HISTORY Somali History and Orientalism

[Xareen]

I usually don't post about anything past the Bronze Age, but a recent thread here reminded me of a large Twitter account some friends and I went to e-war with and the larger question of why the actual heck orientalists hate our guts. There's so much lost because unfortunately one of us got sick of defending Somali history (blame qabiilists who undone all of our combined 100+ hours of researching and posting) and deactivated his account. I also moved on and focused on prehistory because there's no way to argue that muh Punt is Darood history only or some bullshit. Actually LOOL I do remember getting dunked on for trying to post about Laas Geel because it's Somaliland history only a few years ago but anyways....

Typically when dealing with orientalism it's all about Adal and Ethiopianist revisionism. The Twitter account in question however is world-renowned Swahiliphile @Rhaplord (probably portmanteau of Rhapta and lord - he's Ugandan so probably sees them as self-insert); he's one of the biggest African history accounts (for good reason, his other stuff is really quite decent, not the greatest of writers tho) and constantly makes attempts to Swahili-wash the history of South Somalia's biggest cities.

He has umpteen posts where he explicitly states the origins were Swahili, but the best was his long blogpost on Muqdisho. You'll get the gist from the screenshot below:

What surprised us most is that all of the conjecture was supported by commentary by an obscure historian from the 70s-90s where they totally misrepresent the first-hand accounts. We made a quite long thread where we found the primary sources of every claim he made, and some more to support the alternative hypothesis, and dunked on him. All three of us held blocks by the end of the day. It's really quite sinister.

Read the thread by clicking here. I'm still quite proud of the thread, though of course the writing isn't the best in some tweets. We couldn't be bothered to proofread we wanted to dunk same day. I have most of his stuff archived for any of his old followers do let me know if you want me to post any other things.

So many other examples. Another that comes to mind is the Mwalimu Ibrame tweet, where for no good reason, he, using the idea that pre-Yaquubi Muqdisho was Swahili, see here:

... to suggest that a Ma'alin Ibrahim was akshully called Mwalimu Ibrame.... cos Mwalimu is uniquely Swahili apparently. I quite literally have an uncle called Macalin Ibrahim so it made it all the funnier. We found the primary source after way too much digging cos we knew for a fact it was cap, and would you look at that?

The question remains though: how the actual helly hellion are people able to put together such bullshit and still have it be, to normies, well-sourced and credible? Why are there so many slander pieces on Somali history? @Idilinaa interested to hear what you have to say after ur input on the thread in question.

 

[Xareen]

I see that the thread link doesn't have the images we attached. Fret not, I have screenshots.

That should be it.

 

[Midas]

One of the problems with somali history is that its very hard to conceptualize since there is no simple poltical history/dynastic line we can follow we have multiple sultanates ruling different regions and then city states which then all collapses. In comparison The history of Ethiopia for the last several hundred years can be simplified as the politcal history of a single dynasty (the Solomoic dynasty) and the fact that this single politcal instution was continous for all this time combined with the monasteries as centers of literary production that was rarely interrputed meant that it developed and maintained its own historiographical traditon.

 

[Midas]

Also part of what creates the bias against any type of somali-centric narrative is the fact that a lot of these ajnabi researchers don't like the idea of an ethnic centric narrative. The narrative of a Multi-ethnic empire is far more appealing to them . Which is why I think they are always coming up with ideas like afar-saho or ethio-semetic groups being way more widespread in the oast the now. Even though there is way more evidence for the opposite considering a large amount of afars are actually assimilated somalis.

 

[Idilinaa]

I honestly don’t have much more to add , I’ve seen it all before, and this guy blocks Somalis who try to correct him. I think @Malandro even reshared some of @AromataMerchants’ threads last month.

What I can add is that there’s no linguistic or historical evidence supporting the idea that the southern Somali coast was ever Swahili-speaking. In fact, the opposite is true: the southern coast spoke Somali coastal dialects.

There’s also well-documented linguistic and historical evidence of Somalis settling and even holding influence in parts of the northern Swahili coast , like Lamu, Pate, and Siyu in Kenya , especially between the 16th and 17th centuries. They came in contact with Swahili speakers migrating down the coast earlier than this though.

https://langsci-press.org/catalog/view/192/1510/1623-1

Portuguese records describe Somali “Katwa” clans as settled, qabil-organized coastal communities involved in governance and trade.

I also pointed this out before to @Shimbiris and @Zak12 . And there’s a detailed thread that breaks this down even further , covering Somali migration patterns south from Bur Gao, Mijikenda traditions of Somali ancestry, and so on:



Also another thing i really don’t get is how they try to reinterpret sources that clearly describe Somali pastoral traits being present in southern coastal cities and then turn around and argue those cities were Swahili. It just doesn’t hold up, unless you are trying to imply that Swahilis were camel herding agro-pastoralists.

 

[Xareen]

yeah

I honestly don’t have much more to add , I’ve seen it all before, and this guy blocks Somalis who try to correct him. I think @Malandro even reshared some of @AromataMerchants’ threads last month.

Yeah, he's one of the 3 of us to make the thread

What I can add is that there’s no linguistic or historical evidence supporting the idea that the southern Somali coast was ever Swahili-speaking. In fact, the opposite is true: the southern coast spoke Somali coastal dialects.
View attachment 362533

Were u aware of the "webi" connection? How isn't that a slam-dunk? Literally calling the river webi? There were also more words recorded but I forget what they were though I think they were pertaining to a calendar.

There’s also well-documented linguistic and historical evidence of Somalis settling and even holding influence in parts of the northern Swahili coast , like Lamu, Pate, and Siyu in Kenya , especially between the 16th and 17th centuries. They came in contact with Swahili speakers migrating down the coast earlier than this though.

https://langsci-press.org/catalog/view/192/1510/1623-1

View attachment 362534

Portuguese records describe Somali “Katwa” clans as settled, qabil-organized coastal communities involved in governance and trade.

I also pointed this out before to @Shimbiris and @Zak12 . And there’s a detailed thread that breaks this down even further , covering Somali migration patterns south from Bur Gao, Mijikenda traditions of Somali ancestry, and so on:

Very interesting stuff. Thanks.

Also another thing i really don’t get is how they try to reinterpret sources that clearly describe Somali pastoral traits being present in southern coastal cities and then turn around and argue those cities were Swahili. It just doesn’t hold up, unless you are trying to imply that Swahilis were camel herding agro-pastoralists.

I think establishing the connection between Tana-ware and Nderit/PN pottery would be the final nail in the coffin for positing an early Swahili-speaking population in East Africa that would be Shunguwaya Pipalo. Genetic and archaeological evidence makes it so clear that Bantus, never mind Swahilis, came much later. Another one of us made [attached] about their early arrival, though I don't agree with everything said

 

[Idilinaa]

@Midas is right , one of the biggest challenges is that there’s no single, centralized Somali historical narrative or long-standing political dynasty that people can easily follow. That makes Somali history harder to conceptualize for outsiders, especially when compared to something like the Solomonic line in Ethiopia , even though that dynasty is largely mythologized and far from uninterrupted.


That’s why it’s really up to Somalis themselves to gather, organize, and reconstruct their history into a coherent and accessible narrative. There’s a wealth of material , various letters, archives, documents, manuscripts that document all types of stuff, record books , travel accounts, archaeological and linguistic evidence but it needs to be pieced together and framed clearly.

And you're also right about the bias. There’s often discomfort from foreign researchers toward Somali-centered narratives because they’re ethnically cohesive. In contrast, they’re more comfortable with the ‘multi-ethnic empire’ model , it fits neatly into post-colonial or regional academic frameworks. That’s why they often push narratives like “Ethio-Semitic” identities or exaggerated Afar and Oromo presence, even when the evidence points more clearly to Somali continuity across much of the region.


Somalia challenges that mold. We’re a single ethnic group spanning a wide geography, united by language, culture, and kinship. Most African states are multi-ethnic constructs, so when Somalis speak from an ethnic-historical perspective, it gets misread as nationalism. But in reality, it’s simply the structure of Somali society , and our effort to tell our own story.

 

[Idilinaa]

yeah

Yeah, he's one of the 3 of us to make the thread

Were u aware of the "webi" connection? How isn't that a slam-dunk? Literally calling the river webi? There were also more words recorded but I forget what they were though I think they were pertaining to a calendar.

Very interesting stuff. Thanks.

I think establishing the connection between Tana-ware and Nderit/PN pottery would be the final nail in the coffin for positing an early Swahili-speaking population in East Africa that would be Shunguwaya Pipalo. Genetic and archaeological evidence makes it so clear that Bantus, never mind Swahilis, came much later. Another one of us made [attached] about their early arrival, though I don't agree with everything said

Also, camel bones were found at early coastal sites in northern Kenya, carbon dated between 850–1000 AD.

Isaac Samuel mentioned this in one of his articles, but he seemed to gloss over the full implication. The only group historically known to possess and herd camels in large numbers in that region were Somali populations , the evidence practically points to them.

In fact, I’d argue he likely did understand what it implied, but downplayed it due to bias. He frequently references Derek Nurse’s publications in his articles. So it's less likely that he hasn't read this.

 

[Emir of Zayla]

Also, camel bones were found at early coastal sites in northern Kenya, carbon dated between 850–1000 AD.
View attachment 362543
View attachment 362544

Isaac Samuel mentioned this in one of his articles, but he seemed to gloss over the full implication. The only group historically known to possess and herd camels in large numbers in that region were Somali populations , the evidence practically points to them.

In fact, I’d argue he likely did understand what it implied, but downplayed it due to bias. He frequently references Derek Nurse’s publications in his articles. So it's less likely that he hasn't read this.

Also evidence of camel-herding pastoralists pre-800 CE being the first builders of towns in the Lamu archipelago although the author points to it being a possibility of early Muslims in the region bringing camels, the timeline is a bit too early for that so it’s a greater chance they’re a Somali population.

 

[Riftvalley]

Chimini is said to have retained archaic elements not preserved in some other northern Swahili dialects. If it was merely a slave population dialect we would have seen other Bantu languages predominantly spoken by slave populations enter the language. Therefore, proto chimini speakers are most likely a small group (like Bajunis) who moved up the coast and mixed with Somalis/middle east migrants. We already know Somali speakers were already contact with NS, so it needn’t have to be a slave dialect.

 

[Zak12]

that would be Shunguwaya

For the sake of being thorough, I'll quote what shimbris has to say about that myth.

Arab geographer? I don't mean to be insulting but you are outright lying if you claim that Shungwaya has been written about by any Arab geographers. Shungwaya is not found anywhere in any historical document outside of the 19th century like the 19th century Swahili one which, yes, has been debunked and found to be fraudulent by scholars. Look at the links I shared. Neville Chittick who used to be a proponent of its authenticity eventually disavowed it too:

The Shungwaya Myth of Miji Kenda Origins: A Problem of Late Nineteenth-Century

This challenge to standing interpretations of Miji Kenda history was my first publication; it has held up pretty well.

www.academia.edu

The Shungwaya Myth New Evidence.pdf

A follow-up to the 'Myth' article

www.academia.edu

The Cambridge History of Africa

www.google.com

And you truly don't know what you're talking about if you think Bantus predate Cushitic pastoralists in even Kenya let alone Koonfur.



A chime in from my friend who saw this thread from elsewhere:



Sorry to say, saaxiib. But Bantu folks are not native to Koonfur, nor do they predate non-North-Somali speaking Somaloid groups in the area, pastoralist or otherwise.

It's also worth noting that there's no real influence like in the form of substratums from Swahili (or Bantu) in the dialects found in the Banaadir region. Pretty much nothing. In fact, when linguists investigate contact with Swahili it mostly looks like the Swahili speakers clearly came after the Somaloid (Af-Maxaa, Af-Maay, Tunni etc.) speaking groups and as small splintered groups like the Bajuni and Chimwini:



It looks more like the Somaloid speaking groups influenced them than the other way around. Things like Shungwaya have also been debunked and disavowed by the same scholars who used to support them and it looks like even the earlier Somalized Bantu communities in Koonfur were most likely simply brought as slaves during the Ajuuraan's era.

The linguistics appears pretty straight-forward on this. When Battuta came the only native folks of that region would have been groups speaking things like Maay, Banaadiri variants of Af-Maxaa, Tunni and so on. Not Bantus.



Read what the Portuguese write about "Adal" to the north. They describe the exact same skin tones as in the Banaadir which further bolsters your point. Except in "Adal" there are, from what I remember, no more "white" minorities which probably means there weren't much settled Arabs in the area at that time unlike in the Banaadir.

 

[Xareen]

For the sake of being thorough, I'll quote what shimbris has to say about that myth.

Apologise for making me read the coal our good brother Shimbiris had to reply to! My eyes! My nose!

 

[Xareen]

He’s a madow guy who dislikes somalis and has been around for years. He was the first xspotdanmark or however you spell it except xspot isn’t too bad

Great House is an absolute g. He's never told any lies about Somalis. In fact he kinda believed we wuz Egyptian at one point - us specifically not all black people.

 

[Aurelian]

That account was called out months ago in a thread I can't remember who was it. We should make a website that contains all the necessary historical facts about Somali history that acts similar to Wikipedia.

 

[Idilinaa]

Chimini is said to have retained archaic elements not preserved in some other northern Swahili dialects. If it was merely a slave population dialect we would have seen other Bantu languages predominantly spoken by slave populations enter the language. Therefore, proto chimini speakers are most likely a small group (like Bajunis) who moved up the coast and mixed with Somalis/middle east migrants. We already know Somali speakers were already contact with NS, so it needn’t have to be a slave dialect.

Even though Chimini may have older roots in Northern Swahili dialects, I think it was adopted primarily for trans-local communication. It helped people in Barawa engage with their northern Swahili clients, trade partners, or religious contacts , possibly including the Bajuni, as you mentioned.

What makes Barawa unique compared to places like Mogadishu or Marka is that its population had more direct and regular interactions with the northern Swahili coast, which could explain the local adoption of Chimini in more recent times.

Also, Somali dialects outnumbered Northern Swahili dialects in Northern Kenya until recently, which supports the idea that any language shift in Barawa was a relatively recent development , not a case of Swahili predating Somali on the southern Somali coast. Even more so since there is no observable substratum.

In fact, a recent linguistic study shared with me , that was by Nuuh , showed that Barawa itself had a distinct Somali dialect spoken within the city, different from the Tunni dialect used in the countryside:

For comparison:

This dialectal map clearly shows that Barawa clusters with Benadiri -Northern Somali dialects on the far end .

 

[Idilinaa]

Also evidence of camel-herding pastoralists pre-800 CE being the first builders of towns in the Lamu archipelago although the author points to it being a possibility of early Muslims in the region bringing camels, the timeline is a bit too early for that so it’s a greater chance they’re a Somali population.View attachment 362557

Not only that, but it aligns perfectly with the fact that the ruins in that region are called Gedi , which is a Somali name with deep cultural resonance among Somali clans, like Gedi Babow and pillar tombs , ancestral saints.

Southern Somali clans like the Tunni and Geledi have traditions that trace their lineage and historical movements back to Lamu and surrounding areas.

Jamal settled in Lamu and established the Jamal Diin dynasty. Fakhr traveled inland and settled in Afgoy, establishing Fakhr Diin Sultanate, known later as ''Geledi''. Umar continued further toward the northwest and founded Luug, establishing the Umur Diin Sultanate, known later as Gasaaragude. Kalafow, the great grandson of Umar Din, in this version is still recognized as the first to use the title

What’s funny or really telling , is how surprised he was when Tunni oral traditions gave dates that closely matched the archaeological and linguistic timelines. That only seems surprising if you assume oral traditions are unreliable , but in reality, many early explorers and observers noted that Somalis often consulted written Arabic texts before giving historical accounts, meaning these ‘oral traditions’ were actually grounded in a literate culture with documented historical memory.

 

[Idilinaa]

For the sake of being thorough, I'll quote what shimbris has to say about that myth.

Just a few corrections since that post is old and we’ve learned more since. The Shungwaya tradition was re-appropriated and mythologized , what it actually relates to is Somali clans migrating south from Buur Gaabo. It doesn’t describe a Swahili homeland in the Jubba region, but rather Somali groups from Jubba moving further down the coast.

If you check the Twitter thread I linked earlier, he goes into much more detail about this.

 

[NidarNidar]

That account was called out months ago in a thread I can't remember who was it. We should make a website that contains all the necessary historical facts about Somali history that acts similar to Wikipedia.

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[Aurelian]

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[NidarNidar]

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