DNA Or 4 Wittnesses?

Discussion in 'General' started by AussieHustler, May 13, 2019.

?
  1. Yes, DNA should be used because it is reliable

    26 vote(s)
    81.3%
  2. Only 4 wittnesses.

    1 vote(s)
    3.1%
  3. DNA should only be used if 4 wittnesses aren't available.

    5 vote(s)
    15.6%
  1. AussieHustler

    AussieHustler Incels need help not derision Staff Member Moderator

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    Somalia has joined the civilised world in convicting rapists by using DNA evidence for the first time. Is this haram because there must be four eyewitnesses to the rape taking place under Shariah? Or, is this a misconception and impossible to present 4 witnesses because who watches a rape taking place and not intervene? The DNA has proven to be accurate in forensic investigation in rape cases, is it the right course of action? Have your say.


    In first for Somalia, DNA used to convict rapists .

    The Bureau of Forensic Science said in a statement that Somalia had "joined, for the first time, the rest of the world in utilising science to solve a heinous criminal case".


    [​IMG]

    MOGADISHU (AFP) - Somalia has for the first time used DNA evidence to obtain a criminal conviction, sentencing three men to death on Sunday for the gang-rape and murder of a 12-year-old girl, the Bureau of Forensic Science said.

    The country got its first-ever forensic laboratory in 2017 in the semiautonomous state of Puntland, seeking to tackle widespread sexual violence in a country where two decades of conflict and turmoil have put justice out of reach for most.

    The bureau said in a statement that Somalia had "joined, for the first time, the rest of the world in utilising science to solve a heinous criminal case".

    In February, the kidnapping of 12-year-old Aisha Ilyas Adan - who was gang-raped and tortured to death, her body dumped outside her parents home - sparked outrage and protests in the region.

    Human Rights Watch has described rape as "normal" in Somalia, with police often failing to take cases seriously.

    The Puntland state government enacted a Sexual Offences Act in 2016, which criminalised sexual offences and imposed tough penalties.

    The central government in Mogadishu is still working on adopting Somalia's first-ever national rape laws, with a new Sexual Offences Act adopted by ministers in May 2018. It still needs approval by parliament.



    About 10 suspects were arrested in connection with Adan's rape and murder.

    State prosecutors said 37 DNA samples were taken from the suspects and stored in the lab, which cannot at present analyse such material.

    The samples were sent to neighbouring Kenya for processing, which linked three of the suspects to the crime.

    High court judge Abdinur Jama Hussein on Sunday sentenced the three "to the death penalty for kidnapping, raping, and murdering Aisha Ilyas."

    In Somalia, the death penalty is carried out by firing squad.

    https://www.hiiraan.com/news4/2019/May/163777/in_first_for_somalia_dna_used_to_convict_rapists.aspx
     
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  2. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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    It does not matter either way as these guys will be protected by their clan elders
     
  3. IstarZ

    IstarZ Be a mountain or lean on one

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    I thought 4 witnesses is for zina? Rape is a criminal act which is completely different.
     
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  4. CaliTedesse

    CaliTedesse صومال ابن كوش

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    Very true ukhti
     
  5. AussieHustler

    AussieHustler Incels need help not derision Staff Member Moderator

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    @IstarZ

    Not in Salafi countries.

    What is the difference between the ruling on rape and the ruling on fornication or adultery? Can rape be proven by modern methods?

    Question

    What is the ruling on rape? What is the punishment of the rapist? The problem is that the woman is always seen as the guilty party. The accusation made by non-Muslims is that the man’s word is always given precedence and there is no way for the woman to prove that she was raped, and hence the man gets away with his action. How can we prove that the man or woman is guilty, and if she was raped or committed fornication willingly? Is there any role for technology in this matter? How can we prove the crime so that the man will not get away with his action and avoid punishment?.

    Answer

    Praise be to Allaah.

    Rape is essentially zina (fornication or adultery) and is proven in the same way as zina is proven, which is with four witnesses. The punishment is one hundred lashes if the man was a virgin and stoning if he was previously married.

    If rape is committed using the threat of a weapon or if the woman is abducted forcefully from her home, then it becomes a case of haraabah (banditry or terrorising the people), which is proven with two witnesses only. The punishment for it is mentioned in the verse in which Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

    https://islamqa.info/en/answers/158...adultery-can-rape-be-proven-by-modern-methods
     
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  6. Mercury

    Mercury Staff Member Moderator

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    If the court listens to the request of the elders whats the point of having laws in place if people wont get punished for their crimes
     
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  7. Mercury

    Mercury Staff Member Moderator

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    Since these clan elders have 0 honor and 0 sense of justice to anybody other than their tribe id suggest them to be jailed for trying to defend a rapists actions
     
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  8. IstarZ

    IstarZ Be a mountain or lean on one

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    I don’t follow that. From what I know rape isn’t classified the same as zina. Rape is an act of terror so no witnesses are needed. The testimony of the victim is enough when there is no physical evidence available. Afaik historically the testimony of the victim resulted in capital punishment being enacted on perpetrators.
     
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  9. R.Kelly

    R.Kelly We'll know who's sane or insane in the future Patient Zero VIP

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    Kulahaa “DNA is not permissible in Islam to convict someone to death “ :chrisfreshhah::chrisfreshhah::chrisfreshhah: These are the people we given respect throughout the decades. Complete savages and ignorants


     
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  10. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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    Only if it came true than i would be so happy but not likely as the law their is not respected
     
  11. AussieHustler

    AussieHustler Incels need help not derision Staff Member Moderator

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    @IstarZ

    You’ve a point that it’s impossible to find four witnesses to a rape case and therefore rapists get away with it and in many cases, the victim is charged with zina/fornication. Having said that, modern science has showed that DNA is very reliable in solving cases for sexual assaults.
     
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  12. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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    Yes as i used to hear that the victim was forced to marry her abuser ironically to save her sharaf as they say smh
     
  13. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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    What have i been saying that they should just execute those guys in a public place and get it over with it
     
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  14. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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  15. Jaydaan

    Jaydaan

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    It comes down to the victims clan end of the day. Im sure my cousins can get away with rape in puntland. One already has and the other one got away with murder. Somalis only understand power
     
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  16. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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    If their ms yes they can
     
  17. Lum

    Lum

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    ?
     
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  18. 911

    911

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    Is this thread a dig at islamic law?
     
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  19. Mehmet

    Mehmet

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    It depends on what the poster's religion is
     
  20. AussieHustler

    AussieHustler Incels need help not derision Staff Member Moderator

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    @911

    It’s a dig at the emancipation of somalia’s civil criminal law. Rape became a big issue among the different governments in Somalia who all passed stringent sentencing laws against sexual assault cases, but without the DNA testing/evidence, these laws became ineffective and useless. Can modern forensic investigations tools like DNA assist the administration of justice? That’s exactly what they think and developed the DNA testing. Other developed Muslim countries like Malaysia use such methods.

    If you’ve objections to it, please let’s hear them.
     
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