Somali Yibir performed Brain surgery during the late 1800s

[Shimbiris]

From the book "The Warrior Mullah" by Ray Beachey. The lad he had operated on was none other than the Sayyid Mohamed Abdullah Hassan:

It is truly sad how Horners in general treat our crafts people like the Madhiban and Yibir. They were a skilled folk.

 

[anon2]

They are extremely smart, from making weapons, to medicine etc, never understood why they are discriminated against since they look no different than other Somalis, some of them even own livestock and camels in nugaal, bari etc

Wallahi Somali people are strange

 

[Keep it a boqol]

They are extremely smart, from making weapons, to medicine etc, never understood why they are discriminated against since they look no different than other Somalis, some of them even own livestock and camels in nugaal, bari etc

Wallahi Somali people are strange

Weren’t they know to be yahuud , practice magic and have a secret language ?

 

[El Nino]

In other societies, craftsmen were respected class and with industrialisation became the class that took power. Somalia/somaliweyn needs to empower our craftsmen and change how we look upon their jobs. Thankfully many somalis from more ”powerful” clans have started doing xamaali, my abti has done it for 50 years MashAllah, he is a plumber in Xamar.

 

[Shimbiris]

Weren’t they know to be yahuud , practice magic and have a secret language ?

The yahud thing seems like nonsense and the magic thing isn't magic. They were soothsayers and also used to bless amulets Somalis wore around their necks with quranic verses in them (parchments). This was a common practice all the way to Sudan. Somalis felt superstitous toward them as a result and felt they had special powers. As for their secret language; some ajanabi, a Brit I think, heard it like a century ago and said it was merely a dialect of Somali.

 

[Shimbiris]

In other societies, craftsmen were respected class and with industrialisation became the class that took power. Somalia/somaliweyn needs to empower our craftsmen and change how we look upon their jobs.

They are extremely smart, from making weapons, to medicine etc, never understood why they are discriminated against since they look no different than other Somalis, some of them even own livestock and camels in nugaal, bari etc

Wallahi Somali people are strange

This is actually a common practice among Peninsula Arabs, various Berbers and even some Indians and many nomadic African groups:

https://www.somalispot.com/threads/khedive-egyptian-control-of-the-somali-coast.138715/#post-3434055

Arabs, like us, had Madhiban type qabiilo no one intermarried with or ate with and whom they shunned for being blacksmiths, masons, carpenters and so on. These crafts were left to them or Jews and sometimes ajanabis from the fertile crescent as well. Why do our groups do this? It's honestly complex and I'd have to do a whole thread on it and I lack the time nowadays.

 

[Shimbiris]

Also, I looked it up and the first brain surgery in Europe was in 1904:

The start and development of epilepsy surgery in Europe: a historical review

Epilepsy has not always been considered a brain disease, but was believed to be a demonic possession in the past. Therefore, trepanation was done not only for medical but also for religious or spiritual reasons, originating in the Neolithic period (3000 ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And the first one in general in the west was in 1879:

first brain surgery in the west - Google Search

www.google.com

The Sayyid was born around 1856 so this event couldn't have been any later than around the 1860s.

 

[anon2]

Weren’t they know to be yahuud , practice magic and have a secret language ?

If this was true, it's probably for a very very very long time ago as they have assimilated now and are no different the other somalis in terms looks, culture etc maybe I'm wrong but it's an observation

This is actually a common practice among Peninsula Arabs, various Berbers and even some Indians and many nomadic African groups:

https://www.somalispot.com/threads/khedive-egyptian-control-of-the-somali-coast.138715/#post-3434055

Arabs, like us, had Madhiban type qabiilo no one intermarried with or ate with and whom they shunned for being blacksmiths, masons, carpenters and so on. These crafts were left to them or Jews and sometimes ajanabis from the fertile crescent as well. Why do our groups do this? It's honestly complex and I'd have to do a whole thread on it and I lack the time nowadays.

Yeah it seems very complex, I know these groups sometimes carry J haplogroup (but it's a very ancient variation maybe sabean) but are probably largely ev32 like other Somalis.

 

[Luffy]

the only thing What I know about these guys is that they took two sheep from every male born Because they say we killed their grandfather and people thought that if you don't give them, they will charm you They have lied to us for centuries

 

[Idilinaa]

From the book "The Warrior Mullah" by Ray Beachey. The lad he had operated on was none other than the Sayyid Mohamed Abdullah Hassan:

It is truly sad how Horners in general treat our crafts people like the Madhiban and Yibir. They were a skilled folk.

They are extremely smart, from making weapons, to medicine etc, never understood why they are discriminated against since they look no different than other Somalis, some of them even own livestock and camels in nugaal, bari etc

Wallahi Somali people are strange

Yibir are not looked down upon or discriminated because of their crafts specialization.

Yibir face prejudice for their pagan affiliations and magician status. As a consequent of it reduced to bondsmen role.

Whereas other clans were relegated into bondsmen role being that they were weaker lineages. So they would provide these services to more powerful clans in exchange for Patronship(Sponsorship) and protection.

In other societies, craftsmen were respected class and with industrialisation became the class that took power. Somalia/somaliweyn needs to empower our craftsmen and change how we look upon their jobs. Thankfully many somalis from more ”powerful” clans have started doing xamaali, my abti has done it for 50 years MashAllah, he is a plumber in Xamar.

Craftsmen were well respected in the historical Somali Urban towns were they organized into formal crafts guilds . There is a difference between Urban and Rural crafts men. As i have explained here: ARTISAN AND GUILD ORGANIZATIONS

Found some more information on Somali urban artisans and how they apparently organized themselves in guilds

From the; Peoples of the Horn of Africa (Somali, Afar and Saho): North Eastern

ARTISAN AND GUILD ORGANIZATIONS

These occur in the coastal towns of the south (there is no information for the north) and may well be the urban development of the institutions just described. A man wishing to apprentice his son to a carpenter, builder, or craftsman, takes him to the master with a gift (faddi). After a feast attended by apprentices at which roasted coffee is served, the lad joins the craftsman's family and remains under his authority. In return for lodging and keep, the apprentice works for his master's profit until, on reaching the status of craftsman, he desires to be independent. Then he purchases his freedom by a payment of money, a man's kercheif (garbasar) and a shield (gashan), returning his tools. Emancipation is celebrated ritually with feasting. It appears that often, by the time the apprentice is expert, his master has died, and we are not told what happens in this case.

There are similar guilds of weavers and silver-smiths, the second forming a kind of cast probably similar to the Tumaal..

@Shimbiris @xLibaxsenderx @Aurelian

Historically crafts specializations across the medieval world was centered in the Urban towns ,even in Europe. Before it gradually moved to countryside during the Modern period.

Yibir and the legitimate Madhibaan groups exist primarily among them rural Somalis and descend from various Noble clan lineages scattered in few and are primarily a by-product of subsistence economics and de-urbanized migrants. Meaning rurals lack economic cap space because of only producing food to scrape enough to survive on. So 90% of the pop have to be focused on cultivating and finding food.

Herbert Lewis explains this in his study on the origins of the artisan groups among Horners including Somalis:

The fact that these specialists are few in number might be taken as an indication that they are survivals of earlier peoples. However their distribution is so even among all Cushitic groups that another explanation must be sought. Possibly it may be found in the economics of craft specialization among these types of societies. Undoubtedly each community can afford only a few such workers

I think for Somalis the problem is the lack of expansion of Urban culture via food surplus away from subsistence and the increase of interregional-translocal trade distributing those resources and generating wealth in the process.

Historically the expansion of Urban industry & culture among Somalis was due to the effective increase and control of resources and management of trade by centralized governments.

Most of the development that could happen have also been curtailed by their drought prone environments.

 

[Idilinaa]

The yahud thing seems like nonsense and the magic thing isn't magic. They were soothsayers and also used to bless amulets Somalis wore around their necks with quranic verses in them (parchments). This was a common practice all the way to Sudan. Somalis felt superstitous toward them as a result and felt they had special powers. As for their secret language; some ajanabi, a Brit I think, heard it like a century ago and said it was merely a dialect of Somali.

The Yahuud/Jewish thing is 100% BS. If you look at an Archeologists exploration on Yibir in Somali traditions is that they are associated with Paganism and Witch craft , no mentions/association are given to Judaism or Jews.

the Yibir claim Mohammed Haniif (Bu'ur Ba'ayr) as their Islamic boqor, a king who ruled over a wide area. However, it is possible that it is Bu'ur Ba'ayr rather than Mohamed Haniif who is attributed with. .. The legend also suggests that Bu'ur Ba'ayr practiced witchcraft to heal any possible illnesses that the woman might have before she married her ..

In the region at the time there was Bu'ur Ba'ayr, the people here were 'awaan ['pagans'] aflagaadiin ah [of the wrong kind of thinking]. In this situation, Sheikh Isaaq and Sheikh Yusuf came. Sheikh Yusuf Kawnayn came to the place

And also this by another anthropologist:

Are you talking about Yibir? Jewish/Hebrew notions is is something made up by them albeit ''recently'' around the 1970s to dignify their own status. It is not something that other Somalis claimed or believe about them:

As a anthropologist studying them points this out:

According to Virginia Luling, the 'Hebrew' idea is not an anti-Semitic invention by others, but was and is maintained by the Yibr themselves, who have found in this a way of dignifying their outcast status

When in reality they are the most looked down upon out of all the Sab groups because of their Pagan affilitations , thats what Somali tradition of Bucur Bayr shows. Yibir were most likely priest group that were previously pillars of the old religous cult prior to Islam

Which is strenghten by another thing observed in Rendille who are closely related group who broke off from Tunni/Garre Somalis have a Yibir group among them:

Viriginia Luling goes on to explain:

“An important ritual grouping among the Rendille is the Ibire (sg. Ibir) - evidently the same word as the Somali Yibir. The Ibire are men from certain lineages who enjoy high religious statues – in fact the Rendille are divided into Ibire and Wakhkamure, who are the rest of the male population, in a way reminiscent of the traditional Somali distinction between Wadaado and Waranleh. The Ibire however are chiefly respected and feared for the power of their curse. Since their position is central in Rendille society, this is always exercised deviants, to maintain justice and the Social order. And yet these pillars of society share a name with the despised anti-social vagabonds among the Somali. But the Somali Yibir also have extraordinary powers attributed to them, and are feared for the power of the curse.”22


I would also argue that it's most likely the same for Beta Isreal among Habeshas from the evidence i've seen in both texts and culture. They were Pagan Agaw that end up linking themselves to Hebrew/Jewishness link to dignify their status with a more abrahamic faith.

 

[GhostOfSomalia]

Mashallah! Thank you for sharing this knowledge. I’ll share it with my Yibir cousins

 

[JaredAbdullahiKushner2000]

They are extremely smart, from making weapons, to medicine etc, never understood why they are discriminated against since they look no different than other Somalis, some of them even own livestock and camels in nugaal, bari etc

Wallahi Somali people are strange

We need a cultural reformation. The number 1 thing holding us back is ourbackward culture and tribalism. You rarely see Somalis using the word "Haram" or "Halal" its always the word "ceeb" and "its not part of our dhaqan." Somalis are not islamically literate. We put so much emohasis on memorizing the quran and actually ignoring the content of our faith. When I was in Somalia I met bunch of quran xaafidh kids. I asked this one who was 14 who had memorized and finished the quraan 2 times the meaning of Surah Asr. He replied he wasnt taught that. They learn nothing other than memorizing quran and they do not learn the meaning of dua's. I didnt even know about the concept of Tawheed a year ago and I am in the midst of Surah Nisa. And then you wonder why are our sisters and daughters reluctant to wear the Hijab, its because they havent learn why we should wear it. They always respond with waxaas waa ceeb or dhaqankeeyni ma'ahan. So indeed we need a cultural and religious reformation where we put more emphasis on the deen. And we put more emphasis in understanding our faith, reading, writing arabic and reading the books concerning aqeedah. So when a child grows up, they are litterate and educated when it comes to Islam, we won't have somalis selling drugs, women being promiscuous and immodest. Being educated and having the correct aqeedah and manhaj is rewarded. Anything that goes against our faith is rebuked. I guarantee Allah will make us strong and send down abundance of beneficial rain. We will not have corrupt leaders because they will not be able to strive in a Somali society unless they are those good people I just described.

 

[GhostOfSomalia]

We need a cultural reformation. The number 1 thing holding us back is ourbackward culture and tribalism. You rarely see Somalis using the word "Haram" or "Halal" its always the word "ceeb" and "its not part of our dhaqan." Somalis are not islamically literate. We put so much emohasis on memorizing the quran and actually ignoring the content of our faith. When I was in Somalia I met bunch of quran xaafidh kids. I asked this one who was 14 who had memorized and finished the quraan 2 times the meaning of Surah Asr. He replied he wasnt taught that. They learn nothing other than memorizing quran and they do not learn the meaning of dua's. I didnt even know about the concept of Tawheed a year ago and I am in the midst of Surah Nisa. And then you wonder why are our sisters and daughters reluctant to wear the Hijab, its because they havent learn why we should wear it. They always respond with waxaas waa ceeb or dhaqankeeyni ma'ahan. So indeed we need a cultural and religious reformation where we put more emphasis on the deen. And we put more emphasis in understanding our faith, reading, writing arabic and reading the books concerning aqeedah. So when a child grows up, they are litterate and educated when it comes to Islam, we won't have somalis selling drugs, women being promiscuous and immodest. Being educated and having the correct aqeedah and manhaj is rewarded. Anything that goes against our faith is rebuked. I guarantee Allah will make us strong and send down abundance of beneficial rain. We will not have corrupt leaders because they will not be able to strive in a Somali society unless they are those good people I just described.

Beautifully said. Somalia is a nations that preaches the deen but rarely abides by it

 

[Garaad diinle]

This further adds to what i always been thinking of. Somalia isn't rome, ancient egypt or Mesopotamia. Somalia is in some periods a semi-arid hot tropical peninsula with no access to permanent river which is good for supporting large agricultural society and also helps with transport of foods and goods with ships. The previesly mentioned civilization are also called river civilization. There is no thick vegetation such as trees and grass are often yellw and dri menaning low nutrition. There is a periodic drougt that occurse and in fact durning the oromo invation a severe drought was recorded.

Civilizations take and learns from each other the shami people who worked for ancient egyption put a twist on hieroglyphs and created an abjad. Ancenit greece learned from the shami and created alphabet and so on and so forth. Even the anicent egyptions were in heavy contact with mesopotamia before the predynastic era. There was no great civilization near somalia to learn from.

What i'm trying to say is somalia was not suited to be or wasn't able to emulate these great civilization and frankly they don't have to. What you just shared is more than enough for me and from the discription it appears that it's not an unprecedented operation rather that it probably happend couple of time before this. Such advancent medical practes with application of anesthesia and no mention of any infection in the mid 19th century is honestly beyond mind blowing.