What We Must Understand

[Basra]

I rather have Western values than primitive African or Somali or whatever ethnic sh!t there exist. Western values are made of liberalism, tolerance, leave others in peace. Incidentally, that should be the value of a Muslim. Islam instructs us to leave others in peace.


Of course Colonialism does not equal Western ism. Just to make it clear.


Colonialism was wrong, up to a certain point. Although harsh to the ethnic savages, it did clean them up. Ok not cleaning them up but civilized them up. Do u all want to return to brushing with cadeey and wearing guuntino days?

 

[madaxweyne]

No, I haven't. Nor will I ever will. I am Muslim, first and foremost. My Somali culture is just that--a culture. Islam is eternal. What nonsense are you talking about? Being Muslim is 100% an identity. I'm Somali, but if there are any aspects of my culture that directly conflict with my diin, then I absolutely will not partake or endorse it. Toxic tribalism is a Somali thing that was condemned by the Prophet Muhammad (SAW) a number of times. Despite it being a Somali thing, I don't support it.

why do you enforce arab cultral and social norms on somalis,
we all know what you are spreading here is culture arab culture and trying to eliminate somali culture language and customs and for what for islam??

how does somalinimo effect the religion of islam??? cause i realy wanna know

last time i checked Muslim just means someone who worships allah
a student means someone who is learning

in what way does you're ethnic identity get in the way of believing in Allah

 

[Inquisitive_]

The liberal person who has fully embraced the colonial decadent western lifestyle in my book is better then the hypocrite fake 'woke' communities with their superficial BS.

That superficial bs is more destructive as it gives the false appearance that the precolonial culture was nothing more then some empty vain charade bereft of any purpose or meaning to the masses.

Those imbeciles have reduced everything to a few stupid dances and garments people wear.

 

[AIOPZ]

I rather have Western values than primitive African or Somali or whatever ethnic sh!t there exist. Western values are made of liberalism, tolerance, leave others in peace.


Of course Colonialism does not equal Westernism. Just to make it clear.


Colonialism was wrong, up to a certain point. Although harsh to the ethnic savages, it did clean them up. Ok not cleaning them up but civilized them up. Do u all want to return to brushing with cadeey and wearing guuntino days?

Where is that one meme with the Somali hooyo's hands on her head in shock? That really expresses what I'm feeling right now after having read this.

"[I'd] rather have Western values than primitive African or Somali or whatever ethnic sh!t [that] exist."

Primitive? Are you saying Somali values before Western imperalism were primitive? Are you suggesting that had not the kuffars come and taken over our lands we would've been African savages? Self-hatred at its finest.

"Western values are made of liberalism, tolerance, [and] [sic] peace."

Is tolerance exclusive to European Christians? Leaving others in peace That's why 1/4 of the world was colonized by Britian alone. America still invades the Middle East on an annual basis. For people who preach peace and tolerance they sure do a fine job of showing it.

"Of course Colonialism does not equal Westernism. Just to make it clear."

How do you think you were even exposed to Western values?? Your ancestors just decided to embrace Western ideals because it was so beautiful and amazing, is that it?

"Colonialism was wrong, up to a certain point."

Fixed it for you.

"Although harsh to the ethnic savages, it did clean them up. Ok not [cleaned] them up but civilized them up. Do [you] all want to return to brushing with cadeey and wearing guuntino days?"

It cleaned them up quite nicely by depraving them of their orginial culture and values to the point where they start speaking like this, apparently. Abaayo, it's literally gaal propaganda that colonialism benefited the indigenous people in any way. They brought railways, fine, but they also brought diseases and slaughtered many of the natives. The Dervish did not get airstrikes by the British in order for you to be cooning like this.

 

[Basra]

Where is that one meme with the Somali hooyo's hands on her head in shock? That really expresses what I'm feeling right now after having read this.

"[I'd] rather have Western values than primitive African or Somali or whatever ethnic sh!t [that] exist."

Primitive? Are you saying Somali values before Western imperalism were primitive? Are you suggesting that had not the kuffars come and taken over our lands we would've been African savages? Self-hatred at its finest.

"Western values are made of liberalism, tolerance, leave others in peace."

Is tolerance exclusive to European Christians? Leaving others in peace That's why 1/4 of the world was colonized by Britian alone. America still invades the Middle East on an annual basis. For people who preach peace and tolerance they sure do a fine job of showing it.

"Of course Colonialism does not equal Westernism. Just to make it clear."

How do you think you were even exposed to Western values?? Your ancestors just decided to embrace Western ideals because it was so beautiful and amazing, is that it?

"Colonialism was wrong, up to a certain point."

Fixed it for you.

"Although harsh to the ethnic savages, it did clean them up. Ok not cleaning them up but civilized them up. Do [you] all want to return to brushing with cadeey and wearing guuntino days?"

It cleaned them up quite nicely by depraving them of their orginial culture and values to the point where they start speaking like this, apparently. Abaayo, it's literally gaal propaganda that colonialism benefited the indigenous people in any way. They brought railways, fine, but they also brought diseases and slaughtered many of the natives. The Dervish did not get airstrikes by the British in order for you to be cooning like this.

Just to let u know i was bothered or discombobulated as to rate you a 'heart' or a 'laughter' i went with my brain instead of heart.


We agree to disagree then.

If you value the somali culture like u do, one should refrain from contaminating your ideal valuing!


I do unappologetically hold tho--that Western culturism is the way to go in lieu of proper Islam example. And by Islam example i mean, the one dating to Sahaba Omar ibn Khataab Idealism of Islamism!

 

[AIOPZ]

why do you enforce arab cultral and social norms on somalis

Since when was encouraging practice of the diin considered enforcing Carab norms?

we all know what you are spreading here is culture arab culture and trying to eliminate somali culture language and customs and for what for islam??

My thread is literally about preserving Somali traditions, look again saaxiib. My only problem is if said Somali custom does not line up with Islamic teachings, then I can't support said Somali custom. If it makes you feel better, the Carabs have this thing called the "Hand of Fatima" which is apparently suppose to protect from the evil eye and which is very widespread in the Carab world but the practice is blatant shirk as they are praying to something besides Allah (SWT). I think that's gross and I don't condone it.

 

[AIOPZ]

I do unappologetically hold tho--that Western culturism is the way to go in lieu of proper Islam example. And by Islam example i mean, the one dating to Sahaba Omar ibn Khataab Idealism of Islamism!

> Western culture is the way to go
> Omar ibn Khattab (RA) and reigniting the Caliphate also

 

[Basra]

> Western culture is the way to go
> Omar ibn Khattab (RA) and reigniting the Caliphate also

 

[AIOPZ]

 

[Kratos]

This post is a bit of a reach. Out of all the core cultural values listed, only religion and family dynamics can be said to be undermined by Western culture. Taboos are not always a good thing to have either. Many of them have a religious basis but some are ridiculous, like how it was considered taboo for a girl to not be circumcised.

As for governance, laws and conflict resolution, Western systems are immeasurably superior to traditional Somali governance; this is not even comparable.

 

[Tukraq]

I feel like America and Europe have different value systems, so why use a catch all term like western values

 

[AIOPZ]

I feel like America and Europe have different value systems, so why use a catch all term like western values

Do they not share similar Western values like secularism, liberty, freedom, democracy, etc. that are so hyped up?

 

[Tukraq]

Do they not share similar Western values like secularism, liberty, freedom, democracy, etc. that are so hyped up?

Not necessarily, we don’t really believe in secularism but separation of church and state but however giving religion a lot of power and freedom unlike Europe, also you guys don’t have a real freedom of speech or right to carry arms

 

[AIOPZ]

Not necessarily, we don’t really believe in secularism but separation of church and state but however giving religion a lot of power and freedom unlike Europe, also you guys don’t have a real freedom of speech or right to carry arms

Ok, so there you go. Separation of religion and political affairs goes against the inherently religious Somali culture. We're a "secular" country but we have homosexuality punished with the death penalty and Christmas is banned.

 

[Tukraq]

Ok, so there you go. Separation of religion and political affairs goes against the inherently religious Somali culture. We're a "secular" country but we have homosexuality punished with the death penalty and Christmas is banned.

Religion is still part of American politics so we’re not really secular

 

[AIOPZ]

Religion is still part of American politics so we’re not really secular

Yes, but separation of Church and state is still widely adhered to. Same-sex marriages are legal in the U.S, proving that it's not a religious country. Only 63% of Americans are certain that God exists.

 

[Tukraq]

Yes, but separation of Church and state is still widely adhered to. Same-sex marriages are legal in the U.S, proving that it's not a religious country.

Not in all states, mainly due to religion

 

[AIOPZ]

Not in all states, mainly due to religion

Not denying this, but not entirely sure what we're arguing about here. I get that Europe is militantly secular and insane but Western values are still overall pretty secular.

 

[Cognitivedissonance]

Islam is the remedy to all the hearts ills how could you buy someone who beleieves in the last day of judgement? To be a somali is to be a muslim somalinimo is islamimo thats why somalis refer to none somalis as gaal likewise they call a somali who is not a muslim a gaal obviously you cant be somali and a none muslim.

 

[Tukraq]

Not denying this, but not entirely sure what we're arguing about here. I get that Europe is militantly secular and insane but Western values are still overall pretty secular.

America is pretty much vastly different from Europe, and secularism is one of these areas