to rehabs respect fir that book is just plain idiotic. Respect is earned and the Quran shows no respect for unbelievers.
That doesn't even make any sense, are you claiming I shouldn't criticise Islam via hadiths because "some people don't believe in them?" The overwhelming majority of Muslims accept the validity of the Hadith, in fact, without the hadiths much of Islam itself, like prayer, would be drastically different. How would one pray 5 times a day? That comes from the Hadith and not the Quran. The Hadith are the sayings and the doings of the prophet and thus I have every right to use them. That response made no sense at all, are you a Quranist?
yeah, he was non-religious anyway. Hr doesn't believe in god, well the abrahamic gods anyway.Did you tell him???
OmarLittle
Not your typical Farah
WTF, how come I didn't know warya. Did you break this to the others(you know what I mean)??????
Congrats man. My dad is theist, but lives his life like a Deist.
yeah i told them like a month ago. congrats man.
OmarLittle
Not your typical Farah
I'm now waiting for those Muslims who are like "See these ex-Muslims, their parent's weren't even practicing Muslims, that's why they're gaalo"
OmarLittle
Not your typical Farah
^^^^ 
No, my mum is the religious one. lol, wouldn't dare.
The_Cosmos
Pepe Trump
Yes…Actually, I do. Suppose, you’re in school/college/university, the essay title is along the lines of “critically evaluate abcabcabx xyyzyzyzy” Are you going to tell teachers that they don’t get to decide what makes a good evaluation?
I can separate myself from my religion which is why I’m so open to the idea of criticism in the first place. Criticise Islam all you want but at least be constructive about it. Again, you hate your version of Islam and hating an ideology that some of you don’t even understand properly is not justified at all, it’s called Islamophobia.
It’s funny you should say that I can’t separate myself from Islam when the vast majority of the time it’s atheist and Islamophobes who can’t separate Islam and Muslims and hate Islam and Muslims as though they’re one and the same.
So what’s wrong with preaching? All sorts of people preach so why is it only a terrible thing when it is a Muslim that it is preaching? You are not practicing the same right, preaching and criticisms are two very different things, I don’t understand how that isn’t apparent to you. Maybe if you criticised Islam with a certain demeanour then people may take you seriously but you can’t just say “lmao heaven and hell? Lolz moslems are so dumb xD”.
I keep telling you that Islam gets criticised every other day, I don’t understand why that keeps going over your head?
“the way the Quran taunts disbelievers”, why does it bother you so much if you don’t believe in Islam? I don’t care if Jews think I’m going to hell or if Hindus believe that I’m going to get reincarnated into a pig. Maybe it is true that disbelievers are going to hell and in such case, you can argue that it’s a clear warning. Don’t respect the Quran if you don’t want to, I can’t make you and frankly, I don’t really care.
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“The Hadith are the sayings and the doings of the prophet” Can you prove this?
No, I pick and choose which hadiths to follow, some of them seem stupid to me and are against my values as a human being and I can’t follow that. Some of them despite being branded authentic are not.
…Not every Muslim prays the same way and not every Muslim prays five times a day.
Again, it is your version of Islam that the hadiths are part of Islam, this may not be the case for other Muslims. So criticising it seems to not make much sense.
I don’t understand how it didn’t make sense, the Quran clearly states that it is the complete and perfect guide so why would you feel the need to turn to the hadiths when the essence of Islam is in the Quran.
The_Cosmos
Pepe Trump
I am bewildered by what you have just wrote to me. Nonetheless, I will reply.
The fact that you compared yourself to a teacher giving out assignments is evidence that you have no idea what you're talking about. A teacher gives students assignments telling them to critically analyse something in order so they can evaluate how well they're doing. The fact that you compared that, to a school setting guidelines as to how to get good grades is honestly laughable.
The version of Islam that I am arguing against is the version that the majority of Muslims follow, the Sunni sect of Islam. It constitutes 85% of the entire Muslim population of the world. To then go on and claim some of us have no clue about the ideology in which whom we criticise, is nonsensical as you don't have any proof that we don't understand it. In fact, it's hypocritical coming from you when you're the one who once argued with me about the true age of Aisha, claiming she wasn't 6 when she married the prophet and 9 when the marriage was consummated. The Hadith are authentic, the majority agree on it and it's testament on your ignorance of the religion you follow.
Again, you keep touting nonsense. The majority of atheists, when they criticise any religion, manage to seperate the ideology from its adherents. I have always managed to do that so your point is meaningless. If others haven't managed to do that, then address them and not me. Practice what you preach! Atheism is but a definition and thus what an atheist does cannot be used against me.
Oh my, I think you have problems understanding what I'm trying to articulate. Muslims gave the right to preach because it is a right given to them via freedom of speech. The problem is that a lot of Muslims, like yourself, want to control what can be passed as freedom of speech. Also, the difference between preaching and criticism isn't the point that is being made (I think you should read more carefully), the point is that you have the right to preach or criticise. You have the right as I have the to criticise.
Yes, Islam gets criticised everyday but around the world it's Muslims who often times kill people for it. Authentic Hadith justify killing blasphemers but of course, you pick and choose right? I'd call that hypocrisy.
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What is a Hadith:
The fact that I have to explain to you what the Hadith is, shows you know nothing.
Picking and choosing which Hadith to follow shows you to be a hypocrite suffering from cognitive dissonance. The overwhelming majority of Muslim scholars would declare you a kafir for rejecting the Hadith. When a Hadith states it's authentic, you must prove that it isn't you can't simply say "it's not authentic". What kind of nonsense is that??
It's my opinion that Hadith are apart of Islam??? Are you serious?? This is the view of the majority of Muslim scholars, past and old. The majority of Muslims follow them. The fact that you don't consider them to be Islamic is truly jaw dropping!!
The Quran doesn't designate how to pray! How do you pray?? I'm intrigued...
You’re a spectacle, everything just keeps flying over your head, it’s as though you want to argue just for the sake of arguing. Maybe you should learn how to admit that other people make valid points instead of cooking up an argument the minute I send off a reply.
I didn’t compare myself to a teacher, I used an academia setting to highlight the fact that I do get to choose what constitutes towards constructive criticism. Laughable? Right…At least I’m taken seriously, I can’t say the same for you when you constantly hide behind “criticism”, if you hate Islam just be upfront and say I hate Islam because I have yet to see you make any form of constructive criticism, everything you say is generic and can be said about any religion “disbelievers are going to get punished!!!”, wow…Yeah…Very um…A great argument…
In layman's terms: I, a practicing Sunni Muslim may not practice Islam the same way another Sunni Muslim does. How can you not comprehend such a simple concept? Have you got a source on that? (The 85% part)
If you can’t even wrap your head around the fact that Muslims practice Islam differently, how do you expect anybody to think that you can wrap your head around Islam? I said that Aisha was 9 when she got married? Funny because I have no recollection of saying that. I don’t know maybe cite your sources next time like a logical person?
Yes, I know the hadith are authentic, I’m saying that some of them aren’t. How do you know the majority agree on it? Did you ask the majority of Muslims?
What exactly am I so ignorant about? I actually studied Islam, like you know took time out of my life to try and understand the religion that I had left. I’m the last person on this forum that is ignorant about the teachings of Islam. Just because I hold different on certain things (like many other Muslims in the real world do) doesn’t mean that I’m ignorant, how did your great atheist analytical superior mind come to such a stupid conclusion? Correlation does not equate to causation? Did that cross your great atheist analytical superior mind?
Buts has u gots a sauce on dat dough? “The majority of atheists, when they criticise any religion, manage to separate the ideology from its adherents”. It so easy to say “the majority of blah blah blah” like, yo, what happened to sources and having a valid argument?
Man, I don’t know. I feel like you’re putting on façade. Atheism is the absence of a belief in a deity which is a belief in itself. What a person from one group does can’t be used against the rest of the group, my bad if I did.
Yeah, you really can’t articulate yourself well enough for others to understand you properly, which I can’t blame you, I struggle with articulating my thoughts myself.
Personally, I don’t give a shit if you say the prophet was an evil person just as how I don’t give a shit if you say that I’m going to hell but you have to understand that freedom of speech isn’t some sort of shield that can protect you from social repercussions. If you want to say some shit, be my guest but don’t turn around and be like “b-b-but freedom of sPpeech!1” once you get confronted. I can say “f*ck America!!!” but I’m not going to be shocked if some Americans confront me, that’s the reality we live in.
Yes, I pick and choose hadiths, I don’t believe in the stonings or mutilation or any of that barbarity, I’d be an idiot to. The hadiths were relevant to the times they were written and today that justice system doesn’t apply.
Regarding your blasphemy stuff, have a read through this article and maybe it will help you understand a couple things. (Of course I didn’t read all of it because it’s too long for a person with an attention span like mine so don’t ask me any questions about it, e-mail the author(s) or something.)
http://www.reviewofreligions.org/5002/what-is-the-punishment-for-blasphemy-in-islam/
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Stop answering my questions with questions, that’s not doing anything for your argument. Can you prove that the hadiths are the words of the prophet? Say yes if you can or say no if you can’t.
You couldn’t possibly be implying that I didn’t know what a hadith was? That really says more about you more than it says about me. You're saying any old thing to resuscitate your dead argument.I don’t believe you quite understand what a hypocrite is. Are you suggesting that I’m not a Muslim? I clearly follow the Quran and I clearly follow some of the hadiths so how have you come to such an absurd conclusion?
You cannot be a real human being! You just answered your own question in the same paragraph lmao. Yes, it is your opinion that the hadiths are a part of Islam hence the “majority”.
FOR THE LAST TIME DAMN TIME, I FOLLOW THE HADITHS. I can’t make it any clearer than this, why do you keep saying that I don’t follow the hadiths when you yourself said that I pick and choose in the above argument you just made? And who said that I don’t consider them Islamic, stop putting words in my mouth. Why is it jaw-dropping, I’ve come across many people that don’t believe in the hadiths, are they not Muslim because they don’t fit into your idea of what “true” Muslims are?
I pray like the majority of Muslims do but not all Muslims pray the same, does that mean they’re not Muslims? Even in the standard getting up and getting down version of praying their lies some deviations.
People on this forum really need to stop throwing around “cognitive dissonance”.
I tried to educate you on the fact there are so many different types of Muslim and that everybody practices differently but you just weren’t having it. Nothing more I can do when your great atheist analytical superior mind just can’t comprehend simplicity.
Don’t even bother responding to above arguments, I have but one question for you. How am I a hypocrite that is suffering from cognitive dissonance? Go.
I'm now waiting for those Muslims who are like "See these ex-Muslims, their parent's weren't even practicing Muslims, that's why they're gaalo"
My dad's eternal advice to me is "wadaadada iska ilaali". He is a Muslim but probably 1 epiphany away from being a deist lol.
My dad also know about my Atheism.
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The explanation are very simple, these are conformist people, they conform to whatever society they happen to be born in, practices or believes in.
If it was in the filth of the Ganji rivers up in India, it would be the great mythical Elephant God they would worship.
Had it been in the Jungles of death in Congo, they would be a Voodo worshipping miscreants.
Had it been in present day Saudi, they would be Neo-Salafist or Kharijites.
Had it been in the West, they would be Darwinist, evolutionist, spinning-ball earth believing Atheists or Agnostics at best, even Christianity if they grew up in the rapidly declining more religious circles.
These conformist are an insecure feeble minded irrational weak bunch that requires a sense of belonging to a group, and cannot think for themselves, typical group think mentality.
In this world you are either a polytheist or a monotheist, Either Darwin, Copernicus, Dawkins, Hawkins are you God's, or the Elephant multiple trio Gods of Gur nanek singh, Guro Gobi Sing or Ragu if you grew up in India.
The Somalis for as long as we have known were monotheist, from Allah, to Waaq to the Egyptian Eebow, a term we still use until this day, to describe our one powerful creator we always turned our face towards, it's the only logical rational deduction, conclusion that a healthy pure brain will come to.
The rest is nothing more then irrational conformist, inferiority riddled, expressions of self-hate, hence why you never see any respectful Somali ever come out as such.
These are you typical pseudo intellectual mastrubators, that take pride in the miss-education systems they spawned from.
They also include your s and lesbian's, most are poor lost souls that spawned from broken homes, fatherless upbringing, and they usually hail from a weak conformist lineage, with no history of pride nor resistance against invaders or foreign aggressors.
If it was in the filth of the Ganji rivers up in India, it would be the great mythical Elephant God they would worship.
Had it been in the Jungles of death in Congo, they would be a Voodo worshipping miscreants.
Had it been in present day Saudi, they would be Neo-Salafist or Kharijites.
Had it been in the West, they would be Darwinist, evolutionist, spinning-ball earth believing Atheists or Agnostics at best, even Christianity if they grew up in the rapidly declining more religious circles.
These conformist are an insecure feeble minded irrational weak bunch that requires a sense of belonging to a group, and cannot think for themselves, typical group think mentality.
In this world you are either a polytheist or a monotheist, Either Darwin, Copernicus, Dawkins, Hawkins are you God's, or the Elephant multiple trio Gods of Gur nanek singh, Guro Gobi Sing or Ragu if you grew up in India.
The Somalis for as long as we have known were monotheist, from Allah, to Waaq to the Egyptian Eebow, a term we still use until this day, to describe our one powerful creator we always turned our face towards, it's the only logical rational deduction, conclusion that a healthy pure brain will come to.
The rest is nothing more then irrational conformist, inferiority riddled, expressions of self-hate, hence why you never see any respectful Somali ever come out as such.
These are you typical pseudo intellectual mastrubators, that take pride in the miss-education systems they spawned from.
They also include your s and lesbian's, most are poor lost souls that spawned from broken homes, fatherless upbringing, and they usually hail from a weak conformist lineage, with no history of pride nor resistance against invaders or foreign aggressors.
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