Do Muslims Accept Evolution?

[DR OSMAN]

I haven't kept up with Islam position on evolution if they have accepted it or continue to deny, what action they take will have a drastic effect on people belief in Islam.

Evolution is sealed by the fossil record, the changes observed over time in species, but u guys would argue where is the missing link. Well with DNA sequencing that seals it further. If Muslims use DNA and believe in it, how can you reject it when it's sequenced against the animal kingdom? absolute hypocritical and many muslims will turn away from Islam if they deny evolution.

I am 80% settled personally on evolution theory, the fossil records plus dna is strong for me. I do believe it will grow and evolve and possibly other dimensions found in the future tho, just like their found the 5th force recently in atomic sciences.

I know the catholic church has, their wise kkkkkkk

 

[DR OSMAN]

I always knew evolution was true becuz of these main reason.

1. The anatomy similarity of all animals like eyes, noses, teeth, skeleton. U can place all their skeletons on the table and u can't deny a common origin


2. I believe strongly in common origins becuz there is 1 universe or 1 earth, we must all merge somewhere not be independent of each other. I also realized how we go from semen, egg literally bacterias and then become babies and even evolve untill we die.

3. Fossil record and DNA sequencing of humans and animals, showing relations

 

[DR OSMAN]

What a Wise salaheen of biology he was, it had a dramatic effect on my philosophical outlooks. The only area science needs to observe and test which is before birth and after death topics, which is impossible cause it's outside the physical world of time-space kkkkkk, cuz religions are notorious for using the 'god gap' fallacy of putting god everywhere science has no answer for or ignorance remains. It's a big fallacy.

 

[Emir of Zayla]

You should search this up to see what scholars think, most people here are layman

 

[DR OSMAN]

You should search this up to see what scholars think, most people here are layman

Islam today is like the protestants of christianity, every clown is an expert and every clown has different truth, where is the single authority of Islam like the catholic church did for 2000 years, that's ragganimo and having one place or institution that puts forward the position of Islam. I am tired arguing with every clown who has his own individual 'truth'

 

[DR OSMAN]

You should search this up to see what scholars think, most people here are layman

U could literally place all animals anatomy and begin catagorizing them into how many similarities they have and create branches. Like Land animals wud be one branch. Sea Animals another branch, and keep working ur way down on just the similarities.

Now DNA even re-inforcees it even further, what's funny muslims believe in DNA, how will they then deny it when animals are sequenced and catagorized into DNA families like you can do for anatomies.

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Zayla In Islam no-one has perfect faith in Allah. How strong is your belief, judge it by other things u believe like the 'sun existence'. I judge my belief according to 'change' I hold that as a fundamental truth universally and when I die that will be my strongest belief without any doubts. Why I hold it to be 100% true?

I witnessed my own evolution and know I change week to week and assume upon death that will be true also. But then I scale all the rest of my beliefs and none measure up to that. They have different strength of confidence like evolution, federalism, but it's not 100% conviction like I am about change but more like 80% becuz I know it can 'change' also as change is my fundamental belief.

The bad thing about 'change' even upon death u know what u hold to be true will continue to change after ur long dead, so U accept u only had 'part truth based on your ability and time' not a universal truth. For example ppl who died within the last 20 years, died thinking their is only 4 forces in the atom kkkk they really died believing that, but it's not a universal truth, as in our time we know their is 5 forces found. Also this is going to happen to you when u die as ppl look back at your beliefs and say you 'u were stuck in ur time and knowledge' lol.

 

[HiraanBorn]

I always knew evolution was true becuz of these main reason.

1. The anatomy similarity of all animals like eyes, noses, teeth, skeleton. U can place all their skeletons on the table and u can't deny a common origin


2. I believe strongly in common origins becuz there is 1 universe or 1 earth, we must all merge somewhere not be independent of each other. I also realized how we go from semen, egg literally bacterias and then become babies and even evolve until we die.

3. Fossil record and DNA sequencing of humans and animals, showing relations

I believe that some scholars are willing to accept aspects of micro-evolution meaning changes within animal species but are very much reserved when it comes to macro-evolution meaning when one species transitions into another newer species.

Especially when the macro-evolution tries to delve into the origins of man through descent from a primate common ancestor.

I for my part find the theory of evolution through natural selection absolutely fascinating and have read books on it by Richard Dawkins and I've read a little of Darwin's 'On the Origin of Species' as well.

 

[DR OSMAN]

I believe that some scholars are willing to accept aspects of micro-evolution meaning changes within animal species but are very much reserved when it comes to macro-evolution meaning when one species transitions into another newer species.

Especially when the macro-evolution tries to delve into the origins of man through descent from a primate common ancestor.

I for my part find the theory of evolution through natural selection absolutely fascinating and have read books on it by Richard Dawkins and I've read a little of Darwin's 'On the Origin of Species' as well.

So Muslims still reject evolution across species only within species. Why would evolution work at micro level and stop there baffles me. No-one in biology is saying we are the same species becuz we r not, we can't breed together, but argue we do share common origins and split off from each other, that can explain why our anatomy and features is so similar when put on the table.

The explanation of evolution fits dna/fossil records far better then saying we are independent of each other, if we are independent of each other why so much similarities and how do we be independent of each other when we share one environment the earth? that explanation is far more difficult to swallow of Islam position, the fossils/dna wud have to be all dismissed to suit your religious belief and science doesn't work that way.

Science just looks at the evidence in this case anatomy, fossils, dna and provides the most rational explanation that fits the data. It's like a police officer at a crime scene, their collecting pieces of evidence and creating the narrative that must of happened for the crime scene to be how it is.

 

[DR OSMAN]

@HiraanBorn What is your position on naturalism philosophy that guides science narratives where everything is examined and concluded at a 1 dimensional aspect 'natural' and everything discovered is attributed as an accident, anamoly, random, chaos, etc yet at the same time study nature by establishing order, logic, maths, laws, procedures kkkkkk.

Im not 100% sold on that naturalism approach as I think it's far to simple to explain the complexity we observe, and their is hidden dimensions we cannot tap into due to our limitations in knowledge or equipments. They just found out giraffee have a language and communicate but the sound wave is so low it cannot be detected by humans and requires special equipment.

I believe their so much hidden dimensions to be found or never to be found as long as knowledge remains 'open' and a living document, each generation will add or correct something towards it and to be quite honest I don't think it will end and is 'eternal', it's like a book that is just open with no 'closure' part kkkk comparable to the universe scale. If u smart u will know you do 'end' and you are 'limited' and whatever u hold to be true is 'one footnote' of this book of life.

 

[HiraanBorn]

So Muslims still reject evolution across species only within species. Why would evolution work at micro level and stop there baffles me. No-one in biology is saying we are the same species becuz we r not, we can't breed together, but argue we do share common origins and split off from each other, that can explain why our anatomy and features is so similar when put on the table.

The explanation of evolution fits dna/fossil records far better then saying we are independent of each other, if we are independent of each other why so much similarities and how do we be independent of each other when we share one environment the earth? that explanation is far more difficult to swallow of Islam position, the fossils/dna wud have to be all dismissed to suit your religious belief and science doesn't work that way.

Science just looks at the evidence in this case anatomy, fossils, dna and provides the most rational explanation that fits the data. It's like a police officer at a crime scene, their collecting pieces of evidence and creating the narrative that must of happened for the crime scene to be how it is.

Sorry was eating but yeah that's religion for you. If the scientific evidence clearly contradicts the core doctrine of the separate creation of man then it will be rejected by most Muslims.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Sorry was eating but yeah that's religion for you. If the scientific evidence clearly contradicts the core doctrine of the separate creation of man then it will be rejected by most Muslims.

So u do acknowledge there is a level of hypocrisy by muslims in 1 hand they use DNA technology at the same time reject it's finding across species. That's going to hurt Islam credibility, Islam interpretation should evolve as science does, not close itself off and deny it or reject it. It shows dishonesty, the ppl of the 7th century were living according to their time, knowledge, interpretation of the world, they are not to blame, just like we r not to blame for living according to our time when our descendants 2000 years in the future look back at us.

 

[HiraanBorn]

@HiraanBorn What is your position on naturalism philosophy that guides science narratives where everything is examined and concluded at a 1 dimensional aspect 'natural' and everything discovered is attributed as an accident, anamoly, random, chaos, etc yet at the same time study nature by establishing order, logic, maths, laws, procedures kkkkkk.

Im not 100% sold on that naturalism approach as I think it's far to simple to explain the complexity we observe, and their is hidden dimensions we cannot tap into due to our limitations in knowledge or equipments. They just found out giraffee have a language and communicate but the sound wave is so low it cannot be detected by humans and requires special equipment.

I believe their so much hidden dimensions to be found or never to be found as long as knowledge remains 'open' and a living document, each generation will add or correct something towards it and to be quite honest I don't think it will end and is 'eternal', it's like a book that is just open with no 'closure' part kkkk comparable to the universe scale. If u smart u will know you do 'end' and you are 'limited' and whatever u hold to be true is 'one footnote' of this book of life.

Yeah, but that's what scientific empiricism is based upon. What you can observe and experiment with within the realm of the natural world and anything outside that is suspect and open to conjecture. In a way, you can't blame humans too much for only relying on what they can experience with their 5 senses because it's the only method we have of 100% verifying things in the world around us.

One thing I admire about science is that it is always open to a new view or new evidence whenever it arises. It lacks that fundamental dogmatic approach that is prevalent in pretty much all faith-based systems. It is flexible and allows you to be curious about things (which is a very human trait).

I still however admire and respect Islam because to me it is still the most rational and inclined to logic faith by far among all the others.

 

[HiraanBorn]

So u do acknowledge there is a level of hypocrisy by muslims in 1 hand they use DNA technology at the same time reject it's finding across species. That's going to hurt Islam credibility, Islam interpretation should evolve as science does, not close itself off and deny it or reject it. It shows dishonesty, the ppl of the 7th century were living according to their time, knowledge, interpretation of the world, they are not to blame, just like we r not to blame for living according to our time when our descendants 2000 years in the future look back at us.

It's like one scientist said you leave behind religion and personal beliefs once you enter the lab but once you're out of the lab you go back to your beliefs.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Yeah, but that's what scientific empiricism is based upon. What you can observe and experiment with within the realm of the natural world and anything outside that is suspect and open to conjecture. In a way, you can't blame humans too much for only relying on what they can experience with their 5 senses because it's the only method we have of 100% verifying things in the world around us.

One thing I admire about science is that it is always open to a new view or new evidence whenever it arises. It lacks that fundamental dogmatic approach that is prevalent in pretty much all faith-based systems. It is flexible and allows you to be curious about things (which is a very human trait).

I still however admire and respect Islam because to me it is still the most rational and inclined to logic faith by far among all the others.

Empricism is fine I am not saying it is wrong, But I prefer the equation to include other techniques not just 1 technique. Empirically my 5 senses nor any technology or equipment can make me experience reality like a dog who can be trained to sniff out drugs,explosives, etc in luggages or a shark can sense a drop of blood in an ocean full of water or a lion can see something u cant in the dead of night. Do we dismiss everything cuz humans can't experience it or apply human reality to the world.

U see why I feel empiricism isn't fully capturing reality? reality is experienced differently within humans let alone animals. Im big supporter of einstein relativity on time, it's all different our experience with some things objective like the cosmo laws we all under. I see things we share and things we do not across humans and even animals in our experience of the universe.

 

[HiraanBorn]

Empricism is fine I am not saying it is wrong, But I prefer the equation to include other techniques not just 1 technique. Empirically my 5 senses nor any technology or equipment can make me experience reality like a dog who can be trained to sniff out drugs,explosives, etc in luggages or a shark can sense a drop of blood in an ocean full of water or a lion can see something u cant in the dead of night. Do we dismiss everything cuz humans can't experience it or apply human reality to the world.

U see why I feel empiricism isn't fully capturing reality? reality is experienced differently within humans let alone animals. Im big supporter of einstein relativity on time, it's all different our experience with some things objective like the cosmo laws we all under. I see things we share and things we do not across humans and even animals in our experience of the universe.

Yes, everything other thing and person I suppose experiences reality in their own way but does that mean reality should be understood in multiple ways? Reality might not be experienced the same though all species but it remains as one reality nonetheless. Each religion sees its own worldview as the correct one and dismisses all others because that's what adds weight to it.

A dog's life is not the same as a human's life but both need to sleep, eat, relieve of waste material, and mate. The experience is different but the needs are identical. The raw reality of existence is the same.

 

[Khaemwaset]

Islam today is like the protestants of christianity, every clown is an expert and every clown has different truth, where is the single authority of Islam like the catholic church did for 2000 years, that's ragganimo and having one place or institution that puts forward the position of Islam. I am tired arguing with every clown who has his own individual 'truth'

Islam doesn't have a single authority like the catholics or the Jews. We recite the Quran and if we have a problem we go to experts.

Why do you think having a central, human, authority dictating the belief of the religion is good?
You realise how many things in the bible the catholic church deemed to no longer be a sin? They distort the religion to benefit them, Judaism was corrupted by rabbis who hijacked the religion.
Did you know interest was a sin in both Catholicism and Islam but the catholic church deemed it no longer a sin? You know how stupid that is?

 

[DR OSMAN]

Islam doesn't have a single authority like the catholics or the Jews. We recite the Quran and if we have a problem we go to experts.

Why do you think having a central, human, authority dictating the belief of the religion is good?
You realise how many things in the bible the catholic church deemed to no longer be a sin? They distort the religion to benefit them, Judaism was corrupted by rabbis who hijacked the religion.
Did you know interest was a sin in both Catholicism and Islam but the catholic church deemed it no longer a sin? You know how stupid that is?

They are far smarter then Islam. Interest is a sin only if u can't avoid it, even Islam says if hunger is near anything is lawful even pork, that means their is conditions to all haram things. U will die of hunger and live on charity if u don't do interest like we see in Somalia today. Every Islamic country takes interest loan even Saudis. Only Somalis are the idiots.

They are very smart catholics u can't compare them to Islam. 2000 years they store centralized wealth, they have their own fkn vault of wealth, too big for any private bank to hold. Jews don't get me started on their wealth profile.

Not having a central authority means any idiot can have his own Islam, it's the reason I rejected protestant christianity, ur taking a gamble with million interpretations and everyone having different truths. I love ragganimada of jews n catholics doesn't mean I believe in their religion, but there is something honorable about Qof MEEL IS-STAGO.

 

[Khaemwaset]

They are far smarter then Islam. Interest is a sin only if u can't avoid it, even Islam says if hunger is near anything is lawful even pork, that means their is conditions to all haram things. U will die of hunger and live on charity if u don't do interest like we see in Somalia today. Every Islamic country takes interest loan even Saudis. Only Somalis are the idiots.

They are very smart catholics u can't compare them to Islam. 2000 years they store centralized wealth, they have their own fkn vault of wealth, too big for any private bank to hold. Jews don't get me started on their wealth profile.

How are they far smarter??
Interest is a sin because it's predatory. But buisnesses are inheritly predatory so they got the church to permit it so they can freely continue their sinful ways without having to use the Jews as a middle man.

Catholic Church Bank is just wealth for the Vatican. Catholics literally pay tax to the church and that's the money they store for themselves.
Muslims also pay a yearly tax but it isn't to some organisation it's a donation to the poor.
Whats so good about having rich bastards in the Vatican horde wealth??

Jews are rich because they also used predatory ways and made sure they extract as much as possible which is why they got exiled from over a hundred countries in their history.

You as a lost idiotic atheist don't care however. You love these centralised authorities that say all these things you love are no longer sin. Makes sense, the thing materialist atheists love most is having no restrictions, do whatever they want no matter if it harms the greater society as a whole. Stupid people.

I recommend you read on why northern Europe left Catholicism for a de centralised religion like Islam. The predatory nature of the church is more of a buisness with a monopoly than a religious organisation. The most evil acts are tied to them. The Vatican was even involved with the facists during WW2 where even Hitler stored his wealth there.

 

[DR OSMAN]

How are they far smarter??
Interest is a sin because it's predatory. But buisnesses are inheritly predatory so they got the church to permit it so they can freely continue their sinful ways without having to use the Jews as a middle man.

Catholic Church Bank is just wealth for the Vatican. Catholics literally pay tax to the church and that's the money they store for themselves.
Muslims also pay a yearly tax but it isn't to some organisation it's a donation to the poor.
Whats so good about having rich bastards in the Vatican horde wealth??

Jews are rich because they also used predatory ways and made sure they extract as much as possible which is why they got exiled from over a hundred countries in their history.

You as a lost idiotic atheist don't care however. You love these centralised authorities that say all these things you love are no longer sin. Makes sense, the thing materialist atheists love most is having no restrictions, do whatever they want no matter if it harms the greater society as a whole. Stupid people.

If the enemy has switched tactics, u going to sit there and die and not update yourself? what sort of war principle is that? u shud master interest weliba and beat them at it, not believe in it.