America is the Somalia of developed nations

AdoonkaAlle

Ragna qowl baa xira, dumarna meher baa xira.
I don't really care about the ban. As long as I know that women would get the care that they need when it comes to miscarriages and ect, i'm good to go. Kids are a blessing and there are people desperate for babies.

I was simply scared about the medical issue points as miscarriages and ectopic pregnancies can happen to anyone and hearing about it recently happening to people that I know and also being a woman makes you worry about that.
I think part of the confusion starts with calling it a ban when it’s not that. What happened was a woman’s liberty to choose to have an abortion was overturned not that the court made abortion illegal. So that liberty is no longer protected under the federal constitution.

If you read about roe vs wade case it was about a woman who became pregnant with her third child and wanted an abortion. But she lived in Texas, where abortions were illegal except in rare circumstances.

Now after the overturn abortion is still protected in 16+ states, restricted in some & banned in about 13. In all states exceptions are made for medical necessities, self-managed abortion ( taking abortion pills ) is still allowed in all states except for 3 even then the pregnant woman is exempted from prosecution.

I understand the worry that dumarka musliminta have about it laakin I believe many are misled intentionally so as to fight for the liberty to have abortion unrestrictedly whether it’s within the confines of diinta or not. This liberty shouldn’t be denied under any circumstance no state, religion has any right to interfere this is what at stake for such women.
 
I think part of the confusion starts with calling it a ban when it’s not that. What happened was a woman’s liberty to choose to have an abortion was overturned not that the court made abortion illegal. So that liberty is no longer protected under the federal constitution.

If you read about roe vs wade case it was about a woman who became pregnant with her third child and wanted an abortion. But she lived in Texas, where abortions were illegal except in rare circumstances.

Now after the overturn abortion is still protected in 16+ states, restricted in some & banned in about 13. In all states exceptions are made for medical necessities, self-managed abortion ( taking abortion pills ) is still allowed in all states except for 3 even then the pregnant woman is exempted from prosecution.

I understand the worry that dumarka musliminta have about it laakin I believe many are misled intentionally so as to fight for the liberty to have abortion unrestrictedly whether it’s within the confines of diinta or not. This liberty shouldn’t be denied under any circumstance no state, religion has any right to interfere this is what at stake for such women.
If pregnancy is the result of rape, not all States have an exception. A raped Muslim woman in one of these States could fall foul of this restriction. This is based on an Ijtihad assumption being thrown about that Abortion is permitted in cases of rape. Doubt it was ever an issue historically hence the absence of precedent.

@Periplus

You effed up son with your die hard political leftism that folk associate you with 'baby killers'. I've thrown in another Qashin for good measure, no hard feelings, we can't all be Pastor Niemoller. It wasn't easy joining the baying mob bro but if you can't beat em...:mjcry:
 

AdoonkaAlle

Ragna qowl baa xira, dumarna meher baa xira.
If pregnancy is the result of rape, not all States have an exception. A raped Muslim woman in one of these States could fall foul of this restriction. This is based on an Ijtihad assumption being thrown about that Abortion is permitted in cases of rape. Doubt it was ever an issue historically hence the absence of precedent.

Yes it’s true that not all states have exceptions for rape believe 13 of them don’t. Laakin there’s alternative options such as taking abortion pills while not sold in these states that ban them you can order it online from international sites or get it from the states where it’s sold. Another option would be to travel to states where it’s protected & have induced abortion. In 2020 medication abortion accounted for majority of all abortions.


Specifically, preliminary data from the Guttmacher Institute’s periodic census of all known abortion providers show that in 2020, medication abortion accounted for 54% of US abortions
 
I
This is the Hanafi Madhab 'supposedly' . I put in spoiler because i'm at a loss as to how this could be true. I will ask someone of knowledge. I do not agree with this as well as children are rizq!
Also, in according to Islamqa, you can abort if the doctors tells you before 120 days that the fetus will have a disability, whilst I don't have issues with that, how moral is that? Especially, when we hear cases of doctors being wrong?
I wouldnt trust that site
Also a baby being disabled is not a valid reason to not have a baby Islamically. At the at of the day it is qadr what the baby will turn out like
 
Yh it’s true that some scholars among the hanafis made exemptions for economic reasons. I believe that scholars held different opinions with regards to exemptions some were very
while others were not. Then there’s the issue of looking at circumstances in our modern era before rulings are issued.

Tbh there’s a lot to be considered before rulings are passed down on this issue altogether. One of which is the lived experience of people in questions not everyone will have the same circumstance. A scholar may allow economic reasons for one woman but not other all based on their circumstances.

If a necessity arises then the lesser of 2 evils is chosen so as to alleviate the hardship faced by people. Diinta is just not about laws but also about people and their lives so this has to be taken into account.

In some instances abortions reminds me of the incidents where parents have to make tough decisions on which child to save during droughts where they’re starving. Wallahi it’s a hard choice to make either they risk one or allow all to starve, some leave them on the way as they’re no longer able to carry them.

Yh it’s very risky especially when drs are wrong, that’s why it’s important for those parents to look at it carefully seeking different answers from as many drs as possible etc before a final decision is made. The sorrow and trauma will not go away the moment they find out they terminated a healthy baby, even though it wasn’t their fault. I read a case where the mother simply wouldn’t let go of the fetus for hours after finding out there was no abnormalities
tbh we should leave this stuff up to people of knowledge to decide
 
You're Salafi right? Well according to islamqa & Islamweb you can.

Allahu Aa'lam I'm sure there are other opinions, Islamqa obviously have scholars with their own opinions it doesn't mean there isn't any ikhtilaaf on the issue, if a person wants to take that opinion it is fine

But as I said, how far will we go into this, could people say there baby will be ugly therefore they want to abort it, to what measure are we going to allow this, plus doctors are not always right, and the degree of physical deformity could be argued on.

It is a confusing topic I haven't made a conclusion on it yet.
 

AdoonkaAlle

Ragna qowl baa xira, dumarna meher baa xira.
tbh we should leave this stuff up to people of knowledge to decide

We were discussing opinions that already exists and reality on the ground. No one was making rulings sxb just commenting on the differences & nuances that people need to have when it comes to sensitive issues like this one.
 
Just look at the braindead takes about Roe v Wade.

All these braindead niggas celebrating something that won’t reduce the amount of abortions.

Rich people are still going to go to California for their abortions but the poor are going to get their homemade dodgy abortion that will kill both the mother and child.
There was no wide-spread back alley Abortion in the Black American community before Roe Vs Wade and there will not be any with it's end. Evidently the decision of Black Americans not to jump on board and protest this decision impedes you and your community in some manner which has nothing to do with Black Americans. Therefore whether we choose to celebrate or not is really our business. So you can stop attempting to assign ABORTION as a Political angst to Black America, it's not going to work. We are not fighting the fight of white and other culture women to have access to abortions. #NOTOURFIGHT!
 

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