Puntland damaged Somalia and Somaliland.

[White-Macrobian]

How many African states disappeared for 3 decades?
Somalia is unique case and it's about to be concluded soon. You can't say you are staying or else. You can't build a country like that. Maybe you can hold on to some far flung region (like Puntland but even that is iffy) but not major population centres who have a seperate national identity. You have to accept reality.

You keep reverting to regionalism to try to avoid the meat of the topic. Kind of how Puntland keeps Somalia in a vice grip. Double edged swords everywhere

Just asking would u mind if Awdal and SSC seperated tho ?

 

[Abdisamad]

Then do a referendum. That should be fair to everyone there. You want harti to join you qasab thats a no no

Doing a referendum in a land that doesn't belong to them. Are you insane?

 

[JamalFarah]

I've seen your post history, and it seems to be made up of implicitly provoking conflict between various entities in Somalia, whether it's between SSC - PL or switching support between FGS and PL.

This ongoing dispute is fundamentally about constitutional changes and the push to either scrap them or modify them, which is essentially political maneuvering concerning the pace and scope of a federal state and its relationship with the SFG. The issue between FGS and PL at hand doesn't revolve around the philsophical concept of Somalia, there already is agreement on that. Compare that to the philosophical difference between Somalia and Somaliland: ethnic unity versus fragmentation into tribal states.

Whatever "damage" Puntland may have caused by introducing federalism (where the concept and implementation of federalism itself isn't even part of the current issue), it doesn't compare to the fact that Somaliland set the precedent for tribal-led states, normalizing the idea that a majority in a certain region has the right to unilaterally deny others the right to determine their fate.

The concept of Somalia is founded on being a state for the ethnic Somali people, which is inherently more inclusive than the concept of Somaliland. What is the core concept of Somaliland?

There's a good reason why many Gadabuursi individuals suddenly become unionists once they leave Somaliland.

Regionalism is just an extent of tribalism, and to shoulder all of that blame on Puntland is completely unfair. Tribalism hurt the national spirit, some might say its an intrinsic issue within the fabric of Somali society, or the result of Siad Barres nepotistic regime or some other reason, but its a lie to say it comes from one region or even one tribe.

The simple fact that Somalinimo perservered during the darkest hours of Somalias history, for me at least shows that it is something that can survive anything, and its the only thing that allows this pastrolist cushitic heap of a mess fulfill to it's destiny.

 

[Itsnotthateasy]

I've seen your post history, and it seems to be made up of implicitly provoking conflict between various entities in Somalia, whether it's between SSC - PL or switching support between FGS and PL.

This ongoing dispute is fundamentally about constitutional changes and the push to either scrap them or modify them, which is essentially political maneuvering concerning the pace and scope of a federal state and its relationship with the SFG. The issue between FGS and PL at hand doesn't revolve around the philsophical concept of Somalia, there already is agreement on that. Compare that to the philosophical difference between Somalia and Somaliland: ethnic unity versus fragmentation into tribal states.

Whatever "damage" Puntland may have caused by introducing federalism (where the concept and implementation of federalism itself isn't even part of the current issue), it doesn't compare to the fact that Somaliland set the precedent for tribal-led states, normalizing the idea that a majority in a certain region has the right to unilaterally deny others the right to determine their fate.

The concept of Somalia is founded on being a state for the ethnic Somali people, which is inherently more inclusive than the concept of Somaliland. What is the core concept of Somaliland?

There's a good reason why many Gadabuursi individuals suddenly become unionists once they leave Somaliland.

Regionalism is just an extent of tribalism, and to shoulder all of that blame on Puntland is completely unfair. Tribalism hurt the national spirit, some might say its an intrinsic issue within the fabric of Somali society, or the result of Siad Barres nepotistic regime or some other reason, but its a lie to say it comes from one region or even one tribe.

The simple fact that Somalinimo perservered during the darkest hours of Somalias history, for me at least shows that it is something that can survive anything, and its the only thing that allows this pastrolist cushitic heap of a mess fulfill to it's destiny.

You are are selling falsehoods while attacking Somaliland as a tribal entity when you know full well it preexisted Somalia and your Somaliweyn fantasies.

You create a false dichotomy between Somalia and Somaliland- they are both colonial constructions that do not belong any particular tribe. Your concept of ethnic unity has nothing but chaos to show for it. You know all totalitarian visions were sold on positive imagery that was never realized, communisim, socialism etc you name it. All lead to millions of lost of lives.

Anyway you can continue to attempt to keep Somalis stuck on failed notions while the politics outpaces you.

 

[Mohmed]

I've seen your post history, and it seems to be made up of implicitly provoking conflict between various entities in Somalia, whether it's between SSC - PL or switching support between FGS and PL.

This ongoing dispute is fundamentally about constitutional changes and the push to either scrap them or modify them, which is essentially political maneuvering concerning the pace and scope of a federal state and its relationship with the SFG. The issue between FGS and PL at hand doesn't revolve around the philsophical concept of Somalia, there already is agreement on that. Compare that to the philosophical difference between Somalia and Somaliland: ethnic unity versus fragmentation into tribal states.

Whatever "damage" Puntland may have caused by introducing federalism (where the concept and implementation of federalism itself isn't even part of the current issue), it doesn't compare to the fact that Somaliland set the precedent for tribal-led states, normalizing the idea that a majority in a certain region has the right to unilaterally deny others the right to determine their fate.

The concept of Somalia is founded on being a state for the ethnic Somali people, which is inherently more inclusive than the concept of Somaliland. What is the core concept of Somaliland?

There's a good reason why many Gadabuursi individuals suddenly become unionists once they leave Somaliland.

Regionalism is just an extent of tribalism, and to shoulder all of that blame on Puntland is completely unfair. Tribalism hurt the national spirit, some might say its an intrinsic issue within the fabric of Somali society, or the result of Siad Barres nepotistic regime or some other reason, but its a lie to say it comes from one region or even one tribe.

The simple fact that Somalinimo perservered during the darkest hours of Somalias history, for me at least shows that it is something that can survive anything, and its the only thing that allows this pastrolist cushitic heap of a mess fulfill to it's destiny.

You are are selling falsehoods while attacking Somaliland as a tribal entity when you know full well it preexisted Somalia and your Somaliweyn fantasies.

You create a false dichotomy between Somalia and Somaliland- they are both colonial constructions that do not belong any particular tribe. Your concept of ethnic unity has nothing but chaos to show for it. You know all totalitarian visions were sold on positive imagery that was never realized, communisim, socialism etc you name it. All lead to millions of lost of lives.

Anyway you can continue to attempt to keep Somalis stuck on failed notions while the politics outpaces you.

Europeans brought the idea of a democratic nation with shared values to Africa. Before colonialization, Africa lacked nation-building. You people were, and I am saying this to the northerners and southerners, hunters and gatherers as well as pastoralists. Civilization is new to your people. However, tribal lands have existed all over Africa. Somalia is a collection of tribes that haven't passed the stone age of innovation, and Somaliland is a tribal state that likewise hasn't passed the stone age of innovation. Both have a history that is small in comparison to that of West Africa and Northern Africa.

The idea of a civilized society is new to your people, and I mean this to all ethnic Somalis. This is the Truth!

 

[Abdisamad]

Europeans brought the idea of a democratic nation with shared values to Africa. Before colonialization, Africa lacked nation-building. You people were, and I am saying this to the northerners and southerners, hunters and gatherers as well as pastoralists. Civilization is new to your people. However, tribal lands have existed all over Africa. Somalia is a collection of tribes that haven't passed the stone age of innovation, and Somaliland is a tribal state that likewise hasn't passed the stone age of innovation. Both have a history that is small in comparison to that of West Africa and Northern Africa.

The idea of a civilized society is new to your people, and I mean this to all ethnic Somalis. This is the Truth!

Pulling shit out of your ass and calling it truth

Are you even a Somali?

 

[Mohmed]

Pulling shit out of your ass and calling it truth

Are you even a Somali?

I would call myself ethnically and culturally Somali. However, I grew up elsewhere in the Horn.

And, to be honest, it is impossible for a collection of tribes to build a nation that is as big as Somalia. Ethnic Somalis have been doing well and somewhat "civilizing" themselves on the basis of tribal connections. This could be said for the rest of the world at some point. Every nation has dealt with the same issues the ethnic Somalis are dealing with (but they could be issues as old as the dawn of Christianity). But the world is progressing way too rapidly for the ethnic Somalis back home to understand. Only a handful of African societies practiced democracy within their tribes. Some practiced the idea of the elder leading the tribe (ethnic Somalis fall into this category). I am not demeaning anyone with Somali blood, whether he is from the north or the south. Both groups share a commonality: they are new to the idea of state-building. which is surprising due to its close proximity to Ethiopia. Although Ethiopia is also a sh*thole in its own right,.

The dream of Somaliweyn died with Mohamed Siad Barre. A nation filled with tribal "countries" is even too extreme for most of the backward Africans. Somalia has become a region in Africa, not even a country. Somaliland's only argument was about being a civilized country in Africa. But after what happened in Eastern SL, I'd doubt a "country" like that would receive any recognition. A tribal country with nothing to offer the world but its sea.

And with @Itsnotthateasy saying that his qabil-centered society isn't a qabil-centered society then I have some bad news for you.

 

[Abdisamad]

I would call myself ethnically and culturally Somali. However, I grew up elsewhere in the Horn.

And, to be honest, it is impossible for a collection of tribes to build a nation that is as big as Somalia. Ethnic Somalis have been doing well and somewhat "civilizing" themselves on the basis of tribal connections. This could be said for the rest of the world at some point. Every nation has dealt with the same issues the ethnic Somalis are dealing with (but they could be issues as old as the dawn of Christianity). But the world is progressing way too rapidly for the ethnic Somalis back home to understand. Only a handful of African societies practiced democracy within their tribes. Some practiced the idea of the elder leading the tribe (ethnic Somalis fall into this category). I am not demeaning anyone with Somali blood, whether he is from the north or the south. Both groups share a commonality: they are new to the idea of state-building. which is surprising due to its close proximity to Ethiopia. Although Ethiopia is also a sh*thole in its own right,.

The dream of Somaliweyn died with Mohamed Siad Barre. A nation filled with tribal "countries" is even too extreme for most of the backward Africans. Somalia has become a region in Africa, not even a country. Somaliland's only argument was about being a civilized country in Africa. But after what happened in Eastern SL, I'd doubt a "country" like that would receive any recognition. A tribal country with nothing to offer the world but its sea.

And with @Itsnotthateasy saying that his qabil-centered society isn't a qabil-centered society then I have some bad news for you.

Let me guess, you're an Ethiopian

Anyway to address you're stupid points, how many countries countries consists of different tribes, even have different religions and culture and yet are able to form a united country? Arguing with you would be waste of a valuable time, so I'll make it short.

 

[daljirkadahsoon]

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