Sa'id of Mogadishu

[Garaad diinle]

Sa'id al-maqdishi is definitely an interesting case but certainly not a unique one there were probably a lot more travellers from somalia who ventured out to explore and trade with foreign nation. One example that comes to mind albeit a relatively recent one historically speaking is ducaale idris.

He was a very capable and experienced seafarer who've been to britain and north america in his younger days. He spoke fluent english alongside hindi swahili and arabic not to mention somali. I even remember that he travelled to the congo. Sa'id of mogadishu wasn't the first somali to travel around but was one of many. What makes him unique is that his been recorded in ibn battuta.

 

[Cush]

He was Arab, banu abgaal im pretty sure

They lived in mud huts and couldn't build a single metropolis north of Xamar or in land yet expect us to believe they were natives, when none of their tribesmen even claim that, plus all the architecture is Persian or Arab

 

[Somali_patriotic]

No source mentions him being "somali"/reer samaale

There's plenty of sources mentioning him as a somali
But never an arab nor a persian
Here's a one if you would like

 

[Cush]

Why would a nigga need to write about his whole lineage. "he's somali" enough. Somalis are all "Samaale".

Benadiri and Bantu are a minority for a reason. They are not somalis by ethnicity but they are seperate tribes who live under the Somali Nation and Identity. Calling somali a somali is very simple. For him to be a Bantu or benadiri you would specify they are from those groups. Since they aren't "Somali" in its literal sense. No somali refers to themselves as "Samaale - Sab" that's like white Americans and British calling themselves "Anglo-Saxon"

All archaeology, graves and historical sources point to Xamar being Arab and all the infrastructure is Persian and Arab

 

[Somali_patriotic]

Sa'id al-maqdishi is definitely an interesting case but certainly not a unique one there were probably a lot more travellers from somalia who ventured out to explore and trade with foreign nation. One example that comes to mind albeit a relatively recent one historically speaking is ducaale idris.

He was a very capable and experienced seafarer who've been to britain and north america in his younger days. He spoke fluent english alongside hindi swahili and arabic not to mention somali. I even remember that he travelled to the congo. Sa'id of mogadishu wasn't the first somali to travel around but was one of many. What makes him unique is that his been recorded in ibn battuta.

Is ducaale idris the upper or the middle one?
When did he start his travels?

 

[Garaad diinle]

Is ducaale idris the upper or the middle one?
When did he start his travels?

All three pictures is of ducaale the third one is of him and haji Sudi. I remember that he began traveling between 1870-80 that roughly speaking 5-15 after the american civil wars. He even participated in the army of the sayyid.

 

[Somali_patriotic]

All three pictures is of ducaale the third one is of him and haji Sudi. I remember that he began traveling between 1870-80 that roughly speaking 5-15 after the american civil wars. He even participated in the army of the sayyid.

What an interesting life he lived ma'sha'allah
He ended it fighting the kuffars

But sadly he isn't known.

 

[Three Moons]

This discussion devolved back to the usual bickering without sources, yawn. What is interesting about Sa’id of Mogadishu is that Ibn Battuta never described him as an Arab or a Persian, yet when he met Shayban or Qulistan, their Arab and Persian heritage was immediately highlighted, as were many others. Similarly, when he visited Mogadishu itself, not only did he not describe the locals as either Arab or Persian, he gave them the same ethnic description as the people of Zayla i.e ‘Barbara’ hundreds of miles away.

He also couldn’t understand the local language, and at no point hinted that it was Persian, as he had done before at the various royal courts in the Islamic world that he had visited during his journeys, nor did he find any commonality with the ‘language of Mogadishu’ and what he had heard in Kilwa or Mombasa so no chance that it was Swahili either; it was clearly the Somali language that caught his attention.

More importantly Sa’id never identified as al-Mogadishu or any variant of this term. It was Ibn Battuta that highlighted his origin as being ‘from Mogadishu’. If he had been Persian or Arab, this would have been mentioned by Ibn Battuta as he had done before with the various Arab Sultans, Persian scholars or even Turkmen warriors he encountered on his travels. Its therefore safe to assume that he was an ethnic Somali, though considering the time period, most likely would not have identified under that name, much the same way a early Medieval Merovingian wouldn’t identify under the term ‘French’ but would clearly be considered as such today.

To claim otherwise, is to entertain the notion that there was an alternative native group in medieval Somalia that spoke neither Arabic or Persian, was dark skinned, lived in both urban cities and towns on the coast and the hinterland, wore lamagoodle attire, herded camels, sailed with Beden ships, and were Muslims and then mysteriously were replaced or genocided by the Somali people who also don’t speak either Arabic or Persian as a mother tongue, are dark skinned, lived in urban cities and towns on the coast and the hinterland, still wear lamagoodle attire, still herd camels, still maintain Beden ships, and still are Muslims.

No serious scholar would entertain that, it defies logic.

 

[killerxsmoke]

They lived in mud huts and couldn't build a single metropolis north of Xamar or in land yet expect us to believe they were natives, when none of their tribesmen even claim that, plus all the architecture is Persian or Arab

The reason why the buildings are arab or persian is that somalis hired arabs to build those houses, look at zeila or hafun for example we all know that the people that live there are somalis but the all of the buildings are arab because culturally somali men dont build houses it was the women that did it and since building stone houses is hard for women they would just hire arabs to do it for them, it's that simple

 

[El Nino]

The reason why the buildings are arab or persian is that somalis hired arabs to build those houses, look at zeila or hafun for example we all know that the people that live there are somalis but the all of the buildings are arab because culturally somali men dont build houses it was the women that did it and since building stone houses is hard for women they would just hire arabs to do it for them, it's that simple

Thats for pastoral somalis and even then women built the aqal for themselves and the children. Any other type pf construction was carried by other men, especially permanent housing.

Stone houses and structures being present all around the somali peninsula suggests somali craftsmen building these houses and of course foreigners were hired to do construction also.

 

[The alchemist]

More importantly Sa’id never identified as al-Mogadishu or any variant of this term. It was Ibn Battuta that highlighted his origin as being ‘from Mogadishu’. If he had been Persian or Arab, this would have been mentioned by Ibn Battuta as he had done before with the various Arab Sultans, Persian scholars or even Turkmen warriors he encountered on his travels. Its therefore safe to assume that he was an ethnic Somali, though considering the time period, most likely would not have identified under that name, much the same way a early Medieval Merovingian wouldn’t identify under the term ‘French’ but would clearly be considered as such today.

It's amazing how disingenuous people are to hold these conditions full well knowing they are doing anachronistic requirements. It exposes the unfair, or rather impossible, conversation they will have. They want to reject before even considering them by giving a fair and honest look at the evidence with basic charitability. Do you know why? We are dealing with enemies who have hatred for our kind. It is akin to the Jews who fabricate untrue stories about the history of Sham because of their malicious hatred and insecurities.

To claim otherwise, is to entertain the notion that there was an alternative native group in medieval Somalia that spoke neither Arabic or Persian, was dark skinned, lived in both urban cities and towns on the coast and the hinterland, wore lamagoodle attire, herded camels, sailed with Beden ships, and were Muslims and then mysteriously were replaced or genocided by the Somali people who also don’t speak either Arabic or Persian as a mother tongue, are dark skinned, lived in urban cities and towns on the coast and the hinterland, still wear lamagoodle attire, still herd camels, still maintain Beden ships, and still are Muslims.

Don't underestimate their stupidity. They have entertained it, I am sure.

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

He was Arab, banu abgaal im pretty sure

Abgaal didn't exist at the time

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

The reason why the buildings are arab or persian is that somalis hired arabs to build those houses, look at zeila or hafun for example we all know that the people that live there are somalis but the all of the buildings are arab because culturally somali men dont build houses it was the women that did it and since building stone houses is hard for women they would just hire arabs to do it for them, it's that simple

Gibil madows mostly lived in huts in banadiri settlements, Arabs were also hiring other Arabs to build for them in banaadir

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

There's plenty of sources mentioning him as a somali
But never an arab nor a persian
Here's a one if you would like
View attachment 299320

Ibn battuta didn't mention him as Somali, that's an invalid source

 

[killerxsmoke]

Ibn battuta didn't mention him as Somali, that's an invalid source

He mentioned the ruler to be somali only natural to think he is somali

 

[silentshimbir]

No evidence of him being reer samaale, none of the samaale reer xamar groups claim to have lived in xamar that far back nor were they using nisbahs to muqdisho , all that's known is that he's a xamari however whether he's Arab or Persian isn't known yet

he was somali , stop trying to rewrite history,

Yes, there is no more information, but most of the scholars who wrote books in coastal cities were Arabs or Persians

He was a native, and scholars wrote also distinguished the minority ajnabi populations of arab/persion/desi

Yes, there is no more information, but most of the scholars who wrote books in coastal cities were Arabs or Persians

they didn't say it was created them , but there sizeable population of foreign merchants , stop misconstruing history to fit your narrative

 

[silentshimbir]

They lived in mud huts and couldn't build a single metropolis north of Xamar or in land yet expect us to believe they were natives, when none of their tribesmen even claim that, plus all the architecture is Persian or Arab

says the langaab who "we Wuz Arabs"

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

He mentioned the ruler to be somali only natural to think he is somali

No it's not natural for someone that knows basic history of muqdisho

 

[Banadiri Warrior]

he was somali , stop trying to rewrite history,

Saying he was reer samaale is rewriting history what's known is that he's a xamari, and it's also known at the time that there weren't any reer samaale xamaris as they settled in the city after.

He was a native, and scholars wrote also distinguished the minority ajnabi populations of arab/persion/desi

Those native Arabs, Persians and Desi's were majority up until colonization

they didn't say it was created them , but there sizeable population of foreign merchants , stop misconstruing history to fit your narrative

Merchants were native Arab or persian banadiris

 

[Three Moons]

It's amazing how disingenuous people are to hold these conditions full well knowing they are doing anachronistic requirements. It exposes the unfair, or rather impossible, conversation they will have. They want to reject before even considering them by giving a fair and honest look at the evidence with basic charitability. Do you know why? We are dealing with enemies who have hatred for our kind. It is akin to the Jews who fabricate untrue stories about the history of Sham because of their malicious hatred and insecurities.

Don't underestimate their stupidity. They have entertained it, I am sure.

so where was that Arab and Persian MAJORITY the entire time Ibn Battuta was in Mogadishu and Zayla when all he saw was dark skin lamagoodle foreheads?



Ah I know, they were playing hide and seek with the world-traveller cause they wouldn’t want him to accurately record the ethnic make-up of the citizens in medieval Somalia