The Land of Gaabarta

[Luna]

I'm glad you brought the Banu Hashim story. I was actually thinking of making a thread, that will finally put that story to rest/inform people. To begin, you first have to know who Ismail was. Ismail (Ishmael), was Semitic/Sumerian on his father’s side and Egyptian on his mother’s(Hamitic). 2nd, who were the Sumerians?

The earliest civilization of Mesopotamia was that of the Sumerians. They are designated in the Assyrio-Babylonian inscriptions as the black-heads or black-faced people, and they are shown on the monuments as beardless and with shaven heads. This easily distinguishes them from the Semitic Babylonians, who are shown with beards and long hair. From the myths and traditions of the Babylonians we learn that their culture came originally from the south. Sir Henry Rawlinson concluded from this and other evidence that the first civilized inhabitants of Sumer and Akkad were immigrants from the African Ethiopia. John D. Baldwin, the American Orientalist, on the other hand, claims that since ancient Arabia was also known as Ethiopia, they could have just as well come from that country. https://warlockasyluminternationaln...tity-of-the-sumerians-as-seen-in-ancient-art/

View attachment 51180

Hajr was the daughter of Egyptian king and second wife of Abraham she was gifted to prophet Abraham from the king of Egypt. (Wikipedia). That's that origin of Ismail.



Simply put, the "Banu Hashim clan, are a mixture of Hamitic and Semitic(but more on the Hamitic side). SO TO END ALL THIS. THE STORIES COULD BE TRUE.

To add to that, Nimrod who was the son of Cush was said to have founded Babylon. As you know, it was part of Mesopotamia. Therefor, the earliest founders of civilization were Cushites
This is lost ancient history that most do not know ans those that write the history books would prefer to stay hidden. It is important because it will help empower the next generation. They will know their roots and what they are truly capable of. However, this is what Eurocentric modern historians fear most.

Abaayo, Phut are Berbers modern day Libyans. Punt associated with Cushites especially ancient Somalis.

This map is not 100% correct but it shows you where Phut is located.

That is exactly why I am confused. Why would Cushites have a kingdom called Punt??? Their brothers already have that name.
Cushites founding the kingdom of Kush is more plausible imo. Something is wrong here regarding the land of Punt
Either the name or the kingdom itself is misatributed.

 

[Factz]

Sumerian isn't Semitic though, the Sumerian language isn't even Afro-Asiatic, it's something else entirely.

The Sumerians are a people of immense prestige, they invented civilization. Because of this prestige, everyone has claimed them, there have been attempts to identify Sumerian with everything from Basque to Chinese.

They are unique and lost, there are no more Sumerians, the language faded away more than 4000 years ago.

The name the Sumerians had for themselves was the Ungsanggiga, which meant the Black Headed People.

The Sumerians were conquered and assimilated by the ancient Semitic people called Akkadians when they established the Akkadian Empire which ruled the Sumerians and the whole of Mesopotamia. Akkadian gradually replaced Sumerian as a spoken language somewhere between the 3rd and the 2nd millennia BC during the Akkadian Empire period, that's when the Sumerians became extinct through assimilation.

 

[Factz]

To add to that, Nimrod who was the son of Cush was said to have founded Babylon. As you know, it was part of Mesopotamia. Therefor, the earliest founders of civilization were Cushites
This is lost ancient history that most do not know ans those that write the history books would prefer to stay hidden. It is important because it will help empower the next generation. They will know their roots and what they are truly capable of. However, this is what Eurocentric modern historians fear most.


That is exactly why I am confused. Why would Cushites have a kingdom called Punt??? Their brothers already have that name.
Cushites founding the kingdom of Kush is more plausible imo. Something is wrong here regarding the land of Punt
Either the name or the kingdom itself is misatributed.

Abaayo, Phut and Punt are two different names. It's not a misinterpretation, it's recorded in the ancient Egyptian scripts and the skin colour were shown through the drawings of the Egyptian walls and the location were mentioned which was located in the modern-day Horn of Africa.

Land of Punt was indeed a Cushitic civilization.

 

[tesfey67n]

Sumerian isn't Semitic though, the Sumerian language isn't even Afro-Asiatic, it's something else entirely.

The Sumerians are a people of immense prestige, they invented civilization. Because of this prestige, everyone has claimed them, there have been attempts to identify Sumerian with everything from Basque to Chinese.

They are unique and lost, there are no more Sumerians, the language faded away more than 4000 years ago.

The name the Sumerians had for themselves was the Ungsanggiga, which meant the Black Headed People.

when said "Semitic/Sumerian" i meant Semitic And Sumerian.

 

[Grant]

To add to that, Nimrod who was the son of Cush was said to have founded Babylon. As you know, it was part of Mesopotamia. Therefor, the earliest founders of civilization were Cushites
This is lost ancient history that most do not know ans those that write the history books would prefer to stay hidden. It is important because it will help empower the next generation. They will know their roots and what they are truly capable of. However, this is what Eurocentric modern historians fear most.


That is exactly why I am confused. Why would Cushites have a kingdom called Punt??? Their brothers already have that name.
Cushites founding the kingdom of Kush is more plausible imo. Something is wrong here regarding the land of Punt
Either the name or the kingdom itself is misatributed.

I find this map and article of interest. The article has a link at the bottom with additional information on the houses. Also, I was not previously aware that Queen Ati had a daughter with the identical same posterior condition. This would seem to indicate an elite physical attribute linked to genetics, rather than an abnormality. The Medjay were the Beja.


https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs.../images/01_history_chiefdoms.jpg&action=click

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https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/punt/puntlage.htm

"Newer research tends therefore to a localize Punt at the border Eritrea, Ethiopia and Sudan, between the blue Nile and the Red Sea, where everything (spices, gold, ebony) is to be found - also the landscape -, which was depicted in the temple reliefs at Deir el-Bahari. The hypothesis is based on the following facts:

- due to the Egyptian sources Punt is situated southeast from Egypt, near Wawat and Kush (= upper and lower Nubia).

- incense and Myrrh trees are found in the area of Erkowit (in the mountains at Red Sea), in the flat western area of Eritrea, in the Anseba valley, and on the plateau of Tigris; Ebony grows in the mountains near the Red Sea, south of Port Sudan, and in the flat western area of Eritrea.
Giraffes, rhinoceros and elephants lived until the end of the 19. Century in the flat western area of Eritrea and also in the northern area. Gold and Electrum was found southwest of Port Sudan in the mountains near the Red Sea and at other places of the surrounding areas.

- tales about a "mythical" snake king are still known in northern Ethiopia.

- rock paintings showing short horn cattle were found southwest from Port Sudan, at the Ethiopian-Sudanese border, and in the Mareb/Gash valley. People with long hairs, who resemble those in the reliefs of Deir el-Bahari, were also represented in the area of May Aini."

 

[Luna]

I find this map and article of interest. The article has a link at the bottom with additional information on the houses. Also, I was not previously aware that Queen Ati had a daughter with the identical same posterior condition. This would seem to indicate an elite physical attribute linked to genetics, rather than an abnormality. The Medjay were the Beja.


https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=Map+Punt+and+Kush&fr=yhs-iba-1&hspart=iba&hsimp=yhs-1&imgurl=http://www.ancientsudan.org/images/01_history_chiefdoms.jpg#id=0&iurl=http://www.ancientsudan.org/images/01_history_chiefdoms.jpg&action=click

-------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/punt/puntlage.htm

"Newer research tends therefore to a localize Punt at the border Eritrea, Ethiopia and Sudan, between the blue Nile and the Red Sea, where everything (spices, gold, ebony) is to be found - also the landscape -, which was depicted in the temple reliefs at Deir el-Bahari. The hypothesis is based on the following facts:

- due to the Egyptian sources Punt is situated southeast from Egypt, near Wawat and Kush (= upper and lower Nubia).

- incense and Myrrh trees are found in the area of Erkowit (in the mountains at Red Sea), in the flat western area of Eritrea, in the Anseba valley, and on the plateau of Tigris; Ebony grows in the mountains near the Red Sea, south of Port Sudan, and in the flat western area of Eritrea.
Giraffes, rhinoceros and elephants lived until the end of the 19. Century in the flat western area of Eritrea and also in the northern area. Gold and Electrum was found southwest of Port Sudan in the mountains near the Red Sea and at other places of the surrounding areas.

- tales about a "mythical" snake king are still known in northern Ethiopia.

- rock paintings showing short horn cattle were found southwest from Port Sudan, at the Ethiopian-Sudanese border, and in the Mareb/Gash valley. People with long hairs, who resemble those in the reliefs of Deir el-Bahari, were also represented in the area of May Aini."

That's not a reliable source though.... lol
Anyway, even if it wasn't partially located in Somalia (which it likely was), it would still be a land inhabited by essentially the same people. The people of those lands were called Berber's at one point, it was a land founded and inhabited by kin (ancient Cushites).

 

[Grant]

That's not a reliable source though.... lol
Anyway, even if it wasn't partially located in Somalia (which it likely was), it would still be a land inhabited by essentially the same people. The people of those lands were called Berber's at one point, it was a land founded and inhabited by kin (ancient Cushites).

Where's your source?

 

[Luna]

Where's your source?

The burden of proof is on you. You are making the claim that Punt was not located in our lands.

I am just reiterating the claims you are trying to refute.
So far, you've given me a shoddy website as your "proof."

Those claims that suggest you are an anti Somali crusader seem very plausible. You seek to discredit Somali's in any way possible even resorting to dubious sources. Hmm...

 

[Grant]

The burden of proof is on you. You are making the claim that Punt was not located in our lands.

I am just reiterating the claims you are trying to refute.
So far, you've given me a shoddy website as your "proof."

Those claims that suggest you are an anti Somali crusader seem very plausible. You seek to discredit Somali's in any way possible even resorting to dubious sources. Hmm...

Uh

Proof is proof. Mine is based on the archaeology of the Gash region of the Sudan and the Egyptian sources. What have you got?

http://www.joanlansberry.com/setfind/med-habu.html

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/start_e.htm

 

[Grant]

Uh

Proof is proof. Mine is based on the archaeology of the Gash region of the Sudan and the Egyptian sources. What have you got?

http://www.joanlansberry.com/setfind/med-habu.html

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/start_e.htm

http://www.archaeopress.com/ArchaeopressShop/Public/download.asp?id={8051E498-158B-4217-8288-BD6DA9FB5ECC}

 

[Factz]

Uh

Proof is proof. Mine is based on the archaeology of the Gash region of the Sudan and the Egyptian sources. What have you got?

http://www.joanlansberry.com/setfind/med-habu.html

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/start_e.htm

Those are blogs not proper proofs you fool.

The Sudan and Eritrean/Ethiopian border was under Land of Kush, not the Land of Punt. Plus, most of the worlds frankinscense is located in northern Somalia and at least 82% of the worlds frankinscense is found in northern Somalia. Historically the ancient Egyptians traded through sea towards northern Somalia (Land of Punt).

Like I said, explain why most ancient Punt ruins is found in northern Somalia more than any parts of Africa? It literally has ancient pyramids, temples and tombs.

Ancient Punt ruins found in Awdal.

In fact, it's believed the capital of Punt was Ras Hafuun. The ancient Egyptians referred their capital as "Hafuuna".

@Luna please don't bother with this historical revisionist liar. His job here is to troll and discredit the Somali history.

 

[Luna]

Those are blogs not proper proofs you fool.

The Sudan and Eritrean/Ethiopian border was under Land of Kush, not the Land of Punt. Plus, most of the worlds frankinscense is located in northern Somalia and at least 82% of the worlds frankinscense is found in northern Somalia. Historically the ancient Egyptians traded through sea towards northern Somalia (Land of Punt).

Like I said, explain why most ancient Punt ruins is found in northern Somalia more than any parts of Africa? It literally has ancient pyramids, temples and tombs.

Ancient Punt ruins found in Awdal.

In fact, it's believed the capital of Punt was Ras Hafuun. The ancient Egyptians referred their capital as "Hafuuna".

@Luna please don't bother with this historical revisionist liar. His job here is to troll and discredit the Somali history.

You're doing a good job bro. He knows these things but will keep pushing his agenda. Thats why I didn't even bother posting anything becaue the burden is on him. He is making a contrary claim, so he should defend it with integrity.

 

[Grant]

Those are blogs not proper proofs you fool.

The Sudan and Eritrean/Ethiopian border was under Land of Kush, not the Land of Punt. Plus, most of the worlds frankinscense is located in northern Somalia and at least 82% of the worlds frankinscense is found in northern Somalia. Historically the ancient Egyptians traded through sea towards northern Somalia (Land of Punt).

Like I said, explain why most ancient Punt ruins is found in northern Somalia more than any parts of Africa? It literally has ancient pyramids, temples and tombs.

Ancient Punt ruins found in Awdal.

In fact, it's believed the capital of Punt was Ras Hafuun. The ancient Egyptians referred their capital as "Hafuuna".

@Luna please don't bother with this historical revisionist liar. His job here is to troll and discredit the Somali history.

I noticed your source changed Punt to Somalia.

I should have given you a more direct link. Those links either are the work, or mention the work, of Dr. Karl H. Leser, the author of the map and essay Luna was complaining was unreliable. I believe the scholarship speaks for itself.

This is a direct link to his website. Note the navigation at the upper left.

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/start_e.htm

He and his site are cited all over the place.

I will work on getting you an accessible link for the archaeology of the Sudan.

 

[Factz]

I noticed your source changed Punt to Somalia.

I should have given you a more direct link. Those links either are the work, or mention the work, of Dr. Karl H. Leser, the author of the map and essay Luna was complaining was unreliable. I believe the scholarship speaks for itself.

This is a direct link to his website. Note the navigation at the upper left.

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/start_e.htm

He and his site are cited all over the place.

I will work on getting you an accessible link for the archaeology of the Sudan.

Sudan was part of Land of Kush. Northern Somalia = Land of Punt. Get that in your head. I posted the same source so I don't know what you're talking about. Your sources did not prove anything except for that made up map.

Here is a museum in Somaliland showing you Puntite statue heads, items and etc. They even found ancient Egyptian materials proving that the Land of Punt was indeed located in northern Somalia where both ancient empires have been trading together for thousands of years.


You cannot deny Puntite civilization in northern Somalia. It's already been proven and no historians dispute that either. Give it up old man.

 

[Ferrari]

@Factz and the rest of us getting ready to defend our good name when @Grant shows up in another history thread shitting on Somalis.

 

[Ferrari]

According to the old travelogues, the land of Gaabarta (or Jabarta in Arabic) was south of Harar, according to 19th century explorers who asked local people, it could be found to the south-east of Malingur Ogaden territory and was centered on a lake called Gaabarta. This would be in the vicinity of Segeg or perhaps Gerbo.

source?

 

[.279]

I find this map and article of interest. The article has a link at the bottom with additional information on the houses. Also, I was not previously aware that Queen Ati had a daughter with the identical same posterior condition. This would seem to indicate an elite physical attribute linked to genetics, rather than an abnormality. The Medjay were the Beja.


https://images.search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=Map+Punt+and+Kush&fr=yhs-iba-1&hspart=iba&hsimp=yhs-1&imgurl=http://www.ancientsudan.org/images/01_history_chiefdoms.jpg#id=0&iurl=http://www.ancientsudan.org/images/01_history_chiefdoms.jpg&action=click

-------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.maat-ka-ra.de/english/punt/puntlage.htm

"Newer research tends therefore to a localize Punt at the border Eritrea, Ethiopia and Sudan, between the blue Nile and the Red Sea, where everything (spices, gold, ebony) is to be found - also the landscape -, which was depicted in the temple reliefs at Deir el-Bahari. The hypothesis is based on the following facts:

- due to the Egyptian sources Punt is situated southeast from Egypt, near Wawat and Kush (= upper and lower Nubia).

- incense and Myrrh trees are found in the area of Erkowit (in the mountains at Red Sea), in the flat western area of Eritrea, in the Anseba valley, and on the plateau of Tigris; Ebony grows in the mountains near the Red Sea, south of Port Sudan, and in the flat western area of Eritrea.
Giraffes, rhinoceros and elephants lived until the end of the 19. Century in the flat western area of Eritrea and also in the northern area. Gold and Electrum was found southwest of Port Sudan in the mountains near the Red Sea and at other places of the surrounding areas.

- tales about a "mythical" snake king are still known in northern Ethiopia.

- rock paintings showing short horn cattle were found southwest from Port Sudan, at the Ethiopian-Sudanese border, and in the Mareb/Gash valley. People with long hairs, who resemble those in the reliefs of Deir el-Bahari, were also represented in the area of May Aini."

Even if this were the case, these ppl are pure cushites who are more related to somalis than the current inhabitants of those lands.

And when discussing the history of the region why do yall act like migrations aren't a thing and that ppl are at the exact location they were 4500 years ago?

 

[Grant]

Sudan was part of Land of Kush. Northern Somalia = Land of Punt. Get that in your head. I posted the same source so I don't know what you're talking about. Your sources did not prove anything except for that made up map.

Here is a museum in Somaliland showing you Puntite statue heads, items and etc. They even found ancient Egyptian materials proving that the Land of Punt was indeed located in northern Somalia where both ancient empires have been trading together for thousands of years.


You cannot deny Puntite civilization in northern Somalia. It's already been proven and no historians dispute that either. Give it up old man.

Your statues and other Egyptian claims have no provenance. Check with Sada Mire. Absolutely no competent archaeologist has authenticated them. Your usual BS.

I couldn't get you access, but here are the links you want for the archaeology of the Eastern Sudan/Gash region. These are major academic papers.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF01117231

https://foyles.co.uk/witem/history-...in-its-setting-the,andrea-manzo-9781784915582

Part of the abstract for the second link:.

"The ongoing research project in Eastern Sudan by the University `L'Orientale' has provided a preliminary reconstruction of the history of the region from c. 6000 BC to AD 1500. This publication outlines this reconstruction and also considers the more general setting known for the other regions of northeastern Africa. Several issues remain to be clarified and understanding of some phases is still limited, nevertheless it can be safely stated that Eastern Sudan, was in ancient times, as it is now, a crossroads between the Nile basin, Eastern Desert, the Ethio-Eritrean highlands and the Red Sea, represented a crucial region in several respects: the spread of domestic crops and animals towards the Ethio-Eritrean highlands, the spread of the Sahelian crops towards India via the Red Sea and Arabia, as well as the long-distance trade network characterizing northeastern Africa in the 3rd and 2nd millennia BC."

 

[Factz]

Your statues and other Egyptian claims have no provenance. Check with Sada Mire. Absolutely no competent archaeologist has authenticated them. Your usual BS.

I couldn't get you access, but here are the links you want for the archaeology of the Eastern Sudan/Gash region. These are major academic papers.

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF01117231

https://foyles.co.uk/witem/history-...in-its-setting-the,andrea-manzo-9781784915582

Part of the abstract for the second link:.

"The ongoing research project in Eastern Sudan by the University `L'Orientale' has provided a preliminary reconstruction of the history of the region from c. 6000 BC to AD 1500. This publication outlines this reconstruction and also considers the more general setting known for the other regions of northeastern Africa. Several issues remain to be clarified and understanding of some phases is still limited, nevertheless it can be safely stated that Eastern Sudan, was in ancient times, as it is now, a crossroads between the Nile basin, Eastern Desert, the Ethio-Eritrean highlands and the Red Sea, represented a crucial region in several respects: the spread of domestic crops and animals towards the Ethio-Eritrean highlands, the spread of the Sahelian crops towards India via the Red Sea and Arabia, as well as the long-distance trade network characterizing northeastern Africa in the 3rd and 2nd millennia BC."

I've shown you a simple Museum video where it shows you Puntite statue heads, items and even the ancient Egyptian trading materials. You still have the nerve to talk? Yes, they were obviously authenticated by the archaeologist. Why do you think no scholar denies Punt civilization in northern Somalia?


I can't deal with your bullshit. Your quote is talking about the Land of Kush by the way.


Let me show you these authentic sources so you can shut up with your bullshit.

For more, here: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=X1dDDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA44&dq=The+Somali+peninsula+was+a+strategic+magnet&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi8ie66mObcAhVrIcAKHeXjD30Q6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=The Somali peninsula was a strategic magnet&f=false

I'm done giving you the facts. Go check them out and quit being intellectually dishonest.

 

[Grant]

I've shown you a simple Museum video where it shows you Puntite statue heads, items and even the ancient Egyptian trading materials. You still have the nerve to talk? Yes, they were obviously authenticated by the archaeologist. Why do you think no scholar denies Punt civilization in northern Somalia?


I can't deal with your bullshit. Your quote is talking about the Land of Kush by the way.


Let me show you these authentic sources so you can shut up with your bullshit.

For more, here: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=X1dDDwAAQBAJ&pg=PA44&dq=The+Somali+peninsula+was+a+strategic+magnet&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi8ie66mObcAhVrIcAKHeXjD30Q6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=The Somali peninsula was a strategic magnet&f=false

I'm done giving you the facts. Go check them out and quit being intellectually dishonest.

Repeating the same qashin again and again does not make it dahab.