Most Arabs in Zeila were prisoners

[Maintainnnin]

Picked up on this almost 15 years ago. I can't really relate to them. I was born into a wealthy and educated family and grew up in the Khaleej where most Somalis are middle-class to well-off and the ones who aren't are just folks hustling their way through life as drivers or housekeepers to the local Somalis. Intellectual-ish parents who were not qabiilist in the least as well.

I sympathize, though. I had cousins in their situations and/or family friends. When you grow up in a house of 8 kids, you've been lower-income your entire upbringing, grew up as a minority in a country where even some of the other minorities might bully you because of your ethnicity and religion (UK) and your parents are maybe village bumpkins listening day and night to some disingenuous sheikh while a lot of other kids in your situation turn to crime... it's a little inevitable to self-hate and have low self-worth.

Just learned to ignore them, to be honest.

The Somali boomers and their general ignorance and distortion of Somali history has a lot to do with it too, they over emphasis pastoral nomadism, and completely neglect of all other historical occupations and sectors of the Somali economy, and our history of urbanism.

I deadass remember watching a news documentary when I was in highshool where some boomer oday told the news lady "Somalis are an oral people, we didn't write" nacas ass reer baadiyo nigga being used as an authoritative source. Now image the kids that generation raised and the distorted/harmful version of history they passed on. This is why a lot of young diaspora Somalis lack collective self-esteem.

 

[Shimbiris]

The Somali boomers and their general ignorance and distortion of Somali history has a lot to do with it too, they over emphasis pastoral nomadism, and completely neglect of all other historical occupations and sectors of the Somali economy, and our history of urbanism.

I deadass remember watching a news documentary when I was in highshool where some boomer oday told the news lady "Somalis are an oral people, we didn't write" nacas ass reer baadiyo nigga being used as an authoritative source. Now image the kids this generation raised and the distorted/harmful version of history they passed on. This is why a lot of young diaspora Somalis lack group self-esteem.

100% co-sign. I've encountered these types too. Growing up around that + what I stated is a recipe for disaster, tbh.

 

[reer]

Picked up on this almost 15 years ago. I can't really relate to them. I was born into a wealthy and educated family and grew up in the Khaleej where most Somalis are middle-class to well-off and the ones who aren't are just folks hustling their way through life as drivers or housekeepers to the local Somalis. Intellectual-ish parents who were not qabiilist in the least as well.

I sympathize, though. I had cousins in their situations and/or family friends. When you grow up in a house of 8 kids, you've been lower-income your entire upbringing, grew up as a minority in a country where even some of the other minorities might bully you because of your ethnicity and religion (UK) and your parents are maybe village bumpkins listening day and night to some disingenuous sheikh while a lot of other kids in your situation turn to crime... it's a little inevitable to self-hate and have low self-worth.

Just learned to ignore them, to be honest.

i never want to go into dna talk in real life with geeljires again. i tried to explain that we are ev32 and the middle east aint our origins like the history books say. a totally horrible experience.

 

[Shimbiris]

i never want to go into dna talk in real life with geeljires again. i tried to explain that we are ev32 and the middle east aint our origins like the history books say. a totally horrible experience.

Tbh, I don't fully disassociate from MENAs when explaining "real Somali history" to Somalis irl. I just frame it like, "There is something genetically like Arabs in us. It's half of our ancestry but it's old and predates Islam and Arabic." they can wrap their heads around that better. It's the same when I meet Xabashis or Oromos and such.

No one from our region is gonna believe you that we're 100% "African" like a Dinka; they can see something MENA is in us based on our looks. Ya just gotta explain it's very ancient and not from actual Arabs. But don't waste your time on the qabiilist odays. They decided they were Banu Hashim a long time ago.

 

[Shimbiris]

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[Guure⁸]

i never want to go into dna talk in real life with geeljires again. i tried to explain that we are ev32 and the middle east aint our origins like the history books say. a totally horrible experience.

"Inaa carab ahay ba ka xuntahay" a nga said this to me once i was like brother what??

 

[Shimbiris]

"Inaa carab ahay ba ka xuntahay" a nga said this to me once i was like brother what??

This happened once in a discussion my cousin was having with a guy. She's like an older sister to me and lived with my fam for a few years. She speaks pretty good Yemeni Arabic but the fob she was speaking to didn't speak Arabic and she said, "Iza enta 3arabi, laysh ma tafham kalaami, ya ahbal?" - "If you are an Arab, why don't you understand what I'm saying, you moron?" Nigga just stared blank-faced.

 

[reer]

Tbh, I don't fully disassociate from MENAs when explaining "real Somali history" to Somalis irl. I just frame it like, "There is something genetically like Arabs in us. It's half of our ancestry but it's old and predates Islam and Arabic." they can wrap their heads around that better. It's the same when I meet Xabashis or Oromos and such.

No one from our region is gonna believe you that we're 100% "African" like a Dinka; they can see something MENA is in us based on our looks. Ya just gotta explain it's very ancient and not from actual Arabs. But don't waste your time on the qabiilist odays. They decided they were Banu Hashim a long time ago.

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"Inaa carab ahay ba ka xuntahay" a nga said this to me once i was like brother what??

THAT WAS A RESPONSE I GOT. THE SAME THING. WHEN I TALKED ABOUT LINGUISTICS AND HOW LOANWORDS DIDNT CHANGE OUR CUSHITIC LINGUISTICS.

 

[Guure⁸]

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THAT WAS A RESPONSE I GOT. THE SAME THING. WHEN I TALKED ABOUT LINGUISTICS AND HOW LOANWORDS DIDNT CHANGE OUR CUSHITIC LINGUISTICS.

They all have this mindset that being carab makes u superior

 

[Idilinaa]

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I think what complicates these 'Ana-Arab' accusations thrown at Somalis , often rooted in anti-Arab xenophobia and, at times, bordering on Islamophobia, is that we've always had historical and cultural ties to Arabia. Even before Islam, there was regular movement and exchange across the Red Sea. Even the earliest Cushitic-speaking peoples in Eastern Sudan were also connected to Arabia, as confirmed through archaeological and material culture evidence. Our cultures weren’t radically different from one another.


It’s also important to note that cultural influence went both ways. Somalis contributed to Arabian(particularly yemeni) culture just as much as they received from it. That history is often deliberately overlooked to strip us of our own agency and cast us as mere imitators or undue weight is given to an external influence.

The reason for that is that this dynamic is racialized. In other regions whether it's Europe, East Asia, South Asia, or even in parts of MENA , people are allowed to share customs and histories with their neighbors without scrutiny. But when Somalis share deep historical and cultural ties with our neighbors across the Red Sea, we're penalized for it, as if our connections are unnatural or inauthentic

As for the Aqili/Quraishi lineages, they mostly reflect Islamic identity. The saints they trace back to were real, historical figures who had meaningful impacts on their communities. That connection is more about spiritual heritage than racial or ethnic alignment, and dismissing it flattens centuries of Islamic tradition and regional exchange.

 

[Xareen]

Picked up on this almost 15 years ago. I can't really relate to them. I was born into a wealthy and educated family and grew up in the Khaleej where most Somalis are middle-class to well-off and the ones who aren't are just folks hustling their way through life as drivers or housekeepers to the local Somalis. Intellectual-ish parents who were not qabiilist in the least as well.

I sympathize, though. I had cousins in their situations and/or family friends. When you grow up in a house of 8 kids, you've been lower-income your entire upbringing, grew up as a minority in a country where even some of the other minorities might bully you because of your ethnicity and religion (UK) and your parents are maybe village bumpkins listening day and night to some disingenuous sheikh while a lot of other kids in your situation turn to crime... it's a little inevitable to self-hate and have low self-worth.

Just learned to ignore them, to be honest.

If we were in the Bronze Age, walaal, you'd be Mr E-Y18629 himself and I'd be willing to die to expand your harem of South Cushitic fineshyts.

And yeah, I sympathise. I have Allah and my parents to thank for the fact that I wasn't raised to even know my qabiil, nevermind the silly backward politics that most of the accused suffer from. Wise words brah, you're really the goat.

 

[Xareen]

The reason for that is that this dynamic is racialized. In other regions whether it's Europe, East Asia, South Asia, or even in parts of MENA , people are allowed to share customs and histories with their neighbors without scrutiny. But when Somalis share deep historical and cultural ties with our neighbors across the Red Sea, we're penalized for it, as if our connections are unnatural or inauthentic

Our gripes with Somali history usually comes down to two things held against us ever since end of WWII:

1) We're Muslim, Habeshas - our historical 'rivals' - aren't. This is mostly an issue in medieval historical unuka lehs


2) Anti-Hamitism - white post-war guilt lead to overcorrecting previous theories of Hamitic civilisation builders to the point of demonising anything with any racial connotations in East Africa. This has done untold damages on Nubiology, but really all things Neolithic/Bronze Age.

 

[Shimbiris]

If we were in the Bronze Age, walaal, you'd be Mr E-Y18629 himself and I'd be willing to die to expand your harem of South Cushitic fineshyts.

You make too much of me, fam. But the affection is reciprocated. I have to say I'm very proud of how far Somalis have come with our Anthropology community. Other communities lurk and take notes. It's staggering.

So many of you are so knowledgeable, wallahi. Alchemist & idilinaa, you, Garaad, Nidar, Khaem, as well as our brother Drobbah for all of his faults. I used to have a perhaps narcissistic fear about a decade ago of where our people would be left in terms of knowledge about their history if I died before I could make many of the posts I had planned but you chaps have fully disillusioned me of such delusions of grandeur.

And yeah, I sympathise. I have Allah and my parents to thank for the fact that I wasn't raised to even know my qabiil, nevermind the silly backward politics that most of the accused suffer from. Wise words brah, you're really the goat.

War amus, kekekeke. But yeah, I didn't know my qabiil until I was like 10 or something. Cousin mentioned it to me and I was like "Mama, he said we are something Da'od? Da'ud?" she almost fell over with how hard she laughed.

But I remember how she very cleverly found a way to make it not a big deal to me. I had these three 4 cousins I grew up with who were extremely close to me. Turns out 2—a brother and sister who were like my older siblings—were paternally Isaaq (Habar Awal) and another two—twins close in age to me who were like my brothers—were paternally Hawiye (Abgaal) and she was like, "And you are Darood (Dishiishe/basically MJ). Those three are the three that are always at each other's throats. Do you feel any different toward your cousins? Do you love them any less?" the answer was obviously no and that's all qabiil ever was to me after that.

Some chaps on these types of sites might not be able to fully wrap their heads around it but I really don't remotely care about it. Somali waa Somali to me. Any of you ever in my neck of the woods, I'd welcome you like I would any of my tribesmen and do you favors like job referrals if I was in the position to.

 

[Idilinaa]

Our gripes with Somali history usually comes down to two things held against us ever since end of WWII:

1) We're Muslim, Habeshas - our historical 'rivals' - aren't. This is mostly an issue in medieval historical unuka lehs


2) Anti-Hamitism - white post-war guilt lead to overcorrecting previous theories of Hamitic civilisation builders to the point of demonising anything with any racial connotations in East Africa. This has done untold damages on Nubiology, but really all things Neolithic/Bronze Age.

It's ironic you mention the Habesha, because one of the recurring accusations against Somalis is that Islam is a 'foreign imposition' despite the fact that it spread through trade, scholarship, and was deeply compatible with pre-existing Somali culture. Somali scholars and communities played a major role in spreading and sustaining Islam organically.

Yet you rarely see Christianity framed the same way in Ethiopia, even though it arrived through similar foreign contact. Instead, it's imagined as a native imperial force even though the Church historically stifled development and presided over an isolated impoverished mountain enclave marked by constant warfare and deep xenophobia.

As for Hamitic theory it's outdated white supremacist nonsense. You don’t need to invoke it to explain human relatedness or interaction in East Africa. Geography, migration, and trade explain far more without the racial baggage.

 

[Shimbiris]

As for Hamitic theory it's outdated white supremacist nonsense. You don’t need to invoke it to explain human relatedness or interaction in East Africa. Geography, migration, and trade explain far more without the racial baggage.

Indeed, but Xareen's point is that a lot of cadaan scholars, in my humble opinion, do downplay Horners, Sudani Arabs and Nubians and over-emphasize less "admixed" Nilo-Saharans and other similar East-Africans at our expense because they feel embarrassed by the racialist nonsense of their predecessors who felated us as "Hamites" and basically used us a way to steal any form of civilization or culture from our neighboring not or less admixed groups. They were even trying to claim Great Zimbabwe had to be some sort of "Hamite" foray. Was wild.

 

[Guure⁸]

This is BS, kulaha zeila means exile, dont tell me youre taking ts seriously

Where did u get that?