Origins of T-BY182320

Compare the dir/isaaq T that is non-existent in arabia to habeshi J1. https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-L860/

4400ybp lineage that clusters with a yemeni from sanaa and all downstream subclades are yemeni/arabs. That's as clear cut to an arabian lineage you can get.
It's possible that the Dir T were urban settlers in Arabia hence there lineage never grew. However its also possible that Dir crossed into Eritrea from Eritrea coast into Arabia, as you have many EV32 eritreans that crossed from Eritrea into Arabia. Also the Iraqi samples are not as much tested as the Gulf, so it could have a quite recent Babalonian origin. But there is no way its from Asia as you guys share recent TMRC from samples that crossed quite recently into Europea.
 
It's possible that the Dir T were urban settlers in Arabia hence there lineage never grew. However its also possible that Dir crossed into Eritrea from Eritrea coast into Arabia, as you have many EV32 eritreans that crossed from Eritrea into Arabia. Also the Iraqi samples are not as much tested as the Gulf, so it could have a quite recent Babalonian origin. But there is no way its from Asia as you guys share recent TMRC from samples that crossed quite recently into Europea.
What do you mean by this? TMRC between Somalis and any Europeans with T-M70 is like 10,000 years.

My theory about T-Y45591 (somali subclade) is that it is from Bronze Age individual/s that migrated through Arabian peninsula to the HOA. Probably Sea-Peoples or Philistines from the Levant after the Bronze Age collapse. It explains T-Y45591’s rarity outside of the Horn or Arabia and the timescale.

Either that or some ancient Arabian Christians or Jews.
 
What do you mean by this? TMRC between Somalis and any Europeans with T-M70 is like 10,000 years.

My theory about T-Y45591 (somali subclade) is that it is from Bronze Age individual/s that migrated through Arabian peninsula to the HOA. Probably Sea-Peoples or Philistines from the Levant after the Bronze Age collapse. It explains T-Y45591’s rarity outside of the Horn or Arabia and the timescale.

Either that or some ancient Arabian Christians or Jews.

Nah that's abit out there. If T-Y45591 was truly a bronze age lineage from arabia, we would find tons of yemenis/qataris/omanis/saudis with this lineage. Arabs are like somalis so whatever lineage is "native" in that region, it will show up in multiple tribes as a result of founder effects. Also this lineage is completely absent from the HOA apart from people with close contacts with dir/isaaqs. My theory is that its a hellensitic era lineage brought by either egyptians/nubians as merchants. Both those areas are undersampled, the few ancient samples from that area show that T-L208 lineages existed like the Kulubnarti nubians, and Roman era goods were found in grave sites in places like berbera and xiis.
 
T1 and J1 are found everywhere together and appear everywhere roughly at the same time. It’s just that one lineage is more successful at certain places compared to the other. No doubt the T1 found in Somalia is of Arabian origin.

Did you guys know that another T1 strain is found in Somalis that is completely different to the Dir/Isaaq one? It was found among the Raxanweyne.
 
T1 and J1 are found everywhere together and appear everywhere roughly at the same time. It’s just that one lineage is more successful at certain places compared to the other. No doubt the T1 found in Somalia is of Arabian origin.

Did you guys know that another T1 strain is found in Somalis that is completely different to the Dir/Isaaq one? It was found among the Raxanweyne.
Yeah but the rahanweyne one is found in other ethnic groups unlike the dir/isaaq one
 
Yeah but the rahanweyne one is found in other ethnic groups unlike the dir/isaaq one
You are right. They got nothing to do with each other and must have come to the horn at different times just like how J1’s have entered the horn at different points in time.
 
T1 and J1 are found everywhere together and appear everywhere roughly at the same time. It’s just that one lineage is more successful at certain places compared to the other. No doubt the T1 found in Somalia is of Arabian origin.

Did you guys know that another T1 strain is found in Somalis that is completely different to the Dir/Isaaq one? It was found among the Raxanweyne.

Why do you think it is so rare in Arabia? I’m suspicious of YFull because of its over representation of gulf Arabs. More studies need to be carried out around the HOA. There’s a reason that there’s a lot of old Christian gravesites in Somaliland. Maybe @kaahin13 is right about the Nubian/Egyptian link.
 
Iranians are very under represented compared to their population and ethnic groups they have. However I'm leaning towards a hornet /Egyptian Christian origin. Isxaaq sounds like a jewda Christian origin.
 
Iranians are very under represented compared to their population and ethnic groups they have. However I'm leaning towards a hornet /Egyptian Christian origin. Isxaaq sounds like a jewda Christian origin.
Have you ever seen an Iranian with t-l208? Iranians are undersampled but it’s not likely they have any connection with us. They’re more like r1/j2/j1
 
Dunno but the Mideast went through multiple mass genocides especially during the Bronze Age, maybe T niggas were caught lacking
The Assyrians were brutal and the Persians did a series of campaigns in the ME coming to as close as Yemen and Egypt. They even knew about the somali city states along the Northern coast and threatened once.
 
Did you guys know that another T1 strain is found in Somalis that is completely different to the Dir/Isaaq one? It was found among the Raxanweyne.
The rahanwayne sample also has clear connections with the arabian peninsula
It wasn't found in all raxanweyn but only in mirifle sagaal clans like luwaay and hadame and this makes lineage wise sense, as these clans do infact claim to descend from an arab ancestor umar diin who is said to have lived in harar and was a descendent of abu bakr al sidiqi. I think unlike with Darood their claim to arab origin may have some truth and their T lineage may come form the arab peninsula. But the majority of raxanweyne like eelaay, hariin and so on are EV-32
 
It wasn't found in all raxanweyn but only in mirifle sagaal clans like luwaay and hadame and this makes lineage wise sense, as these clans do infact claim to descend from an arab ancestor umar diin who is said to have lived in harar and was a descendent of abu bakr al sidiqi. The majority of rahanweyne like eelaay, hariin and so on are EV-32
yes you are right, majority of raxanweyne get E-V32. I even know of a J2 guy from Bay-Bakool Area. The T1 found among the tribes you mentioned are also found among Sudanese and other horn Africans. I doubt it came with the Islamic sheikhs. It has an ancient presence in Africa and most likely came with other middle Easter derived E-CTS10880 and J1 lineages like P56 among others.
 
Many ancient samples from Arabia are on the way. Some from the Neolithic and others from Bronze and Iron Age. One of them contains a Bronze Age T1 from Khaibar.
The theory of T1 expanding from the Fertile Crescent together with J1 into Arabia while others went from the Fertile Crescent into Europe seems to get stronger and stronger.
 
Many ancient samples from Arabia are on the way. Some from the Neolithic and others from Bronze and Iron Age. One of them contains a Bronze Age T1 from Khaibar.
The theory of T1 expanding from the Fertile Crescent together with J1 into Arabia while others went from the Fertile Crescent into Europe seems to get stronger and stronger.

Come on man you know that bronze age lineage aint gonna be related to us. Check out T-CTS11451, you'll see tons of arabs on their. if a deep subclade is found in that sample you know its gonna be under that.

It originating from the fertile crescent doesnt mean that it had to go through the arabian peninsula into HOA. And even if it did, why don't we see alot of samples along the migratory path? The arabian peninsula is oversampled and even if it did venture their in low frequency, just by the tribal nature of arabs, some tribes will go through founder effects. Also that region never went through massive population change, the relative population group is static, so why aren't the descendents of the sabaeans, himyars, hadramis, adnanis positive for T-Y45591?
 

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