You’re a reformist yourself. I’ve got to laugh at you tbh. Galool the liberal!
Mohammed Hijab gets called a pedo by the far-right, Zionists, and Ryan Garcia after an old video resurfaced in which he talks about underage marriage
- Thread starter Fobnimo Till I Dhimo
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Classic Scholars are human beings, we weigh their word against Islam. Islam is not a religion that teaches we blindly follow someone's opinion merely because of their status in the community.
Galool
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No, you just learned it in this thread and are now switching your entire argument to be based on it.
I have said and made clear several times that I was not speaking at all of any other criteria I was speaking about the age/puberty in isolation.
You keep bringing up other criteria to run away from answering the question.
That is why I even gave you the perfect hypothetical scenario in which all imagined criteria was met at 9, when I asked you if the marriage to you then is moral or immoral based on that, you could not answer. The implication is that you believe it is immoral, which also implies you believe the Prophet SWS marriage was immoral.
You sure you want to go back to that as you evaded the question the entire time.
Everyone can read and see it.
Below is hadeeth straight from Sahih Muslim Regarding Marriage. In Chapter 9 where the title itself says "Chapter: Seeking permission of a previously-married woman in words, and of a virgin by silence"
Sufyan reported on the basis of the same chain of transmitters (and the words are):
A woman who has been previously married (Thayyib) has more right to her person than her guardian; and a virgin's father must ask her consent from her, her consent being her silence, At times he said: Her silence is her affirmation.
وَحَدَّثَنَا ابْنُ أَبِي عُمَرَ، حَدَّثَنَا سُفْيَانُ، بِهَذَا الإِسْنَادِ وَقَالَ " الثَّيِّبُ أَحَقُّ بِنَفْسِهَا مِنْ وَلِيِّهَا وَالْبِكْرُ يَسْتَأْذِنُهَا أَبُوهَا فِي نَفْسِهَا وَإِذْنُهَا صُمَاتُهَا " . وَرُبَّمَا قَالَ " وَصَمْتُهَا إِقْرَارُهَا " .
This is one among many hadeeths and Verses in Islam that dictate and teach about marriage. It is all consent, permission, agreement etc. A child has no place in this business. Scholars or whatever title people have in Islam, they are all bound by Islam.
Sufyan reported on the basis of the same chain of transmitters (and the words are):
A woman who has been previously married (Thayyib) has more right to her person than her guardian; and a virgin's father must ask her consent from her, her consent being her silence, At times he said: Her silence is her affirmation.
وَحَدَّثَنَا ابْنُ أَبِي عُمَرَ، حَدَّثَنَا سُفْيَانُ، بِهَذَا الإِسْنَادِ وَقَالَ " الثَّيِّبُ أَحَقُّ بِنَفْسِهَا مِنْ وَلِيِّهَا وَالْبِكْرُ يَسْتَأْذِنُهَا أَبُوهَا فِي نَفْسِهَا وَإِذْنُهَا صُمَاتُهَا " . وَرُبَّمَا قَالَ " وَصَمْتُهَا إِقْرَارُهَا " .
This is one among many hadeeths and Verses in Islam that dictate and teach about marriage. It is all consent, permission, agreement etc. A child has no place in this business. Scholars or whatever title people have in Islam, they are all bound by Islam.
Im not the one pretending there is a set line one can get married that has traditionally been determined through puberty among other factors to determine physical maturity. But one thing is certain the prophet married aisha at 9 so it is possible within Islamic law for someone to reach the conditions from atleast that age
The question is if you dont have a set line what the hell are you arguing for???
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Galool
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But they [i.e., the hypocrites] say, "We have believed in Allāh and in the Messenger, and we obey"; then a party of them turns away after that. And those are not believers.
And when they are called to [the words of] Allāh and His Messenger to judge between them, at once a party of them turns aside [in refusal].
But if the right is theirs, they come to him in prompt obedience.
Is there disease in their hearts? Or have they doubted? Or do they fear that Allāh will be unjust to them, or His Messenger? Rather, it is they who are the wrongdoers [i.e., the unjust].
The only statement of the [true] believers when they are called to Allāh and His Messenger to judge between them is that they say, "We hear and we obey." And those are the successful.
And whoever obeys Allāh and His Messenger and fears Allāh and is conscious of Him - it is those who are the attainers.
And they swear by Allāh their strongest oaths that if you ordered them, they would go forth [in Allāh's cause]. Say, "Do not swear. [Such] obedience is known. Indeed, Allāh is [fully] Aware of that which you do."
Say, "Obey Allāh and obey the Messenger; but if you turn away - then upon him is only that [duty] with which he has been charged, and upon you is that with which you have been charged. And if you obey him, you will be [rightly] guided. And there is not upon the Messenger except the [responsibility for] clear notification."
Allāh has promised those who have believed among you and done righteous deeds that He will surely grant them succession [to authority] upon the earth just as He granted it to those before them and that He will surely establish for them [therein] their religion which He has preferred for them and that He will surely substitute for them, after their fear, security, [for] they worship Me, not associating anything with Me. But whoever disbelieves after that - then those are the defiantly disobedient.
And establish prayer and give zakāh and obey the Messenger - that you may receive mercy.
Never think that the disbelievers are causing failure [to Allāh] upon the earth. Their refuge will be the Fire - and how wretched the destination.
O you who have believed, let those whom your right hands possess and those who have not [yet] reached puberty among you ask permission of you [before entering] at three times: before the dawn prayer and when you put aside your clothing [for rest] at noon and after the night prayer. [These are] three times of privacy for you. There is no blame upon you nor upon them beyond these [periods], for they continually circulate among you - some of you, among others. Thus does Allāh make clear to you the verses [i.e., His ordinances]; and Allāh is Knowing and Wise.
And when the children among you reach puberty, let them ask permission [at all times] as those before them have done. Thus does Allāh make clear to you His verses; and Allāh is Knowing and Wise.
An-Nur 47-59
And when they are called to [the words of] Allāh and His Messenger to judge between them, at once a party of them turns aside [in refusal].
But if the right is theirs, they come to him in prompt obedience.
Is there disease in their hearts? Or have they doubted? Or do they fear that Allāh will be unjust to them, or His Messenger? Rather, it is they who are the wrongdoers [i.e., the unjust].
The only statement of the [true] believers when they are called to Allāh and His Messenger to judge between them is that they say, "We hear and we obey." And those are the successful.
And whoever obeys Allāh and His Messenger and fears Allāh and is conscious of Him - it is those who are the attainers.
And they swear by Allāh their strongest oaths that if you ordered them, they would go forth [in Allāh's cause]. Say, "Do not swear. [Such] obedience is known. Indeed, Allāh is [fully] Aware of that which you do."
Say, "Obey Allāh and obey the Messenger; but if you turn away - then upon him is only that [duty] with which he has been charged, and upon you is that with which you have been charged. And if you obey him, you will be [rightly] guided. And there is not upon the Messenger except the [responsibility for] clear notification."
Allāh has promised those who have believed among you and done righteous deeds that He will surely grant them succession [to authority] upon the earth just as He granted it to those before them and that He will surely establish for them [therein] their religion which He has preferred for them and that He will surely substitute for them, after their fear, security, [for] they worship Me, not associating anything with Me. But whoever disbelieves after that - then those are the defiantly disobedient.
And establish prayer and give zakāh and obey the Messenger - that you may receive mercy.
Never think that the disbelievers are causing failure [to Allāh] upon the earth. Their refuge will be the Fire - and how wretched the destination.
O you who have believed, let those whom your right hands possess and those who have not [yet] reached puberty among you ask permission of you [before entering] at three times: before the dawn prayer and when you put aside your clothing [for rest] at noon and after the night prayer. [These are] three times of privacy for you. There is no blame upon you nor upon them beyond these [periods], for they continually circulate among you - some of you, among others. Thus does Allāh make clear to you the verses [i.e., His ordinances]; and Allāh is Knowing and Wise.
And when the children among you reach puberty, let them ask permission [at all times] as those before them have done. Thus does Allāh make clear to you His verses; and Allāh is Knowing and Wise.
An-Nur 47-59
Galool,
I used to be like you, big ignoramus who thought attending few Halaqat and listening to half the Quran Tafseer granted me all the wisdom to play a knowledgeable dude who had the license to condemn other muslims in any disagreement I had with them.
It is not too late saxib to reflect on your ignorance and go back to the basics. You may not even pray five times on the regular yet quote verses to aim at others who could be more pious than you can ever be.
Dude, get your religious facts straight cause it shows inaad jaahil tahay. Yaa Damiin, wax baro.
And there is no marriage in Islam without Consent, so you can not marry a 9 year old.
Galool
VIP
I have only posted the consensus of Ahul-Sunnah and the Ayat of Allah SWT. Somehow this upset you so much you are throwing around baseless accusation and insults.
Your issue is not with me but with fundamental Islamic beliefs.
The personal insults you're throwing around just displays your own character.
Is it not ironic that in your disagreement with not my personal opinion but uncontroversial agreed upon Sunni doctrine you have given yourself the license to condemn me while you do not know me personally or my own level of piety? Reflect on your own words if they mean anything to you.
"The jurists have agreed that one of the obstacles to submission is young age. Therefore, a young girl who cannot bear intercourse should not be submitted to her husband until she matures and this obstacle is removed, because excessive desire may lead to harm for her.
The Maliki and Shafi'i schools have considered the obstacle of young age as being removed by her ability to bear intercourse. The Shafi'i school says: Even if the husband says, 'Submit her to me but I will not have intercourse with her until she can bear it,' she should not be submitted to him even if he is trustworthy, because he cannot be trusted in the heat of desire.
And the Hanbali school says: When the young girl reaches nine years old, she is handed over to her husband, and they do not have the authority to withhold her after reaching nine, even if she has a skinny body. Ahmad (bin Hanbal) confirmed this, based on the established fact that the Prophet, peace be upon him, married Aisha when she was nine years old. However, Judge (Al-Qadi) said: This is not my view in a definitive manner, rather (Imam Ahmad) has mentioned that usually at the age of nine a female becomes able to have intimacy.'
And if a nine-year-old girl is submitted to him (the husband) and she fears harm due to his stature, she can prevent him from having intercourse with her, and he can enjoy her just as he enjoys a menstruating woman."
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marcellady
Nathan's DustyLyft
I’m speechless
Hadith is not on the same level as the Quran.You can’t question Sahih cause it don’t sit right with you
Hadiths were transmitted orally for several generations before being compiled in written form, the hadiths without a doubt are full for human error and cultural/political influences over time.
Galool
VIP
But no, by your Lord, they will not [truly] believe until they make you, [O Muḥammad], judge concerning that over which they dispute among themselves and then find within themselves no discomfort from what you have judged and submit in [full, willing] submission.
And if We had decreed upon them, "Kill yourselves" or "Leave your homes," they would not have done it, except for a few of them. But if they had done what they were instructed, it would have been better for them and a firmer position [for them in faith].
And then We would have given them from Us a great reward.
And We would have guided them to a straight path.
And whoever obeys Allāh and the Messenger - those will be with the ones upon whom Allāh has bestowed favor of the prophets, the steadfast affirmers of truth, the martyrs and the righteous. And excellent are those as companions.
That is the bounty from Allāh, and sufficient is Allāh as Knower.
An-Nisa 65-70
And if We had decreed upon them, "Kill yourselves" or "Leave your homes," they would not have done it, except for a few of them. But if they had done what they were instructed, it would have been better for them and a firmer position [for them in faith].
And then We would have given them from Us a great reward.
And We would have guided them to a straight path.
And whoever obeys Allāh and the Messenger - those will be with the ones upon whom Allāh has bestowed favor of the prophets, the steadfast affirmers of truth, the martyrs and the righteous. And excellent are those as companions.
That is the bounty from Allāh, and sufficient is Allāh as Knower.
An-Nisa 65-70
No, you have posted nothing but ignorance and unislamic views.
That ignorant fool Galool should read this.
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Galool
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You have thumbs down a post in which there is nothing but the ayat of Allah SWT.
Even those disagreeing with me know everything I have posted is standard Sunni Islam.
You have contributed nothing but random insults.
I dont know if you are fully sound of mind therefore I will not pursue any discussion with you.
Do you agree with that? What @World posted?
1.) There can be more then one major classical opinion on a topic. There just isnt one regarding age of consent being 18 in Islam
2.) Nice pivot. You’re a deviant for rejecting and i quote “the” classical opinion. You havent even denied being a reformist or liberal lol im happy if your the face of this
Another example of liberal feminism inching people towards hadith rejection and kufr.
@Galool you are truly a strong man if your able to endure this brainrot in generals. I forget how much gaalo and liberals roam this place
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