Philosophy is kufr and leads to shirk?

[Bundasliga]

this is a weird thing to claim. if you want to develop software or airplanes or nukes.... I don't think you need to study Plato or Aristotle.

But in the process you would engage in philosophy. For example logic is part of philosophy.

 

[Bundasliga]

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If I do an interview to work as a software engineer at Google- which of these philosophers am I going to be asked about at Google?

Probably none.
I don't think you understand my point, it has nothing to with those individuals rather their methods that they came up with.

Look it up the relationship of science & philosophy.

 

[Omar del Sur]

But in the process you would engage in philosophy. For example logic is part of philosophy.

I'm sure Michael Jordan has reflected on his career and thought about the meaning of it all and what drove him. But Michael Jordan and Shaquille O Neal don't need to take a philosophy class to stick a basketball in a hoop.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Probably none.
I don't think you understand my point, it has nothing to with those individuals rather their methods that they came up with.

Look it up the relationship of science & philosophy.

yes, let's look at the relationship of science and philosophy.

The scientist is the athlete putting the basketball through the hoop. The philosopher of science is the ESPN commentator. Saying you can't have science without philosophy is like saying you can't have sports without ESPN commentators.

 

[altrae]

Probably none.
I don't think you understand my point, it has nothing to with those individuals rather their methods that they came up with.

Look it up the relationship of science & philosophy.

He wont even accept that theres a relation between the two. No point in debating with this guy, its a waste of time. He probably just hates philosophy for quite literally no reason at all.

 

[Bundasliga]

yes, let's look at the relationship of science and philosophy.

The scientist is the athlete putting the basketball through the hoop. The philosopher of science is the ESPN commentator. Saying you can't have science without philosophy is like saying you can't have sports without ESPN commentators.

Where do you get that from?

Can you proof God without engaging in philosophy?

 

[Bundasliga]

He wont even accept that theres a relation between the two. No point in debating with this guy, its a waste of time. He probably just hates philosophy for quite literally no reason at all.

I think it comes from a place of ignorance. They have a different definition of philosophy than others.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Where do you get that from?

where do I get that from? I get that from knowing a bit about philosophy.

look- when we're talking about philosophy as an actual field of study we're talking about people like Plato and Aristotle. more recently, people like Marx and Nietzsche. the word "philosophy" is greek. it comes from the ancient greeks.

if someone gets a job at a store and they have a training thing where they say "here is our company's philosophy of exceptional customer service"....

when Muslim scholars of today or of the past such as Al-Ghazali- when they warned against philosophy, is that what they were talking about? "this is our company's philosophy of excellent customer service"?

they are talking about the actual field that includes people such as Plato and and Aristotle

 

[Omar del Sur]

I think it comes from a place of ignorance. They have a different definition of philosophy than others.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy

wikipedia and basically every academic institution on earth must all be coming from the same place of ignorance.

 

[Omar del Sur]

Can you proof God without engaging in philosophy?

if you go to any college and take the philosophy course- it's going to be stuff like Plato and Aristotle. no, you don't any of that to prove God's existence.

 

[altrae]

I think it comes from a place of ignorance. They have a different definition of philosophy than others.

Anyone that isnt muslim in their eyes is considered "whatever" pretty much. Sort of like the word we have, "gaal"

 

[Bundasliga]

@Omar del Sur check dm

 

[Omar del Sur]

yes, let's look at the relationship of science and philosophy.

The scientist is the athlete putting the basketball through the hoop. The philosopher of science is the ESPN commentator. Saying you can't have science without philosophy is like saying you can't have sports without ESPN commentators.

just to expand on this for anyone who doesn't understand what I mean here.

scientists actually do science. soldiers actually wage war. musicians actually perform music (which is haraam btw but that is besides my point).

the philosopher of science just theorizes about science, philosopher of war theorizes about war, philosopher of music theorizes about music.

you don't need philosophy for science, war, or music (which is again is haraam but I'm just using it as an example). you don't need to study Aristotle to develop software. soldiers don't need to study Plato to fight a war. Someone like Michael Jackson doesn't need a philosophy class to perform on stage. philosophers don't actually do the thing- they just theorize about it. you don't need philosophy for there to be science.

 

[Bundasliga]

just to expand on this for anyone who doesn't understand what I mean here.

scientists actually do science. soldiers actually wage war. musicians actually perform music (which is haraam btw but that is besides my point).

the philosopher of science just theorizes about science, philosopher of war theorizes about war, philosopher of music theorizes about music.

you don't need philosophy for science, war, or music (which is again is haraam but I'm just using it as an example). you don't need to study Aristotle to develop software. soldiers don't need to study Plato to fight a war. Someone like Michael Jackson doesn't need a philosophy class to perform on stage. philosophers don't actually do the thing- they just theorize about it. you don't need philosophy for there to be science.

 

[Omar del Sur]

I see. This is the problem when you're listening to these people like Muhammad Hijab. We need Quran and Sunnah. We don't need to mix in stuff like Aristotle.

 

[Omar del Sur]

you should hold up Quran and Sunnah as your banner but you hold up Quran, Sunnah, philosophy.... this is opening the door to all kinds of trouble. the religion was already complete over 1,400 years ago. we don't need to be adding anything to it.

 

[altrae]

Lol this guy clearly has extreme hatred for philosophy. I wonder why....

 

[Omar del Sur]

Lol this guy clearly has extreme hatred for philosophy. I wonder why....

because I believe in Quran and Sunnah, not Aristotle.

 

[Bundasliga]

because I believe in Quran and Sunnah, not Aristotle.

You believe in mathematics, science ,physics, chemistry, biology etc.

Or do you denounce them also ?

 

[Omar del Sur]

You believe in mathematics, science ,physics, chemistry, biology etc.

Or do you denounce them also ?

Philosophy is stuff like Plato and Aristotle. If you take any philosophy course in college, that's the kind of thing they teach. You read any book on history of philosophy and that's the kind of thing they're talking about. You're playing games with the definition.

When Al-Ghazali and Sheikh Ibn Taymiyyah and them were talking about philosophy, they were talking about stuff like Aristotle. No, we don't need Plato, Aristotle, etc.