Nabi amaan
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Steamdevolopment
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I have hard time doing that the more I get to know about Muhammed.
The first problem is he had sex slaves.
It’s in the past, why be angry about a dead man?
Steamdevolopment
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I'm not angry, I merely question the idea that he is model or even what we would consider a good person.
Upon being surrounded by scum who verbally and physically abused Muhammad, I'd say a being a good person was not hard at the time.
Steamdevolopment
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The eternal Prophet of God cannot just be judged by the Arabian standards.
No matter the surrounding, it will never excuse reducing women to human flesh lights.
You know it’s likely women at his time were greatful for Mohammad because he gave them previously nonexistent rights.
So you should criticize men who today still hold these old standards.
Mohammad belongs to his time.
Steamdevolopment
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1) But doesn't the very fact that Mohammad's conduct have to be judged by the limited Arabic standard make him imperfect in relations to future generations and therefore not a role model for all time?
2) Also Muhammad's conduct which would be criticized by modern standards is blessed by God in the Quran, and therefore criticizing Muhammad also means criticizing God's allowance of this as imperfect?
3) Also my argument isn't that Muhammed did not bring rights to women, but that it was inadequate as guide for humanity for all times. It is just not good enough, we wouldn't accept 7th century Arabic standards for technology, why would we accept it for morality on a rational basis?
But doesn't the very fact that Mohammad's conduct have to be judged by the limited Arabic standard make him imperfect in relations to future generations and therefore not a role model for all time?
Also Muhammad's conduct which would be criticized by modern standards is blessed by God in the Quran, and therefore criticizing Muhammad also means criticizing God's allowance of this as imperfect?
That’s very wrong.
How do you know that in more than a millennia people will lay the same claim as you, call us savages and uncivilized? You don’t.
We’re a product of our time and Mohammed his.
He didn’t deviate in any way from his own contemporaries.
Of course that doesn’t make him moral by OUR stands.
How do you know that there is an absolute timeless and objective notion of morality?
In a thousand years, you and I can be the uncivilized savages.
Blame the salafists today who want to follow outdated and dumb ideas.
Steamdevolopment
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Islam claims to be the word of God and therefore the absolut truth about the universe and perfect and objective morality.
My argument is that moral is subjective and changes according with our understanding and the technoloical evolution, not objective as claimed by religious people. The morality that is subjective can be rationally reasoned in according with our understandning of the world, while the objective morality never changes even when fact of reality contradicts it, and this in many ways allows for more cruelty as it does not need a rational justification.
By example we know now more about the human psychology and the effects of forced sexual relations and the trauma and objective damage it causes and therefore ban any form of it, the sames for slavery as people who have done nothing wrong shouldn't be abused, but under objective morality this does not matter because the circular logic decrees that what is made from God is moral, and that is inherently irrational and thereby allows for continous forced rape and slavery as morally good.
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