Jarahoroto (ancient) town in Awdal named after King and Queen of the Harla people

[MARAQ DIGAAG]

@Young Popeye ,

Have you heard of Harla king called Yakamasure? Apparently there is some Somali oral history indicating an ancient Kimgdom around the modern Somaliland/East Ethiopia area. I haven’t found much online.


@James Dahl , how do Harla fit into Somali genealogy?

 

[James Dahl]

There are three proposed origins of the Xarla or Xarala people, they are either not originally Somali but adopted, Xarla Xariire Samaale, or Xarla Koombe Kablalax Daarood. Their homeland was directly north of Xarar on the other side of the Ahmar mountains, where their town Xarla lay.

Xarla history is not very well documented and this is the extent of my knowledge.

 

[MARAQ DIGAAG]

There are three proposed origins of the Xarla or Xarala people, they are either not originally Somali but adopted, Xarla Xariire Samaale, or Xarla Koombe Kablalax Daarood. Their homeland was directly north of Xarar on the other side of the Ahmar mountains, where their town Xarla lay.

Xarla history is not very well documented and this is the extent of my knowledge.

I think they are a Somaloid group who later became their own stand alone tribe like many other groups across the Horn. Someone needs to test minority clans in the North.

 

[Young Popeye]

@Young Popeye ,

Have you heard of Harla king called Yakamasure? Apparently there is some Somali oral history indicating an ancient Kimgdom around the modern Somaliland/East Ethiopia area. I haven’t found much online.


@James Dahl , how do Harla fit into Somali genealogy?

I have not heard of Yakamsure but tales all revolve around harla, he was probably Yahar (yibir) which were harla tribe in hargeysa and other northern cities. Studies on the Yibr language shows similarity with af harla. I have heard of harla clans attacking aw barkhedle and aw abadir. The two saints were influential in founding Adal by successfully ending tribal disputes. Although Harla accepted this, the newly entered afar/Irir Samale did not get that message because they arrived after Adal was formed. This is why Harla disappeared when Adal collapsed, and regional politics shifted back to nationalism. Here's a map of 1300BC from the book "the student's manual of ancient geography"

 

[MARAQ DIGAAG]

I have not heard of Yakamsure but tales all revolve around harla, he was probably Yahar (yibir) which were harla tribe in hargeysa and other northern cities. Studies on the Yibr language shows similarity with af harla. I have heard of harla clans attacking aw barkhedle and aw abadir. The two saints were influential in founding Adal by successfully ending tribal disputes. Although Harla accepted this, the newly entered afar/Irir Samale did not get that message because they arrived after Adal was formed. This is why Harla disappeared when Adal collapsed, and regional politics shifted back to nationalism. Here's a map of 1300BC from the book "the student's manual of ancient geography"

Thanks for the response.


The Yibir and the Madhibaan do not have their own Language. From what I read,they merely have some extra slang which they communicate amongst themselves with. The Madhibaan are basically the blacksmith caste, groups who are looked down up all across Africa by Nilotes and Cushites. Gabooye were the hunter gatherers. Gabooye claim to have had a large kingdom called “Dhaami” in Northern Kingdom and the neighbouring areas before they were overthrown by Somali clans. I believe the history of the Harla, Yibir, the Northern Darood and Dir, even some Afar, are somewhat tied together.

My theory is that the minority groups were the first proto-Somalis to settle Northern Somalia and they could do this because of a subsistence economy consisting of Hunter gathering, fishing on the coast and tool making. The other Somalis who were at this time around the Ogaden and Northern Somali probably migrated en masse to Northern Somalia when they adopted large scale pastoralist lifestyle after they started domesticating the camel. There might have been some small remnants of Afar -Saho like people in Northern and some Semitic migrants there too, around the coast (See Apollos thread on the Somali origin). This is all Suugo science by the way.

As for the Yibir, there is a lot of confusion about their Jewish comections etc. Yibiro were basically the priestly class of Somalis, whom people visited for blessings , spiritual knowledge, astrology and treatment of ailments. I think there might have been a power struggle between them and the Islamic orthodoxy.

 

[Young Popeye]

Thanks for the response.


The Yibir and the Madhibaan do not have their own Language. From what I read,they merely have some extra slang which they communicate amongst themselves with. The Madhibaan are basically the blacksmith caste, groups who are looked down up all across Africa by Nilotes and Cushites. Gabooye were the hunter gatherers. Gabooye claim to have had a large kingdom called “Dhaami” in Northern Kingdom and the neighbouring areas before they were overthrown by Somali clans. I believe the history of the Harla, Yibir, the Northern Darood and Dir, even some Afar, are somewhat tied together.

My theory is that the minority groups were the first proto-Somalis to settle Northern Somalia and they could do this because of a subsistence economy consisting of Hunter gathering, fishing on the coast and tool making. The other Somalis who were at this time around the Ogaden and Northern Somali probably migrated en masse to Northern Somalia when they adopted large scale pastoralist lifestyle after they started domesticating the camel. There might have been some small remnants of Afar -Saho like people in Northern and some Semitic migrants there too, around the coast (See Apollos thread on the Somali origin). This is all Suugo science by the way.

As for the Yibir, there is a lot of confusion about their Jewish comections etc. Yibiro were basically the priestly class of Somalis, whom people visited for blessings , spiritual knowledge, astrology and treatment of ailments. I think there might have been a power struggle between them and the Islamic orthodoxy.

My theory is North to South and then South to North. The Cushites at one point held Syria but when the asian empires began to gain momentum, they invaded the coast hundreds of years ago and pushed the cushites south but a few remained in the north adopting the invaders way of life. Tribes also wondered off into the south all the way to kenya tanzania and even zimbabwe. the bantu migration wiped many cushites out, some survived and returned back to the north but their language and way of life was very different from the northern cushites as a result of isolation. If you take a look at the map it puts cush way out into sudan. The Jabart known as Darod are found in eritrea and other regions, they seem to be a separate tribe distinct from Dir or Harla but were assimilated by them in the later stages.

 

[Luna]

My theory is North to South and then South to North. The Cushites at one point held Syria but when the asian empires began to gain momentum, they invaded the coast hundreds of years ago and pushed the cushites south but a few remained in the north adopting the invaders way of life. Tribes also wondered off into the south all the way to kenya tanzania and even zimbabwe. the bantu migration wiped many cushites out, some survived and returned back to the north but their language and way of life was very different from the northern cushites as a result of isolation. If you take a look at the map it puts cush way out into sudan. The Jabart known as Darod are found in eritrea and other regions, they seem to be a separate tribe distinct from Dir or Harla but were assimilated by them in the later stages.

Syria?????? Never heard that before.

When did Darod get assimlated by Dir? Lol. Xarla in fact, got assimilated by Darood (Xarla Koombe).
What is the relation between Somali's and Harari's in your opinion? Are you guys and Sheikhaal the same thing?,

 

[Young Popeye]

Syria?????? Never heard that before.

When did Darod get assimlated by Dir? Lol. Xarla in fact, got assimilated by Darood (Xarla Koombe).
What is the relation between Somali's and Harari's in your opinion? Are you guys and Sheikhaal the same thing?,

You never heard about it because there's no historical documents that survived such as what the romans and Assyrians have since it was long before them, there's evidence in old texts like bible and archaeological findings in the area. Bahrain for example was under Cushite rule: https://books.google.ca/books?id=0m...QAQ#v=onepage&q=bahrain royal cushite&f=false

Irir samale dir hawiye etc ties to darod, is by assimilation, though they call it intermarriage thats their tradition. Intermarriage is a clever way of saying assimilated. The Oromo also claim to have gone through an intermarriage with Hadiya in Arsi and other regions.

Hararis consider sheekhal to be harari who got assimilated by Somalis. Sometime in the 19th century, there wasnt enough Hararis to intermarry so they imported many Sheekhal to be re-harariszed, so they certainly have recent Sheekhal blood.

 

[Luna]

You never heard about it because there's no historical documents that survived such as what the romans and Assyrians have since it was long before them, there's evidence in old texts like bible and archaeological findings in the area. Bahrain for example was under Cushite rule: https://books.google.ca/books?id=0maIAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA35&lpg=PA35&dq=bahrain+royal+cushite&source=bl&ots=kg_KIWO2dK&sig=K87XrdtWa9LrbMFiMiuNFXVal90&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwinmr-Is7TdAhXm6IMKHTVDCagQ6AEwHXoECAAQAQ#v=onepage&q=bahrain royal cushite&f=false

Irir samale dir hawiye etc ties to darod, is by assimilation, though they call it intermarriage thats their tradition. Intermarriage is a clever way of saying assimilated. The Oromo also claim to have gone through an intermarriage with Hadiya in Arsi and other regions.

Hararis consider sheekhal to be harari who got assimilated by Somalis. Sometime in the 19th century, there wasnt enough Hararis to intermarry so they imported many Sheekhal to be re-harariszed, so they certainly have recent Sheekhal blood.

Interesting. Thanks for the link.

What do you suppose Darood/Jaberti's were originally?

I always felt that Sheikhaals wrre Somali speaking Harari's. Good to know I am not the only one.

 

[embarassing]

Interesting. Thanks for the link.

What do you suppose Darood/Jaberti's were originally?

I always felt that Sheikhaals wrre Somali speaking Harari's. Good to know I am not the only one.

What makes you believe that? I see no difference, and genetically they're exactly the same as the rest of the Somalis.

 

[Luna]

What makes you believe that? I see no difference, and genetically they're exactly the same as the rest of the Somalis.

They claim the same ancestry as Harari's (Abadir Umar) and originate from Harar. They also look different. I know quite a few Sheikhaals and Harari's and there are a lot of similarities even just lookswise.

 

[Young Popeye]

They claim the same ancestry as Harari's (Abadir Umar) and originate from Harar. They also look different. I know quite a few Sheikhaals and Harari's and there are a lot of similarities even just lookswise.

Arab empires such as Abbasid were major powers that wiped out many civilizations with the "Arabic" first politics just look at Iraq Syria Egypt etc. The thing is Sheekhal/Harari dont originate from Abadir however Abadir settled Harla tribal disputes by telling them to look at their brothers as fellow humans, so the clans respect him and call him father. There's also a tribe in the west (Halaba) who also respect him and claim to originate from Harar. Harla invested in Arabism/muslim first and Adal cease to exist so most of them disappeared, had Adal survived until today, there wouldnt be a somali, eritrean or Ethiopian but something like Sudan, full of Arabic speakers claiming Arab identity. Persians are probably the only people that resisted this by coming up with their own Shia sect.

btw Hararis were going to settle around 60,000 sheekhal in Harar after the Somali state kicked them out but Oromo state vetoed

 

[embarassing]

They claim the same ancestry as Harari's (Abadir Umar) and originate from Harar. They also look different. I know quite a few Sheikhaals and Harari's and there are a lot of similarities even just lookswise.

Most of if not all the lineages Somalis claim have proven to be false though.

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[Young Popeye]

Most of if not all the lineages Somalis claim have proven to be false though.

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I think there's a better way to go about it, then say clans are myths even if its true as most will take offense to it. I think the better question to ask is are clans important? My family were in Mogadishu before the civil war, and it was awful. Secret police were rampant spying on people, my fam were surprised to find out some of the police were Hararis. People would make assessments of what clan one belonged to by the type of car he drove. Associating the owners of expensive cars with Siad Barre's clan etc