Modernity and the Demise of Love

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Love is considered to be one of the purest and most fundamental emotions of humanity. Its manifestations may vary greatly—from a mother’s affection towards her child to cheap and shallow pop romances. However, there is pretty much a consensus in public discourse regarding love being something positive and even necessary.

Within modern pop culture (such as in cinema, music, etc.), love is often employed as a tool in order to make and increase sales.

But does the possibility of love really even exist with modernity?

Modern Love: Is It Even Real Love?​

Denis de Rougemont (1906-1985) was a Swiss essayist, and despite him not really being well-known in the English-speaking world, he was quite influential in France from the ’30s onwards. This is also the period when he wrote his most famous book, Love in the Western World.

He says that what is widely considered today as being “love” actually has its roots in medieval Europe; specifically among the troubadours (a kind of wandering public poets) of France, Italy and Spain. These troubadours themselves were influenced by the Cathars—a Gnostic sect deemed heretical by the Catholic Church—and eventually eradicated during the Albigensian Crusade (1209–1229).

Denis de Rougement shows that the idea of love espoused by the troubadours and Cathars was not Christian in nature. Their conception of it was essentially pagan in essence, with love equating eros or “boundless passion” whereas Christianity puts more emphasis on agape (a Greek word which basically refers to love as selfless charity).

We could see it as a sort of Shirk-grounded “love” devoid of modesty and without restraint in its expression. The objective is purely carnal and not religious.

In order to prove his thesis, Denis de Rougement carries out a detailed examination of the history of Western literature, from the popular medieval Tristan and Iseult romance (based on some Celtic legends of the Arthurian cycle) to more recent authors such as Cervantes, Wagner, etc.

The later passages of the book are more relevant to our discussion, as this is where he makes a connection between such “passional” love and the crisis of our modern world.

For instance, how passion being equated with love basically led to the legitimization and normalization of zina (pp. 276-277):

The appearance of the passion of Love was bound radically to transform the attitude to adultery.
[…]
Only thus can we account for the fact that in the twelfth century an adulterer or adulteress suddenly became somebody ‘interesting’. King David, in lying with Bath-sheba, was held to have committed a crime and to have made himself into an object of contempt. But when Tristan carries off Iseult, his deed turns into romance, and he makes himself into an object of admiration. What had hitherto been a ‘fault’ and what could only give rise to edifying remarks on the perils of sin and on remorse now became—in symbol—something mystically virtuous, and later on was degraded (in literature) into a disturbing and alluring entanglement.
RELATED: Debate Over the Legalization of Zina in Morocco

This is typical of cultural-liberalism. Just take a look at the multitude of movies and TV series that portray adulterers and adulteresses as being some sort of heroes.

Netflix utilizes such psychological tricks in an attempt to normalize obviously abnormal behaviors, employing clever and emotional characterization.

RELATED: Netflix Pushes Sexual Liberation on the Muslim World. The Surprising History of Its Founder

After all, if love is merely just passion, then what value does the “patriarchal institution” of marriage entail anyway? Why restrain two “free” individuals whose only desire is to express their love for one another?

According to Denis de Rougement, this passional concept of love had a certain easily anticipated and short-term consequence for society: the breakdown of marriage (also the title of an entire chapter in his book).

When someone grows up watching “romantic” movies and TV series, they’d naturally expect to have a daily dose of romance.

This is obviously impossible even from a purely neurobiological perspective, as this person’s dopamine receptors have intentionally been messed up by the mass-media in order to transform them into a consumerist junkie. It is for this reason that they’re always craving more.

Nobody would ever be “happy” or content within a marriage if happiness is synonymous with a constant stream of daily outings, flowers, poetry, and whatnot.

Besides this love-passion notion, Denis de Rougement says the other reasons behind the implosion of the institution of marriage are feminism and psychologization (note how he was writing this in the ’30s).

RELATED: The False God of Modern Psychology

We read on p. 294:

It is also clear that the present breakdown of marriage, in Europe as in America, results from a plurality of profound or proximate causes, of which the cult of romance is but an instance. (But it was my due to myself to insist on it here.) For the quest for individual happiness to have precedence on social stability, and for respect of psychological evolution to have precedence on the meaning of a vow, is something which can be connected with the romantic complex. But there is more to it, and in other domains, or at other levels of reality, at times social and at other times psychical.
Woman’s emancipation—her entrance into the professions and her claim to equality of treatment—is a perceptible factor in the breakdown. The popularization of psychological knowledge is another.

Love During Times of Individualism, Materialism and Secularism​

We now understand how people’s understanding of love has become skewed, so let’s also take a deeper look at how modernity shaped such an understanding.

Zygmunt Bauman (1925-2017) was a Polish sociologist of ethnic Jewish origins who conceptualized the idea of “liquid modernity.”

Bauman refused to embrace the idea of “postmodernity” as, according to him, we were still in the process of modernization or late modernization and that solid modernity was being replaced by liquid modernity.

As detailed in his book, Liquid Love, he uses “liquid” to denote the frail and transitory nature of modernity as a whole, including human relationships.

In Bauman’s view, maintaining bonds within liquid modernity is an arduous task. For example, this is the reason why he thinks many don’t wish to “create a family,” i.e., have children (p. 43):

‘Creating a family’ is like jumping headlong into uncharted waters of unfathomed depth. Forfeiting or postponing other seductive consumer joys of an attraction as yet untried, unknown and impossible to predict, itself an awesome sacrifice stridently jarring with the habits of a prudent consumer, is not its only likely consequence.
Having children means weighing the welfare of another, weaker and dependent, being against one’s own comfort. The autonomy of one’s own preferences is bound to be compromised, and ever anew: year by year; daily. One may become, horror of horrors, ‘dependent‘. Having children may mean the need to lower one’s professional ambitions, to ‘sacrifice a career’, as the people sitting in judgement over professional performance would look askance at any sign of divided loyalty. Most painfully, having children means accepting such loyalty-dividing dependence for an indefinite time, entering an open-ended and irrevocable commitment with no ‘until further notice’ clause attached; the kind of obligation that goes against the grain of liquid modern life politics and which most people at most times zealously avoid in the other manifestations of their lives. Awakening to such a commitment may be a traumatic experience. Post-natal depression and post-childbirth marital (or partnership) crises look like specifically ‘liquid modern’ ailments, in the same way as anorexia, bulimia, and countless varieties of allergy.
 
The “Muslim feminists,” with their cultural-liberal rhetoric about “being independent” and “autonomous,” should be concerned by these lines.

RELATED: Confessions of a Muslim Ex-Feminist

Another author who sees the demise of love within modernity is the contemporary Morocco-born Israeli sociologist Eva Illouz.

She argues that love is suffering from what you might call the intrusion of cultural capitalism (a consumerist approach to relationships, seeing love as a form of “transaction” that you can easily withdraw from, and so on).

But these authors are often some sort of Marxist, and the enemy is conveniently always capitalism. Whereas the real culprits may in reality be a set of factors defining much of the modern-liberal Western civilization: individualism, materialism, and secularism. And despite these being phenomena being linked with capitalism, they also go beyond just capitalism alone.

After all, within an individualistic society or civilization, only the “sovereign” individual’s “feelings” matter. So why even maintain a “relationship” when you could satisfy your primal urges through short-term sexual “adventures”? If it’s all just about you and you alone, why even “bother” committing to a long-term relationship, let alone marriage, with all the pseudo-romantic gimmicks?

Materialism intervenes in the sense that, from a materialistic perspective, the idea of “pure love” itself is redundant. It’s all about neuronal connections. And from the perspective of neo-Darwinian evolutionary psychology (see the works of Geoffrey Miller), it’s all about “mating” and “transmitting your genes.”

Why would anyone even bother with “love” when operating within such a paradigm?

Is there even a place for love under such a cold worldview, apart from being a mere utilitarian and temporary lie—ahem—instrument?

As for the secularization process, it’s because it destroys the very meaning of love itself:

Love becomes individualistic and materialistic only when society is disconnected from religion. Only religion could define love in the same way that it defines everything else, with its rules and limits being set by the Creator Himself.


 
The definition of independent:

"not depending on another for livelihood or subsistence"

"free from outside control; not subject to another's authority"


When will you insecure males stop conflating your misogyny with Islam? Unfortunately for you, women are not your slaves, we have the right to be independent, we have the right to study, work and we don't even have to share our income with our husbands. I know that burns you up inside. Now back on ignore you go. I just wanted to share this comment for the sisters who are in threat of falling for your bullshit.

First they used 'feminist' as an insult, now they are coming for 'independent'.

You ladies and sane men, see where this is headed right?
 

Yaraye

VIP
She argues that love is suffering from what you might call the intrusion of cultural capitalism (a consumerist approach to relationships, seeing love as a form of “transaction” that you can easily withdraw from, and so on).

Materialism intervenes in the sense that, from a materialistic perspective, the idea of “pure love” itself is redundant. It’s all about neuronal connections. And from the perspective of neo-Darwinian evolutionary psychology (see the works of Geoffrey Miller), it’s all about “mating” and “transmitting your genes.”
Wake up!:comeon: No one will love you unconditionally except your blood. Marriage always has some kind of transaction/ conditions on both ends. There might be affection/ fondness in the mix, but not unconditional love. That's only your parents and your kids.
Go Away What GIF by TNC Africa
 
View attachment 248857


Love is considered to be one of the purest and most fundamental emotions of humanity. Its manifestations may vary greatly—from a mother’s affection towards her child to cheap and shallow pop romances. However, there is pretty much a consensus in public discourse regarding love being something positive and even necessary.

Within modern pop culture (such as in cinema, music, etc.), love is often employed as a tool in order to make and increase sales.

But does the possibility of love really even exist with modernity?

Modern Love: Is It Even Real Love?​

Denis de Rougemont (1906-1985) was a Swiss essayist, and despite him not really being well-known in the English-speaking world, he was quite influential in France from the ’30s onwards. This is also the period when he wrote his most famous book, Love in the Western World.

He says that what is widely considered today as being “love” actually has its roots in medieval Europe; specifically among the troubadours (a kind of wandering public poets) of France, Italy and Spain. These troubadours themselves were influenced by the Cathars—a Gnostic sect deemed heretical by the Catholic Church—and eventually eradicated during the Albigensian Crusade (1209–1229).

Denis de Rougement shows that the idea of love espoused by the troubadours and Cathars was not Christian in nature. Their conception of it was essentially pagan in essence, with love equating eros or “boundless passion” whereas Christianity puts more emphasis on agape (a Greek word which basically refers to love as selfless charity).

We could see it as a sort of Shirk-grounded “love” devoid of modesty and without restraint in its expression. The objective is purely carnal and not religious.

In order to prove his thesis, Denis de Rougement carries out a detailed examination of the history of Western literature, from the popular medieval Tristan and Iseult romance (based on some Celtic legends of the Arthurian cycle) to more recent authors such as Cervantes, Wagner, etc.

The later passages of the book are more relevant to our discussion, as this is where he makes a connection between such “passional” love and the crisis of our modern world.

For instance, how passion being equated with love basically led to the legitimization and normalization of zina (pp. 276-277):


RELATED: Debate Over the Legalization of Zina in Morocco

This is typical of cultural-liberalism. Just take a look at the multitude of movies and TV series that portray adulterers and adulteresses as being some sort of heroes.

Netflix utilizes such psychological tricks in an attempt to normalize obviously abnormal behaviors, employing clever and emotional characterization.

RELATED: Netflix Pushes Sexual Liberation on the Muslim World. The Surprising History of Its Founder

After all, if love is merely just passion, then what value does the “patriarchal institution” of marriage entail anyway? Why restrain two “free” individuals whose only desire is to express their love for one another?

According to Denis de Rougement, this passional concept of love had a certain easily anticipated and short-term consequence for society: the breakdown of marriage (also the title of an entire chapter in his book).

When someone grows up watching “romantic” movies and TV series, they’d naturally expect to have a daily dose of romance.

This is obviously impossible even from a purely neurobiological perspective, as this person’s dopamine receptors have intentionally been messed up by the mass-media in order to transform them into a consumerist junkie. It is for this reason that they’re always craving more.

Nobody would ever be “happy” or content within a marriage if happiness is synonymous with a constant stream of daily outings, flowers, poetry, and whatnot.

Besides this love-passion notion, Denis de Rougement says the other reasons behind the implosion of the institution of marriage are feminism and psychologization (note how he was writing this in the ’30s).

RELATED: The False God of Modern Psychology

We read on p. 294:


Love During Times of Individualism, Materialism and Secularism​

We now understand how people’s understanding of love has become skewed, so let’s also take a deeper look at how modernity shaped such an understanding.

Zygmunt Bauman (1925-2017) was a Polish sociologist of ethnic Jewish origins who conceptualized the idea of “liquid modernity.”

Bauman refused to embrace the idea of “postmodernity” as, according to him, we were still in the process of modernization or late modernization and that solid modernity was being replaced by liquid modernity.

As detailed in his book, Liquid Love, he uses “liquid” to denote the frail and transitory nature of modernity as a whole, including human relationships.

In Bauman’s view, maintaining bonds within liquid modernity is an arduous task. For example, this is the reason why he thinks many don’t wish to “create a family,” i.e., have children (p. 43):
This is an enlightening thread. I really liked the excerpt from Bauman you added onto the end. He seemed to summarize my feelings of anxiety around children/marriage in a concise and understanding manner. I will try to check out his book.
 
Materialism intervenes in the sense that, from a materialistic perspective, the idea of “pure love” itself is redundant. It’s all about neuronal connections. And from the perspective of neo-Darwinian evolutionary psychology (see the works of Geoffrey Miller), it’s all about “mating” and “transmitting your genes.”

Why would anyone even bother with “love” when operating within such a paradigm?

Is there even a place for love under such a cold worldview, apart from being a mere utilitarian and temporary lie—ahem—instrument?

As for the secularization process, it’s because it destroys the very meaning of love itself:

Love becomes individualistic and materialistic only when society is disconnected from religion. Only religion could define love in the same way that it defines everything else, with its rules and limits being set by the Creator Himself.
Looking at the world through a materialist lens has taken a lot of the beauty and spirituality out of our lives.
The “Muslim feminists,” with their cultural-liberal rhetoric about “being independent” and “autonomous,” should be concerned by these lines.
It is a losing game for women to measure their own success and self worth with standards we have for men. It will feel like chasing your own tail and will probably result in a lifelong inferiority complex and resentment.
I don't know how women wanting to make their own money and bring value to the market through their skills is an issue. Women have always been in the labour force. In our post-industrial, highly educated world - there are so many opportunities to increase your skills and sell your labour / products for more. Women, alongside men have the opportunity to make a way for themselves in this capitalist economy.
We can never truly be independent, man or woman. We are a product of the work our parents put into us.
 
Looking at the world through a materialist lens has taken a lot of the beauty and spirituality out of our lives.

It is a losing game for women to measure their own success and self worth with standards we have for men. It will feel like chasing your own tail and will probably result in a lifelong inferiority complex and resentment.
I don't know how women wanting to make their own money and bring value to the market through their skills is an issue. Women have always been in the labour force. In our post-industrial, highly educated world - there are so many opportunities to increase your skills and sell your labour / products for more. Women, alongside men have the opportunity to make a way for themselves in this capitalist economy.
We can never truly be independent, man or woman. We are a product of the work our parents put into us.
This isn’t about women working, like you stated women have always worked. Even if you go to traditional rural parts of world in which people still rely on produce and agriculture ect, it is women that are working the fields and feeding cattle. Some studies show that they do even more work than the men.

The real crux of the issue is daring to be paid for you labour which leads to what they think is independence. The idea of women having enough finances to look after her themselves is the problem for them. It isn’t the backbreaking work, it isn’t conditions you’re working in since women’s historical work was a lot more arduous than it is today in the West. it’s simply the fact that you’re able to sustain yourself and at times are able to live a lifestyle that even they can’t afford.

For all of this articles talk of materialism, why is that you find that these Muslim men influenced by the manosphere such as DH ect all support and fawn over Andrew Tate? Is it his manners? Certainly not, he’s proven to be vulgar. Is it is intelligence? Certainly not. It’s because of materialism. Andrew Tate is rich and has influence. That is what they crave and regard as the peak of manliness. Absolute materialism, yet when Muslim women want to earn halal money they’ll parrot articles mentioning materialism and capitalism, whilst also championing a man in the corn industry.

We see through you.
The definition of independent:






When will you insecure males stop conflating your misogyny with Islam? Unfortunately for you, women are not your slaves, we have the right to be independent, we have the right to study, work and we don't even have to share our income with our husbands. I know that burns you up inside. Now back on ignore you go. I just wanted to share this comment for the sisters who are in threat of falling for your bullshit.

First they used 'feminist' as an insult, now they are coming for 'independent'.

You ladies and sane men, see where this is headed right?
Like I said sis, we see through them. They’ll condemn materialism whilst uplifting a ographer (Tate) because drumroll…….materialism. They think he’s the epitome of masculinity because of the money, cars and women. All of that is materialism.
 
The definition of independent:






When will you insecure males stop conflating your misogyny with Islam? Unfortunately for you, women are not your slaves, we have the right to be independent, we have the right to study, work and we don't even have to share our income with our husbands. I know that burns you up inside. Now back on ignore you go. I just wanted to share this comment for the sisters who are in threat of falling for your bullshit.

First they used 'feminist' as an insult, now they are coming for 'independent'.

You ladies and sane men, see where this is headed right?
You ignored his entire post and concentrated on one sentence
have you got nothing else to add?
 
This isn’t about women working, like you stated women have always worked. Even if you go to traditional rural parts of world in which people still rely on produce and agriculture ect, it is women that are working the fields and feeding cattle. Some studies show that they do even more work than the men.
Absolutely..a 2013 Oxfam report found that 80% of farm work in India was performed by women, Indian men have searched for work outside of the field but it is 'taboo' for rural women to find work in the cities. Women are behind the labour which produce food for not only their massive country but the world ( rice) same with Vietnam. They are highly likely to be underpaid for it too.
The real crux of the issue is daring to be paid for you labour which leads to what they think is independence. The idea of women having enough finances to look after her themselves is the problem for them. It isn’t the backbreaking work, it isn’t conditions you’re working in since women’s historical work was a lot more arduous than it is today in the West. it’s simply the fact that you’re able to sustain yourself and at times are able to live a lifestyle that even they can’t afford.
It seems like nobody minds the "female labour" of women who are in poverty. It is because their condition isn't enviable. Its like it was never an issue. Women were maids, farmhands, factory workers since time immemorial but were always just "scraping by." The issue seems to be with middle class women in the workforce.
For all of this articles talk of materialism, why is that you find that these Muslim men influenced by the manosphere such as DH ect all support and fawn over Andrew Tate? Is it his manners? Certainly not, he’s proven to be vulgar. Is it is intelligence? Certainly not. It’s because of materialism. Andrew Tate is rich and has influence. That is what they crave and regard as the peak of manliness. Absolute materialism, yet when Muslim women want to earn halal money they’ll parrot articles mentioning materialism and capitalism, whilst also championing a man in the corn industry.
:ohhhdamn:you never miss!! These men attach so much value to the material success of this man... the cars, the house, the ego, the fame, the women. They admire it all, even before he "became Muslim". They think we cant see right through it.
 

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