The birth of the 3rd Republic

[Angelina]

LOL

Abdulahi Yusuf did the right thing, by destroying ICU, the terrorist entity. As for Hawiye, they should use the same power and energy they used during 1991, to remove these terrorists. But, I guess it's easier to ethnically cleanse unarmed civilians, than it is to face armed men.

What are you basing it on? What proof do you have they were terrorists? How were they terrorists when they actually brought about stability during that time period after years of wars and bombing?

At this point, do you actually care about the peace and stability of Somalis in general or is it classic case of, if it isn’t my clan ruling I don’t care?

I will continue using AlShabab and AMISOM talking points, because they are very relevant.

No, using that talking point when it was an MJ man that caused the havoc is ridiculous. Take a bit of accountability. You can use it as much as you like, but I’ll remind you that it’s YOUR abti who started this hell.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

What are you basing it on? What proof do you have they were terrorists? How were they terrorists when they actually brought about stability during that time period after years of wars and bombing?

At this point, do you actually care about the peace and stability of Somalis in general or is it classic case of, if it isn’t my clan ruling I don’t care?

No, using that talking point when it was an MJ man that caused the havoc is ridiculous. Take a bit of accountability.

AlShabab itself is the baby of ICU, where do you think they came from?

Al-Shabaab formed as the military wing of the Islamic Courts Union (ICU), which briefly gained control of central and southern Somalia in mid-2006.

So, who is to blame for the baby of ICU, for growing in power? The mother? Or the one who tried to kill the beast?

One thing I do not agree with, is Abdulahi Yusuf going to Hawiye land, to install a new government. He should have cut ties, and declared a separate country.

 

[Angelina]

AlShabab itself is the baby of ICU, where do you think they came from?

And when did radicalization start? Were they running around bombing and causing havoc? Believe me, and ask anyone who was in Xamar under the ICU it was the most stable time in Xamari history post 1991. Hence to suggest they were terrorists is incredibly false and unfair.

So, who is to blame for the baby of ICU, for growing in power? The mother? Or the one who tried to kill the beast?

He didn’t kill the beast, he created it. Xamar had no issues under ICU. This is fact. He propelled radicalization by bringing foreign Ethiopians.

One thing I do not agree with, is Abdulahi Yusuf going to Hawiye land, to install a new government. He should have cut ties, and declared a separate country.

If he never set foot, they wouldn’t be dealing with AS and their nightmare.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

And when did radicalization start? Were they running around bombing and causing havoc? Believe me, and ask anyone who was in Xamar under the ICU it was the most stable time in Xamari history post 1991. Hence to suggest they were terrorists is incredibly false and unfair.

He didn’t kill the beast, he created it. Xamar had no issues under ICU. This is fact. He propelled radicalization by bringing foreign Ethiopians.

If he never set foot, they wouldn’t be dealing with AS and their nightmare.

ICU was a radical, qabiilist, terrorist entity from day 1. All they did, like HSM was 'stabilise' Mogadishu. But their intentions for the rest of the country was not as positive. They declared war on Puntland, and planted their clansmen in Kismaayo. They wouldn't have left us alone, even if we did decide to self-isolate.

You see the similarities between HSM, ICU etc,? He's fine with his house being stable, but he doesn't want that for the rest of the country.

Anyway, the best case scenario, is for Puntland to leave, and let's hope that we're left alone.

 

[Heavy Mountains]

AS existed before the Ethiopian invasion, they were a coalition of radical groups within ICU that viewed other members as unorthodox.

Problem with ICU is that it had former Al Ittihad jihadist that had contacts with AQ

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

AS existed before the Ethiopian invasion, they were a coalition of radical groups within ICU that viewed other members as unorthodox.

Problem with ICU is that it had former Al Ittihad jihadist that had contacts with AQ

People always say that ICU made Mogadishu 'peaceful'. So what? AlShabab also provides some semblance of normalcy for those who pay tax to them. That doesn't mean they're not batshit crazy.

These crazies would have declared 'jihad' on the entire world, and invited AlQaeda, and ISIS, the same way that their baby: AlShabab, does today.

 

[Angelina]

ICU was a radical, qabiilist, terrorist entity from day 1. All they did, like HSM was 'stabilise' Mogadishu. But their intentions for the rest of the country was not as positive. They declared war on Puntland, and wouldn't have left us alone, even if we did decide to self-isolate.

Qabilsts? It was made up of different tribes. Also, how were they terrorists when they defeated the secular warlords who made the lives of people a living hell. Provided basic services like opening schools, healthcare clinics and trash collection services.

When did they declare war on PL? Can you post any articles that outlines this

You see the similarities between HSM, ICU etc,? He's fine with his house being stable, but he doesn't want that for the rest of the country.

I can say the same for AY, finally Xamar and the South at large which was impacted by the war the most had peace and what did he do? Call foreign tropes. Did he care about the innocents who would be displaced or the radicalization that would ensue whilst PL was in relative peace?!

AY like any politician put the welfare of his people above the rest of the country, effectively used Ethiopia to thwart ICU threat over his precious state of Puntland even if it meant nuking Hawiye and setting Somalia back to stone age.

Anyway, the best case scenario, is for Puntland to leave, and let's hope that we're left alone.

What do you call ICU government who brought back peace and stability to Mogadishu and south Somalia at large? It was the legitimate government with popular support. The same city Kismayo were Marexaan HG were fighting Ogaden and MJ over who gets to rule it have fallen in minutes to ICU. No body wanted that smoke. ICU was posed to end the civil war and emerge as the winner.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Qabilsts? It was made up of different tribes.

When did they declare war on PL? Can you post any articles that outlines this

I can at the same for AY, finally Xamar and the South at large which impacted by the war the most had peace and what did he do? Call foreign tropes. Did he care about the innocents who would be displaced or the radicalization that would ensue whilst PL was in relative peace?!

AY like any politician put the welfare of his people above the rest of the country, effectively used Ethiopia to thwart ICU threat over his precious state of Puntland even if it meant nuking Hawiye and setting Somalia back to stone age.

What do you call ICU government who brought back peace and stability to Mogadishu and south Somalia at large? It was the legitimate government with popular support. The same city Kismayo were Marexaan HG were fighting Ogaden and MJ over who gets to rule it have fallen in minutes to ICU. No body wanted that smoke. ICU was posed to end the civil war and emerge as the winner.

You really believe ICU, the father of AlShabab, would form an effective government? The same people that were calling people 'kufaar' and declaring jihaad on their opponents.

Just because an organisation is multi-clan in terms of footsoldiers, doesn't mean their intentions aren't qabiilist. For example, Godane, never attacked his clan land, and instead brought 'jihad' to the rest of Somalia. Similarly, Isaaq 'jihadists' who join AlShabab never set up shop in their own land.

As for the ICU war declaration on Puntland, it was all over the media at the time. I'll tag you when I find it.

Finally, I don't support what Abdulahi Yusuf did, although I do see why he did it. I would have preferred that he waited in Galkacyo and fought to defend our land. I don't believe there was a Somalia to rebuild, post 1991.

 

[Angelina]

People always say that ICU made Mogadishu 'peaceful'. So what? AlShabab also provides some semblance of normalcy for those who pay tax to them. That doesn't mean they're not batshit crazy.

These crazies would have declared 'jihad' on the entire world, and invited AlQaeda, and ISIS, the same way that their baby: AlShabab, does today.

Nonsense. ICU had 13 courts. 2 of the courts (Al Shabaab & Dahir Aweys) were rulled by extremists, the rest of the 11 courts we're headed by moderates who were much powerful than Al Shabaab and kept them on line.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Nonsense. ICU had 13 courts. 2 of the courts (Al Shabaab & Dahir Aweys) were rulled by extremists, the rest of the 11 courts we're headed by moderates who were much powerful than Al Shabaab and kept them on line.

How is that nonsensical? You yourself are admitting to me right now, that some of ICU's courts were extremists. "Show me who your friends are"

As for Dahir Aweys, he's the same guy who attacked Puntland in the 90s, to wage "Jihaad". We had plenty of experience with him and his friends.

 

[aarkamudug]

Idk why the hutus try to glorify icu terrorists https://sudantribune.com/article17048/

 

[Angelina]

You really believe ICU, the father of AlShabab, would form an effective government? The same people that were calling people 'kufaar' and declaring jihaad on their opponents.

They didn’t. ICU were moderate compared to the batshit Al shaydaan.

Just because an organisation is multi-clan in terms of footsoldiers, doesn't mean their intentions aren't qabiilist. For example, Godane, never attacked his clan land, and instead brought 'jihad' to the rest of Somalia. Similarly, Isaaq 'jihadists' who join AlShabab never set up shop in their own land.

Yes, but isn’t it funny how Al Shaydan is made up of many clans with the Leaders being from outside of Hawiye lands with funding from international players but it’s Hawiye and the South at large who are insulted for it and most casualties have been Hawiyes and other southern tribes.

As for the ICU war declaration on Puntland, it was all over the media at the time. I'll tag you when I find it.

Please do.

Finally, I don't support what Abdulahi Yusuf did, although I do see why he did it. I would have preferred that he waited in Galkacyo and fought to defend our land. I don't believe there was a Somalia to rebuild, post 1991.

I don’t see it at all. It was above selfish Bs what he did made Al Shaytaan bold. ICU had AS on a chokehold but once Ethiopia invaded, it was AS that were fighting the Ethiopians and how they gained support and then starting abusing the citizens not long after.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

They didn’t. ICU were moderate compared to the batshit Al shaydaan.

Yes, but isn’t it funny how Al Shaydan is made up of many clans with the Leaders being from outside of Hawiye lands with funding from international players but it’s Hawiye and the South at large who are insulted for it and most casualties have been Hawiyes and other southern tribes.



Please do.

I don’t see it at all. It was above selfish Bs what he did made Al Shaytaan bold. ICU had AS on a chokehold but once Ethiopia invaded, it was AS that were fighting the Ethiopians and how they gained support and then starting abusing the citizens not long after.

You see it as selfish, AY (AUN), saw it as a pragmatic move, to defang a monster, that he defeated in the 90s, prior to Puntland's existence. AlShabab was fostered by ICU, they didn't come out of thin air.

The same thug, that attacked Puntland (before Puntland was founded) in the 1990s, chasing our unarmed civilians, under the pretence of "Jihad", rose to a high-ranking position in ICU.

Sheikh Hassan Dahir Aweys (English: Hassan Dahir Aweys (Somali: Xasan Daahir Aweys, (Arabic: حسن طاهر أويس; born 1935) is a Somali Islamist political figure.[2] During the regime of Siad Barre, Aweys was a colonel in the Somali National Army and served in the 1977 Ogaden War against Ethiopia.[3][4][5]

Aweys later came to be a leading figure in Somalia's rising Islamic movements at the start of the Civil War, beginning with Al-Itihaad al-Islamiya from 1991. After the effective dissolution of Al-Itihaad in 1997, he became the head of an Islamic Court in north Mogadishu and eventually rose to a high-ranking position within the Islamic Courts Union until the Ethiopian invasion of 2006. After the invasion he joined the Alliance for the Re-Liberation of Somalia and became head of the Asmara wing of the ARS. During the insurgency, his wing of the alliance merged with several groups to form Hizbul Islam.

If ICU wanted to act moderate, they wouldn't have people like him in their midst.

 

[attash]

Qabilsts? It was made up of different tribes. Also, how were they terrorists when they defeated the secular warlords who made the lives of people a living hell. Provided basic services like opening schools, healthcare clinics and trash collection services.

When did they declare war on PL? Can you post any articles that outlines this

After taking control of Xamar, the ICU declared their intention to take over all of Somalia. They swept through the south began invading Puntland as well:

Islamic Courts clash with Puntland

Heavy fighting has been reported between forces of Union of Islamic Courts and Puntland, the semi-autonomous region of Somalia.

www.aljazeera.com

The problem was, Puntland already had an administration of their own that was keeping the peace. They did not need the ICU, nor did they want the ICU in their lands. So the war between the ICU and reer PL was a war that the ICU started.

I think the ICU did a really good job bringing peace to the south, but they were too belligerent. They were not interested in engaging in peaceful dialog with the other administrations in Somalia, instead they wanted to rule everyone by force. So the ICU has no-one but themselves to blame for their downfall. If they engaged in a more conciliatory approach with the people in other regions, perhaps things would be different in Somalia.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

After taking control of Xamar, the ICU declared their intention to take over all of Somalia. They swept through the south began invading Puntland as well:

Islamic Courts clash with Puntland

Heavy fighting has been reported between forces of Union of Islamic Courts and Puntland, the semi-autonomous region of Somalia.

www.aljazeera.com

The problem was, Puntland already had an administration of their own that was keeping the peace. They did not need the ICU, nor did they want the ICU in their lands. So the war between the ICU and reer PL was a war that the ICU started.

I think the ICU did a really good job bringing peace to the south, but they were too belligerent. They were not interested in engaging in peaceful dialog with the other administrations in Somalia, instead they wanted to rule everyone by force. So the ICU has no-one but themselves to blame for their downfall. If they engaged in a more conciliatory approach with the people in other regions, perhaps things would be different in Somalia.

Great find!

Would it have killed them, to leave us alone? And to add insult to injury, promoting the likes of Xasan Dahir Aweys, who already had a history of "Jihaad" in our land.

"Since capturing Mogadishu, the Somali capital, in June, the Islamic Courts have pledged to extend their control over the whole of the East African country."

"But the leaders of Puntland and Somaliland, two self-governing areas of northern Somalia, have said they will fight any attempt by the Islamic Courts to invade their areas."

Somaliland was next on their agenda, if they succeeded in overrunning Puntland.

But we are supposed to believe the ICU were benevolent.

 

[Angelina]

You see it as selfish, AY (AUN), saw it as a pragmatic move, to defang a monster, that he defeated in the 90s, prior to Puntland's existence. AlShabab was fostered by ICU, they didn't come out of thin air.

The same thug, that attacked Puntland (before Puntland was founded) in the 1990s, chasing our unarmed civilians, under the pretence of "Jihad", rose to a high-ranking position in ICU.






If ICU wanted to act moderate, they wouldn't have people like him in their midst.

You see it as selfish, AY (AUN), saw it as a pragmatic move, to defang a monster, that he defeated in the 90s, prior to Puntland's existence. AlShabab was fostered by ICU, they didn't come out of thin air.

It was the most peaceful time in Xamari history and the people were in support. AY instead of rallying his fellow PL instead called the gaals, the Ethiopians with support of the Americans against Somalis.

What happened afterwards? AS then gained power and for 5 yrs terrorized the locals. My family has to dodge bombs and bullets and it was the worst after the calling of the Ethiopians. Before it was tribal
Wars, now they were dealing with crazy radicals that was labeling everyone gaals.

The actions of AY was horrendous and people were actually killed in the thousands due to this. More people in Xamar suffered than ever.

He didn’t defang it, he made it 10x worse and that’s a fact.

The same thug, that attacked Puntland (before Puntland was founded) in the 1990s, chasing our unarmed civilians, under the pretence of "Jihad", rose to a high-ranking position in ICU.

If ICU wanted to act moderate, they wouldn't have people like him in their midst.

That is definitely were they went wrong. Shouldn’t have let them there in the first place. They clearly didn’t see them as a threat since when ICU was in power, they were actually powerless. It was during the war with Ethiopia that they rose.

 

[Angelina]

Great find!

Would it have killed them, to leave us alone? And to add insult to injury, promoting the likes of Xasan Dahir Aweys, who already had a history of "Jihaad" in our land.









Somaliland was next on their agenda, if they succeeded in overrunning Puntland.

But we are supposed to believe the ICU were benevolent.

Yes, but bringing American supported Ethiopians and thus creating even more terrorism was the answer!

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

Yes, but bringing American supported Ethiopians and thus creating even more terrorism was the answer!

The Ethiopians were coming anyway, as ICU, cleverly declared "Jihaad" on them also.

 

[Garaad Awal]

Seriously leave, grow some balls and become independent instead throwing tantrums but having one foot in and the other out.


This so called ‘dictator’ has made the capital safer, this is a fact i’m someone that has visited before and after, recently got rid of the 4.5 system and is on course to get rid of AS. People of Xamar are finally able to be out and about and enjoy themselves with business thriving. I was there a few months ago.

Amisom came after your uncle AY decided to call the Ethiopians and destroyed the months of peace under ICU. Let’s not forget how AL shaydaan were formed and who is the catalyst of this disastrous issue.

Finally joining the FKD trenches

 

[Angelina]

After taking control of Xamar, the ICU declared their intention to take over all of Somalia. They swept through the south began invading Puntland as well:

Islamic Courts clash with Puntland

Heavy fighting has been reported between forces of Union of Islamic Courts and Puntland, the semi-autonomous region of Somalia.

www.aljazeera.com

The problem was, Puntland already had an administration of their own that was keeping the peace. They did not need the ICU, nor did they want the ICU in their lands. So the war between the ICU and reer PL was a war that the ICU started.

It was a short lived war because of PL fighting back properly, they called the Ethio backed Americans to come and cause more havoc in the South.

I think the ICU did a really good job bringing peace to the south, but they were too belligerent. They were not interested in engaging in peaceful dialog with the other administrations in Somalia, instead they wanted to rule everyone by force. So the ICU has no-one but themselves to blame for their downfall. If they engaged in a more conciliatory approach with the people in other regions, perhaps things would be different in Somalia.

At least you’re honest enough to admit they did a great job in South Somalia. I think arrogance got the best of them especially after what that achieved in Jubbaland, but what I see as unforgiveable is the calling
Of gaals and causing groups like AS to gain more power and non stop bombing.