National Armed Forces will increase to 70 thousand!

[mohamedismail]

It will come. I believe HSM will win a second term so around that time imo we will see SNA & NISA in Puntland, possibly before depending on their upcoming elections.

Reer SSC would be happy if a large number of their militia were integrated into the SNA and the rest police/daraawiish of their fms. HSM hand is strong. PL iyo SSC dad isku xeran ma ahan mida kale dhulbahante dad aqoonsi raadinayo waye lol Puntland will be surrounded

That would be good to see. No reason for SNA to be in JL,KGS,HS,GM and not have a presence in PL and SL. We should have SNA in all four corners of the country. It would be nice to see hsm make that happen.

 

[Libaax-Joore]

That would be good to see. No reason for SNA to be in JL,KGS,HS,GM and not have a presence in PL and SL. We should have SNA in all four corners of the country. It would be nice to see hsm make that happen.

Same way thiers is no Ethiopia/kenya troops in puntland boowe puntland is country with in a country the only SNA that will be in puntland will be PUNTLAND NATIONAL ARMY
Look at this post on Facebook https://fb.watch/oINbtkpX2K/?mibextid=qC1gEa

 

[Jaale]

Without adequate training and payment, it's useless, your going to get a bunch of parasites. Thousands of newly deputised mooryaans creating checkpoints and preying on people.

 

[𐒋𐒖𐒆𐒔𐒖𐒕𐒈]

Why are you fixated on the IMF as the only source of potential loans? I posted the previous article in reference to the size of the current budget not the IMF. Besides, Somalia can easily request more budgetary support from Turkey, US and Qatar to fund and sustain a new military, that’s what’s already happening. Long term, however, with the establishment of those infrastructure projects the need to depend on external sources will significantly lessen.

Oh never mind, I thought you thoroughly pondered these matters, but it does not look like it.

A few things to think about. What do these nations get in return from being so charitable? In a financial facts void world, if a bankrupt nation with no discernible ready resources could easily get loans, the entire lending instruments would have collapsed at the turn of 18th century.

Do continue, and let me not slow you down in your moment of bowl-carrying, alms-sniffing, debt-seeking expedition.

 

[Hassan Garguute Buldanana]

That would be good to see. No reason for SNA to be in JL,KGS,HS,GM and not have a presence in PL and SL. We should have SNA in all four corners of the country. It would be nice to see hsm make that happen.

Because they are not wanted or needed in PL. Don't listen to these clueless kids. Those paper states need the FGS holding their hands. There is more chance of unicorn to be sighted in Baidoa than SNA in PL. It will be the end of Deni if he allowed the likes of tuug Mahad salad in PL or any other moryaan.

 

[Libaax-Joore]

Oh never mind, I thought you thoroughly pondered these matters, but it does not look like it.

A few things to think about. What do these nations get in return from being so charitable? In a financial facts void world, if a bankrupt nation with no discernible ready resources could easily get loans, the entire lending instruments would have collapsed at the turn of 18th century.

Do continue, and let me not slow you down in your moment of bowl-carrying, alms-sniffing, debt-seeking expedition.

Inshallah PISF would be the new SNA inshallah will conquer from raaskamboni to loyaacada bi idmilaah

 

[Sup]

Because they are not wanted or needed in PL. Don't listen to these clueless kids. Those paper states need the FGS holding their hands. There is more chance of unicorn to be sighted in Baidoa than SNA in PL. It will be the end of Deni if he allowed the likes of tuug Mahad salad in PL or any other moryaan.

The status quo will not remain forever, the country is moving forward. You can’t have one foot in the door and another one out. Make up your mind lads, things are moving fast.

 

[Libaax-Joore]

The status quo will not remain forever, the country is moving forward. You can’t have one foot in the door and another one out. Make up your mind lads, things are moving fast.

It will stay the same trust me nothing will change in our lifetime maybe when we die 50 years from now until then I will be proudly waving the blue,green and white puntland flag

 

[Aseer]

Why not?

Eventually there has to be. All of Somalia will have to have SNA even Somaliland.

It's not possible there's not many roads/transportation networks there even during the kacaan era they barely got visited or checked on apparently my father told me the people there thought president sharmake was still in power while siad barre was in power and most the towns are quite small and not to mention its quite mountainous and as i said before no roads so it will be quite a hassle, only way is to get in through air or ships while roads being built but even then the small ports and airports there weren't used in ages I think they are breaking down. Heck i heard my adeeros there tried making their own state cause they barely got any attention or development but they cooled down when puntland agreed and promised to visit and develop us more time to time.

 

[Jungle]

It will stay the same trust me nothing will change in our lifetime maybe when we die 50 years from now until then I will be proudly waving the blue,green and white puntland flag

50 years kulaha we will see Nisa and SNA in Puntland within the next 5 years

Because they are not wanted or needed in PL. Don't listen to these clueless kids. Those paper states need the FGS holding their hands. There is more chance of unicorn to be sighted in Baidoa than SNA in PL. It will be the end of Deni if he allowed the likes of tuug Mahad salad in PL or any other moryaan.

If that will be the end of Deni who will takeover? You people are coming across very disjointed lol

Its not about whether you want them there or not. NISA and SNA are federal and present in every FMS. Puntland will follow.
Btw you're making out like soldiers will be shipped to PL. All various military PL will be integrated into SNA/ NISA and the state left with a police force.

 

[FBIsomalia]

50 years kulaha we will see Nisa and SNA in Puntland within the next 5 years


If that will be the end of Deni who will takeover? You people are coming across very disjointed lol

Its not about whether you want them there or not. NISA and SNA are federal and present in every FMS. Puntland will follow.
Btw you're making out like soldiers will be shipped to PL. All various military PL has got be will integrated into SNA/ NISA and the state left with a police force.

You dreaming too much, kulaha NISA in puntland.

NISA or SNA in Puntland its day HAG accept RX to govern xamar.

PL army will stay under our control.

 

[Three Moons]

Oh never mind, I thought you thoroughly pondered these matters, but it does not look like it.

You are being passive-aggressive for no reason.

A few things to think about. What do these nations get in return from being so charitable?

What did the United States get back from funding the reconstruction of a war ravaged continent like Europe with the Marshall Plan? The local economies were in tatters, cities buried in rubble, entire industries destroyed. Today the EU is one of America’s biggest trading partners, but it took years for them to get a return on their investment.

If you cannot look beyond a year, 5 years or even several decades then the actions of countries like Turkey make little sense, I get it, but countries don’t do business based on pessimistic presentism or myopic planning.

In a financial facts void world, if a bankrupt nation with no discernible ready resources could easily get loans, the entire lending instruments would have collapsed at the turn of 18th century.

I noticed that you used the world ‘insolvent’ to characterise Somalia in previous posts and now ‘bankrupt’, probably not realising that all of those loans were inherited from the communist era, and the prolonged war prevented Somalia from managing and eventually repaying those loans, causing them to balloon to the current ridiculous figure through interest. The world financial institutions were well aware of that factor, and as a result the ledger will be erased, putting the country back in the black, and eligible for financial assistance.

The world financial institutions and major countries backing Somalia clearly understand that there are far greater benefits to gain from a stable and prosperous Somalia than the situation of the last couple of decades.

Do continue, and let me not slow you down in your moment of bowl-carrying, alms-sniffing, debt-seeking expedition.

The fact that you mischaracterise a common feature of propelling a country to economic growth is clear evidence that you are not in this thread with a genuine interest to discuss ways that Somalia could improve its military or its economy. I guess all of these countries below fall under the same categories?

• Turkey: World Bank agrees to provide $18bn in loans amid economic overhaul​

• World Bank approves $7 billion loan to support Egypt reforms​

• Exclusive: Ethiopia seeking $2 billion under IMF program, sources say​

• ADB, World Bank leads as Sri Lanka gets US$1.5bn in loans in 2023​

  ​

• Nigeria Set to Receive $1.5 Billion World Bank Loan by Year-End​

 

[Libaax-Joore]

50 years kulaha we will see Nisa and SNA in Puntland within the next 5 years


If that will be the end of Deni who will takeover? You people are coming across very disjointed lol

Its not about whether you want them there or not. NISA and SNA are federal and present in every FMS. Puntland will follow.
Btw you're making out like soldiers will be shipped to PL. All various military PL will be integrated into SNA/ NISA and the state left with a police force.

Inshallah when xurmadle he said abdullahi deni take over somalia president from moriyan hassan gurgurte 2026 will once again karbaash hawiye like we did once with president abdullahi yusuf ahmed 2006 will rule somalia with iron fist from raas komboni to loyacada bi idmilah

 

[𐒋𐒖𐒆𐒔𐒖𐒕𐒈]

You are being passive-aggressive for no reason.



What did the United States get back from funding the reconstruction of a war ravaged continent like Europe with the Marshall Plan? The local economies were in tatters, cities buried in rubble, entire industries destroyed. Today the EU is one of America’s biggest trading partners, but it took years for them to get a return on their investment.

If you cannot look beyond a year, 5 years or even several decades then the actions of countries like Turkey make little sense, I get it, but countries don’t do business based on pessimistic presentism or myopic planning.



I noticed that you used the world ‘insolvent’ to characterise Somalia in previous posts and now ‘bankrupt’, probably not realising that all of those loans were inherited from the communist era, and the prolonged war prevented Somalia from managing and eventually repaying those loans, causing them to balloon to the current ridiculous figure through interest. The world financial institutions were well aware of that factor, and as a result the ledger will be erased, putting the country back in the black, and eligible for financial assistance.

The world financial institutions and major countries backing Somalia clearly understand that there are far greater benefits to gain from a stable and prosperous Somalia than the situation of the last couple of decades.




The fact that you mischaracterise a common feature of propelling a country to economic growth is clear evidence that you are not in this thread with a genuine interest to discuss ways that Somalia could improve its military or its economy. I guess all of these countries below fall under the same categories?

• Turkey: World Bank agrees to provide $18bn in loans amid economic overhaul​

• World Bank approves $7 billion loan to support Egypt reforms​

• Exclusive: Ethiopia seeking $2 billion under IMF program, sources say​

• ADB, World Bank leads as Sri Lanka gets US$1.5bn in loans in 2023​

  ​

• Nigeria Set to Receive $1.5 Billion World Bank Loan by Year-End​

You really should not have used those nations as examples. Notice how you accused me of 'obsessing' about IMF, yet here you are offering financially struggling nations, with poor internal control systems, and with high levels of corruption, as 'good' examples of what not to do, and in turn making the case for me, with all your examples being IMF. There is a word for that.

From the sound of it, you might not be financially very literate, so, let me explain how loans work; say, you want to borrow $1, and your credit history is worse than poor, judging from your defaulting on previous debts, and have just gone through bankruptcy along with a debt clearing 7 step programme. With such background, you could not go to the open lending market for a loan at a decent rate, and instead you go to the loan sharks with exuberant, if exploitative rates. Here, the risk of your repaying the loan is greater, therefore your rate of borrowing is proportionately greater. For example, if a nation with a good credit standing along with robust internal control systems could fetch a loan at, say 3%, the best rate for a struggling creditor would be in the 20% - 30% rate band.

To put this in context, of the $1 you wanted to borrow, 1/3rd would go towards surcharges whereas you would only get less than 2/3rds before the debt is even released (0.67 cents of the dollar to be precise; this accounts for the rate of interest, servicing, and security the loan: these are standard rate charges, and are very conservative, for the rate is most likely greater, but shall suffice for this exercise).

Now, let us put this into perspective: in the case of .So, say, you want to borrow 1 billion US, from a loan shark, the likes of IMF. You would only get 710 million with a monthly payment of 8.3 million over a 10 year period.

Bear in mind, .So is NOT borrowing to invest in revenue generating projects, but to keep its head above water. Your own admission to pay salaries of soldiers, which you consider an investment worthy project.

Does it make financial sense to borrow? Now, before you answer, think about the hard numbers, and the next 10 years.

One more thing: ponder if a poor nation with no functioning institutions goes to an exploitative 3rd party to borrow, say Sri Lanka borrowing from China. Are you familiar with the case?

Whilst at it, read these articles as to how IMF operates. Pay close attention to the cases of Brazil, and Argentina.

Event Transcript - IMF Surcharges: A Necessary Tool or Counter-Productive Obstacle to a Just and Green Recovery?

Transcript of a CEPR event titled, “IMF Surcharges: A Necessary Tool or Counter-Productive Obstacle to a Just and Green Recovery?”

cepr.net

https://cfape.org/2023/05/31/the-impact-of-imf-loans-on-poor-nations/

 

[Three Moons]

You really should not have used those nations as examples. Notice how you accused me of 'obsessing' about IMF, yet here you are offering financially struggling nations, with poor internal control systems, and with high levels of corruption, as 'good' examples of what not to do, and in turn making the case for me, with all your examples being IMF. There is a word for that.

All of those countries are doing much better than Somalia in every metric, several of them are in the top 20 most powerful militaries, which was the original subject of this discussion. You asked how Somalia could sustain a new strong military, and you received an answer, no need to move the discussion in a different direction, but alas;

From the sound of it, you might not be financially very literate, so, let me explain how loans work; say, you want to borrow $1, and your credit history is worse than poor, judging from your defaulting on previous debts, and have just gone through bankruptcy along with a debt clearing 7 step programme. With such background, you could not go to the open lending market for a loan at a decent rate, and instead you go to the loan sharks with exuberant, if exploitative rates. Here, the risk of your repaying the loan is greater, therefore your rate of borrowing is proportionately greater. For example, if a nation with a good credit standing along with robust internal control systems could fetch a loan at, say 3%, the best rate for a struggling creditor would be in the 20% - 30% rate band.

To put this in context, of the $1 you wanted to borrow, 1/3rd would go towards surcharges whereas you would only get less than 2/3rds before the debt is even released (0.67 cents of the dollar to be precise; this accounts for the rate of interest, servicing, and security the loan: these are standard rate charges, and are very conservative, for the rate is most likely greater, but shall suffice for this exercise).

Now, let us put this into perspective: in the case of .So, say, you want to borrow 1 billion US, from a loan shark, the likes of IMF. You would only get 710 million with a monthly payment of 8.3 million over a 10 year period.

Bear in mind, .So is NOT borrowing to invest in revenue generating projects, but to keep its head above water. Your own admission to pay salaries of soldiers, which you consider an investment worthy project.

Does it make financial sense to borrow? Now, before you answer, think about the hard numbers, and the next 10 years.

One more thing: ponder if a poor nation with no functioning institutions goes to an exploitative 3rd party to borrow, say Sri Lanka borrowing from China. Are you familiar with the case?

Whilst at it, read these articles as to how IMF operates. Pay close attention to the cases of Brazil, and Argentina.

Event Transcript - IMF Surcharges: A Necessary Tool or Counter-Productive Obstacle to a Just and Green Recovery?

Transcript of a CEPR event titled, “IMF Surcharges: A Necessary Tool or Counter-Productive Obstacle to a Just and Green Recovery?”

cepr.net

https://cfape.org/2023/05/31/the-impact-of-imf-loans-on-poor-nations/

No offense brother, but you live in a fantasy world where a country recovering from decades of war could magically get back on its feet economically WITHOUT significant financial assistance first. Somalia has no credit score to begin with, it’s not ranked by Fitch, Moodys, Standard & Poor, etc. It’s amusing that you call me financially illiterate but ignore that the only way Somalia could transform its financial ranking is by first taking loans, inject that into the economy, the military and other important sectors, and eventually pay back what it’s owed, thereby improving its credit rating over time.

Putting up your hands and simply giving up because your current rating is in the gutter is not an option, neither is fear mongering about the big bad financial institutions with hypotheticals. The only reason Somalia reached the critical Completion point for debt relief is because of the country’s sound economic reforms, I see no reason why this couldn’t be sustained post debt-relief.

Paying the salaries of a new military that will not only recover one of the most fertile agricultural belts of your country, but also stabilise the entire region is definitely a worthwhile investment as it will open up a world of possibilities for agricultural, Fisheries, Industrial and major infrastructural projects that are transformative and enable the movement of goods and people, all of which would naturally result in more revenue streams for the government and increase the tax base of the country.

Somalia’s current annual taxable income is minuscule compared to what it could potentially raise, but it needs support first to sustain a strong military and civil service that can increase the tax base in multiple sectors. This is the main issue here, you are putting the cart before the horse, a horse that needs to visit a modern vet first to get back on its feet before it can once again gallop with pride, but you are telling us we should leave the poor sick horse the way it is because the costs to make it healthy are too expensive, not realising this same horse could take you to a land of milk of honey and mountains of gold if you a took a leap of financial faith.

Its obvious that you treat and consider Somalia as a country that’s already blessed with border to border stability, power-plants, industrial parks, post-Panamax ports, with elaborate modern highway + railway systems, functioning healthcare and education sectors etc when it’s not. It wants to to get there but it needs financial support first, regardless of the rates.

The countries I referenced above ALL have that. They have the strong militaries, the infrastructure projects, the economic growth, the rise in standards of living, and they achieved that with the assistance of international loans. I really don’t understand why you would deny Somalia to do the same and allow it to reach a new economic category, just because those same countries also endured periods of economic crisis, defaults and mismanagement?

It’s all part of the game, but you don’t even want Somalia to participate. That’s not an option brother.

 

[𐒋𐒖𐒆𐒔𐒖𐒕𐒈]

All of those countries are doing much better than Somalia in every metric, several of them are in the top 20 most powerful militaries, which was the original subject of this discussion. You asked how Somalia could sustain a new strong military, and you received an answer, no need to move the discussion in a different direction, but alas;



No offense brother, but you live in a fantasy world where a country recovering from decades of war could magically get back on its feet economically WITHOUT significant financial assistance first. Somalia has no credit score to begin with, it’s not ranked by Fitch, Moodys, Standard & Poor, etc. It’s amusing that you call me financially illiterate but ignore that the only way Somalia could transform its financial ranking is by first taking loans, inject that into the economy, the military and other important sectors, and eventually pay back what it’s owed, thereby improving its credit rating over time.

Putting up your hands and simply giving up because your current rating is in the gutter is not an option, neither is fear mongering about the big bad financial institutions with hypotheticals. The only reason Somalia reached the critical Completion point for debt relief is because of the country’s sound economic reforms, I see no reason why this couldn’t be sustained post debt-relief.

Paying the salaries of a new military that will not only recover one of the most fertile agricultural belts of your country, but also stabilise the entire region is definitely a worthwhile investment as it will open up a world of possibilities for agricultural, Fisheries, Industrial and major infrastructural projects that are transformative and enable the movement of goods and people, all of which would naturally result in more revenue streams for the government and increase the tax base of the country.

Somalia’s current annual taxable income is minuscule compared to what it could potentially raise, but it needs support first to sustain a strong military and civil service that can increase the tax base in multiple sectors. This is the main issue here, you are putting the cart before the horse, a horse that needs to visit a modern vet first to get back on its feet before it can once again gallop with pride, but you are telling us we should leave the poor sick horse the way it is because the costs to make it healthy are too expensive, not realising this same horse could take you to a land of milk of honey and mountains of gold if you a took a leap of financial faith.

Its obvious that you treat and consider Somalia as a country that’s already blessed with border to border stability, power-plants, industrial parks, post-Panamax ports, with elaborate modern highway + railway systems, functioning healthcare and education sectors etc when it’s not. It wants to to get there but it needs financial support first, regardless of the rates.

The countries I referenced above ALL have that. They have the strong militaries, the infrastructure projects, the economic growth, the rise in standards of living, and they achieved that with the assistance of international loans. I really don’t understand why you would deny Somalia to do the same and allow it to reach a new economic category, just because those same countries also endured periods of economic crisis, defaults and mismanagement?

It’s all part of the game, but you don’t even want Somalia to participate. That’s not an option brother.

I see you do not like numbers, eh? It is as if we are not speaking of the same thing nor seeing matters at the same wavelength. For a goodwill, I'll assume you want that which is good for .So, and with that, I shall pause there, but in the interim, let me note: Recovery, be it in societal, economic, security, stability etc all of which .So is in dire need of, requires slow, gradual, and structured management.

As the wise general said 'The reason most people fail instead of succeed is they trade what they want most for what they want at the moment'.

Does that ring a bell?

Most troubled nations, and even persons, find sprints more desirable than slow walks. The same mindset which got them into trouble in the first place.

 

[Three Moons]

I see you do not like numbers, eh? It is as if we are not speaking of the same thing nor seeing matters at the same wavelength.

We aren’t, your position, though admirable, is 10 to 15 years premature. Let Somalia build up a new respectable credit rating first before we can indulge in hypotheticals.

So what would you have a Somali government do instead to spur economic growth without funding for a strong military or international loans? I’d be interested in hearing your alternative perspective.

For a goodwill, I'll assume you want that which is good for .So, and with that, I shall pause there, but in the interim, let me note: Recovery, be it in societal, economic, security, stability etc all of which .So is in dire need of, requires slow, gradual, and structured management.

There is nothing to suggest that this is not already the case, in-fact according to the Sixth Review with the IMF both the government and the global financial institutions have agreed to a successor program after the debt relief to manage their relationship with clear checks and balances.

Misappropriation of funds would be flagged very quickly in such a system, and jeopardise future credit injections.

As the wise general said 'The reason most people fail instead of succeed is they trade what they want most for what they want at the moment'.

Does that ring a bell?

Most troubled nations, and even persons, find sprints more desirable than slow walks. The same mindset which got them into trouble in the first place.

“A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they shall never sit.” — Greek Proverb

50 years have already been wasted brother, its time to plant those trees. Our neighbours and the rest of the world are enjoy the shade of their jungles, woodlands and forests, while our people are being swept away by floods and reduced by droughts.

 

[Mutombo]

It will come. I believe HSM will win a second term so around that time imo we will see SNA & NISA in Puntland, possibly before depending on their upcoming elections.

Reer SSC would be happy if a large number of their militia were integrated into the SNA and the rest police/daraawiish of their fms. HSM hand is strong. PL iyo SSC dad isku xeran ma ahan mida kale dhulbahante dad aqoonsi raadinayo waye lol Puntland will be surrounded

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[Heavy Mountains]

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[𐒋𐒖𐒆𐒔𐒖𐒕𐒈]

We aren’t, your position, though admirable, is 10 to 15 years premature. Let Somalia build up a new respectable credit rating first before we can indulge in hypotheticals.

So what would you have a Somali government do instead to spur economic growth without funding for a strong military or international loans? I’d be interested in hearing your alternative perspective.



There is nothing to suggest that this is not already the case, in-fact according to the Sixth Review with the IMF both the government and the global financial institutions have agreed to a successor program after the debt relief to manage their relationship with clear checks and balances.

Misappropriation of funds would be flagged very quickly in such a system, and jeopardise future credit injections.

Good old bah humbug; let me ask you: toss the complexities of financial statements to aside for a moment, have you ever reconciled a double ledger? if so, could you offer an instance?

“A society grows great when old men plant trees in whose shade they shall never sit.” — Greek Proverb

That is quite a misuse of the proverb. Political leaders in .So are only out for themselves with their deeds only to benefit them and theirs, and not the public.