Walashma Dynasty

[SOMALI GENERAL]

Some folks on here claim they were Arabised Hararis & I'm interested to know how they came to that conclusion.

The Andalusian Berber Diplomat & Traveller Leo Africanus stated the founding dynasty of the Ifat Sultanate were Somalis & spoke Somali.

 

[Pipit]

The Andalusian Berber Diplomat & Traveller Leo Africanus stated the founding dynasty of the Ifat Sultanate were Somalis & spoke Somali.

Source?

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

Source?

The source is the Book written by Leo Africanus called 'A Geographical Historie of Africa'. Prior to Colonialism, Europeans got most of their knowledge about Africa from this Book.

Link: A Geographical Historie of Africa.

 

[Som]

Some folks on here claim they were Arabised Hararis & I'm interested to know how they came to that conclusion.

The Andalusian Berber Diplomat & Traveller Leo Africanus stated the founding dynasty of the Ifat Sultanate were Somalis & spoke Somali.

Interesting, do you have the link were Leo Africanus says they spoke somali?
According to Italian scholar Enrico Cerulli Yusuf Al Kawneyn was the founder of the walashma dinasy, the walashma claimed to be from aqeel ibn abu taleb and interesting enough most somali clans also claim to descend from Aqeel. These two things may indicate that the dinasty was somali. To be honest though there is no evidence of the walashma speaking af somali, and many historians believe they were ethio-semitic speakers. Even when it comes to the adal-Ethiopian wars somalis seem to be one of the many muslim ethnic groups fighting under the sultanate.It's very difficult to identify ethinicites in the Adal sultanate cause they primarily identified as muslim.
A large number of the 'adalites' was definitely somali, but I'm not sure about the ruling class ethnicity

 

[Som]

The first mention of the word "somali" is in the 1420s when an Ethiopian emperor defeated the king of Adal in a battle, king Yeshaq of Ethiopia occupied zeila and it's surrounding for some time and mentioned somalis in his victory poem. This indicates that Somalis were infact a significant entity in the Ifat sultanate but the kingdom itself was intially carved out the sultanate of Showa which is in modern day somali region, oromia and Harar. I suspect that the walashma had a mixed Somali-harari origin and they used Arabic to administer the state.
Somalis and hararis in those areas are much closer than you think, even today there are plenty of Somalis in Ethiopia who are part harari.
The SYL even had a branch in Harar and many hararis were involved in somali nationalism and somali affairs, even though they speak a semitic language hararis have a strong link with somalis in Ethiopia.

 

[madaxweyne]

Some folks on here claim they were Arabised Hararis & I'm interested to know how they came to that conclusion.

The Andalusian Berber Diplomat & Traveller Leo Africanus stated the founding dynasty of the Ifat Sultanate were Somalis & spoke Somali.

i doubt thier were any ethnic arabs just go to northern somalia and eastern ethiopia today their are hardly any arabs mostly ethnic somalis hararis afars which was about the same situation a few hundred years ago adal sultanate was a multi ethnic somali led dynasty so arabic was used as a lingua franca as a way to communicate between the diffrent muslim ethnic groups.

Arabic was used becouse that was the language they had in common since as muslims they could learn and speak arabic

 

[Som]

i doubt thier were any arabs just go to northern somalia and eastern ethiopia today their are hardly any arabs mostly ethnic somalis hararis afars which was about the same situation a few hundred years ago adal sultanate was a multi ethnic somali led dynasty so arabic was used as a lingua franca as a way to communicate between the diffrent muslim ethnic groups.

Arabic was used becouse that was the language they had in common since as muslims they could learn and speak arabic

True.
The only thing we can be sure about is that the Walashma were not arabs.

 

[Farabuuto]

The source is the Book written by Leo Africanus called 'A Geographical Historie of Africa'. Prior to Colonialism, Europeans got most of their knowledge about Africa from this Book.

Link: A Geographical Historie of Africa.

can you show the screenshot where it tells us?

 

[Farabuuto]

All I'm gonna say is that wikipedia is completely wrong on anything about the Walashma.

 

[Farahslayer]

I believe one of the Ogaden (makahil) clans and Hawiy clan trace their maternal lineage to walashama nobility?

I’ve never heard of it being anything other than Somali because Somalis routinely intermarried with them. I wonder if their clan is still around?

In 50 years habash will be claiming that Ajuraan are an ethiopian. Smh

I wish Somalis would stop treating each other as foreigners. If you look at western historians you would assume every clan is it’s own race subhanAllah.

 

[Removed]

I believe one of the Ogaden (makahil) clans and Hawiy clan trace their maternal lineage to walashama nobility?

I’ve never heard of it being anything other than Somali because Somalis routinely intermarried with them. I wonder if their clan is still around?

In 50 years habash will be claiming that Ajuraan are an ethiopian. Smh

I wish Somalis would stop treating each other as foreigners. If you look at western historians you would assume every clan is it’s own race subhanAllah.

Theres a subclan of Ogaden that has the exact same abtirsi and descend from Omar Dunyahuz(walashama) Yusuf Barkanti. The suldaan of Muqaabul in Jubbaland I believe is from that lineage.

 

[Ace the shank]

was the Walsham dynasty dir or darood and did somalis arabs Persians Indians hararis populate or live in north during that time?

 

[Som]

was the Walsham dynasty dir or darood and did somalis arabs Persians Indians hararis populate or live in north during that time?

No evidence of walashma being actually part of a modern somali clan.
Some say dir, some say they were related to Ogaden but it's not simple fo identify their qabil.
Yes there was an Arab presence in northern somalia, but it was negligible if compared to Mogadishu and the southern coastal cities. No visible arab admixture survives in somaliland and puntland

 

[Ace the shank]

and

No evidence of walashma being actually part of a modern somali clan.
Some say sir, some say they were related to Ogaden but it's not simple fo identify their qabil.
Yes there was an Arab presence in northern somalia, but it was negligible if compared to Mogadishu and the southern coastal cities. No visible arab admixture survives in somaliland and puntland

the thing is there is two ahmed gurneys one was isaaq and the other one was the conquer of Abyssinia.was that onesomali if so what qabil was he?

 

[Marquis]

and
the thing is there is two ahmed gurneys one was isaaq and the other one was the conquer of Abyssinia.was that onesomali if so what qabil was he?

Imam Ahmed was Balaw Seexawle Karanle Hawiye. Here is his abtirsi: http://www.abtirsi.com/view.php?person=5214

And here is a famous Ethiopian historian who states the Imam was Hawiye.

 

[Marquis]

Some folks on here claim they were Arabised Hararis & I'm interested to know how they came to that conclusion.

The Andalusian Berber Diplomat & Traveller Leo Africanus stated the founding dynasty of the Ifat Sultanate were Somalis & spoke Somali.

"Harari" was a identity created by Nur ibn Mujahid, long after the Ifat. Basically everyone in Harar where to discard their tribal identities and become a Harari.

 

[Farahslayer]

was the Walsham dynasty dir or darood and did somalis arabs Persians Indians hararis populate or live in north during that time?

I think Walashama are there own thing. They are certainly Somali because Somalis heavily intermarried with them.

There are many Somali clans today that no longer exist that have been absorbed by other clans.

 

[Ace the shank]

I think Walashama are there own thing. They are certainly Somali because Somalis heavily intermarried with them.

There are many Somali clans today that no longer exist that have been absorbed by other clans.

what clans where obsorbed by the walashama dynasty if I may ask brother

 

[Farahslayer]

what clans where obsorbed by the walashama dynasty if I may ask brother

Other way around. Walashama were likely absorbed into clans in the k5. Most likely Ogaden but also others.

There’s a history of clans being absorbed when they become small.

 

[Som]

and
the thing is there is two ahmed gurneys one was isaaq and the other one was the conquer of Abyssinia.was that onesomali if so what qabil was he?

Yes i heard that the isaaq Ahmed Guray and the other one were conflated in one figure.
There is no clear cut evidence to say Ahmed Guray was an ethnic somali but we have some evidence that points in that direction.
First of all Ahmed Guray heavily relied on somali troops, another thing is that he is claimed by somalis. Somalis usually don't claim other people to be somali, another thing is that Nur ibn Mujahid was his nephew. Italian scholar Enrico Cerulli Cerulli mentioned that Nur ibn Mujahid was claimed by the marehan clan, if this claim is true it would mean Ahmed Guray was at least part somali.
Most scholars say he was probably somali