Siad Barre Was A Close Call

[SOMALI GENERAL]

In our timeline, Siad Barre was a mild Arabist but he didn't seek to diminish the native Somali language & culture, but instead instituted the Arabic language as co-official with the Somali language & sought closer political ties with the Arab World. However, if Siad Barre had been more aggressive in implementing his Arabization program then it could well have succeeded, since many tribes have Arab Patriarch myths and believed they were Arabs (this is an era prior to advanced Genetics/DNA testing); as a result they would have no qualms with ditching Somali for the Arabic language if Siad Barre were to enforce it.

Although, certain tribes would have been more easier to Arabize than other. For example in this alternate timeline scenario, the Darod tribe would have been more likely to embrace the Arabic language due to their genealogy already being Arabized versus the Rahanweyn tribe who'd have likely resisted the Arabic language.

 

[Octavian]

why would darod become more arabized than rahanweyn

 

[Apollo]

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[SOMALI GENERAL]

why would darod become more arabized than rahanweyn

The Darod genealogy was already Arabized & folks already identified with being Arab. Therefore, switching to the Arabic language would have been more smooth for Darods, Dirs, Isaaqs etc.

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

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Most Somalis know how to read the Arabic script, but know zilch Arabic.

Very weird.

 

[Marquis]

I doubt it, Barre came into power in the 70s and Colonialists didn't see us as Arabs. The Somali identity was already seen as distinct from Arabs and it's own thing by that point to the world.

 

[Apollo]

Most Somalis know how to read the Arabic script, but know zilch Arabic.

Very weird.

The top 10% educated elite in Somalia know Arabic. 1 in 10 is quite a lot of people, could be even higher now with internet penetration.

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

I doubt it, Barre came into power in the 70s and Colonialists didn't see us as Arabs. The Somali identity was already seen as distinct from Arabs and it's own thing by that point to the world.

Darods in the past saw themselves as Arabs due to genealogy & many still do now. The "We Wuz Arabs" phenomenon is very old. The possibility of Siad Barre linguistically Arabizing the population could have been accomplished.

 

[Marquis]

Darods saw themselves as Arabs due to genealogy. The "We Wuz Arabs" phenomenon is old.

Doesn't matter, the Colonialists didn't see them as Arab nevertheless and they didn't speak Arabic as the mother tongue, clearly their larping wasn't convincing to them. Contrast that with Sudan where the British saw them as full blown Arab mestizos and the Colonial administration even wrote a book on the history of the Arabs in the Sudan

"H. A. MacMichael was a member of the Anglo-Egyptian Sudan government between 1905 and 1933. This two-volume work, first published in 1922, is the culmination of almost twenty years' ethnological research conducted while MacMichael was stationed in various parts of Sudan."

 

[Marquis]

The possibility of Siad Barre linguistically Arabizing the population could have been accomplished.

In the 70s? I doubt it. You need to have a Arabic speaking core already. Somali was always the widespread language. Turkification of Turkey worked because there was already a large Turkish speaking core, same with North Africa as there was already a large Arabic core. If Darood for example all spoke Arabic as their mother tongue, then I could possibly see it having a possibility of succeeding but no major clan speaks Arabic as their mother tongue, and Arabic has always been the language of the elite.

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

Doesn't matter, the Colonialists didn't see them as Arab nevertheless and they didn't speak Arabic as the mother tongue, clearly their larping wasn't convincing to them. Contrast that with Sudan where the British saw them as full blown Arab mestizos and the Colonial administration even wrote a book on the history of the Arabs in the Sudan

View attachment 140249

"H. A. MacMichael was a member of the Anglo-Egyptian Sudan government between 1905 and 1933. This two-volume work, first published in 1922, is the culmination of almost twenty years' ethnological research conducted while MacMichael was stationed in various parts of Sudan."

The point I'm trying to get across is the Darods still regarded themselves as Arabs despite the European colonialists saying otherwise.

Hence why Siad Barre who hailed from the Darod tribe could well have adopted a more aggressive Arabization program & would have likely had an easier time Arabizing tribes that already have Arab Patriarch myths. It would have taken a long time though.

 

[Marquis]

The point I'm trying to get across is the Darods still regarded themselves as Arabs despite the European colonialists saying otherwise.

Hence why Siad Barre who hailed from the Darod tribe could well have adopted a more aggressive Arabization program & would have likely had an easier time Arabizing tribes that already have Arab Patriarch myths.

Arabic was never widespread among the Arab lineage claiming clans such as Darood and Isaaq. Arabic was a language among the elite educated but never made inroads among the regular folks throughout it's history in Somali regions. Arabic was never the lingua franca historically as it was in North Africa, Sudan, Chad which is why it would have failed.

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

In the 70s? I doubt it. You need to have a Arabic speaking core already. Somali was always the widespread language. Turkification of Turkey worked because there was already a large Turkish speaking core, same with North Africa as there was already a large Arabic core. If Darood for example all spoke Arabic as their mother tongue, then I could possibly see it having a possibility of succeeding but no major clan speaks Arabic as their mother tongue, and Arabic has always been the language of the elite.

The Turkification of Anatolia was presided over by different Turkish Beyliks who encouraged the Anatolian population they ruled over to switch from Greek to Turkish.

 

[Marquis]

The Turkification of Anatolia was presided over by different Turkish Beyliks who encouraged the Anatolian population they ruled over to switch from Greek to Turkish.

Yes exactly and that was in the middle ages. I think a better premise for your thread would be if Adal never fell apart and continued to rule the Somali lands as they were very Arabized and a centralized state would have spread the Arabic language among the masses. A centralized state is the next best thing in implementing a language shift as Arabic would be the lingua franca among the different ethnic groups under Adal rule.

 

[Sloane Ranger]

Even decendants of ethnic Arabs in Somalia don't speak Arabic.

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

Yes exactly and that was in the middle ages. I think a better premise for your thread would be if Adal never fell apart and continued to rule the Somali lands as they were very Arabized and a centralized state would have spread the Arabic language among the masses. A centralized state is the next best thing in implementing a language shift as Arabic would be the lingua franca among the different ethnic groups under Adal rule.

True. If Adal had survived, there would likely have been a highly Arabized population due to the Arabic language being spread throughout the major urban centers in the Adal Realm. However, I'm unsure if the Rahanweyn & other tribes with no Arab genealogy would have succumbed to Arabization if Adal were to expand their realm to rule over most Muslim Horn Africans.

We could well have had a Morocco/Algeria-style situation today.

 

[The Somali Caesar]

I love the Somali language. Thank god we didn’t get Arabized

 

[SOMALI GENERAL]

I love the Somali language. Thank god we didn’t get Arabized

Don't you find it weird when you see banners/posters written in Arabic alongside Somali at functions/meetings in Somalia?

Plus, Arabic is given official status alongside French, whereas Somali is just a "recognised" language in Djibouti lol.

 

[The Somali Caesar]

Don't you find it weird when you see banners/posters written in Arabic alongside Somali at functions/meetings in Somalia?

There’s also English banners/posters writings in Somali meetings also. Somali is still the official language

 

[Mckenzie]

There were efforts to arabise Somalis as early as the 1950s. A breakaway branch of the SYL became extremely pro Nasser and argued for Arabic to be lingua franca but the European influence was too strong at the time. So strong infact they orchestrated the assassination of Kamaluddin the Egyptian special envoy of the UN in Xamar.

Afweyne may have joined the Arab League but he didn't speak Arabic and it's known he never liked them, none came to him with significant Aid in the 77 War except Iraq who sent shiploads of Timir

Sheikh Sharif is the only President who spoke fluent Arabic but he isn't a revolutionary so an Arabic speaking population shift is never happening.