Is The Sharia Barbaric? #Stoning #Theft #Murder #Apostasy || The Hot Seat by AMAU

[AhmedAdde]

great lecture

 

[Sheikh Google]

You will never convince a modern society that stoning, cut of a finger/hand for theft and killing someone for apostasy isn't barbaric. Spending 2hrs plus to do mental gymnastics and provide nothing insightful that hasn't already been addressed. Like there are so much more insightful things you can talk about the deen but no lets spend 2hrs plus talking dressing up something that has no place in modern society.

 

[Omar del Sur]

You will never convince a modern society that stoning, cut of a finger/hand for theft and killing someone for apostasy isn't barbaric. Spending 2hrs plus to do mental gymnastics and provide nothing insightful that hasn't already been addressed. Like there are so much more insightful things you can talk about the deen but no lets spend 2hrs plus talking dressing up something that has no place in modern society.

You will definitely end up in jahannam if you die in the state you're in.

 

[Sheikh Google]

You will definitely end up in jahannam if you die in the state you're in.

Ahh, the salaf special. No nuanced discussion just straight takfir and ready to gaalify any opposition. Like think about it for a second without resorting to any scriptures etc.. you are advocating for something like stoning someone in the 21st century. What does one gain from that? what insight does society gain and what does it do to help progress society?

 

[Omar del Sur]

Ahh, the salaf special. No nuanced discussion just straight takfir and ready to gaalify any opposition. Like think about it for a second without resorting to any scriptures etc.. you are advocating for something like stoning someone in the 21st century. What does one gain from that? what insight does society gain and what does it do to help progress society?

I didn't say you are a kaffir. Even some Muslims will (temporarily) go to hell.

You are a kaffir, though. Insulting the dīn is apostasy and believing in secularism is apostasy.

I didn't mention you being a kaffir because I didn't realize you were trying to deny it.

 

[Sheikh Google]

I didn't say you are a kaffir. Even some Muslims will (temporarily) go to hell.

You are a kaffir, though. Insulting the dīn is apostasy and believing in secularism is apostasy.

I didn't mention you being a kaffir because I didn't realize you were trying to deny it.

It's funny because you are using a site that allows you to display freely whatever opinion you want to have. You most likely live in the west and gain the benefits from living there. Yet you want Sharia law? I can't wrap my head around it seriously. Makes no sense to me. Can the deen not be a personal thing just like how it is that way millions of people who perhaps do not share the same ideas as you, can leave freely without fear of persecution? You hate secularism and call it kuffar yet it's this secularism that allows you to freely practice whatever you want with the comforts of knowing no government can kill you or terrorize you for believing in something.

 

[Muzaffer]

It's funny because you are using a site that allows you to display freely whatever opinion you want to have. You most likely live in the west and gain the benefits from living there. Yet you want Sharia law? I can't wrap my head around it seriously. Makes no sense to me. Can the deen not be a personal thing just like how it is that way millions of people who perhaps do not share the same ideas as you, can leave freely without fear of persecution? You hate secularism and call it kuffar yet it's this secularism that allows you to freely practice whatever you want with the comforts of knowing no government can kill you or terrorize you for believing in something.

so you are against the sharia law?

 

[Liban89]

Ahh, the salaf special. No nuanced discussion just straight takfir and ready to gaalify any opposition. Like think about it for a second without resorting to any scriptures etc.. you are advocating for something like stoning someone in the 21st century. What does one gain from that? what insight does society gain and what does it do to help progress society?

The salafi specializes in a concept called (النقل قبل العقل) meaning there is no place for critical thinking when it comes to disecting backward ideas in islam in modern societies. They either declare you a kaffir on the spot or they resort to ad-hominem tactics, or utilize both tactics at the same time. It is really sad.

 

[Liban89]

Where does stoning even come from in islam? Quran? Because killing someone is no easy decision.

 

[reer]

It's funny because you are using a site that allows you to display freely whatever opinion you want to have. You most likely live in the west and gain the benefits from living there. Yet you want Sharia law? I can't wrap my head around it seriously. Makes no sense to me. Can the deen not be a personal thing just like how it is that way millions of people who perhaps do not share the same ideas as you, can leave freely without fear of persecution? You hate secularism and call it kuffar yet it's this secularism that allows you to freely practice whatever you want with the comforts of knowing no government can kill you or terrorize you for believing in something.

so you are saying "Ilaahay baa na abuuray. but we should not use his law." la xawla.

 

[Muzaffer]

The salafi specializes in a concept called (النقل قبل العقل) meaning there is no place for critical thinking when it comes to disecting backward ideas in islam in modern societies. They either declare you a kaffir on the spot or they resort to ad-hominem tactics, or utilize both tactics at the same time. It is really sad.

النقل قبل العقل is part of Islam but its depend on the way you see explain it if what is written have a strong claim than mind then we would definitely choose what is written but if the mind has a stronger claim than what is written then we will take mind, it's impossible to both have a strong claim at the same time.

but to always taking favoring the mind over what is written is the way of mutazilah which are dangerous groups which Wahabis and ahlu sunnah was jama'ah ( Ash'aris and Maturidi ) warn people from them

 

[Sheikh Google]

so you are against the sharia law?

Depends on what do you consider sharia law? remember Islam through historical context went through many versions of sharia law. That is the issue I have with salafs they disregard history completely. For example, the Islamic golden age which is parroted constantly online was headed majorly by the Mu'tazilites yet any salaf would mention that they are heretics and kafirs yet they still believe in the oneness of God. Salafism is just blind to the history of Islam that has had many versions of Sharia law. It's always my way or the highway with them.

 

[Sheikh Google]

so you are saying "Ilaahay baa na abuuray. but we should not use his law." la xawla.

The laws of Allah have been reinterpreted many times during the 1400 years of Islam. Or are you saying that only the salafs interpretation of sharia is right and that everyone else who interpreted differently was wrong and is a kafir and is therefore in hell.

 

[TheManWhoIsAlive]

You will never convince a modern society that stoning, cut of a finger/hand for theft and killing someone for apostasy isn't barbaric. Spending 2hrs plus to do mental gymnastics and provide nothing insightful that hasn't already been addressed. Like there are so much more insightful things you can talk about the deen but no lets spend 2hrs plus talking dressing up something that has no place in modern society.

People don't want to hear this. This is straight facts. Anyone who says otherwise ain't looking at reality. The Deen is insightful, but what he said is no lie. No modern state in the west will ever approve of lashings for having sex. We gotta be real about this shit.

 

[Abba Sadacha]

Ahh, the salaf special. No nuanced discussion just straight takfir and ready to gaalify any opposition. Like think about it for a second without resorting to any scriptures etc.. you are advocating for something like stoning someone in the 21st century. What does one gain from that? what insight does society gain and what does it do to help progress society?

Ask yourself this instead: am I a believer in what Allaah revealed? or in what the children of adam, who are inherently flawed, more inclined to corruption, etc, created?

then ask yourself this: what is the purpose, for laws and punishment? to deter criminals, right? not to encourage them by being too lenient, right? if a rapist knows he'd be stoned for rape, or executed, do you think that would deter him more than say, a few years or a decade behind bars?
Also, do not forget that, Allaah may forgive you when you stand before him on Yawmul Qiyamah, so yes, you may be punished in this temporary life; but if you aren't punished in the next life, that's true success, you avoided the longer lasting, more agonizing punishment.

 

[Ismail99]

The salafi specializes in a concept called (النقل قبل العقل) meaning there is no place for critical thinking when it comes to disecting backward ideas in islam in modern societies. They either declare you a kaffir on the spot or they resort to ad-hominem tactics, or utilize both tactics at the same time. It is really sad.

If we use our minds then everybody can come up with their own ideas. What if I like raping boys? Should I do it because my mind tells me it's ok

 

[Muzaffer]

Depends on what do you consider sharia law? remember Islam through historical context went through many versions of sharia law. That is the issue I have with salafs they disregard history completely. For example, the Islamic golden age which is parroted constantly online was headed majorly by the Mu'tazilites yet any salaf would mention that they are heretics and kafirs yet they still believe in the oneness of God. Salafism is just blind to the history of Islam that has had many versions of Sharia law. It's always my way or the highway with them.

the problem with Mu'tazilite is that they always favor the mind over what is writen

 

[Sheikh Google]

Ask yourself this instead: am I a believer in what Allaah revealed? or in what the children of adam, who are inherently flawed, more inclined to corruption, etc, created?

then ask yourself this: what is the purpose, for laws and punishment? to deter criminals, right? not to encourage them by being too lenient, right? if a rapist knows he'd be stoned for rape, or executed, do you think that would deter him more than say, a few years or a decade behind bars?
Also, do not forget that, Allaah may forgive you when you stand before him on Yawmul Qiyamah, so yes, you may be punished in this temporary life; but if you aren't punished in the next life, that's true success, you avoided the longer lasting, more agonizing punishment.

Again like a true salaf you never answered my questions. My way or the high way. Throughout the history of Islam, the words of Allah have been poured over and that's how you get the many different interpretations from classical tafsirs to ibn taymiyaah etc... Are they wrong? is ibn Kathir, al-jalalayn etc all wrong?

 

[Sheikh Google]

If we use our minds then everybody can come up with their own ideas. What if I like raping boys? Should I do it because my mind tells me it's ok

If you need the deen to tell you to not rape someone then boy I can't even tell you anything else.

 

[Abba Sadacha]

Again like a true salaf you never answered my questions. My way or the high way. Throughout the history of Islam, the words of Allah have been poured over and that's how you get the many different interpretations from classical tafsirs to ibn taymiyaah etc... Are they wrong? is ibn Kathir, al-jalalayn etc all wrong?

I am asking you, questions too. Can you answer me? What is the purpose of having laws, penalties, consequences for those who commit lewd/evil acts? To deter people from even considering doing them, no?