Why is it bad for Somaliland to get recognised?

[Yusuf M]

For Hawiyes its an welcoming gift that SL gains its independence, but if you are darood than its bad for you that Somaliland becomes independent, simply because you will than have 3 Irir states (Hawiye's Somalia, Isaaqs Somaliland and Cisa Djibouti) who all have 1 thing in Common, which is their shared hatred for anything Darood.

These 3 Irir States will be doing co-operation in subjugating Daroods in their lands, Cisa will be supported to subjugate Ogadens in Ethiopia Somali State, Isaaq will be supported to keep their pets (Warsangali and Dhulbahante) on leash, and Hawiye will be supported to keep the treacherous mjs under their subjugation.

Heck even SL and DJ will give Hawiye's Somalia who is under Embargo heavy weapons to subjugate the annoying mjs under full occupation.

So haviing said that, we Hawiye deeply welcome our Isaaq Irir brother's Somaliland independence

VIVA IRIR STATES.

Where was this irirnimo when SL detained Xaaf at Hargaysa airport?

 

[Dharbaaxo Jin]

Name any ethnicity under 30 million with 3 countries.

You haven't answered my question: why is that an objective standard for determining the basis of a country?

 

[Zapfox1]

Your reason is neither simple nor logical. What would be fundamentally wrong with having multiple countries that have Somali majorities?

I’d be happy for SL independence if you guys work well with us hawiyes down south. We will help our regions grow and SL can help south central Somalia and karbaash jebartis together. Only then will I be down for SL independence and fully support it

 

[Dharbaaxo Jin]

That’s true.

Generally social scientists have covered Somalia in dept tho, not necessarily anthropologists, but economists, diplomats, academics or policy analysts. Similar to the Balkans.

As a result, I don’t think any social scientist will fall for any new ethnicity coming out of Somalia. Somalia is already considered one of the most homogenous countries in Africa.

The basis for Somaliland has nothing to do with ethnicity. If that were the objective standard, There would be about hundreds of African countries.

 

[Periplus]

You haven't answered my question: why is that an objective standard for determining the basis of a country?

Because it’s makes or breaks the self-determination aspect for recognition.

How can SL effectively argue that it’s self-determination is different the rest of the Somali ethnicity.

Aren’t the citizens of SL already represented/ or have the opportunity to be represented as much as any other ethnic Somali in Somalia?

In a continent where hundreds of ethnicities have no nation-state, how can SL justify that the Somalis deserve a third one?

 

[Dharbaaxo Jin]

Because it’s makes or breaks the self-determination aspect for recognition.

How can SL effectively argue that it’s self-determination is different the rest of the Somali ethnicity.

Aren’t the citizens of SL already represented/ or have the opportunity to be represented as much as any other ethnic Somali in Somalia?

In a continent where hundreds of ethnicities have no nation-state, how can SL justify that the Somalis deserve a third one?

I think you are terribly misinformed about the case for Somaliland's independence. I suggest you read further on the subject.

Not a single Somalilander has ever argued that Somaliland should be independent based on ethnicity.

 

[Periplus]

I think you are terribly misinformed about the case for Somaliland's. I suggest you read further on the subject.

Not a single Somalilander has ever argued that Somaliland should be independent based on ethnicity.

I know the argument, I’m saying that self-determination is generally bullshit unless you have an ethnic/religious context to it.

SL has neither and therefore doesn’t really have legs to stand on.

 

[0117]

I know the argument, I’m saying that self-determination is generally bullshit unless you have an ethnic/religious context to it.

SL has neither and therefore doesn’t really have legs to stand on.

What is the argument for us folks that don't know?

 

[Dharbaaxo Jin]

I know the argument, I’m saying that self-determination is generally bullshit unless you have an ethnic/religious context to it.

SL has neither and therefore doesn’t really have legs to stand on.

I dont think you know the argument at all.

If you did, you'd know why none of what you you just said is relevant to Somaliland.

 

[Periplus]

What is the argument for us folks that don't know?

But you do know, so cut the bs bro and just say I don’t really know the argument and keep it moving.

But to satisfy you, I’ll bite. The argument for SL being a nation is multi-pronged. Primarily, it is a former nation-state that voluntarily ceded sovereignty and has reclaimed it on the collapse of Somalia.

Since Somalia failed to exist in 1991, the obligation of SL to remain in union ceased to exist.

Now there are a litany of reasons for why SL decided to reclaim sovereignty such as the inequity in the union, tribalism in the union, dictatorship by the Kacaan and importantly the events leading up to the collapse of Somalia.

 

[Hayfever]

My opinion is that SL will only get recognition when Mogadishu gives it and they won’t until they get their house in order.

This is sadly true

 

[Periplus]

This is sadly true

As I said bro, my opinion on SL has nothing to do with emotion.

Don’t get me wrong, I can become emotional about it and may sometimes show that on a forum but when it really comes down to it, I know this is an issue where emotion must be removed completely.

 

[Dharbaaxo Jin]

But you do know, so cut the bs bro and just say I don’t really know the argument and keep it moving.

But to satisfy you, I’ll bite. The argument for SL being a nation is multi-pronged. Primarily, it is a former nation-state that voluntarily ceded sovereignty and has reclaimed it on the collapse of Somalia.

Since Somalia failed to exist in 1991, the obligation of SL to remain in union ceased to exist.

Now there are a litany of reasons for why SL decided to reclaim sovereignty such as the inequity in the union, tribalism in the union, dictatorship by the Kacaan and importantly the events leading up to the collapse of Somalia.

I take it back, you actually have a decent grasp of the argument, although there are a couple of point where you are slightly incorrect in your wording.

With the above in mind, along with a very strong legal argument that the union was never officially ratified, you should realise that the point you were making vis-à-vis ethnicity as a basis for self-determination, has no relevance to Somaliland's case for independence.

 

[Periplus]

I take it back, you actually have a decent grasp of the argument, although there are a couple of point where you are slightly incorrect in your wording.

With the above in mind, along with a very strong legal argument that the union was never officially ratified, you should realise that the point you were making vis-à-vis ethnicity as a basis for self-determination, has no relevance to Somaliland's case for independence.

My argument is that legal arguments generally don’t mean much when it comes to the creation of nation states.

Most new nation-states in the last century were based on the ethnic/religious aspect of self-determination rather than legal arguments.

 

[Manafesto]

I take it back, you actually have a decent grasp of the argument, although there are a couple of point where you are slightly incorrect in your wording.

With the above in mind, along with a very strong legal argument that the union was never officially ratified, you should realise that the point you were making vis-à-vis ethnicity as a basis for self-determination, has no relevance to Somaliland's case for independence.

Let us be honest here, Somaliland's argument of secceding from Somalia is not based on anything worth mentioning beside them being a fifth column within Somalia when it comes to clan power sharing.

If Isaqs were second/ third or fourth largest tribe within Somalia they will be waving that blue flag, let us not sugarcoat it Huuno,your Traingle compacted tiny tribe is the fifth largest in Somalia hence why your politcians want to be independent from the union, I would have done the same.

https://www.somalispot.com/threads/somaliland-mp-sl-shouldnt-ask-a-recognition-from-somalia-bcoz-its-foreign-occupied-and-unindependent-and-we-are-not-even-allowed-for-top-posts.121425/

 

[liya]

The whole idea of Somaliland is based off of colonial borders. There’s no big reason why they should leave us either

 

[Woke1.4rm.Shibis]

For those who are saying somaliland wont get recognition because somalis are homogeneous nation .

The western intellectuals already know Somalia is one of the most ethnically divers nation in the world . .somaliland mistake was to name itself "somali"land .
They have to change their name , prove to the world that they dont share anything but religion with the south , work on installing a pro somaliland president in villa wardhiigley

 

[Dharbaaxo Jin]

My argument is that legal arguments generally don’t mean much when it comes to the creation of nation states.

Most new nation-states in the last century were based on the ethnic/religious aspect of self-determination rather than legal arguments.

The legal argument is a smaller, but incredibly valid element of Somaliland's case. However, there is clear precedent of several countries that have voluntarily entered into unions and afterwards reinstated their sovereignty, which is the primary argument in the case for SL independence.

 

[Dima&Damo]

For those who are saying somaliland wont get recognition because somalis are homogeneous nation .
View attachment 213115

The western intellectuals already know Somalia is one of the most ethnically divers nation in the world . .somaliland mistake was to name itself "somali"land .
They have to change their name , prove to the world that they dont share anything but religion with the south , work on installing a pro somaliland president in villa wardhiigley

England More Diverse

 

[Periplus]

For those who are saying somaliland wont get recognition because somalis are homogeneous nation .
View attachment 213115

The western intellectuals already know Somalia is one of the most ethnically divers nation in the world . .somaliland mistake was to name itself "somali"land .
They have to change their name , prove to the world that they dont share anything but religion with the south , work on installing a pro somaliland president in villa wardhiigley

Nigga you can’t even spell, what do you know about intellectuals.