The EU Has Better Chance Then Somalia

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
The E.U is the classic example people point to strong states and weak central authority(brussels). I mean what are the duties of Brussels beyond 'euro currency' which doesn't effect all member states of the E.U. They also provide no borders for the free movement of it's member states trade or people. Their people can settle in any E.U country and become an automatic resident, enjoy the same privileges of locals in terms of health-care, work rights, and social services. I think this is far more realistic for Somalia.

We always argue can a southerner move to PL, well under a confederation, not only can he move to PL, he can work there, enjoy public services like any puntite, he can work, and they're will be no restriction of business or people movement on our roads, seas, or air. Isn't this all Somalis want at the end of the day, to feel at home in any region and enjoy certain rights? well the E.U confederation option will achieve this for us. Support it.

They're is calls for it now after realizing Federalism has failed to get anywhere. We spent 2004-2019 which is 15 years in a vicious dead-lock with Mogadishu government about duties and responsibilities, lack of judicial courts working, constant disagreements and political instability. This is harming our social cohesion as Somalis, why? We consider each other enemies. So an E.U model may actually make us love one and another when we have our own separate govt that is independent, separate army, separate police, separate courts, separate layers of government and parliament, separate foreign relationship.

Yes BOO WOOOO, Puntland or Hirshabelle or any member state will be able to sign they're own 'bilateral' deals on all aspects be it military, business, education, oils and minerals, etc. Yes this means you will see PL/JL/HS/GM/SWS meeting with world leaders about they're state matters on all aspects. They're will be no duty delegated to Mogadishu, by removing any duties from Mogadishu this will ensure we cease to conflict and everyone does they're own thing.

We can even make this arrangement be it '20 year' confederation pact between Somali states to get they're houses in order without any interference or debates from other regions. Once each house is in order and at the same level, we can slowly move towards 'federalism' by enpowering Mogadishu with duties and responsibilities, but this time, every state will be enpowered and have something, they're will be no more centralist lovers, everyone will be federalist lover. Your federalist lover mainly because your state has done something and you have something and you don't want to lose it to the 'central authority'. So for federalism to succeed we need to ensure the REGIONS first become stakeholders and they're regions are empowered, secure, governance, law and order, and yearly progress is occurring. As long the regions are not progressing, wallahi it will be hard for them to defend federalism since the locals feel they got nothing from it but been worse of.

Come in all centralists, federalist, and EU model supporters of Somalia. Lets have this frank discussion, or the other option is 15 more years of futile in-fighting between regional states and Mogadishu. Over what? OUR DAMN RELATIONSHIP, nothing else.
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Libaaxseendheer @nomand we already are quasi semi-independent not fully confederation though. Why you may ask?

Well PL GOVT handles the following.

1. My own taxation revenue
2. My own Infrastructure roads, air, sea-port
3. My own Government, parliament, courts, prisons, schools, hospitals
4. My own Military and Border matters
5. My own Coast-guard and Intelligence Services
6. I do my own service delivery across my own region based on 5 year development plans
7. I set my own regional laws through my parliament on all aspects in my society
8. I am currently implementing devolved local governments for each district. 60% are well established and functioning.
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What does PL govt lack to make it a completely Independent state? you will be suprised all.

1. Foreign bi-lateral meetings with world government and multinational companies regarding trade and investment. I already hold bi-lateral deals with Dubai and the CIA directly through PSF/PMPF, so my security bi-lateral relationship is very independent.
2. Foreign PL Embassies but we do have some consular services
3. Currency. We do have our PL regional bank and we do print Somali shillings sometimes but it's not 'official' it's all behind the scenes. We do not have a currency regulator role whatsoever nor does Somalia. This role hasn't been filled by either the REGIONS OR THE FEDS. This is why I say to PL jump on this and do your own currency.
4. Immigration matters. We don't control nothing about this, it seems like it's shared role with PL/SFG both providing they're regional and federal input. Our immigration is a very GREY area.

So outside of Immigration/Currency which are delegated Federal responsibilities, right now PL does both but not in a full capacity or in legalized manner. We are like 2-3 duties away from being a fully fledged state.

If we secure Foreign 'duties' for PL, the rest are minuscule wallahi, Somalia shouldn't represent me in the world stage nor receive any donor funds under my region untill such time there is REAL SOMALIA, this isn't a REAL Somalia, this is just DIASPORA losers who couldn't make it in the west that come to Somalia for work nothing more nothing less. PIM @PuntiteQueen I AM FEELING THE BURNNNNNNNNNNN
 
PIM JIM and create a Dblock confederacy. Puntland & jubbaland merge as one nation. Have one president, one army and most importantly declare independence so we can represent ourselves in the world, rather than tuugta Muqdisho gobbling all aid money. The sooner the better.
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@SirLancelLord @Lordilord @DRACO and all the anti Puntites from SL are right, we have no right to criticize them for being officially separated when PL is only 2 duties away from being an independent state which is foreign relations and currency printing.

We literally have our own PL bank and we do currency printing but it's 'behind the scenes' so you could say these roles are not even fully SFG at all. I never see them Hamar niggas bring me my daily and weekly currency into PL bank to distribute to PL private banks and begin the lending function to the civilians.

We even have our own Immigration ministries and Laws that enact our rules at the airport, port, and roads on foreign nationals. PL is a fake federalist state, it's SEMI-Independent. The only real duty we are missing is 'foreign relations' which is completely delegated to Mogadishu who attends all functions in our name.
 
The E.U is the classic example people point to strong states and weak central authority(brussels). I mean what are the duties of Brussels beyond 'euro currency' which doesn't effect all member states of the E.U. They also provide no borders for the free movement of it's member states trade or people. Their people can settle in any E.U country and become an automatic resident, enjoy the same privileges of locals in terms of health-care, work rights, and social services. I think this is far more realistic for Somalia.

We always argue can a southerner move to PL, well under a confederation, not only can he move to PL, he can work there, enjoy public services like any puntite, he can work, and they're will be no restriction of business or people movement on our roads, seas, or air. Isn't this all Somalis want at the end of the day, to feel at home in any region and enjoy certain rights? well the E.U confederation option will achieve this for us. Support it.

They're is calls for it now after realizing Federalism has failed to get anywhere. We spent 2004-2019 which is 15 years in a vicious dead-lock with Mogadishu government about duties and responsibilities, lack of judicial courts working, constant disagreements and political instability. This is harming our social cohesion as Somalis, why? We consider each other enemies. So an E.U model may actually make us love one and another when we have our own separate govt that is independent, separate army, separate police, separate courts, separate layers of government and parliament, separate foreign relationship.

Yes BOO WOOOO, Puntland or Hirshabelle or any member state will be able to sign they're own 'bilateral' deals on all aspects be it military, business, education, oils and minerals, etc. Yes this means you will see PL/JL/HS/GM/SWS meeting with world leaders about they're state matters on all aspects. They're will be no duty delegated to Mogadishu, by removing any duties from Mogadishu this will ensure we cease to conflict and everyone does they're own thing.

We can even make this arrangement be it '20 year' confederation pact between Somali states to get they're houses in order without any interference or debates from other regions. Once each house is in order and at the same level, we can slowly move towards 'federalism' by enpowering Mogadishu with duties and responsibilities, but this time, every state will be enpowered and have something, they're will be no more centralist lovers, everyone will be federalist lover. Your federalist lover mainly because your state has done something and you have something and you don't want to lose it to the 'central authority'. So for federalism to succeed we need to ensure the REGIONS first become stakeholders and they're regions are empowered, secure, governance, law and order, and yearly progress is occurring. As long the regions are not progressing, wallahi it will be hard for them to defend federalism since the locals feel they got nothing from it but been worse of.

Come in all centralists, federalist, and EU model supporters of Somalia. Lets have this frank discussion, or the other option is 15 more years of futile in-fighting between regional states and Mogadishu. Over what? OUR DAMN RELATIONSHIP, nothing else.

Wow someone actually thinking for once.
The fight for the kursi so that your qabiil can lord it over others has blinded everyone, and almost destroyed what somali nationalism survives.

Siad Barre taking over was a fluke, he had a state structure to take over, but that is gone.
The resources of the whole state were sused to settle a clan feud in the North, first in Majerteeniya,
then in Somaliland.

While in Somaliland we said take your state and shove it up your behind,
the other clans had a different understanding over the implications.
They understood that it is imperitive that their clan gets the kursi so that they can make sure nobody does to them what was done in the north, dont forget controlling access to foriegn aid could mean life or death, and ofcourse pride.


You then have Ethiopia and kenya and god knows how many others , even little gay ass Norway is heavily interfering in xamar politics its a god damn mess.

Reuniting the Somali people is gonna be one hell of a challenge, but everything that is worthwhile is usually difficult and even painfull.

This is comming from me a self confessed isaaq qabiilist and Somaliland nationalist.
 
here a wierd idea,

Why not convert the office of president and prime minister to a an executive council 9 to 12 members
representing he federal states.
Every federal state will be practically independent like Puntland.

The executive council can deal with foriegn affairs, finance/central bank and foriegn aid
and defence.

This is not that hard to implement but the defence part is the hardest.

Without unity of command the army is useless, completely useless.

you can defeat an enemy that is larger than you, better equipped and one that has more experience
quite easily if they have no unity of command.

there is a mountain of historical evidence 9/10 cases times this is the case.
 
A federal Somalia as part of a Somaliweyn confederation is a better solution. Just like Belgium is internally governed via federalism yet this country is part of a larger confederation called the Benelux Union (along with Netherlands and Luxembourg).

Somaliweyn could be theoretically recognised globally as one single country yet in practice functions as a confederation and is composed of three independent regions (Somalia, Somaliland and West Somalia/DDSI)
 

Abdalla

Medical specialist in diagnosing Majeerteentitis
Prof.Dr.Eng.
VIP
Whatever comes from Brussels supersedes national laws. EU is super powerful
 
Whatever comes from Brussels supersedes national laws. EU is super powerful

But funnily enough the EU isn't a single country but a collection of 27 separate countries. I think this puts our country to shame since we have an FG that exerts virtually zero power over more than 1/2 of the Somali Republic
 

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