Puntland investment conference LIVE

[Finesse]

So Toyota will open a branch in Garowe and train locals who will get certifications.
Just like they did in Mogadishu where they employ 15 locals.

 

[GBTarmy]

So Toyota will open a branch in Garowe and train locals who will get certifications.
Just like they did in Mogadishu where they employ 15 locals.

Yes

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Finesse do you want economic development? you need banks there is no two if's or but's about this common factor in all nations. Where there is no banks, people must rely on hand outs from diaspora relatives or charities or NGO. Why? they don't have money and there is no place that will loan them money, so this ensures 90% remain broke and live day to day waiting for dahabshiil to send them money.

Local/Foreign investors are ALREADY RICH, they already have capital, we shouldn't talk about them, since this is small class of 1-2% of each society in the world. Wa dadyow lacag haysto oo ka fekerayo meel kale ay lacagtooda geliyan si ay uu kordho. Becuz the worst thing a rich person can do is to keep his money sitting there becuz the market inflates and his money becomes less and less. So it's in his interest to place his money into different business ventures. But this won't end up povery, since like u said he will only hire 15 people.

What we need is 90% of the poor people loo sheego, if you got an idea which they usually do, we will facilitate you in the process of securing a loan and executing your idea. If 1000 poor people came to the bank each year which is plausible figure, each one hired 10 people. U just reduced poverty by 10k in PL in ONE YEAR sister. Imagine the next year another 1000 or 2000 come for loan, u just reduced poverty by another 20,000 workers who will work for these new small start ups in PL.

The benefit for the government is tremendous, they can now rely on tax stream from more workers and not just rely on small 1-2% rich business class who are these investors that are attending PIF.

 

[GBTarmy]

 

[SirLancelLord]

@Finesse do you want economic development? you need banks there is no two if's or but's about this common factor in all nations. Where there is no banks, people must rely on hand outs from diaspora relatives or charities or NGO. Why? they don't have money and there is no place that will loan them money, so this ensures 90% remain broke and live day to day waiting for dahabshiil to send them money.

Local/Foreign investors are ALREADY RICH, they already have capital, we shouldn't talk about them, since this is small class of 1-2% of each society in the world. Wa dadyow lacag haysto oo ka fekerayo meel kale ay lacagtooda geliyan si ay uu kordho. Becuz the worst thing a rich person can do is to keep his money sitting there becuz the market inflates and his money becomes less and less. So it's in his interest to place his money into different business ventures. But this won't end up povery, since like u said he will only hire 15 people.

What we need is 90% of the poor people loo sheego, if you got an idea which they usually do, we will facilitate you in the process of securing a loan and executing your idea. If 1000 poor people came to the bank each year which is plausible figure, each one hired 10 people. U just reduced poverty by 10k in PL in ONE YEAR sister. Imagine the next year another 1000 or 2000 come for loan, u just reduced poverty by another 20,000 workers who will work for these new small start ups in PL.

The benefit for the government is tremendous, they can now rely on tax stream from more workers and not just rely on small 1-2% rich business class who are these investors that are attending PIF.

Dahabshiil has been doing that "micro-financing " to help people start a business. Not sure if the bank has set up shop in PL yet.

As long as free trade is allowed between Somali States. It would you rather trade with outside then within, if we're all realiant on each other less likelihood for conflict which was one of the reasons for the EU.

Africa has this problem where they trade more with outside the continent them within

 

[DR OSMAN]

Dahabshiil has been doing that "micro-financing " to help people start a business. Not sure if the bank has set up shop in PL yet.

As long as free trade is allowed between Somali States. It would you rather trade with outside then within, if we're all realiant on each other less likelihood for conflict which was one of the reasons for the EU.

Africa has this problem where they trade more with outside the continent them within

How does dahabshil micro-financing work? where is the capital stored, who are the people who store the capital? how is the loan process done? it has to be money to money though, not this muharaba crap that @Farah072 is talking about, since it's not about 'assets' or fixed asset loans which is what he is confusing with 'business based loans'. He thinks business is an asset, it's not. A business trades goods n services, but in order to trade he needs money to purchase those goods n services, and on top of that he needs money to pay for the expenses he will encounter like rent money for a building, electricity bill, workers need salaries, transportation could be another cost.

The thing is they need to pay all this with 'money' so if you don't give him money loan, he cannot achieve this let alone reach the stage of making profitable by adding a nice 'margin' to cover his living costs like his own bills, foods, housing. People have this huge phobia about banks, it's due to ignorance and religion causing this. Banks and Businesses are not much different to people who go to work everyday, they are trying to survive and pay they're bills and they do this by 'trading' goods or delivering a service like hairdressing or massage parlour or foot bath even is a service. I am sick of all this cuqdad and jahiliyah surrounding money based loans.

As your aware @SirLancelLord it's about the supply chain, everyone sits on the supply chain somewhere and is grabbing a 'margin' of it from banks to business to workers all taking a margin for themselves in order to feed themselves and pay they're bills. This farah guy doesn't see that is supply chain economics

 

[Finesse]

Amal Bank/ transfer company also does microfinancing.

As does the other bank in Bosaso.

Puntland does have banks Dr Osman

 

[SirLancelLord]

Someone lists all the Somali Commercial Banks, I know so far:

• Amal Bank (is it a proper bank with accounts etc)
• Dahabshiil Bank
• Salaama Bank
• Premier Bank

Is there anymore if it's just 4 that's a pretty small market.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Someone lists all the Somali Commercial Banks, I know so far:

• Amal Bank (is it a proper bank with accounts etc)
• Dahabshiil Bank
• Salaama Bank
• Premier Bank

Is there anymore if it's just 4 that's a pretty small market.

@Finesse

There is this SOM BANK that raised my interests recently. They said they do 'lending' to Somali people who have business ideas.



I think it may be the only pure bank in Somalia that deals with storing(accounts) like dahabshill but also lending because that is another function he said of this BANK,

The rest of the so-called banks in Somalia are probably just savings account and credit card accounts like mastercard which is service Premier Bank delivers. This however is not dealing with lending waryaa, that is storing or giving credit too people not lending. Lending is another arm of a bank and even lending has different sub-sections like home loans, fixed asset loans, car loans, business loans, personal loans, the sub sections get more complicated inside lending.

I doubt there is a single bank in Somalia that deals in lending services whatsoever let alone the different type of loans in lending services. Forget investment services, this is also has different sub sections of investment banking that takes people money and invests into different areas of a bank and gives them a return. Our banking system is not sophisticated in Somalia, we need Jewish people to train us, that's how they got rich. That's how we can convert 90% poverty class into middle class. Our govt can stop waiting for more 'charity' also. What causes a society to rely on charity is they don't lend money to each other, so this results in waiting for hand out.

The whole Somalia is charity case be it the civilians who require remittance or the govt who requires aid money. The cause of this lack of banks, this is well known philosophy what happens to a nation without banks, they only develop 1-2% rich who inherited they're riches from family and the rest living on aid money be it remittance or charity donors like the govt.

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Finesse I am worried when he said at the 2:05-2:10 mark. He said hadan aragno dawlad dhisan, dad dhisan, iyo sharci 'they will invest' the bank money into all projects. So this may not be the sort of bank I was talking about. This wud fall under investment banking, these are bunch of people who have money but have no idea where to put so they put it together into a bank and want you to bring them projects or ideas and they will 'invest' and obviously take they're shares based on they're investment portion. This is investment banking, this isn't a lending bank. Lending banks enpowers locals to take money and do something themselves so they become 'wealthy' also.

We will never have middle class who is independent until we loan them money to invest themselves in their own business idea. We cannot continue having 'top 1-2%' rich class sida investment bankers in Somalia and the rest are poor as hell waiting for charity because waxaa loo diidan yahay in lacag la siiyo si ay iyagu wax uu bilaabsadan.

 

[SirLancelLord]

@Finesse

There is this SOM BANK that raised my interests recently. They said they do 'lending' to Somali people who have business ideas.



I think it may be the only pure bank in Somalia that deals with storing(accounts) like dahabshill but also lending because that is another function he said of this BANK,

The rest of the so-called banks in Somalia are probably just savings account and credit card accounts like mastercard which is service Premier Bank delivers. This however is not dealing with lending waryaa, that is storing or giving credit too people not lending. Lending is another arm of a bank and even lending has different sub-sections like home loans, fixed asset loans, car loans, business loans, personal loans, the sub sections get more complicated inside lending.

I doubt there is a single bank in Somalia that deals in lending services whatsoever let alone the different type of loans in lending services. Forget investment services, this is also has different sub sections of investment banking that takes people money and invests into different areas of a bank and gives them a return. Our banking system is not sophisticated in Somalia, we need Jewish people to train us, that's how they got rich. That's how we can convert 90% poverty class into middle class. Our govt can stop waiting for more 'charity' also. What causes a society to rely on charity is they don't lend money to each other, so this results in waiting for hand out.

The whole Somalia is charity case be it the civilians who require remittance or the govt who requires aid money. The cause of this lack of banks, this is well known philosophy what happens to a nation without banks, they only develop 1-2% rich who inherited they're riches from family and the rest living on aid money be it remittance or charity donors like the govt.

Before the banking sector, let's get our Industry more developed and self sufficient and have adequate supply chains.

It's a perfect time to establish our own brands & household names like Coca Cola Starbucks etc.

We need to up our manufacturing and food production

Can anyone give me an update on the Coca Cola factory in Somalia haven't heard anything about it since 06 is it still open.

 

[DR OSMAN]

Before the banking sector, let's get our Industry more developed and self sufficient and have adequate supply chains.

It's a perfect time to establish our own brands & household names like Coca Cola Starbucks etc.

We need to up our manufacturing and food production

Diaspora is less then 100k of Somalis world-wide. We can't rely on such a small portion to bring they're hard currency from the west and develop industries, that's why development is slow in Somalia, since we are relyin on small sub-set of our population. Imagine if we enpowered the 90% of our population who are locals? rather then seeing one or two hotels and malls every few year as is the case now, you could be seeing locals taking 50k loans and paying it back and developing profit margins of 1k a month, imagine all the workers employed, no more sitting around cafes, jobs will be everywhere for locals. U just enpowered the bulk of your people, this would mean more taxes for govt, this would mean the rich 1% will gain more money since the customers are richer. U can't continue this 1% top class with 90% bottom class, you will not get rich like this anyways since your customers are not wealthy to begin with.

Lets talk strategies on how to put more money in the locals pocket, cuz once he has more money, we can gain from this waryaa as he will spend this locally and if we position our business in the right place where this local spends, we end up getting richer. It's better having 10,000 locals with 1000 dollars each in their pocket, then 100 millionaires ma garatay? because those millionaires is only 100 not 10000 locals with 1k each, market depends on volume of customers not relying on just 100 customers who have money.

 

[SirLancelLord]

Diaspora is less then 100k of Somalis world-wide. We can't rely on such a small portion to bring they're hard currency from the west and develop industries, that's why development is slow in Somalia, since we are relyin on small sub-set of our population. Imagine if we enpowered the 90% of our population who are locals? rather then seeing one or two hotels and malls every few year as is the case now, you could be seeing locals taking 50k loans and paying it back and developing profit margins of 1k a month, imagine all the workers employed, no more sitting around cafes, jobs will be everywhere for locals. U just enpowered the bulk of your people, this would mean more taxes for govt, this would mean the rich 1% will gain more money since the customers are richer. U can't continue this 1% top class with 90% bottom class, you will not get rich like this anyways since your customers are not wealthy to begin with.

I don't mean hotels, we have plenty of water bottles plant and a hive flour mill is about to begin operations in berbera.

Agriculture production needs to increase
We need more milk / drinks plants. Etc

Manufacturing yes we might start small but in the long run we will be importing less year after year to a point where we export more but also have an internal Somali market / supply chain.

We need to lol at data from the main ports to see what is imported the most and gather up resources to establish that industry within the country that has good links to multiple population centres.

That's what the people behind the flour mill saw when every month several truckloads of flour was being imported from Egypt that they decided to build one after spending several getting financed

 

[DR OSMAN]

I don't mean hotels, we have plenty of water bottles plant and a hive flour mill is about to begin operations in berbera.

Agriculture production needs to increase
We need more milk / drinks plants. Etc

Manufacturing yes we might start small but in the long run we will be importing less year after year to a point where we export more but also have an internal Somali market / supply chain.

We need to lol at data from the main ports to see what is imported the most and gather up resources to establish that industry within the country that has good links to multiple population centres.

That's what the people behind the flour mill saw when every month several truckloads of flour was being imported from Egypt that they decided to build one after spending several getting financed
View attachment 78880

Well you need to demonstrate to 'traders' it's cheaper for them to purchase your locally made product, rather then going to dubai and buying from there where it has most likely been produced overseas. There is no point producing coca cola 10 times over all over the world, when one can simply cut the cost of production and import it.

You need to demonstrate why it's cheaper to produce locally for trades people rather then going to dubai and buying it? The costs involved are tremendous, the GDP value add is minimal since the product is 'cheap' 1-2 dollar per bottle x 100,000 bottles a MONTH which is 100-200k a month x 12 months is 1-3 million a year in term of production value that is not account for deduction of expenses to work out your real 'value' portion. Those GDP calculations are horrendous to any economist becuz the item you produce is cheap, the investment u put in is 'high', the cost to benefit ratio is questionable when imports could work out cheaper then producing locally, and the fact your reproducing something that has been produced elsewhere in the world is creating 'duplication' of effort.

The benefit of workforce is minimal as the poverty rates lessens maybe 50 workers by each plant in Somalia so far. I personally prefer start ups and enpowering locals to create they're own business. Small to medium sized business with 5-10 workers beats anything offered by large scale manufacturing.

Let's talk economics since this is your favorite field and not so much tribal and reconciliation maters or even political matters.

 

[SirLancelLord]

Puntland few things you need to fix to help your business community:

Issues faced by #puntland business community

1. Bosaso doesn’t have a container terminal so goods land in Salalah(Oman).

2. The problem with this is that it’s expensive, goods are damaged during loading and unloading, Dhows have a greater risk of capsizing leading to loss.

3. Exorbitant port charges at Bosaso port.

4.Higher cost of shipping from China-Salalah-Bosaso rather than China-Bosaso (which is not possible due to lack of container terminal

Note : logistical and economical challenges crippling their operations the business community in PL came up wth the following solutions:

1. Use Berbera where the containers can arrive directly from China thus avoiding the risk of dhow shipping, delays and higher fees of Salalah.

2. Tax exemption from the Somaliland Gov as the goods are destined for another country

3. Is that it’s faster and cheaper.

Puntland Responds to these actions by proposing to:

1. Summary execution of Sool/Sanaag residents who are with Somaliland

2. Ban all goods produced in Somaliland

3. 500% tax in goods from SL

4. Protect the interests of Salalah port at all costs

If you're a capitalist you should really question this policy - question you're representatives why there isn't container handling at you're main port after signing a deal to develop it 2 years ago

 

[DR OSMAN]

Puntland few things you need to fix to help your business community:

Issues faced by #puntland business community

1. Bosaso doesn’t have a container terminal so goods land in Salalah(Oman).

2. The problem with this is that it’s expensive, goods are damaged during loading and unloading, Dhows have a greater risk of capsizing leading to loss.

3. Exorbitant port charges at Bosaso port.

4.Higher cost of shipping from China-Salalah-Bosaso rather than China-Bosaso (which is not possible due to lack of container terminal

Note : logistical and economical challenges crippling their operations the business community in PL came up wth the following solutions:

1. Use Berbera where the containers can arrive directly from China thus avoiding the risk of dhow shipping, delays and higher fees of Salalah.

2. Tax exemption from the Somaliland Gov as the goods are destined for another country

3. Is that it’s faster and cheaper.

Puntland Responds to these actions by proposing to:

1. Summary execution of Sool/Sanaag residents who are with Somaliland

2. Ban all goods produced in Somaliland

3. 500% tax in goods from SL

4. Protect the interests of Salalah port at all costs

If you're a capitalist you should really question this policy

Sxb all the items you send to PL is already done in PL, so it's favouring it's local production. There is hundreds of drinks plants in PL from water to soda to juices. It doesn't need your SL made products. If there was a certain 'gap' in PL market, then that's fine but with SL there is no 'gap' in sectors, SL is just doing the same thing as PL is.

There is nothing there that is 'uniquely' missing from PL economy sxb. U don't know PL and what it produces. So I support 500% taxes on all items puntland already has done in it's market, we don't need you, ma ceeb ba? your getting emotiona for SL trying to act capitalist but your not as you deny PL is bustling economy, it requires less aid then SL which proves who is the basket-case here, it's you, if you had bustling economy, you wouldn't be begging donors and somali development fund all purely funded by outsiders. You dont have a single 'iskaga wax uu gabso' meaning your people are poorer then puntland people since you can't fund anything yourself. Your can't compare PL to SL, it's polar apart and if u don't believe me ask your people why they work in PL as waiters and cooks and cleaners. U even get better money in PL as waiter and cook then u would in somaliland showing u 'awooda dhaqaale' jeebka puntland iyo jeebka somaliland.

 

[DR OSMAN]

@SirLancelLord if your true capitalist, how can u deny the difference in PL citizen wallet who pay your cooks and waiters such a good wage in comparison to SL, why else are they here in PL working such areas? they get good money that's why, it's because puntland markay yimadan they say 'war illahi ba somaliland iyo faqrikisa naga soo waday oo jeebkooda maran tahay' looooooooool. ADMIT IT BRO, no other justification can explain it other then that. That's why I am in the west, because jeebkooda naga roon, just like your in PL since jeebkooda ka roon SL. The other factor to consider bro is if your so productive and have bustling economy, why is your state relying on foreign donors?

Can u demonstrate 1 project funded by your govt? you wont find a single one, not even public/donor partnership where u pay a portion and the donor pays the rest. Can u show one self funded community project? nope, why? jeebkooda waa eber dheh somaliland, wuxu sugayo GAALO iyo sadaqo is the only answer.

 

[SirLancelLord]

@SirLancelLord if your true capitalist, how can u deny the difference in PL citizen wallet who pay your cooks and waiters such a good wage in comparison to SL, why else are they here in PL working such areas? they get good money that's why, it's because puntland markay yimadan they say 'war illahi ba somaliland iyo faqrikisa naga soo waday oo jeebkooda maran tahay' looooooooool. ADMIT IT BRO, no other justification can explain it other then that. That's why I am in the west, because jeebkooda naga roon, just like your in PL since jeebkooda ka roon SL. The other factor to consider bro is if your so productive and have bustling economy, why is your state relying on foreign donors?

Can u demonstrate 1 project funded by your govt? you wont find a single one, not even public/donor partnership where u pay a portion and the donor pays the rest. Can u show one self funded community project? nope, why? jeebkooda waa eber dheh somaliland, wuxu sugayo GAALO iyo sadaqo is the only answer.

You were doing so well till you brought rubbish claims about wallets and jobs.

You've got no accurate data to verify your claims as PL state doesn't carry out statistics on the state of economy so you can't measure it.

Economy & Industry is not the job of the Government all they have to do is regulate and tax it and ensure the country is attractive for such by making sure it is seen as safe as secure to put your money in. Private sector brings in the most cash, everything is private business. A true free market.

The government is supposed to support them by building the right infrastructure but they're pretty useless at that at the moment. When you haven't got technocrats in charge you regress but the private sector continues to grow as it fully supplies the domestic markets and needs to expand to outer regions

Bro I'm complimenting you lot, like you said PL people have more money which Somaliland business sees as an opportunity to sell products too

 

[DR OSMAN]

You were doing so well till you brought rubbish claims about wallets and jobs.

You've got no accurate data to verify your claims as PL state doesn't carry out statistics on the state of economy so you can't measure it.

Economy & Industry is not the job of the Government all they have to do is regulate and tax it and ensure the country is attractive for such by making sure it is seen as safe as secure to put your money in. Private sector brings in the most cash, everything is private business. A true free market.

The government is supposed to support them by building the right infrastructure but they're pretty useless at that at the moment. When you haven't got technocrats in charge you regress but the private sector continues to grow as it fully supplies the domestic markets and needs to expand to outer regions

So you can't examine wallets? so when one community can fund it's own port, roads, schools, hospitals thru community efforts and fund-raising locally and diaspora which is PL, and another community cannot do this which is SL, isn't this a key difference in wallet size according to you?

When one community prefers to work as a cook/waiter in another region while a person from that same region refuses to work as a cook/waiter or in any sector beyond 'business owner' of hotels which some majerten have hotels there in SL, there is no difference in wallet size to you?

When PL govt has govt/donor projects where PL pays a portion where-as SL is totally foreign based donor and not paying a portion, this isn't a difference to you? When SL govt relies on foreign donor and IDP money they put it back into they're people who are basically IDP level citizens themselves, PL doesn't and uses all IDP funds for IDPS.

The only projects ever done in PL with a donor focus is infrastructure like JPLG in the cities which PL has to pay it's fair portion since they know we are not as poor as SOMALILAND.

Come on your in denial sxb that Majerten is 10 times richer then Isaaq. There is no fuckin comparison whatsoever, u will see it when you go to garowe and hargeisa. Why u think Somalis are in the west? jeebkooda naga roon galbeedka, we gain a benefit here by even driving cabs and being cleaners in the lowest sectors since it pays so well. The same can be said for your isaaq brothers working as cooks/waiters being paid handsomely in PL, so imagine what the other industries pay when the lowest industries are 'enticing' Isaaq?

 

[DR OSMAN]

You were doing so well till you brought rubbish claims about wallets and jobs.

You've got no accurate data to verify your claims as PL state doesn't carry out statistics on the state of economy so you can't measure it.

Economy & Industry is not the job of the Government all they have to do is regulate and tax it and ensure the country is attractive for such by making sure it is seen as safe as secure to put your money in. Private sector brings in the most cash, everything is private business. A true free market.

The government is supposed to support them by building the right infrastructure but they're pretty useless at that at the moment. When you haven't got technocrats in charge you regress but the private sector continues to grow as it fully supplies the domestic markets and needs to expand to outer regions

Bro I'm complimenting you lot, like you said PL people have more money which Somaliland business sees as an opportunity to sell products too

Sxb I am not sure why you have this major 'cuqdad' about Majerten wealth? Why you have this unrealistic outlook about SL when the facts don't align.

Fact 1. If your rich u won't need charity.

Fact 2. If your economy is bustling your taxation would be also hence u won't need charity.

Fact 3. WTF why are your people being Puntland mexicans and working in shitty industries like mexicans work in shitty industries of america like farmers? Cuz America is rich thats why mexicans come and work as farmers. PL is rich that is why SL works as cooks and waiters is the logic I am applying.

Fact 4. Your govt hasn't self funded a damn thing and requires foreign donors in everything nor does it pay even portion so it's govt and donor partnership. U want me to list more facts or u get the picture? What your saying about Isaaq and the realities are two different things.

Fact 5. Your locals/diaspora never do community projects like water wells, schools, roads, ports, airport terminals, we built all this stuff in PL by ourselves. That's why they tell you in PL if you took away our locals/diaspora, there would not be a single project in PL, since 90% are locally driven with diaspora fundraising support.