The alchemist
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It's established that pastoralism reached Arabia before agriculture. It was more like pastoral subsistence with hunting characteristics.
Nomadic african pastoralists in the neolithic arabian peninsula ?
- Thread starter Midas
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The alchemist
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There was no such thing. The hunter-gatherer existed in the Egyptian-Nubian region. The Cushitic genetic genesis happened right are the border of Egypt in northwest Nubia. What people today call South Western Egypt, in the Nabta-Kiseiba region.
The alchemist
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That is an interesting perspective. How do the other megalith sites look from that time and region?
The alchemist
VIP
Agriculture in the Fayum Neolithic came with Levantine settlers. They entered with wheat and barley (two winter-adapted grains) because the Levant was supposedly getting dry and cold or something.
Anyway, these people were Levantines altogether. The Fayum HGs were different. The cattle herders of the South Western Egypt were different and I think the lithics reflected the HGs of the first Fayum than the Neolithics. There was also a clear population replacement between the HG and Neolithics with a few centuries of no occupation in Fayum. I have written extensively about this but it was supposed to be part of a broader thread so I have not posted yet. I will say there were some continuity of lithics to some extent but that is definitely more to horizontal influence than lateral continuity.
To give you a sneak peak, the north have been a Levant second homeland since those Agriculturalist touched ground. Southern Egypt and Nubia were separate things. Along the Western Desert (the whole thing) was a nuance because some of those Levant Neolithic peoples resorted to mixed subsistence and then moved on to pastoralism, affecting the cattle herders and probably influenced som Neolithic Levant ancestry in those north and central Western Desert herder. But majority of their ancestry would be Fauym HG related.
Yes, I am basically saying that whatever was in those Fauym HG would be the bulk of the non-East African ancestry in Cushites. And they were replaced by Neolithic peoples in the north. The south and the north of Egypt were separate population history hot-spots since the Neolithic. The southern populations were where the prehistoric components of the civilization arose from, and they were within the same broader culture zone as these Cushitics, while the northern peoples were Levantines. Two universes that were not one.
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Im not too sure it seems like this is around when the megaltihs start to emerge.
Although I just know made the connection that there emergence seems to be very close in time too the domestication of the donkey which happens around this time give or take a few centuries.
Yeah Its been nonstop in my mind for the last couple days. Once I started thinking about the implications I couldn't stop.
Yh i have no good grasp of the technical stuff but Its incredibly how quickly this change happens from 5000 b.c onwards
Human migration, language shift, and dynamics are complex. Imagine a society in 4,000-5,000 years trying to research population movements in the future long after we are gone and all data stored in books and computers vanish; God help them.
Human society is complex, they found grain dating back to Anatolia being traded in the English Channel in pre-neolithic times, our story is more complex than what is spouted.
The idea that I really really want to emphasize is the connection between religion and architecture. This is the idea thats been buzzing in my head for days whose implication only grows the more I think about it.
If you look at the beliefs and temples of the pagan Arabs and jews its exactly the same as that of the ancient mespotomias and levantines. No real afterlife. And temples that are "houses of god" in the form of small rectangle boxes like the kaaba and solmons temple .( even prophet Ibrahim who originally built the kaaba was from mespotomia )
There's more that could be said about the fact that the main ancient eygptian deities used to be human (osiris,horus, isis, etc) and became divine after their death. ( which seems to hint at pastoral relegion beginning as a cult of ancestor worship) while none of the main mespotomian deities were ever human .
- The people who built these megalithic tombs/temple in the arabian penisula where obviously very concerned with the afterlife .
- The farming civilizations of the middle east did not care about life after death and had no real conception of an afterlife. They only believed in God's who lived in the sky who came down to the small box shaped temples to communicate.
- The pastoralist civilizations of northeast Africa believed in an afterlife . But more than that they believed all their gods also lived in the underworld. The ancient eygptian deities all lived in Duat which is the underworld i.e ( the gods lived underground ).
If you look at the beliefs and temples of the pagan Arabs and jews its exactly the same as that of the ancient mespotomias and levantines. No real afterlife. And temples that are "houses of god" in the form of small rectangle boxes like the kaaba and solmons temple .( even prophet Ibrahim who originally built the kaaba was from mespotomia )
There's more that could be said about the fact that the main ancient eygptian deities used to be human (osiris,horus, isis, etc) and became divine after their death. ( which seems to hint at pastoral relegion beginning as a cult of ancestor worship) while none of the main mespotomian deities were ever human .
I wanted to stop here for today. But I found this too tantalizing of a fact to pass up.
The quran mentions two prophets before Abraham. Hud and saleh. They were "Arabs " and were prophets sent to warn these "Arabs". Thamud and ad and these two people's built "tall stone buildings" and the "arabs of ad" had camels.
The quran mentions two prophets before Abraham. Hud and saleh. They were "Arabs " and were prophets sent to warn these "Arabs". Thamud and ad and these two people's built "tall stone buildings" and the "arabs of ad" had camels.
ZBR
سبحان اللهِ وبحمدِه Free Palestine
I do think that the reentering of Africa from the Levant was motivated by seeking pastoral land in lieu of going east , in more competitive lands with states, taxes etc but non the less I do think it was a mistake as the Wild West was more free but also more unjust hasteness
So our pastoralism to me has its pros (freedom) but it’s cautionary tale too
So our pastoralism to me has its pros (freedom) but it’s cautionary tale too
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ZBR
سبحان اللهِ وبحمدِه Free Palestine
Did you know that it’s said that figs were domesticated before the domestication of grains or sheep cattle etc
That means we were more civil and refined from the beginning
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
That means we were more civil and refined from the beginning
Early domesticated fig in the Jordan Valley - PubMed
It is generally accepted that the fig tree was domesticated in the Near East some 6500 years ago. Here we report the discovery of nine carbonized fig fruits and hundreds of drupelets stored in Gilgal I, an early Neolithic village, located in the Lower Jordan Valley, which dates to 11,400 to...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
ZBR
سبحان اللهِ وبحمدِه Free Palestine
What you’re saying is actually real
My theory is grain farmers especially in the east lives have less risk, and it’s calculated so have less belief, pastoralists live life on the the edge and put their trust in god may it be in personal conflict or survival in marginal lands where survival depends on weather, fate, and divine favor. Also Animals are born, die, and are sacrificed or lost.
but the most faithful I think are the Levantine PPNA who stayed rooted and patience with their fruits neither trying to dominate like the herders overpowering the HGs and foragers or the Eastern hoarders
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The pastoralists from africa crossed the red sea and entered the arabian penisula. They inhabited baiscally the entire arabian peninsula whereas the Levant and mespotima were inhabited by Middle Eastern farmers.
People from the Levant didn't re-enter africa. They didnt even arrive in the arabian penisula till they became pastoralists after the bronze age collapse in 1177 b.c
The grain Farmers of the middle east were at the mercy of the rain and the flooding of the river. So they believed in uncaring gods who created them to farm and worship them.
Where's the pastoralists relied on their livestock which they had total control and killed them at will. So these guys believed in a religion where they had total mastery over life and death. Which is why you have all these afterlife rituals in ancient eygptian religion.
