What if we exchange Hiiraan State for SSC State?

[The Midlands]

Hassan Sheikh will not accept a new Daarood State because it will make Daarood 3 States (PL, SSC & JL) vs two Hawiye/Samaale States (Galmudug&Hirshabelle)

Banadir will remain the capital and will not be a state but will have 4.5 based representation and elected mayor and elected local assemply so they dont need to exchange it with full-fledged FMS but if necessary there is another scenario and that is Hiiraan but this needs to be campaigned from both Reer Hiraan and Reer SSC.
Jowhar will be under Mogadushu. Its now under Mogadishu now anyways.

Hawadle new polticial orientation makes Daarood to be friendly towards them and accept Hiiraan State unlike the 2011 road map under the infulence of PL that was against both Hiiraan's special case as one of the 6 oroginal Somali regions under the trusteeship and the first 8 regions after the independence so Hiiraan State not on the basis that it is two regions but on the basis that it is the original region that has remained undivided since independence. Will puntland support Hiiraan State in exchange of SSC? Hawadle fully support SSC struggle.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

I don't see why one region shouldn't be allowed to be a federal state. As long as one region does not get the same number of Senators etc, as a state with multiple regions.

 

[The Midlands]

Somali Federalism: Far easier Middle Shabelle to rejoin Banaadir than to join Hiiraan?
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by Mohamed Isse Mudey
Sunday, November 02, 2014

Starting a side note for facts of federalism that we should all know:

Federalism would be defined as form of government in which a sovereignty is constitutionally divided between a the governing authority (the central government), and and constituent political units (like states or provinces). With that in mind,

Somalia has never, I repeat never, had a system of governance called 'federalism'. This is an obvious arrangement that was imposed on Somalia- therefore meaning federalism is something came from outside of our country. This was established ithout considering its impact in the future, and not meant to provide any gain for us what so ever, and most of the Somali population have no knowledge or monetary resources to determine what federalism really is.

My entire article does not aim to define federalism or make an interpretation on it, assuming everyone generally knows what it is. But rather my objective is to elaborate upon a way to make the three regions left federalized with a least amount of disagreement as possible. Now, as long as our country Somalia is pressured to keep federalism in it's place, the Somali government would have to create it without disagreements and disputes are prevented from happening. The few existing regional administrations and the ones that are going to be established in the future are the parties the government should try to keep the peace between. Along with this priority should also be the smooth transition of joining several regions together.

Closely examining how current regions had joined the federalist system, the ones that are presently in place are most likely going back to the eight former regions, except a few misplaced ones. Now, there are only three provinces left that have not adopted federalism to their system -Banaadir, Middle Shabelle and Hiiraan. The best way to close the cases of these provinces would be to rejoin Middle Shabelle to Banaadir, like it was in 1960. It would not take long to adopt, nor would it cause much uproar compared to if Middle Shabelle was federated to Banaadir. If this would work, then some of the districts in Mogadishu (the six or seven of them) would be part of our main capital region of Somalia. The other ones left would join Middle Shabelle. It would be more efficient time-wise and productive as a whole all together. Having said that, Banaadir was divided into three regions- Banaadir, Shabelllada Hoose and Shabellada Dhexe. To be fair, if Banaadir and Middle Shabelle must join together, Banaadir would still be missing Lower Shabelle. However, we have an opportunity to rectify the mistakes we have made, such as the current status of the water wells (Ceelasha Biyaha) that were controlled by the south-west administrations. This is an unfortunate standing because it is My stand as my point was, at least should Middle Shabelle should be joined to Banaadir, both would from economic and population boom. Eonomically, Middle Shabelle are known for their agriculture, and their marine life, that would support Banadir, who are known for their airport and harbors and ports their sea. Banadir tax revenue isn't formal, nor it it official enough yet, so the joining would help. and their population is substantial as well.

But, if the Middle Shabelle was annexed to Hiiraan, than we would have extreme complications, and would also happen to be a war zone if things get too far. After all, we have experienced and seen what happened in Jubba and Lower Shabelle. Today, we have also seen the situation in Gaalkacyo as well. If we do annex both regions together, it would result in a similar or worse template scenarios to what happened to other regions. There were warning signs of discontent between the elders of both Hiiraan and Middle Shabelle as we have witnessed in the media before. The Middle Shabelle governing council set a press conference stating their dissatisfaction with being with Hiiraan. They also indicated that they would rather join Banadir instead of Hiiraan. The government should learn a lesson from what happened to Lower Shabelle and Jubba and the other places, and take precedent from that. In addition, today the form of federalism in Somalia is completely different the other world's image of federalism because the one we have is based on land, power sharing and resided demographics. Therefore, both regions will have have borderlines, including Jowhar, splitting it to two, being put a " Clan Border" which is dangerous, because it will simply result to feuds and disputes. This thinking of borderlines and such is very intricate, and is bound to create a clan-neighbor war. I think this scenario will be the most difficult scheme that the government will have to deal with. Because, there will be (possible) committee that will establish the lines and borders between clans and their regional administration, as well.

On the other hand, Hiiraan provides an argument that they survived standing alone and independent from other regions since colonization. From Somalia being broken up from six regions to eight, then from eight to eighteen regions, the regions have changed their names and their geographics as well. However, Hiiraan, never got disrupted from its position, and it never changed its name. This is a legitimate argument, as they have been standing alone since the independence of Somalia. Hiiraan region is one biggest supporters of the Somali government in our country, as I should also mention that two presidents were born in that region, his excellency (our first country president) Aden Abdulle Osman and our current president Hassan Sheikh Mohamoud. Another great politician, Sheikh Ali Jima'ale, who was candidate in 1960 accepted the results of the election without denial was also born in Hiiraan. There is a good set of evidence for this region's support in favor of the government after Mogadisho, Beledweyn- also considering that both of these cities have also had numerous Al Shabab attacks. It was in Beledwayne that one of the worst attack in the country had occurred, which's the one that happened on June 19, 2009 that was killed almost 70 people in one setting, including the former (AUN) TFG Minister of National Security Col. Omar Hashi Adan and Ambassador Abdikarin Farah Laqanyo. They were targeted for their national support

Throughout all this events Hiiraan has been through, former President Shariif Sheikh Ahmed signed a decree on July 23, 2012 stating the recognition of Upper Shabelle (click here to view that document).

From a legal standpoint, no one can simply ignore this decision that was signed by a president. If President Hassan does not follow through to this decree by the former president, he would have to issue a completely different decree that would take out this one. It would also have go come through the Parliament, as well. At the end the final decision is based on the law makers of Hiiraan and people of Hiiraan themselves to adopt or put it on veto.

Middle Shabelle can easily join Banaadir, but wouldn't do so with any other region, such as Hiiraan. This current government must use the best approach to resolving some of the issues that arise from the federalist system. This mostly due to the fact that the delegation that leaves to go to the host region aren't the always the right propositions, and that might be the same thinking at the end of the other table, too. In order to best work out the problems that we Somalis have with federalism today. with the provinces and states left that have not authorized federalism and its governing complex, we must first should improve our provisional constitution. It is the base of our whole establishment, along with all the decisions and decrees issued in the country, and it needs some amendments to fit our current situations and circumstances. Second, we need a group of trustworthy, patriotic, just individuals who should head or made judges in some sort of Supreme Court system, overlook our system and make the necessary verdicts, the best for our people and future. Somali people need to understand, negotiate and reconcile with one another. Somalia needs to format federalism for their own future and circumstances. As a people, we can no longer live in anarchy. It is time for true ethical justice. It is time for bold achievement and creativity. And it is time for honesty, both among and between people. It's time for reconciliation.

Mohamed Isse Mudey
mcmuudeey@gmail.com

Somali Federalism: Far easier Middle Shabelle to rejoin Banaadir than to join Hiiraan?

Federalism would be defined as form of government in which a sovereignty is constitutionally divided between a the governing authority (the central government), and and constituent political units (like states or provinces). With that in mind,

www.hiiraan.com

 

[The Midlands]

I don't see why one region shouldn't be allowed to be a federal state. As long as one region does not get the same number of Senators etc, as a state with multiple regions.

The current constitution only fits PL because Garowe under Faroole supported by PM Abdi Wali Gaas had a plan to host the capital so it demanded that each two regions to form an FMS no less than that because Hawiye/Samaale have three regions of their own so they will not be able to take the capital if they tried to establish two States. PL wanted Hiiraan to join Galgaduud and Jowhar Banaadir than take the capital!

South mudug was supposed to be extra of Galhiiraan like North mudug is extra for PL.

Hassan Sheikh and Abdikareem Guuled fucked up this plan that was arranged under Seikh Sharif who even accepted in caasimada laga hadli doono meesha laga dhigayo so Mogadushu is not the capital per "Faroole constitution"

Hassan Sheikh and Abdikarim Guuled established Galmudug State in vision2016 and the remaining FMS to be Hiiraan and Middle Shabelle that why they kept the Capital Banaadir as an extra gobol

Now it seems PL is accepting SSC State and if there is any Hawiye/Samaale region to exchange with it they will welcome Hiiraan State. We started reaching out to Harti on such deal.

 

[Abaq]

Sounds like a good plan. We get an extr Daarood state while weakening Hawiye at the same time

 

[SPMLegend]

Let’s instead trade Bakool sare state for Hiiraan state

 

[Hilmaam]

Throw out 2 region rule over complicates things .Banadir Hiran awdal gedo makhir… let everyone form own state based on qabil pefect form of governance for uncivilized people like us

 

[The Midlands]

Throw out 2 region rule over complicates things .Banadir Hiran awdal gedo makhir… let everyone form own state based on qabil pefect form of governance for uncivilized people like us

i Support too this. federation of two or more regions must be voluntary.

 

[Bowda-dheer]

Hiiraan would have to be made two gobols by Hassan sheikh then those two gobolka will form hiiraan federal state. Hadii kale we will opening up a pandora box like @Hilmaam over here. Who knows any clan will demand a new federal state.

 

[𐒋𐒖𐒆𐒔𐒖𐒕𐒈]

Hassan Sheikh will not accept a new Daarood State because it will make Daarood 3 States (PL, SSC & JL) vs two Hawiye/Samaale States (Galmudug&Hirshabelle)

View attachment 263642

Let us think rationally, and pretend we are in 2023, and not roaming on Noah's arch, shall we?

a) What are the real reasons for this being a problem?
b) What are the presumed benefits of having 3 versus 2 States?
c) What are the disadvantages of having less FMS?

Postscript:
The map is defective, for NorthEast was Togdheer, and Sanaag, and Bari was called Majertania.

 

[MenacingGeeljire]

I’m sorry to burst your bubble but you speak like the “support” of Hawadle holds any weight in Somalia. Darood know if they make a new state in Somalia there will be a new Hawiye state and if they’re going to reach an agreement with anyone on the creation of a new state, it will be with the other 4.5 heavyweight aka Hawiye.

Sounds like a good plan. We get an extr Daarood state while weakening Hawiye at the same time

You wish. If such thing was to happen you can expect Middle Shabelle as a new state and if anyone can break up federal states that easy, we will make sure to break up SWS and merge lower shabelle with Banadir like it was meant to be.

 

[The Midlands]

I’m sorry to burst your bubble but you speak like the “support” of Hawadle holds any weight in Somalia. Darood know if they make a new state in Somalia there will be a new Hawiye state and if they’re going to reach an agreement with anyone on the creation of a new state, it will be with the other 4.5 heavyweight aka Hawiye.

You wish. If such thing was to happen you can expect Middle Shabelle as a new state and if anyone can break up federal states that easy, we will make sure to break up SWS and merge lower shabelle with Banadir like it was meant to be.

Here we go look this hater. Its not up to you Abgaal will go back to their Xamar Hiiraan wax ba kaama galin GTFO.

 

[Hilmaam]

Hiiraan would have to be made two gobols by Hassan sheikh then those two gobolka will form hiiraan federal state. Hadii kale we will opening up a pandora box like @Hilmaam over here. Who knows any clan will demand a new federal state.

I say let it happen it happen. Somalis act up if their qabil not in power they will sabatoge FMS and empower Al shabab. Even if we have fair 1m1v people will complain about results and say we should get turn and ignore results. I don’t blame them either FGS is corrupt and so is most FMS let each qabil get fair shot at aid and loans why should few eat using name of all. Somaliland was leading way and was most advanced FMS and look at them even they imploded

 

[The Midlands]

Let us think rationally, and pretend we are in 2023, and not roaming on Noah's arch, shall we?

a) What are the real reasons for this being a problem?
b) What are the presumed benefits of having 3 versus 2 States?
c) What are the disadvantages of having less FMS?

Postscript:
The map is defective, for NorthEast was Togdheer, and Sanaag, and Bari was called Majertania.

Under the Somali federalism decisions are taken unanimously so if the balance is in favour of Daarood by having more votes/States things will happen on their way.

 

[MenacingGeeljire]

Here we go look this hater. Its not up to you Abgaal will go back to their Xamar Hiiraan wax ba kaama galin GTFO.

Call me a hater all you want but someone had to burst your bubble. Where’s the logic in Hawiye or HSM breaking up a hawiye state to form a new Darood state?

Hiiraan wax ba kaama galin GTFO.

I have more rights to talk about Hiiran than you.

 

[Abaq]

I’m sorry to burst your bubble but you speak like the “support” of Hawadle holds any weight in Somalia. Darood know if they make a new state in Somalia there will be a new Hawiye state and if they’re going to reach an agreement with anyone on the creation of a new state, it will be with the other 4.5 heavyweight aka Hawiye.

You wish. If such thing was to happen you can expect Middle Shabelle as a new state and if anyone can break up federal states that easy, we will make sure to break up SWS and merge lower shabelle with Banadir like it was meant to be.

Ok make your state then. We want Bakool Sare too to leave the Eelaay Union called KG

 

[The Midlands]

Call me a hater all you want but someone had to burst your bubble. Where’s the logic in Hawiye or HSM breaking up a hawiye state to form a new Darood state?

I have more rights to talk about Hiiran than you.

f*ck off you r blocked by me and nothing in Hirshabelle focus on your Galmudug. HIIRAAN WILL BE A SAMAALE STATE WITH ITS 90% HAWADLE AND GAALJECEL.

 

[Burqad]

this should be the map of the new federal states

 

[MenacingGeeljire]

Ok make your state then. We want Bakool Sare too to leave the Eelaay Union called KG

So do we. It was a mistake from HSM’s first term to include Lower Shabelle in KG. The Eelays can have their lower Bakool and Bay to themselves.

I’ve more to gain than to lose in this proposal to break up certain states but I highly doubt it will happen.

f*ck off you r blocked by me and nothing in Hirshabelle focus on your Galmudug.

Struck a nerve?

focus on your Galmudug.

Your proposal concerns my land in Hiiran.

 

[Bowda-dheer]

I say let it happen it happen. Somalis act up if their qabil not in power they will sabatoge FMS and empower Al shabab. Even if we have fair 1m1v people will complain about results and say we should get turn and ignore results. I don’t blame them either FGS is corrupt and so is most FMS let each qabil get fair shot at aid and loans why should few eat using name of all. Somaliland was leading way and was most advanced FMS and look at them even they imploded

Somaliland was built on hate and anti-somali and daaroodphobia it makes sense for them to fight dhulbahante. On the other hand maamul goboleeds are legit fine with some grievances from the clans but that’s normal for now. When people are poor and disorganized we tend to be in each other’s throats.