If greater Somalia happened

[The Oponian Guild]

Truth of the matter is the blue flag is flying high in every city in Puntland. The people of Puntland are very patriotic and would never accept a seccesionist ideology.. This is the truth sxb.

Let’s put that to the vote and national dialogue, otherwise this is close to hearsay.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

First all what happens in Garisa would affect us, because firstly we are Muslims, Secondly we are brothers and sister and thirdly when you are a weak one qabiil nation other countries will seek to exploit you and your people. Even the EU has formed a union of multiple countries, why do you think so? While you are conditioned to divide yourself into village lines..

I think Somalis would do well under a E.U. style Union.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

@Abdisamad @Zak12 @The Oponian Guild @Devilsadvocate

I was thinking today. We place a lot of blame on qabil, but the biggest issue for Somalis is that Somalis do not respect authority and no group of people will rise and create a sustainable nation or kingdom without some sort of respect for hierarchy and accepting rulership.

I’m reminded of this quote of a Ugandan doctor in the 1910 in which he said: View attachment 368745

I remember when I first read this, I found it funny, but upon closer inspection, it’s actually a tragic state of affairs that is a by-product of tribalism in many ways but also separate. This is the sickness that afflicts the Somalis. They are without doubt ungovernable and if you look closely at world history, super powers are those that have citizens that can be steered to greatness and listen to their leaders.

The Somalis are a group of people filled with hubris, but nothing to show for it. They won’t listen to the best amongst them, because as noted by the intelligent Ugandan more then a 100 yrs earlier, everyone thinks he is a mini king or believes that an elder in his clan is more deserving than another man from another clan- even if the other is superior in every department.

This sickness I describe I’ve noticed in everyday exchanges with those raised primarily back home. I’ve noticed they’re over confident and will even debate with people who know more than them and claim to be right. Everyone is self important and believes they’re the wisest.

I feel for any future emerging politician who has a real vision for us because this is the nature of our people which is detrimental for any real progression.

The lawlessness and chaos is true for some more than others. We have hierarchy and a ruling class. Others don’t.

 

[Riftvalley]

Somalis not respecting authority is not really true. There hasn’t been any major rebellions or outbreaks of civil war since the 90s in SL or PL. The problem in the south is that there hasn’t never been an indigenous local reconciliation campaign without the interference of neighbouring states or the UN/West. If there was a government where all the clan felt that they had input and the 4.5 system was scrapped, I think such a government would have tremendous support. It is not like most Somalis did not obey the Government from the 1960s. I would say Somalis are actually yearning for a central government which is for them and is just. The ease with which the ICU took most of the south would show you this. I even believe Hassan sheikh could have taken more parts of Somalia and even extended beyond the initial areas taken from Shabab. He isn’t just a bad leader operating in a system designed to trap Somalis.

 

[reer]

The problem in the south is that there hasn’t never been an indigenous local reconciliation campaign without the interference of neighbouring states or the UN/West.

i highly doubt that is possible. because multiple brutal warlords who abused other qabiils also defended their clans' civilians during the civil war.

If there was a government where all the clan felt that they had input and the 4.5 system was scrapped, I think such a government would have tremendous support.

bro 4.5 is actually similar to somali dhaqan. the major qabiils have big piece of hilib and minorities get the calooley. in somaliweyn might makes right. the only real way to avoid 4.5 or a similar version of 4.5 is a military dictatorship like the kacaan where samatar (minority qabiil) was powerful. even AS arent like itixad they dont really shake the local clan structures.

 

[livinlavish]

I think Somalis would do well under a E.U. style Union.

I’ve been thinking about this recently as well. The most realistic form of Somaliweyn we can achieve (as of right now) is one where each state handles its own internal affairs, but on the global stage we are united. From Djibouti to DDS, to NFD, to South Somalia, to PL and beyond.

We have one army, one currency and one language. Only difference is that each state is responsible for their own local issues.

The only risk I see is that foreign powers might try to divide us or pit us against each other, which could be catastrophic and could break the entire union.

For this to work, we would need some form of reconciliation between every qabiil, so we don’t hold any grudges against each other and so that we can move forward, making it harder for outside forces to exploit our divisions.

Once the wounds of the civil war have truly healed (no matter how long it takes) we can finally rise again as one Somali nation, and make Somaliweyn a reality.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

i highly doubt that is possible. because multiple brutal warlords who abused other qabiils also defended their clans' civilians during the civil war.


bro 4.5 is actually similar to somali dhaqan. the major qabiils have big piece of hilib and minorities get the calooley. in somaliweyn might makes right. the only real way to avoid 4.5 or a similar version of 4.5 is a military dictatorship like the kacaan where samatar (minority qabiil) was powerful. even AS arent like itixad they dont really shake the local clan structures.

Token gabooye who couldn’t threaten marexan hold on power. I hate to break it to you but 4.5 was being used in the junta era too.

 

[Riftvalley]

i highly doubt that is possible. because multiple brutal warlords who abused other qabiils also defended their clans' civilians during the civil war.


bro 4.5 is actually similar to somali dhaqan. the major qabiils have big piece of hilib and minorities get the calooley. in somaliweyn might makes right. the only real way to avoid 4.5 or a similar version of 4.5 is a military dictatorship like the kacaan where samatar (minority qabiil) was powerful. even AS arent like itixad they dont really shake the local clan structures.

Reconciliation between clans can happen even if takes a while. A lot of people forget that the Isaaq had a mini civil war a few years after declaring independence. Elders literally went on tour going to different locations making peace between clans and actors. In the south- it will be complicated because of the extra diversity and foreign intervention. The Isaaq and Dhulbahante made peace after the civil war, as did the Gadabursi. I don’t think it is impossible for clans in the south to come to indigenous clan sharing agreements.

Somalis are not fighting Ethiopia or NFD because they’re generally happy with the current arrangements. If Somalis were generally anti authority they would have given more headaches to these two states; on the contrary, Somalis are generally peaceful and are participating more in the their states especially Kenya. The times Somalis rebel en masse is when there severe hardship/oppression or when they’re rights are denied (Kenya and Ethiopia taking Somali regions).

 

[Angelina]

Yeah well you’re a foreigner I don’t live for or accept your definitions.

I am not a foreigner. I am a Somali like you and if I wanted to run around Puntland, I will and what will you do about it. Foreigner my backfoot.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

I am not a foreigner. I am a Somali like you and if I wanted to run around Puntland, I will and what will you do about it. Foreigner my backfoot.

You will be arrested, processed in a jail, put on a bus, and deported.

 

[Angelina]

The lawlessness and chaos is true for some more than others. We have hierarchy and a ruling class. Others don’t.

You do not have a hierarchy. True acceptance of rulership is you an MJ being ok with being ruled by a Warsengli or an Hg or Abgaal or Marehaan, but being the typical Somali that is riddled with a superiority complex, you’re only ok with an MJ ruling you. You’re not special, other sub tribes are also ok with their sub tribe ruling as well.

 

[Angelina]

You will be arrested, processed in a jail, put on a bus, and deported.

lol, we both know I wouldn’t. I’m a woman also, surprisingly Somali sexism works in hardy at times, the men will literally just dismiss me as a Gabadh.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

You do not have a hierarchy. True acceptance of rulership is you an MJ being ok with being ruled by a Warsengli or an Hg or Abgaal or Marehaan, but being the typical Somali that is riddled with a superiority complex, you’re only ok with an MJ ruling you. You’re not special, other sub tribes are also ok with their sub tribe ruling as well.

Puntland nativist platform is for puntlanders, it does not include other peoples. We never once advocated for ruling over others. Nor will we accept others ruling over us in our own land. We are a national movement in PL for PL.

Our foundations lay on love for our country and not clan supremacy.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

lol, we both know I wouldn’t. I’m a woman also, surprisingly Somali sexism works in hardy at times, the men will literally just dismiss me as a Gabadh.

You’ll get deported by PL women. It is not a man’s business (so yes in a way) Trespassing is not tolerated and marti must not out stay their welcome (3 days max)

 

[Angelina]

You’ll get deported by PL women. It is not a man’s business (so yes in a way) Trespassing is not tolerated and marti must not out stay their welcome (3 days max)

PL women like the rest of Somalis are hardly in Gov or the police force and are normal citizens. What on earth are you talking about?

I’m not a Marti in PL, since PL is still part of Somalia and you’re mad to think that people can be kicked out? How do you know I don’t have uncles there I can live with? How do you know I don’t have family? Is my qabil written on my forehead?

Tribalists are truly the most low IQ of the bunch.

 

[The Oponian Guild]

PL women like the rest of Somalis are hardly in Gov or the police force and are normal citizens. What on earth are you talking about?

I’m not a Marti in PL, since PL is still part of Somalia and you’re mad to think that people can be kicked out? How do you know I don’t have uncles there I can live with? How do you know I don’t have family? Is my qabil written on my forehead?

Tribalists are truly the most low IQ of the bunch.

I’m not gonna waste my time arguing with a border hopper/trespasser in waiting. And Idk how many times I have to repeat this but my arguments are national not clannish. PL is de facto independent. cill u dhimo ama cirka u qaylii. Good day.

 

[LacagChaser]

PL is a one clan enclave that is now having Intra-Harti conflicts. SSC would soon rather join SL than be under their PL brothers who have little to offer except violence and a safe haven for terrorists.