I assume you mean the supposed "landers" who are paid to "represent SL" in Somalia? If so, I'd agree with you, they are parasites and you should expel them all.
USC failed miserably, but what about SNM?
- Thread starter somalipatriot
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Woke1.4rm.Shibis
VIP
I assume you mean the supposed "landers" who are paid to "represent SL" in Somalia? If so, I'd agree with you, they are parasites and you should expel them all.
Dont get me wrong I dont have anything against landers and other Somalis living in Ethiopia or kenya but is ridiculous we have to give them seats .there are many hawiye subclans , raxanweyne subclans 0.5 who have no representation even tho they pay more taxes to the government and put in more work then cisse , reer sool&sanaag and landers.
When ppl like khadar guleed & the fish minister awad are done with FGS they would most likely go back to somaliland and laugh at the koonforians miseries
somalipatriot
Unfortunately, therefore lack of any wisdom
Are you based in Somalia?
I'm with you. Expunge those parasites. They do not in any way or shape represent SL, they are just filling their pockets.
TekNiKo
Loyal To The One True Caliph (Hafidahullah)
True gaalka dil gartiisna si, Caydiid did a wonderful job against foreigners like UN and America. He would be a better President than all of these failed presidents. I respect power not AMISOM babysitting. This applies to Farmaajo to albeit he is trying to build our military
@reer tell @somalipatriot you are Marehan. You're Somali Net username is nine
as @Dharbaaxo Jin said the guys you call parasites dont represent JSL. I support giving those seats to anti Afweyne clans of SomaaliaItaliana
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The Italian estimates were that Haawiye make up about 40% of SomaliaItaliana. Thats reason why I keep telling Haawiye hater like the @Future and @reer that the disenfranchisement of Benaadir can backfire into an unconstitutional arrangement that always makes Haawiye leader the most powerful leader in SFG. The Rooble/NuurCadde scenario. Or worse: 1991 scenario where USC overthrow Afweyne/FGS not necessarily the senseless tribal wars which were incited by Afweyne
Blame that on biidhiqaate CaliMahdi and is close cousin biidhiqaate CaliGeeddi. They agreed to make Haawiye the most heavily taxed clan who have the least control over their terrritories. The SFG will eventually turn into Haawiye government if that situation continues. When Haawiye gets PM the PM position becomes powerful. Unless the PM is a biidhiqaate like CaliGeeddi. When Haawiye gets presidency, the you get the XSM scenario of rotating MX/MG prime ministers
Ciise in JSL are under JSL flag. Isaaq live in Sanaag and West SoolSanaag and almost all Sool/Sanaag are under JSL flag. You are even betrayed by the words you use to describe JSL territories
JSL democracy should be fully restored in Badhan and JSL should work harder done to counter activities hindering the functioning of JSL democracy in Badhan
Woke1.4rm.Shibis
VIP
Cool story . I still view you as a somali speaking ethiopian . Search yourself how many times you've mentioned ali Mahdi aun or usc .is nasiib daro for an Ethiopian citizen to criticize banadir heroes, we view you as every ethnicities in ethiopia . I advise you to worry about taking your piece of land in Ethiopia and joining your brothers in somaliland , there is nothing for your parasites in banadir , we see the qaldaani ethiopians lower then beesha shanaad .
I'm saying this as someone who is pro Somaliweyn and against separatism. SNM is the only winner in the somali civil war, they reached their goal which was overthrowing Siad Barre and getting de facto independence. Today Somaliland has many issues and does many stuff i disagree with but at the end of the day they reached their goal and managed to be relatively peaceful and stable. USC on the other hand is the biggest looser of the civil war, they had the entire country in their hands and destroyed everything by looting and killing each other even among their own group. The USC had potential to become a TPLF style ruler in Somalia but instead they literally destroyed themselves.
Their goal was to rule the country because they claimed to be better than Siad, when they conquered Xamar they destroyed everything and turned out to be worse than anything Siad Barre ever did. The USC lost and didn't achieve their goal.
SNM only fought to liberate the SomaliRepublic from Afweyne. After achieving that goal, CaliMahdi violated the USC/SNM/SPM transitional government plan. He did so to appease Afweyne. Then SNM chose to sign JSL seperation agreement with the pro Afweyne clans
USC military wing was only trying to liberate the SomaliRepublic. The reached that objective and Caydiid/SNM/SPM had a plan for transitional government but CaliMahdi ruined that plan because biidhiqaate CaliMahdi was trying appease Afweyne. The chaos in SomaliaItaliana had 3 main causes.
First Afweyne had been losing Muqdisho streets to nonclannist street gangs for the last few years of his regime
Afweyne caused southernJabartis to be antagonistic towards USC. Unfortunately, many Jabartis listened to Afweyne instead of OG mujaahid CumaJees. CumarJees warned southernJabartis about working against the USC but the liberation war turned into a Jabarti/Irir clan war in SomaliaItaliana. Jabartis were quicly overpowered as southernIrir are much bigger than southernJabartis.
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CaliMahdi betraying Caydiid and Xawaadle siding with CaliMahdi created inter Irir chaos
I think you're view here is incredibly blighted by the fact that you are Mx. Only an Mx could downplay what Afweyne as you did. However, that conversation has been had a million times and it would be useless to have an Isaaq and a Marexaan have that debate.
The question my post attempted to answer was: what was the USC formed?
Provide one iota of evidence for your ridiculous claim that their goal was to rule from the beginning.
So is it true then that SNM didn't actually want to separate ? I've been told by some people that Egal never closed the door on reunification and was just waiting for the south to get more stable. Do you confirm this?
It is true that the original mission of the SNM never included wanting to seperate/re-declare Somaliland independence. They did however support it when the SNM Guurti and other clan elders suggested that independence once and for all from the chaos in Somalia was the right course.
The Cigaal AUN thing is total speculation and based on nothing but hearsay. Somaliland is where it is today based on the transformational contribution Cigaal made to the Independence cause.
If their goal wasn't to rule the country it even makes things worse for your case.
I'll try to be unbiased as possible. USC said they wanted to get rid of Siad cause he was a dictator, ok fine understandable. Then they started fighting against each other and targeting Darood civilians, they couldn't agree amongst themselves and turned the whole country into a failed stare. What I'm I supposed to think about such a group? Even if I leave my clan out of the conversation how can any sane person believe the USC was beneficial to Somalia?
If their goal was just to overthrow Siad with no other plan for the future it means they were stupid, which is probably worse than just failing to rule the country.
As a former prime minister of Somalia I think Egal still had some pro Somaliweyn sentiments even though he supported separation. That's my uniformed opinion though
What you are failing to see is that it wasn't simply because Afweyne was a dictator that they and the SNM wanted to bring him down. He'd been a dictator for 20 odd years at that point, and no real significant movement had arisen to take him down just because he was a dictator. It was that he was homicidal despot that was massacring various groups through the country, including their own Hawiye, that gave rise to the USC and the SNM. They're primary mission was to stop him from killing their people. Mission accomplished.
I never said that the USC was beneficial to Somalia. Only that they did what they set out to do from the beginning: to stop Afweyne from massacring their people. I don't condone what they did after they accomplished that.
No one can know what was in his heart apart from Allah SWT. I can only look at his actions and the words he spoke publicly. Don't think for one second that he would be held up in the great regard he is in Somaliland today, if he were a traitor to the Independence cause.
Look at Cabdiraxmaan Tuur for example, the first President of JSL. He is respected for his SNM leadership, but his legacy in Somaliland is significantly blighted by the fact he betrayed the Independence cause when he lost to Cigaal in '93, even though he apologized for it on his deathbed.
It was the rebels who started attacking the government starting from the late 70s. Siad became paranoid because he didn't trust anyone so he targeted anyone who was suspected of being against him, he believed the opposition would destroy the country and he was right. From 1969 untill the early 80s Siad never did anything against any specific clan. condemn the attacks on civilians though let be very clear on this.
Anyway the USC in their public interviews talked about the future of all somalis not just Hawiye, that's how they presented themselves. Even if we say they wanted to protect Hawiye it doesn't make sense for them to destroy a Hawiye majority city and kill each other between different Hawiye subclans.
As I said if I have to be honest and unbiased SNM reached it's goal and was a much better organization than USC because they did their own interests in a logical and rational way even though I disagree with separatism.
Well you said the original mission of SNM was not separation so technically many of your own heroes started out as a political liberation movement for all Somalia. Anyway I found this interview (disclaimer: I'm not making any statements or claim , I'm genuinely curious to know if this is true or not)
In an interview with IRIN the same year, SNM leader Abdirahman Awale also said of Egal that "when he says he is for independence, it is for local consumption only. He tells the people here one thing, but in his speeches elsewhere he has clearly declared that Somalia will unite one day. He says we will talk to the southerners when they make their home clean and negotiate with them... He says one thing to the public, and a different thing to the international community."
Somalia: IRIN interview with Somali National Movement (SNM) - Somalia
News and Press Release in English on Somalia; published on 18 May 2001 by TNH
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