No reconciliation until there's a consensus on our history

[World]

I thought it was common knowledge that only hargeisa etc were destroyed by the kacaan government and that xamar was left untouched? Let’s leave the revisionism behind.

 

[Chase]

Harsh truth that might get me some hate but most abgaals died in the hands of other hawiye than daroods if we are truly being honest. As i always say no such thing as tribes just clans. Its all the past though

For sure, I'd say the biggest killers of Darood are other Darood, bruh we were having a civil war ourselves when Barre was head of state, MF played us against each other for decades. I think landers have a legitimate grievance against the Kacaan, everyone else just jumped on it to further their own ambitions

 

[Darood]

Not really, all Hawiye including Madowwayne & RX ganged up on Abgaal, it was pretty much Abgaal vs everyone.

Most of the government buildings were actually left intact by the Kacaan, even SNM were present at the time of negotiating a new government, but they left once USC decided to embark on their holy chimpout.

I don’t think all Hawiye were against Abgaal
Murursade played both sides if I’m correct.
Certain sections within HG disobeyed Caydid orders to bomb Abgaal

 

[convincation]

I don’t think all Hawiye were against Abgaal
Murursade played both sides if I’m correct.
Certain sections within HG disobeyed Caydid orders to bomb Abgaal

Initially it was just a war to get Ali mahdi out of power and Caydiid onto the throne. Caydiid being the head of the USC managed to rally up all the troops and weaponry against Ali mahdi regardless of clan. There were abgaal on caydiids side and HG (saleebaan) on Cali mahdis. The war became more tribal over time and the USC split with Abgaal on one side and HG+XL+MR+RX+Madow+GJ+Dir on the other. Eventually Murusade had a disagreement with Caydiid leading them to fight him and be defeated and robbed dry in 6 hours which is where the famous “beesha kuwait” insult originates from. After that MR switched to our side and the war continued. Outside of Xamar Abgaal and wacdaan were fighting GJ+XL+HG in Lower shabelle

Regardless that’s all in the past, we all live together and eat together all over Mog and LS today

 

[Periplus]

Are you arguing more people died and less property was destroyed in 1991 than a war involving more than 50 000 troops expanding over 5 years? You do realise how ridiculous you sound when you make arguments that can be easily disproven. 4 months of war involving rag tag militias destroyed more than a war lasting 5 years involving professional armies and airforces from Uganda and Ethiopia. Why Somalis are so anti-intellectual?

It is quite hilarious when people pretend to be experts. My argument is based on statements from the locals who lived in Xamar from 1991 to 2022 never left and have seen it all. Not some bogus online pictures showing the streets that were damaged the most. 2006 to 2011 was five years str8 of daily conflict, suicide bombings, deaths and destruction.

Ffs even the less qabiilist and intellectual folk among us are blinded by clan loyalties to the extent they straight out lie.

I never mentioned people. All I am saying is that Xamar was destroyed in the 1990s and continued to get destroyed in each passing year.

There is no magical scenario in which full blown anarchy occurs for 16 years (1991-2007) and there is no damage.

 

[Periplus]

It’s people being disingenuous for obvious reasons. Everyone knows that the reason the city was in shambles was because of the fight against Barre

A 1 month war between army and rebels in a last stand and they pretend it wasn’t completely destroyed

My mother who isn’t Darood was in Xamar during the last stand of MSBs soldiers, she said the real damage started after Aideed took over.

That was when her family realised it was time to leave.

 

[convincation]

My mother who isn’t Darood was in Xamar during the last stand of MSBs soldiers, she said the real damage started after Aideed took over.

That was when her family realised it was time to leave.

What clan is your mother?

 

[World]

Initially it was just a war to get Ali mahdi out of power and Caydiid onto the throne. Caydiid being the head of the USC managed to rally up all the troops and weaponry against Ali mahdi regardless of clan. There were abgaal on caydiids side and HG (saleebaan) on Cali mahdis. The war became more tribal over time and the USC split with Abgaal on one side and HG+XL+MR+RX+Madow+GJ+Dir on the other. Eventually Murusade had a disagreement with Caydiid leading them to fight him and be defeated and robbed dry in 6 hours which is where the famous “beesha kuwait” insult originates from. After that MR switched to our side and the war continued. Outside of Xamar Abgaal and wacdaan were fighting GJ+XL+HG in Lower shabelle

Regardless that’s all in the past, we all live together and eat together all over Mog and LS today

Didn’t Aideed unite everyone by saying that Abgaal will cleanse everyone that isn’t Abgaal from Xamar? Which probably would have happened. It was always tribal.

 

[convincation]

Didn’t Aideed unite everyone by saying that Abgaal will cleanse everyone that isn’t Abgaal from Xamar? Which probably would have happened. It was always tribal.

Nope. Everyone rallied up because they felt Ali Mahdi wasn’t doing enough being in power for so long and achieving nothing. Ofcourse Somalis can’t fathom starting a maamul from scratch takes time and effort

If Wacbudhan wanted to cleanse everyone from xamar, they could have done so at any point. Abgaal are known to be neighbourly people, this whole idea is just jeberti PTSD

 

[Periplus]

What clan is your mother?

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[xLibaxsenderx]

Shamelessness and lack of selfworth, in a couple words.

 

[Unbothered]

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How disrespectful

 

[Maraq]

You have people trying to compare a few months of tribal gun fights, with aerial and heavy artillery bombardment for years from a professional army(ethiopia). Keydmedia and AP have archived a lot of it, and destroyed much of the narratives on here.

So we know that the 2006-9 years torched the city and left it unrecognisable. Now the question shifts to: why? Why do certain individuals on here want to deny it?

It's simple: darood revisionism and self-victimisation. They seek a narrative where they were haplessly massacred, and their oppressors shortly self-destructed. So far are they in pursuit of this quest, that they have pseudo-intellectuals, such as kapteijins, writing rumours and passing it off as genuine journalism. It irks them when one reminds them that the precious handlers of their beloved TFG, the xabeshas, left the city unrecognisable.

Anyway, it doesn't matter. Despite their sickening quest in 2006 to destroy us, we have built back. Remain strong, and let them whimper in their desolate northern wasteland

 

[Hilmaam]

War caused more than physical damage.
1.Big brain drain.
2. Our culture and arts also suffered. the music ,poetry , and theatre plays were top notch and was so good that our artists used to perform in Sudan and Ethiopia to packed concerts
3. Segregation. Since war many clans separated and each moved to own location and stronghold.

 

[Periplus]

How disrespectful

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[Magaffe]

You have people trying to compare a few months of tribal gun fights, with aerial and heavy artillery bombardment for years from a professional army(ethiopia). Keydmedia and AP have archived a lot of it, and destroyed much of the narratives on here.

So we know that the 2006-9 years torched the city and left it unrecognisable. Now the question shifts to: why? Why do certain individuals on here want to deny it?

It's simple: darood revisionism and self-victimisation. They seek a narrative where they were haplessly massacred, and their oppressors shortly self-destructed. So far are they in pursuit of this quest, that they have pseudo-intellectuals, such as kapteijins, writing rumours and passing it off as genuine journalism. It irks them when one reminds them that the precious handlers of their beloved TFG, the xabeshas, left the city unrecognisable.

Anyway, it doesn't matter. Despite their sickening quest in 2006 to destroy us, we have built back. Remain strong, and let them whimper in their desolate northern wasteland
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When did Xamar become a Hawiye city?

Nibbas trying to steal a whole city now.

 

[Based]

Who destroyed Mogadishu is a question of fact not opinion. When MSB left the city in Jan 1991, it was intact except for some shelling damage in the outskirts. The USC gained control of the city and began to loot everything owned by non-Hawiye. After this was done, the USC divided into two and began to shell each other with the artillery found in the government’s armories.

This shelling and inter-USC fighting over who would form the post MSB government is what actually destroyed the city. Most Hawiye are ashamed of the USC’s failure to govern, and so shift the blame onto MSB.

To see the magnitude of this failure, compare the TPLF’s takeover of Addis in May 1991 to the USC’s takeover in Jan 1991.

Facts

 

[Darood]

Initially it was just a war to get Ali mahdi out of power and Caydiid onto the throne. Caydiid being the head of the USC managed to rally up all the troops and weaponry against Ali mahdi regardless of clan. There were abgaal on caydiids side and HG (saleebaan) on Cali mahdis. The war became more tribal over time and the USC split with Abgaal on one side and HG+XL+MR+RX+Madow+GJ+Dir on the other. Eventually Murusade had a disagreement with Caydiid leading them to fight him and be defeated and robbed dry in 6 hours which is where the famous “beesha kuwait” insult originates from. After that MR switched to our side and the war continued. Outside of Xamar Abgaal and wacdaan were fighting GJ+XL+HG in Lower shabelle

Regardless that’s all in the past, we all live together and eat together all over Mog and LS today

My mother who isn’t Darood was in Xamar during the last stand of MSBs soldiers, she said the real damage started after Aideed took over.

That was when her family realised it was time to leave.

My mother says something similar.
There was a brief period of tranquility when MBS left.

 

[Darood]

Initially it was just a war to get Ali mahdi out of power and Caydiid onto the throne. Caydiid being the head of the USC managed to rally up all the troops and weaponry against Ali mahdi regardless of clan. There were abgaal on caydiids side and HG (saleebaan) on Cali mahdis. The war became more tribal over time and the USC split with Abgaal on one side and HG+XL+MR+RX+Madow+GJ+Dir on the other. Eventually Murusade had a disagreement with Caydiid leading them to fight him and be defeated and robbed dry in 6 hours which is where the famous “beesha kuwait” insult originates from. After that MR switched to our side and the war continued. Outside of Xamar Abgaal and wacdaan were fighting GJ+XL+HG in Lower shabelle

Regardless that’s all in the past, we all live together and eat together all over Mog and LS today

Interesting. I didn’t know Abgaal were fighting in LS.
It’s in the past but we must try to always remember and record this time period.
I try to listen more closely to my Dad now when he speaks about the war.
I want to record first hand accounts.

 

[El Nino]

Somali clans throughout the history of our people have xasuuqed other clans for more lands and cattle. Shit is in our dna. Qabyaalad did not suddenly stop when Somalia gained independence. It still lingered.

AUN to all the victims that were killed by HG. InshAllah the grievances will be solved and there won’t be future issues one day. But lets make one thing clear.

Had it been HG that would get xasuuqed by Darood or others there would be no apology or anything close to reconciliation. Stop the act. The whole reconciliation shit is basically trying to get us HGs to acknowledge our crimes but the ones who want to held us accountable are still doing qabyaalad and being hypocrites.

Reconciliation will happen in Somalia/somaliweyn when people/leaders will acknowledge how detrimental qabyaalad is and will stop it. This requires all parties to be on the same ground, otherwise shit is pointless. After this is done, then we can talk about who murdered who and work to solve our problems.