Rendille or Reer diide

No.



I think the person who wrote this meant Dabarre instead of Geelidle because the latter is a Mirifle subclan who speak the local Reewin (aka Af Maay) language. Basically Geelidle don't have a unique language but Dabarre do and they're missing from the tree.
The language tree was from the works of Christopher Ehret and a Somali researcher:
1603837635487.png
 

Plo_Koon

❇Geeljire of the Cosmos❇
Cushites are the weakest link in the Afroasiatic family , getting dominated by nilotics and Bantu , they even got dominated in their homeland in Ethiopia by dhagcas Semites for the past 3 thousand years :kendrickcry:

Somalis were the last hope for the Cushites and look at their situation
:mjlol:
 
Rendille are different their language is so similat to af somali that some scholars say it's a dialect of somali. These people definitely have a relation with somalis much more than afars who are our closest 'relatives'
 
Cushites are the weakest link in the Afroasiatic family , getting dominated by nilotics and Bantu , they even got dominated in their homeland in Ethiopia by dhagcas Semites for the past 3 thousand years :kendrickcry:

Somalis were the last hope for the Cushites and look at their situation
:mjlol:
Actually habashis are just cushite with some semitic blood, they adopted the semitic language.
Suugo Science isnt real science saxiib. :comeon:
Proto Somalis (omo tana) came from northern kenya
Oromos dont descent from Omo tana
View attachment 149237
This isn't complete.
Proto sam originated in southern ethiopia/northern kenya then they moved slowly to the north and then came back south. Actual historical evidence from arab scholars shows that Somalis lived around Xamar and Barawe everything South of that was Bantu
 
That's incompatible with the latest genetic findings. Trust me, the ancestor of all those yar-yars linguistically related to Somalis came from Somalia and then moved in the direction of Northern Kenya or Southern Ethiopia.

Why do you have issues with this? I'd rather be their ancestor than descend from them. 😂
I think it's already well established that somalis come from southern ethio/north kenya.
We moved to the north and then came back so technically proto-somalis come from the south , went up north and occupied the rest of somalia when they became modern somalis.
Rendille are probably a group of proto somalia who never moved up north, when somalis came back from the north we were already a different people.
 

Apollo

Staff Member
Moderator
Proto sam originated in southern ethiopia/northern kenya then they moved slowly to the north and then came back south.
I think it's already well established that somalis come from southern ethio/north kenya.
It isn't an established fact. That hypothesis (which it is, and not a fact) is solely based on that there are a few more Somali related languages in that area. There is no archaeological or genetic evidence pointing in this direction.

At best, Somalis may come from Southern Somalia. But I do not believe at all they come from Southern Ethiopia or Northern Kenya. Those two areas have extremely high Omotic admixture (related to the Mota cave population) which is either extremely low or completely lacking in Northern Somalis.

Also, recently (2020) some ancient genomes from 3,000-1,000 years ago from Northern Kenya were published and they are nothing like present-day Somalis.


Even native North Kenyan Somalis (Garre etc) and Northern Somalis (Isaaq etc) are genetically (autosomally) different, forget those others like the Sakuye and Rendille.

Moreover, Af-Maxa has erased previous linguistic diversity that may have existed among proto-Northern Somalis.

We moved to the north and then came back so technically proto-somalis come from the south , went up north and occupied the rest of somalia when they became modern somalis.
Rendille are probably a group of proto somalia who never moved up north, when somalis came back from the north we were already a different people.
From Southern Somalia, perhaps, but not from Southern Ethiopia nor Northern Kenya. I reject that hypothesis and I see no convincing evidence for it.
 
It isn't an established fact. That hypothesis (which it is, and not a fact) is solely based on that there are a few more Somali related languages in that area. There is no archaeological or genetic evidence pointing in this direction.

At best, Somalis may come from Southern Somalia. But I do not believe at all they come from Southern Ethiopia or Northern Kenya. Those two areas have extremely high Omotic admixture (related to the Mota cave population) which is either extremely low or completely lacking in Northern Somalis.

Also, recently (2020) some ancient genomes from 3,000-1,000 years ago from Northern Kenya were published and they are nothing like present-day Somalis.


Even native North Kenyan Somalis (Garre etc) and Northern Somalis (Isaaq etc) are genetically (autosomally) different, forget those others like the Sakuye and Rendille.

Moreover, Af-Maxa has erased previous linguistic diversity that may have existed among proto-Northern Somalis.



From Southern Somalia, perhaps, but not from Southern Ethiopia nor Northern Kenya. I reject that hypothesis and I see no convincing evidence for it.
Interesting. I think that southern ethio can still ne a possibility, we aren't really talking about omo valley but an area which is still inhabited by cushites like modern day southern oromia and southern DDSI. Even northern kenya is still largely inhabited by somalis and boranas, i think we need to differentiate north-west kenya and south-west ethiopia which has omotic and nilotiv populations and north-east kenya south -east ethiopia which have cuschitic populations.
Even if we say we come from modern day southern somalia that area isn't far from sothern ethiopia/northen kenya. For example let's say somalis come from Gedo or Jubbada hoose, that's not really far from the north kenya/south ethiopia hypothesis.
 

Apollo

Staff Member
Moderator
Interesting. I think that southern ethio can still ne a possibility, we aren't really talking about omo valley but an area which is still inhabited by cushites like modern day southern oromia and southern DDSI. Even northern kenya is still largely inhabited by somalis and boranas, i think we need to differentiate north-west kenya and south-west ethiopia which has omotic and nilotiv populations and north-east kenya south -east ethiopia which have cuschitic populations.
Even if we say we come from modern day southern somalia that area isn't far from sothern ethiopia/northen kenya. For example let's say somalis come from Gedo or Jubbada hoose, that's not really far from the north kenya/south ethiopia hypothesis.
By the way, the Raxanweyn and Hawiye are both E-BY192465 (less diverse paternally) meanwhile Northern Somalis have more different E-V32 lineages and recently a North Somali with E-Z21175 was discovered (quite different from the main E-Y18629 Somali branch).

It is still up in the air where the first proto-Somalis originated, but I am thinking it truly was somewhere in Somalia rather than Ethiopia or Kenya.
 
It isn't an established fact. That hypothesis (which it is, and not a fact) is solely based on that there are a few more Somali related languages in that area. There is no archaeological or genetic evidence pointing in this direction.

At best, Somalis may come from Southern Somalia. But I do not believe at all they come from Southern Ethiopia or Northern Kenya. Those two areas have extremely high Omotic admixture (related to the Mota cave population) which is either extremely low or completely lacking in Northern Somalis.

Also, recently (2020) some ancient genomes from 3,000-1,000 years ago from Northern Kenya were published and they are nothing like present-day Somalis.


Even native North Kenyan Somalis (Garre etc) and Northern Somalis (Isaaq etc) are genetically (autosomally) different, forget those others like the Sakuye and Rendille.

Moreover, Af-Maxa has erased previous linguistic diversity that may have existed among proto-Northern Somalis.



From Southern Somalia, perhaps, but not from Southern Ethiopia nor Northern Kenya. I reject that hypothesis and I see no convincing evidence for it.
It seems the northern kenya hypothesis is modern while in the past ( before the 1960s) western academia was convinced that somalis came from either arabia(disproved) or southern egypt/nubia. What do you think? And what about other cushitic peoples like agaws, afars, beja etc. I know we aren't the same but it would make sense if all cushites came from the same area and then became different people, maybe there's also a southern ethiopia hypothesis that includes afars/agaws,bejas, oromos and somalis , if it was confirmed they also come form that area then the southern ethio/north kenya hypothesis would be more likely
 

Apollo

Staff Member
Moderator
It seems the northern kenya hypothesis is modern while in the past ( before the 1960s) western academia was convinced that somalis came from either arabia(disproved) or southern egypt/nubia. What do you think? And what about other cushitic peoples like agaws, afars, beja etc. I know we aren't the same but it would make sense if all cushites came from the same area and then became different people, maybe there's also a southern ethiopia hypothesis that includes afars/agaws,bejas, oromos and somalis , if it was confirmed they also come form that area then the southern ethio/north kenya hypothesis would be more likely
Hehe, there's no way Agaws and Afars are from Southern Ethiopia. Those two groups are surprisingly high in autosomal SW-Eurasian (almost the same % as Tigrays and more than Oromos, even the Oromized Agaws) and have the lowest Omotic affinities in Ethiopia (especially the Saho and Xamtanga Agaws). I think they are pretty much native to their regions.

proto-Cushitic came from Northeast Sudan and moved into the Horn via Eritrea. The first split was with the Beja vs the rest, then Agaws vs the rest, then (relevant for Somalis) Saho-Afars vs the rest. Following a pattern where main branches emerge in a North to South pattern. But what I said in this post is only relevant to the origins of the Cushitic language family and not necessarily to proto-Somali which comes a few thousand years later.
 
Hehe, there's no way Agaws and Afars are from Southern Ethiopia. Those two groups are surprisingly high in autosomal SW-Eurasian (almost the same % as Tigrays and more than Oromos, even the Oromized Agaws) and have the lowest Omotic affinities in Ethiopia (especially the Saho and Xamtanga Agaws). I think they are pretty much native to their regions.

proto-Cushitic came from Northeast Sudan and moved into the Horn via Eritrea. The first split was with the Beja vs the rest, then Agaws vs the rest, then (relevant for Somalis) Saho-Afars vs the rest. Following a pattern where main branches emerge in a North to South pattern. But what I said in this post is only relevant to the origins of the Cushitic language family and not necessarily to proto-Somali which comes a few thousand years later.
What? I thought we had the lowest omotic percentages while habeshas amharas and tigrays had more followed by oromo
 

Nafiso Qalanjo

Meme Queen
By the way, the Raxanweyn and Hawiye are both E-BY192465 (less diverse paternally) meanwhile Northern Somalis have more different E-V32 lineages and recently a North Somali with E-Z21175 was discovered (quite different from the main E-Y18629 Somali branch).

It is still up in the air where the first proto-Somalis originated, but I am thinking it truly was somewhere in Somalia rather than Ethiopia or Kenya.
Interesting. I thought Northern Somalis were hapologroup T, while Southern were E-V32. I am Hawiye and I got E-V32 on my parental haplogroup so you were wrong there.

Or are E-BY192465, and E-Z21175 a sub branch of E-V32?🤔
 

Apollo

Staff Member
Moderator
What? I thought we had the lowest omotic percentages while habeshas amharas and tigrays had more followed by oromo
I meant excluding Somalis, as in "Ethiopians" (not Somali).

Interesting. I thought Northern Somalis were hapologroup T, while Southern were E-V32. I am Hawiye and I got E-V32 on my parental haplogroup so you were wrong there.

Or are E-BY192465, and E-Z21175 a sub branch of E-V32?🤔
Both regions got those lineages. T is the new one of the two (came later, probably spread from Djibouti two thousand years ago), so it has less of a balanced spread.

Yeah, those aforementioned long numbers are sub-groups of V32. They aren't tested by 23andme, but elsewhere.
 
Even native North Kenyan Somalis (Garre etc) and Northern Somalis (Isaaq etc) are genetically (autosomally) different, forget those others like the Sakuye and Rendille.
No Somali tribe in Kenya claims to be native to that area in reality. By sheeko one of the earliest groups there were the Ajuran who were pushed there due to their oppressive rule and that's recent. They also claim to have welcomed the Degodia to Wajir. Maybe native to Southern Ethiopia?
 
@Som I know you have been holding to this Southern origin Hypothesis (Tana-dawa river).

For the first time, you could have genetics on your side, if some of the Somali Clans keep
Showing Non E-V32 DNA results like we have now E-M293 and others (E-M35s.)
( I have like 3 E-M293 in my relatives list).

So, if the so called Proto-Samaale Hypothesis holds with genetic prove that their so many
Clans being Non E-V32 that they are genetically different from Northern Somali Origin
E-V32, then that means, we will have two Somali origins one for Northern origin
red sea/ Gulf of Aden and one for Proto-Somali Tana-dawa river.

I have had this feeling for Proto-Somali (i know a lot of Somalis felt the same) with the
all the Maay Somali dialects and Af-Tunni Af-Dabare Af-Garre and others. i have also heard
there is also Af-Ajuraan.
 
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It will be very interesting to see this Clan Dna results for A- Mirifle-Eelaay because
they are the oldest Rahaweyn Clan and B-Digil-Tunni Digil.

Also to see Ajuraan results will be nice.
 
@Som I know you have been holding to this Southern origin Hypothesis (Tana-dawa river).

For the first time, you could have genetics on your side, if some of the Somali Clans keep
Showing Non E-V32 DNA results like we have now E-M293 and others (E-M35s.)
( I have like 3 E-M293 in my relatives list).

So, if the so called Proto-Samaale Hypothesis holds with genetic prove that their so many
Clans being Non E-V32 that they are genetically different from Northern Somali Origin
E-V32, then that means, we will have two Somali origins one for Northern origin
red sea/ Gulf of Aden and one for Proto-Somali Tana-dawa river.

I have had this feeling for Proto-Somali (i know a lot of Somalis felt the same) with the
all the Maay Somali dialects and Af-Tunni Af-Dabare Af-Garre and others. i have also heard
there is also Af-Ajuraan.
Interesting. So i guess major clans (darood, Hawiye, isaaq, dir etc) would have Northern origins while smaller ones + rahanweyn would be from North kenya/south ethiopia
 

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