Landlord breaksdown crying after tenants vandalize his rental property for telling them to pay rent!

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
Stupid law and idea

why does a cleaner get paid 10$ an hour but a pilot makes way way more or a heart surgeon?

because the cleaner has no skills and anyone can do it, no disrespect, just their value is lower, but a heart surgeon makes millions for his hospital

if you want someone to be paid more, increase their skills, educate them more, dont make a law

let me teach you a basic economic lesson called marginal utility, you get paid what revenue you bring to a company, the cleaner only makes 15$ , the heart surgeon way more and the movie star end of the day earns millions for the studio

why would pay someone 5004 when they only bring in 1004 in value, anything more than 100$ is a loss

i mean look at the illogical position of your idea, why only $300, why not stipulate by law $600 or $2000

why only 300 when you can magically wave a wand and force firms to pay them $300

wallahi socialists and communists lack common sense and logic

@Sultan keenadiid is back @Periplus I thought we had the guy hanging on the ropes, maybe this will keep him down for the 10 count at least. It doesn't matter if we shift Somalis to high skilled segment, it's all about supply/demand, if 90% of them are high skilled, companies have more leverage as they can set the 'wage low' because there is a market full of them to benefit from.

Where-as in Somalia the bulk of the people are at the low to semi skilled, the reason they get paid less isn't due to having less skill, it's due to the market being full of them only. If there was only 1 cleaner left in a population of 10 million, they can dictate higher wages because where-else will a company go to seek these services.
 
Dont make a law forcing companies to pay x or y

educate people, give them skills, knowledge etc, and allow capital formation to accumulate so firms can invest in labour and their skills, this is how wages go up

why does a pilot make more money than say a warehouse worker? the pilot needs massive training and skills and cilmi in maths, physics, engineering literally

and that pilot brings in massive revenue, lets do the maths,

airbus plane has 800, 800 X 500$, = $400,000 that is a low estimate of $500, price could be 700, 800$ for a long haul international flight

that is why a pilot long haul flights gets paid £100,000 starting, he brings in revenue,

say what you want, if you only bring me in £5 an hour, paying you more is a loss i will not accept and would rather close, or simply get robots

but increase productivity, cut taxes, regulations and do not allow the president to allow his nephew to steal businesses and society becomes richer,

also get gold standard in place for gold cannot br printed but paper money can be evaporated over night

a gold ounce coin in ancient Rome could you buy you a nice sandals and toga, $2000 in todays money can buy you a nice suit and shoes and much left over

gold is god's money and helps the average poor keep their purchasing power , this is why governments hate gold


but both the US constitution and islam has demanded gold and silver should be only money,. go figure

@DR OSMAN why only $300, why not $10,000 minimum wage a week?

lets see the doctor answer that one,
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Sultan keenadiid Wages need to reflect cost of living for many reasons.

1. U drive up consumption and generate more investors n business ppl to create further employment

2. Noone will work if they don't have their basics covered

3. It's a damn human right that ppl should be paid according to living conditions and costs or why else work if you can't cover these basics. This will lead to no employment or low quality employees which will effect the business model

4. I only said the minimum wage should cover food-housing-health cost of a person as a bare minimum, Im not setting up minimum wages without any guiding principle like you tried to make me out to be.
 

Periplus

It is what it is
VIP
@Sultan keenadiid

Bro, you are getting confused.

Let’s get some things straight.

1. The vast majority of people are workers

2. The consumption of goods is reliant on workers

3. Having social programs increases GDP (increases consumption and government spending)

Now, I have a simple question for you:

Can you guarantee that big businesses will always strive not to “f*ck over” their worker?

Im not asking for generous pay but at least a guarantee that the worker can make ends meet.

If you can’t make that guarantee then you have realised the need for government intervention.
 
My point was that those who generally scream about the “government bogeyman interfering in their industry” are those who will turn to government when the going gets tough.

I completely agree that what the banks did was fraudulent and that Bush and other presidents were also culpable.

I am also against “capitalist socialism” of pursuing socialist policies whenever big business fucks up.

My point is that in 2008, I didn’t see any of these banks or free market cheerleaders refusing their handouts.

yur wrong, maybe too young, but every free market guy i know today was against government bailing out banks, socialise loses but privatised profits, very very wrong and many were against it

also you claimed free market caused the 2008 recession, speaking to you about economics is a waste of time if all you throw is a cheap line with no backing, explanations

@Removed seems to either be an economist or has common sense and pointed the finger at the state interventionism and will nilly federal reserve printing money will nilly for bushes every American should own a home dream BS so he can win votes

nothing to do with free market, in fact the free market would have allowed these banks to go bust as a punishment for their actions,

but the big banks all knew daddy government see theme s too big to fail, and will bail them out because they spend millions each year lobbying the state and election campaign funds

yet you seem to only blame the free market, the only system that punishes the likes of Lehman brothers and others

also the use of riba, this is why they print money and charge riba, well digital creation now, something the Austrians and other free markets are deeply against as they know riba causes the boom and bust cycle and makes the rich richer and poor poorer

please read Austrian economics before you judge it

read basic economics and listen to free markets economists like peter Schiff, Mises.org, Ron Paul, Tom Woods, and dead ones like Murry rothbard, Ludwig von Mises, VonHayek etc before you judge


 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Sultan keenadiid

Bro, you are getting confused.

Let’s get some things straight.

1. The vast majority of people are workers

2. The consumption of goods is reliant on workers

3. Having social programs increases GDP (increases consumption and government spending)

Now, I have a simple question for you:

Can you guarantee that big businesses will always strive not to “f*ck over” their worker?

Im not asking for generous pay but at least a guarantee that the worker can make ends meet.

If you can’t make that guarantee then you have realised the need for government intervention.

Our brother @Sultan keenadiid is fuming like a typical conservative but as the facts start to dawn on him, he sees himself shifting towards socialism but his 'kicking n screaming' as they normally all do because he can't stand that 'majority of academics n experts are socialists'.

He clearly didn't read a single point I raised when I refuted him about skilled worker vs low skilled, he think's it's about the skill and not about the supply of those skills in the market. Imagine they're was 10 million ppl with pilot skills and only 100 people with cleaner skills? who wud u pay more @Periplus? obviously the cleaner because they're is less of them.

It's purely a numbers game that determines what someone is paid not their skill at all.
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Periplus this capitalist run markets simply work on supply/demand no matter if it's a commodity, material, labor, etc. The reason cleaners r paid less is because the bulk majority of the population can 'apply for that job' hence this brings down their wages, well not in Australia as they are careful to ensure no-one goes below minimum or 'award' rates for industry.

The Australians cleverly protected their unskilled worker and ensured they can become consumers also which is of course in the interest of business people, the more consumers, the more production they produce or even cross investment opportunities into other industries.

The GDP is centered around consumption n production levels of each country. Somalia daily consumption is 1 dollar day per person against 10 million population x 365 days, that's roughly around $3-4 billion a year. A good addition of 1-2 billion flows in from remittance and diaspora investors. Surely anyone who cares for Somalia general well being, we need to end this model as soon as possible.
 

MT Foxtrot

Anti-qabil
@DR OSMAN @Periplus

Morgan Freeman Applause GIF by The Academy Awards
 
@Sultan keenadiid

Bro, you are getting confused.

Let’s get some things straight.

1. The vast majority of people are workers

2. The consumption of goods is reliant on workers

3. Having social programs increases GDP (increases consumption and government spending)

Now, I have a simple question for you:

Can you guarantee that big businesses will always strive not to “f*ck over” their worker?

Im not asking for generous pay but at least a guarantee that the worker can make ends meet.

If you can’t make that guarantee then you have realised the need for government intervention.


No my cousin , you are confused

1) workers are nothing with out the investors/ capitalist / entrepreneurs who take the risk = do you work? who provides the bloody computers, desks, building rent, ? who makes you more efficient? its their money and their invest they have used to buy capital to make yuo more productive? a worker digging with a machine is much faster than a one using a spoon, they gave you the bloody capital and your only risk is you can leave them any them, they must make profit or go bust

2) consumption by black ass, no one can consume with out investment first to produce said goods to be consumed and no one can invest with out saving said investment,

where did you get the money to buy those goods? a job, where did it come from, investors created said job

why dont you create your own job ?

3) social programs cannot exist unless investors are taxed on their hard earned savings/investment, workers do not pay tax unless they have a job, profits are not taxed unless made by the capitalist first

4) why would firms abuse workers? in a free market if you get abused you can just go to another workers, besides why would they invest thousands in you then abuse you?
 
@Periplus

are you a slave? can you not also set up your own bloody company and hire people? why do you think like a slave owned by a business? your free to work

this guy did not hold a gun to your head, he asked you or in fact you went to him and begged him for work

get off your back side and attract investors to your business idea and become like him and work 18 hours a day with no guarantee for profit and if you make it, good for you, if not then go and beg him for work for he is not holding you back from starting a firm

is he holding you rom starting your own company? bloody communists mind set with no logic and no reason skills

workers are not abused because no one holds a gun to their head and they can walk any time,

also no one stops the worker from starting their own business and seeking investors

some people seem envious
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Periplus I think @Sultan keenadiid is one of those ancient thinkers. Anything can form as a currency as long as it's accepted by the people which makes it legal. Look at Crypto now, as long as ppl buy in and trust a currency, that's all that matter, the currency itself can be anything, what counts more is the people trust in it which depends on it's reliability, stability, ease of access, market valuation, etc.

Gold was used because ppl trusted in it and it was nothing more then a global tender that two people could use as a measure to value goods or products on. But since the world is no longer living in isolated islands, there is a world order now, the amount we trade today do u realize how much gold that needs to be dug up? before it was just small kingdoms trading with nearby kingdoms if something went wrong with their trade it wouldn't effect the globe. Now gold is like oil, it's a natural resource this means it's 'finite' or can be depleted.

This is a big risk in global market place if something went wrong with Gold in terms of depletion or even 'war' in places where it's abudant would send the world shutting down. The country where gold is located are some of the most insecure nations and to have your currency lifeline rely on those places is an insane currency policy to take.
 

Removed

Gif-King
VIP
My point was that those who generally scream about the “government bogeyman interfering in their industry” are those who will turn to government when the going gets tough.

I completely agree that what the banks did was fraudulent and that Bush and other presidents were also culpable.

I am also against “capitalist socialism” of pursuing socialist policies whenever big business fucks up.

My point is that in 2008, I didn’t see any of these banks or free market cheerleaders refusing their handouts.
In 2008 it was all the younger pseudo-socialists in occupy wall street who were indifferent with government interference and only focused on “the 1%” having too much money for their liking.

Businessmen (most intense supporters of capitalism) especially outside of the billionaire class largely fight to kill one another it was the biggest spit in the face to them when all the bigger fish got saved from failure and having their wealth trickle into the rest of the economy. Heres a video showcasing the above
 

Periplus

It is what it is
VIP
It’s almost 3 am where I live.

Let’s pause this discussion for tomorrow which is in a few hours for me.

:samwelcome:
 
You mean the government intervention that bailed those banks out even after committing fraud. 2008 is literally the worst recent example of intervention from the gov. it was a complete defilement of the free market, am I misunderstanding your point?

Actually if I remember correctly the system that caused them to start giving out housing loans willy nilly and repackaging them was from the nudging of the bush administration to encourage more home ownership for minorities.


i must say sir your genius amazes me at how you have grasped what these silly champagne socialist kids cannot grasp

the logical deductive skills of these young ones today has been destroyed by game consoles and champagn socialists on YouTube who parrot the greatness of the utopia known as socialism,

the hate the free makret that ahs free billions in india, china, africa ever since they became more free market oriented which is just a fancy term for let people create firms and employ people and beg them to buy their goods with out holding a gun to their heads, hence the free market rather than waiting for daddy government to give said firms special interest

i would love it if some of these kids were shipped to cuba or north korea for a few months to respect the beauty of the free market and its gift to the human race
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Periplus @Sultan keenadiid I am sorry to inform you also. Unregulated market in itself is detrimental to small to medium enterprises, the biggest company will form in the land and buy out or merge smaller n medium enterprises, it will lead to ogligarchy. A good example is Haiti, a capitalist came in, plundered their resources, his a billionaire, while the ppl are so poor they eating 'mud biscuits'.

Oh yes poverty can get to the point ppl eat biscuits made of mud. So it's even in the interest of the whole market the GOVT doesn't play preferences with any single company, it has to have holistic view of small-medium-large and set up laws on how they can co-exist without leading to a top dog eating smaller dog. Even they need the regulations to protect themselves.
 
@Periplus I think @Sultan keenadiid is one of those ancient thinkers. Anything can form as a currency as long as it's accepted by the people which makes it legal. Look at Crypto now, as long as ppl buy in and trust a currency, that's all that matter, the currency itself can be anything, what counts more is the people trust in it which depends on it's reliability, stability, ease of access, market valuation, etc.

Gold was used because ppl trusted in it and it was nothing more then a global tender that two people could use as a measure to value goods or products on. But since the world is no longer living in isolated islands, there is a world order now, the amount we trade today do u realize how much gold that needs to be dug up? before it was just small kingdoms trading with nearby kingdoms if something went wrong with their trade it wouldn't effect the globe. Now gold is like oil, it's a natural resource this means it's 'finite' or can be depleted.

This is a big risk in global market place if something went wrong with Gold in terms of depletion or even 'war' in places where it's abudant would send the world shutting down. The country where gold is located are some of the most insecure nations and to have your currency lifeline rely on those places is an insane currency policy to take.


no my friend, anything cannot be money, it must have certain intrinsic value and characteristics

humans have used salt, hence the Latin word salary comes from the word salt, animals, sea shells, even females, Arabs would use females as money thousands of years ago

but they discovered gold and silver were the perfect money even Islam demands it and also paying zaka in gold for that reason,

to economists money must meet certain criteria's, and also bitcoin could be money but it will cost you $50 minimum cost to buy coffee due to heavy transaction costs

1636386544108.png
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
@Sultan keenadiid look at Australia coal miners, truckers, diggers, etc their paid 6 figure salaries, accodomation paid for, they fly in fly out 3 weeks and 1 week they get to go home all paid for. Ask @Periplus if u don't believe me.

Now look at the same miners in South Africa doing the same job on $2 dollars a day.


Now what's the difference between South Africa and Australia, it's literally the same skills involved, one protects it's low to semi skilled worker while the other doesn't. Me and @Periplus are not arguing for the government to get rich waryaa, we are saying the earnings of companies need be regulated to ensure low to semi skilled employees have their basics covered.

We are more interested in the lower-semi skilled populace being breadwinners and consumers because we know that will generate more companies to open up and create more employment. I know your arguing no interference needed, for lower-semi skilled workers interference is mandatory or else they can't negiotate with companies who can simply sack them for someone else in the market place who is willing to work cheap. U keep talking about high skilled workers shud be paid more and all this nonsense.

U fail to realize or grasp it's not about what skills someone has, but the supply side of those skills in the market determine wages, without govt interference, most aussie traders-factory workers-hospitality industry-etc wud be paid no more then what africans r paid and this wud lead to a low gdp. U seem to forget the GDP consumption n production are equal that means labor n investors are equal, without one or the other no-one is eating.
 

Removed

Gif-King
VIP
i must say sir your genius amazes me at how you have grasped what these silly champagne socialist kids cannot grasp

the logical deductive skills of these young ones today has been destroyed by game consoles and champagn socialists on YouTube who parrot the greatness of the utopia known as socialism,

the hate the free makret that ahs free billions in india, china, africa ever since they became more free market oriented which is just a fancy term for let people create firms and employ people and beg them to buy their goods with out holding a gun to their heads, hence the free market rather than waiting for daddy government to give said firms special interest

i would love it if some of these kids were shipped to cuba or north korea for a few months to respect the beauty of the free market and its gift to the human race
They need to experience the hardship of making a business.

Nobody who makes over 200k a year after working their heart away will think, “I would sure love if the government would take 100k+ from me now”.

Young starters making 30k-60k a year whose taxes are taken before they even see their check and only experience life as the employee just wont understand the stresses or grievances of an owner.
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
please explain what you mean by this ? regulate how? words have meanings dud

do you mean the state decides who can produce what and how and how much workers are paid? hasn't that failed in the Soviet Union, china before 1984?

failed in Europe during their flirtation with socialism when the state nationalised all firms in the car sector for example in England and the they ended up killing the famous strong auto sector in the UK

words have meaning, so please explain to me what you mean by that and how it will be implemented


why do you yap about economics and econ polices when you do not know zilch about the topic and you come from an IT back ground,

why do you do it?

I didn't even mention privatization or nationalisation of companies, wtf , but I don't believe philosophically either that public infrastructure should be owned by private investors since it's an infrastructure and can create 'ogligarchs' who can simply start buying out other businesses. U seem to not understand a GDP requires production(businesses) and consumption(workers). If you don't get the balance right, you can screw up a whole nation.

I don't know why ujust did a 360 on my argument. Listen, a $300-500 minimum wage wud ensure the bulk of our unskilled can either rent or get a mortgage when married, that wud be a $600-1000 income between two people. My calculations are conservative and reflect the true cost of living.

All I want is a 'big middle class' emerging from the low to semi skilled workers. U seem to argue middle class has to have high skills, which is not feasible becuz it wud lead to the same problem which is over-supply of the high skills. If 90% of our population all become high skilled, it would mean we won't have anyone doing low-semi skilled work needed, it will lead to the same supply side problem we are combating with low to semi skilled workers.

We need low-semi-high skilled segments created in Somalia, just like we need small-medium-large businesses co-existing without each one trampling the other out. I want the bulk of the countries wealth in low-semi-high skilled segment workers not in businesses.

If u removed the middle class in the west, they wud be very poor, the reason why 3rd world are poor is due to no middle class as they have a pure capitalistic structure of 1% rich and 99% poor, that 1% will not generate any economic growth, that's why their GDP as a whole is low and if your GDP is low, ur country relies on hand out.
 

DR OSMAN

AF NAAREED
VIP
They need to experience the hardship of making a business.

Nobody who makes over 200k a year after working their heart away will think, “I would sure love if the government would take 100k+ from me now”.

Young starters making 30k-60k a year whose taxes are taken before they even see their check and only experience life as the employee just wont understand the stresses or grievances of an owner.

You simple only understand business and clueless on GDP. A GDP requires u holistically link all businesses combined and their level of productions against their worker income which is consumption part, u need to look at it as a 'whole' not just look at 'one business'.

If u don't find a way to increase consumption, businesses don't have a market. Consumption comes purely from workers and if workers don't have realistic income, there is no business and the whole market collapses. It's in the interest of businesses that workers have an income or else they don't have a market to sell to. How bloody hard is that to understand
 

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