What was Ahmed Yusufs Geledi Really?

[010101]

The biggest accomplishments of the geledi would be
1:Their establishment in the heart of Ajuuran territory
2:Their seemingly complex governing system in which they would incorporate many people in fairness under there tax system (probably adopted from ajuuran)
3:Repelling and keeping away of a far wealthier and prominent Hiraab Imamate
4:Their repelling of some families of Darood tribes such Absame/Sade/Harti for a number of decades
5:The sacking of Baardheere

They also had people who lived as far as waajir before being chased out by gaalo madow until the juba river. My question is why were they so inactive in campaigning against gaalo madow like Ogaden led darood and Degoodi led hawiye and further more how do you make sense of the fable of them fighting zanzibar for lamu when at the time when that was meant to happen gaalo madow had control of nfd and jubaland? Is it possible the Zanzibar campaign was a teamup with the previous aggressor gaalo madow?

@Factz @Balaayo

 

[Misil]

No idea pal. Gaalo madow stuff isn't my forte.

 

[Grant]

The biggest accomplishments of the geledi would be
1:Their establishment in the heart of Ajuuran territory
2:Their seemingly complex governing system in which they would incorporate many people in fairness under there tax system (probably adopted from ajuuran)
3:Repelling and keeping away of a far wealthier and prominent Hiraab Imamate
4:Their repelling of some families of Darood tribes such Absame/Sade/Harti for a number of decades
5:The sacking of Baardheere

They also had people who lived as far as waajir before being chased out by gaalo madow until the juba river. My question is why were they so inactive in campaigning against gaalo madow like Ogaden led darood and Degoodi led hawiye and further more how do you make sense of the fable of them fighting zanzibar for lamu when at the time when that was meant to happen gaalo madow had control of nfd and jubaland? Is it possible the Zanzibar campaign was a teamup with the previous aggressor gaalo madow?

@Factz @Balaayo

Get copies of Lee Casannelli and Virginia Luling. The Wikipedia articles have been grossly falsified.

The Hiraab killed the Muzzaffar governor of Mogadishu about 1590 and the last Ajuraan Imaam in 1668. The Ajuraan were gone as a power by 1700. The Silis took over in the Afgoye area, continueing many Ajuraan practices and collecting taxes from the resident clans, but were defeated by an alliance of the Geledi and Wacdaan. Geledi control under Ibrahiim begins about 1750.
Yusuf takes credit for the sack of Bardheere, but it was really a joint effort of all the city states and most of the southern clans except the Biimaal, whose ports and lands the Geledi coveted. The Bardheere jamaca had cut off the ivory trade and was attempting to monopolize all of the trade that normally flowed down the Shabelle to all the traders at the coast.
The Gallo Madow wars were fought by the Ajuraan, not the Geledi.
The Lamu and Zanzibar campaigns are made-up fables that never happened. The Geledi fought the Biimal twice in all-out wars, losing both times. The Geledi never got a port or ships and Geledi power was done when the Biimaal killed Sultan Ahmad Yusuf in 1878. His son, Osman, barely controlled the clan lands and died shortly after the Italians took over.
The Darood fought for the Bardheere Jamaca and were defeated and expelled by the coalition, not by the Geledi alone.

 

[010101]

Get copies of Lee Casannelli and Virginia Luling. The Wikipedia articles have been grossly falsified.

The Hiraab killed the Muzzaffar governor of Mogadishu about 1590 and the last Ajuraan Imaam in 1668. The Ajuraan were gone as a power by 1700. The Silis took over in the Afgoye area, continueing many Ajuraan practices and collecting taxes from the resident clans, but were defeated by an alliance of the Geledi and Wacdaan. Geledi control under Ibrahiim begins about 1750.
Yusuf takes credit for the sack of Bardheere, but it was really a joint effort of all the city states and most of the southern clans except the Biimaal, whose ports and lands the Geledi coveted. The Bardheere jamaca had cut off the ivory trade and was attempting to monopolize all of the trade that normally flowed down the Shabelle to all the traders at the coast.
The Gallo Madow wars were fought by the Ajuraan, not the Geledi.
The Lamu and Zanzibar campaigns are made-up fables that never happened. The Geledi fought the Biimal twice in all-out wars, losing both times. The Geledi never got a port or ships and Geledi power was done when the Biimaal killed Sultan Ahmad Yusuf in 1878. His son, Osman, barely controlled the clan lands and died shortly after the Italians took over.
The Darood fought for the Bardheere Jamaca and were defeated and expelled by the coalition, not by the Geledi alone.

Ive seen some of your posts before I don’t think its possible to say the Geledi were landlocked when they had Baraawe (Tunni city not biimaal) also what is the primary evidence to support this “Muzzafarr Dynasty” it seems its a fable in and of itself from what i could make of it.

 

[Grant]

Ive seen some of your posts before I don’t think its possible to say the Geledi were landlocked when they had Baraawe (Tunni city not biimaal) also what is the primary evidence to support this “Muzzafarr Dynasty” it seems its a fable in and of itself from what i could make of it.

The Geledi collected tribute from Baraawe for a few years after Bardheere, but don't get the idea the Digil fit neatly under the Geledi, because they didn't. The closest Geledi holding was at Buulo Mereer, on the other side of the Shabelle. Oman controlled the trade and shipping at Baraawe.
After Yusuf's death at the hands of the Biimaal, the Geledi established a suldaan at each of the three corners of their holdings: Afgoye, Buulo Mareer and Buur Heybe.

Get yourself an actual source.

 

[010101]

The Geledi collected tribute from Baraawe for a few years after Bardheere, but don't get the idea the Digil fit neatly under the Geledi, because they didn't. The closest Geledi holding was at Buulo Mereer, on the other side of the Shabelle. Oman controlled the trade and shipping at Baraawe.
After Yusuf's death at the hands of the Biimaal, the Geledi established a suldaan at each of the three corners of their holdings: Afgoye, Buulo Mareer and Buur Heybe.

Get yourself an actual source.

If im not wrong Geledi is a descendant of Digil so if there was any fighting it would be classed as “infighting”. Im not trying to hold to any claim tbh but what is your primary evidence that oman had reached that far up the somali coast. keep in mind that them even reaching kismaayo(currently gaalo madow) at this point is itself a reach.

 

[Misil]

The Geledi collected tribute from Baraawe for a few years after Bardheere, but don't get the idea the Digil fit neatly under the Geledi, because they didn't. The closest Geledi holding was at Buulo Mereer, on the other side of the Shabelle. Oman controlled the trade and shipping at Baraawe.
After Yusuf's death at the hands of the Biimaal, the Geledi established a suldaan at each of the three corners of their holdings: Afgoye, Buulo Mareer and Buur Heybe.

Get yourself an actual source.

Buur Eyle/Heybe or Buur Hakaba? I'm sure you mean the latter because the other one's a very small village.

 

[Grant]

Buur Eyle/Heybe or Buur Hakaba? I'm sure you mean the latter because the other one's a very small village.

Buur Heybe. The Geledi were in alliance with the Eelay.

 

[Misil]

Buur Heybe. The Geledi were in alliance with the Eelay.

Buur Hakaba is the capital of Eelay territory, not Buur Heybe which is an Eyle village.

 

[Grant]

If im not wrong Geledi is a descendant of Digil so if there was any fighting it would be classed as “infighting”. Im not trying to hold to any claim tbh but what is your primary evidence that oman had reached that far up the somali coast. keep in mind that them even reaching kismaayo(currently gaalo madow) at this point is itself a reach.

The Omanis took the whole coast from the Portuguese in 1698, splitting into 2 houses, with one on Zanzibar, about 1840. At the time of the burning of Baraawe prior to the Bardheere Jihad, Baraawe had appealed to Barghash of Zanzibar for protection and aid, and not Yusuf of Geledi. In the second half of the 19th century Zanzibar maintained a garrison as well as a customs house at Baraawe. The Zanzibari house under Barghash built the Garessa in Mog, to collect the customs duties and curtail the power of the Shingaanni Abgal in 1872. Don't forget, the Omanis sold the whole shebang to the Italians by the turn of the 20th century..

Kismayo was a tiny Bajunni fishing village on an off-shore island where the port now is until the Harti got there in the 1840s. Barghash established a small garrison and trading post there in the 1870s.

 

[Grant]

Buur Hakaba is the capital of Eelay territory, not Buur Heybe which is an Eyle village.

See Virginia Luling, p. 27. The Sultans of Buur Heybe were Abiikar, Maxamed and Gurey.

 

[Grant]

Ive seen some of your posts before I don’t think its possible to say the Geledi were landlocked when they had Baraawe (Tunni city not biimaal) also what is the primary evidence to support this “Muzzafarr Dynasty” it seems its a fable in and of itself from what i could make of it.

The Muzzaffars have always been something of a mystery to me too, but I found these articles of interest:

https://www.jstor.org/stable/42662497?read-now=1&refreqid=excelsior:fd4f808a89a96f97f663a2b68fc803ec&seq=22#page_scan_tab_contents
Coins of Mogadishu, many of which turn out to be Muzzafar. Some history with it.

https://www.persee.fr/doc/remmm_0997-1327_1993_num_67_1_1584

History of the Unity of the Rasulid State under al-Malik al-Muzaffar

 

[010101]

Why in this world did this thread get moved?

The Muzzaffars have always been something of a mystery to me too, but I found these articles of interest:

https://www.jstor.org/stable/42662497?read-now=1&refreqid=excelsior:fd4f808a89a96f97f663a2b68fc803ec&seq=22#page_scan_tab_contents
Coins of Mogadishu, many of which turn out to be Muzzafar. Some history with it.

https://www.persee.fr/doc/remmm_0997-1327_1993_num_67_1_1584

History of the Unity of the Rasulid State under al-Malik al-Muzaffar

hmm ill read the second one but coins aren’t exactly evidence of an entire dynasty usually the first assumption would be trade if i’m not wrong i will give it a look though.