Somalia's paleolithic hunter-gatherers

[Grant]

What languages do the Eyle speak? Has a substratum of any other language been detected? Have they been sampled genetically? I feel like a lot of this discussion is an argument from ignorance.

But between your claim that Bantu farmers predate Somalis in the South & the Eyle, I am personally becoming a bit suspicious of your intentions Grant. I’ve asked if you were a missionary because I suspected that maybe you had some success converting non-Somali populations and grew a soft spot for them.

Now though I’m starting to doubt your whole narrative about that one-time trip to Somalia that launched your obsession with attempting to prove Somalis not to be natives. It seems very personal for you. Are you possibly a Somali Bantu or Mohamed Eno in disguise?

We have been through this before. I taught English as a second language to Somalis as a Volunteer in the US Peace Corps. I lived in Jilib and managed to travel throughout the country. I was there 1966-67, predating the Kacaan.

What does my "trip" to Somalia have to do with the data at hand?

To catch you up, I am an American of Anglo-Irish, French and Danish descent. Genetically, I am E-1b1b1c1a, with mtDna of U5a2a. These are the Natufian farmers and the Ice Age Europeans. Cheddar Man was U5a.

As a student of history, I resent the notion that I would change my views because of some prejudice.
That idea has more to do with qabyalad than honest academics. I have no qabiil, and my only strong bias is against the falsification of history,

 

[Grant]

What languages do the Eyle speak? Has a substratum of any other language been detected? Have they been sampled genetically? I feel like a lot of this discussion is an argument from ignorance.

Agreed about the ignorance. Apollo is jumping to conclusions based on at most 1 or 2 samples he won't divulge. The modern Eyle deserve a real study. If they are mixed, it will take more than a few to get realistic results. The archaeology of Buur Heybe has involved several authors and extended studies with dating. No one has suggested anyone but the Eyle, but more data won't hurt. Beats nothing coming from the local source.

The Eyle were a significant Geledi ally. I don't know of any specialized studies, but they speak a Maay dialect at home. The community of Eyle butchers in Mog probably also speak Maxaa now. The deep language throughout the interriverine region is af Helledi.

 

[Dues Ex Machina]

 

[Grant]

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This is definitely worth a link and the name of the author.

 

[Apollo]

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If something is written in a book it does not equal being a fact. A lot of falsities are documented proven to be false later on.

Here the Waboni are portrayed as eternal natives of the land, while in reality (recent genetic analysis performed on them) they were majority Cushitic + non-trivial Niger-Congo Bantu admixture and almost negligibly of paleolithic hunter-gatherer stock.

The same will happen to the Eyle, mark my words.

Just like no WHGs like Cheddar Man exist anymore in Europe the same is true for Somalia. Only people not capable of understanding genetics think otherwise.

 

[World]

If something is written in a book it does NOT equal being a fact. A lot of falsities are documented proven to be false later on.

Here the Waboni are portrayed as eternal natives of the land, while in reality (recent genetic analysis performed on them) they were majority Cushitic + non-trivial Niger-Congo Bantu admixture and almost negligibly of paleolithic hunter-gatherer stock.

The same will happen to the Eyle, mark my words.

Just like no WHGs like Cheddar Man exist anymore in Europe the same is true for Somalia. Only people not capable of understanding genetics think otherwise.

It could be possible that the Eyle have a high % of South Cushitic admixture.

 

[Apollo]

It could be possible that the Eyle have a high % of South Cushitic admixture.

I already have access to someone who claims to be partly Eyle and he is heavily Bantu admixed (autosomes tested). This is why I am so vocal about my stance.

I can't stand them being portrayed as ancient Somalis when they are likely less Somali than random nomadic Somalis.

 

[World]

I already have access to someone who claims to be partly Eyle and he is heavily Bantu admixed (autosomes tested). This is why I am so vocal about my stance.

I can't stand them being portrayed as ancient Somalis when they are likely less Somali than random nomadic Somalis.

What is his other half and how heavily?

 

[Apollo]

What is his other half and how heavily?

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[Grant]

I already have access to someone who claims to be partly Eyle and he is heavily Bantu admixed (autosomes tested). This is why I am so vocal about my stance.

I can't stand them being portrayed as ancient Somalis when they are likely less Somali than random nomadic Somalis.

One "part Eyle" sample? Oh, wow!

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Ha ha! Buur Heybe itself is down to about 400 individuals, and only 20 potters. Buur Hakaba is no longer a center of Eyle residence, and is certainly mixed. You should try either Buur Heybe or the Eyle community in Muqdisho.

 

[Apollo]

One "part Eyle" sample? Oh, wow!



Ha ha! Buur Heybe itself is down to about 400 individuals, and only 20 potters. Buur Hakaba is no longer a center of Eyle residence, and is certainly mixed. You should try either Buur Heybe or the Eyle community in Muqdisho.

I am using Occam's Razor and will stick to my opinion until proven otherwise.

- Bantu admixture in the Boni.
- Bantu admixture in an individual who is part Eyle from nearby where they live.

The burden of proof of them not being part Bantu is on you.

Pieces of paper won't suffice. Anyone can write lies into books.

 

[Grant]

I am using Occam's Razor and will stick to my opinion until proven otherwise.

- Bantu admixture in the Boni.
- Bantu admixture in an individual who is part Eyle from nearby where they live.

The burden of proof them not being part Bantu is on you.

Admixture does not disprove the original Dna, which is just mixed. There is no "one drop rule" in genetics. Let's get more than one mixed sample before we claim victory.

 

[Dues Ex Machina]

Duh.....

Go back. Get the link for here and read the rest of it.

Slaves were being moved overland to the Middle East because the British were seizing all slaves on the high seas, even freeing many of them at the Jubba to join Nassib Bundo. The slaves were not being used in Somalia and that phase of the slave trade did not last long..

It's been proven countless times that the bantu of southeastern Africa are not native to Somalia and have been brought to the country as slaves-in-transit or slaves to be used in local plantations. Having said that there is still inconclusive evidence when it comes to earlier settlements of hunter-gatherer groups of bantu origins.

However I am curious as to what research you have about the Waboni (bon/b00n) hunter-gatherer group. They were touted for their scouting and hunting skills by the British and were used for their skills by their Somali masters and the wardei/borana before the Northern pastoralists pushed into southern Somalia/Jubbaland.

Here are some of the documents I have on hand.

 

[Apollo]

It's been proven countless times that the bantu of southeastern Africa are not native to Somalia and have been brought to the country as slaves-in-transit or slaves to be used in local plantations. Having said that there is still inconclusive evidence when it comes to earlier settlements of hunter-gatherer groups of bantu origins.

However I am curious as to what research you have about the Waboni (bon/b00n) hunter-gatherer group. They were touted for their scouting and hunting skills by the British and were used for their skills by their Somali masters and the wardei/borana before the Northern pastoralists pushed into southern Somalia/Jubbaland.

Bonis/Bo0ns are mixed with Bantus. We have genetic data on them.

They are not native to Somalia.

 

[southside]

None of us are native to the Horn of Africa let alone Somalia. Bantus are West African and Somalis are Nilotic/Middle Eastern mutts. A Bantu i(non slave decedent) is no less native to Shabelle then a Raxaweyn is.

the somali hunter gatherer ancestry we have is native to the horn sxb plus nilotics are aboriginal to east africa

They still would have some ancestry from those early Bantus.

East Africa belongs to the Khosian and the dead Hunter Gatherers. Everyone else are invaders.

khoisans are from south africa

 

[Timo Jareer and proud]

the somali hunter gatherer ancestry we have is native to the horn sxb plus nilotics are aboriginal to east africa

khoisans are from south africa

Nilo Sharans are actually from North Africa (Sudan) not East Africa.

The 10% Hunter Gatherer DNA in Somalis is nothing. AA are 10-20% Cadaan on average yet there is pretty much no difference between them and modern day West Africans.

Khoisan used to live in East Africa tell the Afro Asaitic, Bantu, and Nilo Sharan migrations wiped them off the map. Their is still small community's in Kenya and Tanzania that decedent from their Khosian ancestors. But, they are few and far between.

 

[southside]

Nilo Sharans are actually from North Africa (Sudan) not East Africa.

The 10% Hunter Gatherer DNA in Somalis is nothing. AA are 10-20% Cadaan on average yet there is pretty much no difference between them and modern day West Africans.

Khoisan used to live in East Africa tell the Afro Asaitic, Bantu, and Nilo Sharan migrations wiped them off the map. Their is still small community's in Kenya and Tanzania that decedent from their Khosian ancestors. But, they are few and far between.

sxb nilotics originate in south sudan thats pretty much east africa they're even part of EAC, and the khoisans left east africa around the same time as all the other humans did so if they're east african so is everybody else

 

[land owner]

sxb nilotics originate in south sudan thats pretty much east africa they're even part of EAC, and the khoisans left east africa around the same time as all the other humans did so if they're east african so is everybody else

nilotes originate between south sudan and west Ethiopia to be more specific

 

[land owner]

Nilo Sharans are actually from North Africa (Sudan) not East Africa.

The 10% Hunter Gatherer DNA in Somalis is nothing. AA are 10-20% Cadaan on average yet there is pretty much no difference between them and modern day West Africans.

Khoisan used to live in East Africa tell the Afro Asaitic, Bantu, and Nilo Sharan migrations wiped them off the map. Their is still small community's in Kenya and Tanzania that decedent from their Khosian ancestors. But, they are few and far between.

The hadza and sandawe are actually closely related with mota not the khoisan, khois can only be found in Southern Africa

 

[Timo Jareer and proud]

sxb nilotics originate in south sudan thats pretty much east africa they're even part of EAC, and the khoisans left east africa around the same time as all the other humans did so if they're east african so is everybody else

Nilo Sharans migrated to South Sudan. The Dinka and other Nilos have origin stories stating they are originally from "the North" I.E, Sudan.