If the Turks never moved Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff via rail in 1917 do you think they would still exist?

[Mohamedamiin120]

Recently alot of Saudis and a few Qataris have been crying online about how the Turks 'sToLe' Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff from his grave and moved it to a museum in Istanbul during ww1. Now with the context of their absolutely insane mass-destruction of Islamic heritage sites in the Hijaz during the 30s-40s would they have been spared? Also keep in mind their devastating Sack of Karbala where they straight up robbed everything from Hussein's grave and destroyed his Masjid and did the same for a lot of stuff in Hijaz and Iraq when they briefly took those areas from the Turks.

The Wahhabi youth have mellowed out yes but it seems they have forgotton their own history, the Turks were correct in moving the artifacts to a safer location once the fall of Hijaz was imminent.

Your thoughts? (image is of the train that moved Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff to Topkapi Palace Museum, Istanbul)

 

[cunug3aad]

Most certainly they would have been piled up and burned or something and the saudi yutes would have no idea they ever existed

 

[NoticeNoticer]

Recently alot of Saudis and a few Qataris have been crying online about how the Turks 'sToLe' Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff from his grave and moved it to a museum in Istanbul during ww1. Now with the context of their absolutely insane mass-destruction of Islamic heritage sites in the Hijaz during the 30s-40s would they have been spared? Also keep in mind their devastating Sack of Karbala where they straight up robbed everything from Hussein's grave and destroyed his Masjid and did the same for a lot of stuff in Hijaz and Iraq when they briefly took those areas from the Turks.

The Wahhabi youth have mellowed out yes but it seems they have forgotton their own history, the Turks were correct in moving the artifacts to a safer location once the fall of Hijaz was imminent.

Your thoughts? (image is of the train that moved Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff to Topkapi Palace Museum, Istanbul)
View attachment 373782

What’s stuff was in it

 

[Mohamedamiin120]

What’s stuff was in it

It has not been disclosed by the museum or the Turkish government what exactly was evacuated by the Ottoman Army but this is what they say on their website

"In 1916, after the Ottoman government’s decision to partially withdraw from the Hejaz, Fahreddin Pasha sent 30 sacred relics which had been kept in the Prophet’s mosque to Istanbul by railroad; this was done to prevent the relics from being looted. Fahreddin Pasha sent the relics to Istanbul under the protection of 2,000 soldiers. When Mehmed VI was leaving Istanbul on November 17, 1922, he refused Zeki Bey’s offer to take the sacred relics with him, saying that they were gifts given to the Turkish people by their ancestors. Likewise, the Turkish committee refused the offer made during the Lausanne peace talks to return the sacred relics that had been sent by Fahreddin Pasha."

They probably never said what exactly they took so that now, a full century after the fact, the Saudi gov cannot actually request to have them back because they don't know what they took. For reference the museum has the vast majority of Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff and the stuff of many Sahaba.

Some random examples: Khalid Ibn al Walid's sword and Muhammad (ﷺ)'s clothes.

 

[Shimbiris]

These guy's demolished Khadijah's grave and would have honestly demolished the Green Dome if Ibn Saud hadn't basically stopped them, thinking that was maybe a step too far that could inflame the rest of the Muslim world against them too much, from what I remember.

 

[NoticeNoticer]

It has not been disclosed by the museum or the Turkish government what exactly was evacuated by the Ottoman Army but this is what they say on their website

"In 1916, after the Ottoman government’s decision to partially withdraw from the Hejaz, Fahreddin Pasha sent 30 sacred relics which had been kept in the Prophet’s mosque to Istanbul by railroad; this was done to prevent the relics from being looted. Fahreddin Pasha sent the relics to Istanbul under the protection of 2,000 soldiers. When Mehmed VI was leaving Istanbul on November 17, 1922, he refused Zeki Bey’s offer to take the sacred relics with him, saying that they were gifts given to the Turkish people by their ancestors. Likewise, the Turkish committee refused the offer made during the Lausanne peace talks to return the sacred relics that had been sent by Fahreddin Pasha."

They probably never said what exactly they took so that now, a full century after the fact, the Saudi gov cannot actually request to have them back because they don't know what they took. For reference the museum has the vast majority of Muhammad (ﷺ)'s stuff and the stuff of many Sahaba.

Some random examples: Khalid Ibn al Walid's sword and Muhammad (ﷺ)'s clothes.
View attachment 373783View attachment 373784

is this actually true. Swords and clothes dont last nearly 1700 years. Dont they rust and wither away.

 

[Guure⁸]

These guy's demolished Khadijah's grave and would have honestly demolished the Green Dome if Ibn Saud hadn't basically stopped them, thinking that was maybe a step too far that could inflame the rest of the Muslim world against them too much, from what I remember.

They destroyed qabr Shrines and they were right

 

[moosaid]

They wanted to demolish the Prophet's grave, but there was anger in the Islamic world, and then they stopped. The Wahhabis have no deen

 

[moosaid]

They destroyed qabr Shrines and they were right

Why don't you demolish the Prophet's grave then?

 

[Guure⁸]

Why don't you demolish the Prophet's grave then?

The prophet's grave isn't a shrine mate

 

[moosaid]

The prophet's grave isn't a shrine mate

He has a quba. All the qubas have been demolished. Should the qubae of the Prophet’s grave should be destroyed like other

 

[reer]

These guy's demolished Khadijah's grave and would have honestly demolished the Green Dome if Ibn Saud hadn't basically stopped them, thinking that was maybe a step too far that could inflame the rest of the Muslim world against them too much, from what I remember.

yes they wish to demolish the green dome.

 

[Guure⁸]

The prophet ﷺ ordered ali رضي الله عنه to make Graves even and to destroy statues

أنَّ عليًّا رضي اللهُ عنه بعَث صاحبَ شُرْطَةٍ فقال : أبعَثُك لِما بعثَني له رسولُ اللهِ صلَّى اللهُ عليهِ وسلَّمَ لا تَدَعْ قبرًا إلا سوَّيْتَه ولا تِمثَالًا إلا وضَعْتَه

 

[reer]

The prophet ﷺ ordered ali رضي الله عنه to make Graves even and to destroy statues

أنَّ عليًّا رضي اللهُ عنه بعَث صاحبَ شُرْطَةٍ فقال : أبعَثُك لِما بعثَني له رسولُ اللهِ صلَّى اللهُ عليهِ وسلَّمَ لا تَدَعْ قبرًا إلا سوَّيْتَه ولا تِمثَالًا إلا وضَعْتَه

Building Structures over Graves - IslamQA

Question: Is it allowed to make the buildings on the buried place of Auliya. Need some proof from Quraan, Imams, or Sahabah. Country: India Answer: Wa alaykum salam wa rahmatuLlahi wa barakatuHu, In

islamqa.org

 

[IKHALIIL]

They probably never said what exactly they took so that now, a full century after the fact, the Saudi gov cannot actually request to have them back because they don't know what they took.

 

[Guure⁸]

Building Structures over Graves - IslamQA

Question: Is it allowed to make the buildings on the buried place of Auliya. Need some proof from Quraan, Imams, or Sahabah. Country: India Answer: Wa alaykum salam wa rahmatuLlahi wa barakatuHu, In

islamqa.org

Ur source doesn't disagree with me mate, and this is imam al shafici reported from his student al marodi رحمهم الله جميعا

 

[reer]

Ur source doesn't disagree with me mate, and this is imam al shafici reported from his student al marodi رحمهم الله جميعا View attachment 373809View attachment 373808

building around private graves is not haram according to our madhab.

 

[Guure⁸]

building around private graves is not haram according to our madhab.

View attachment 373811

I brought u imam ash-shaf'i my fella

 

[Father]

is this actually true. Swords and clothes dont last nearly 1700 years. Dont they rust and wither away.

What kind of math are you doing? it's been about 1400sh years.

 

[reer]

I brought u imam ash-shaf'i my fella

exactly. he differentiates between public and private. the salafi-wahhabis do not. its why they had a issue with one of their shaykhs prayer in azhar mosque (it has graves in it).