How are Some Horners Cushitic and others Semetic? Not including Nilotes

[Qeelbax]

Wtf makes them semitic? I thought it was just amhara but tigray and harar are listed as semitic. I thought it was just the languages but no they fall under semitic ethnic groups. Why is that? I thought they had the same origins as us:
Back migration from 3k years ago, mixed with proto-nilotes and proto-horner and bam! Horners.

Y’all really trying to tell me we are closer to Oromo than Harari?

And how did this Semitic-ness skip over Beja and Afar, they are literally blocking Middle East/North Africa from Habesha. Did they teleport over them

 

[greznigrezni]

Since you are from the Somali region of Ethiopia, I would guess that a couple of hundred years ago, your people were categorized as Ethiopian. You could be a fellow Semite.

 

[Qeelbax]

Since you are from the Somali region of Ethiopia, I would guess that a couple of hundred years ago, your people were categorized as Ethiopian. You could be a fellow Semite.

Nigga stfu. I’m 100% Somali. They were Somalis. 500 years ago, I’m sure who ever you came from were as langaab as you.

 

[Hamzza]

Y’all really trying to tell me we are closer to Oromo than Harari?

Yes we are closer to oromo than any other big ethnicity

 

[greznigrezni]

Since you are from the Somali region of Ethiopia, I would guess that a couple of hundred years ago, your people were categorized as Ethiopian. You could be a fellow Semite.

Imagine hating your oromo cousins. Haile Selassie didn't die for this.

 

[Qeelbax]

Imagine hating your oromo cousins. Haile Selassie didn't die for this.

Cousins my ass. They are from Madagascar

 

[Dark-king]

They are language groups not ethnic groups.

A Semitic tigrayan is still more related to a Somali than a Arab or Jew.

If Somalis ditched Somali for Arabic we would be semites too.

 

[Som]

Wtf makes them semitic? I thought it was just amhara but tigray and harar are listed as semitic. I thought it was just the languages but no they fall under semitic ethnic groups. Why is that? I thought they had the same origins as us:
Back migration from 3k years ago, mixed with proto-nilotes and proto-horner and bam! Horners.

Y’all really trying to tell me we are closer to Oromo than Harari?

And how did this Semitic-ness skip over Beja and Afar, they are literally blocking Middle East/North Africa from Habesha. Did they teleport over them

Semitic is a language group.
Historically it has been confirmed that habeshas (Amhara and tigrays) were actually cushitic speakers similar to the Agaw people's of northern Ethiopia. After contacts with Yemenis he habeshas adopted a semitic language 3000 years ago, there was a language shift and a bit of genetic influx on habeshas from the semitic speakers. Technically habeshas are de facto Cushites who started speaking a semitic language and got a bit (5-10%) more Yemeni admixture than other cushites like somalis and oromo

 

[Som]

Yes we are closer to oromo than any other big ethnicity

I'm not so sure about that. Oromo is a big group, we are probably closer to a Harari than to a willow Oromo who lives next to amharas. Many hararis have recent ethnic somali ancestry. We are only close to Muslim oromos who share borders with somalis

 

[Hamzza]

I'm not so sure about that. Oromo is a big group, we are probably closer to a Harari than to a willow Oromo who lives next to amharas. Many hararis have recent ethnic somali ancestry. We are only close to Muslim oromos who share borders with somalis

Linguistically, culturally and genetically we are related to waaq worshiping oromo's more than any other major ethnic group including adari's who speak ethio-semitic language and don't border any somali clan.

 

[The alchemist]

Cushitic and Semitic are two linguistic branches in the Afro-Asiatic language family. From a historical perspective, people of various disciplines and backgrounds had the tendency to associate tribes or speech communities with their branch, as that informed substantially on culture and relational context, and there is the overall strong (not absolute), the correlation between genetic affinities between language and genetics. Semitic-speaking Horn of Africans is a good case study and convenient for the thread, so let's take and explain them in simple terms.

Besides a few irregular, highly admixed peoples that belong to Cushitic (excluding Omotics completely to reduce the complexity of explanation and reduce uncertainty level), the overwhelming majority of the DNA Cushitic speakers carry came from north of the Horn of Africa. Early Cushitic tribes around 7000-5000 before present migrated southeast, and additionally absorbed relatively substantial minor indigenous hunter-gatherer DNA. Now we have a genetic structure that we today consider the essential component structure that makes up a "pure" East Africa Afro-Asiatic people.

As time went by, particularly around 2800 before the present, South Arabian tradesmen migrated to modern Eritrea and northern Ethiopia and settled. These people mixed with local Cushitic populations that were Agaw-like in speech and influenced linguistically as well for them to speak the first Ethio-Semitic language. From a temporal perspective, as time went by, new languages and dialects formed out of this initial language, and the South Arabian-derived ancestry frequency got stabilized between the Ethio-Semitics to exist in the ~25% range (it can fluctuate 5% above and under for good measure).

The question of relatedness in the Horn of Africa is driven by geographic association. This subject matter is can be complex; there are always exceptions to the rule, so I will keep it simple and generalized. Oromo people are heterogeneous in that they can exist in three clusters and anything in-between. We have Oromo that got substantial Omotic admixture (Oromos in general, no matter what cluster, still got higher hunter-gatherer admixture levels compared to the average Semitic-speaker, Cushites from Eritrean, northeast Ethiopian Cushitic-speakers and Somalis), that are on autosomal (genetic makeup) basis, no different from Omotics (Afro-Asiatic people with substantial endemic hunter-gatherer ancestry). We have Oromos who were acculturated—genetic profile-wise no different than an Amhara—yet is Oromo on an identity basis. And then you have Oromos that show a good amount of affinity to Somalis, simply put.

Oromos then will show an unequal relation to Somalis depending on what Oromo you choose to compare with. But the overwhelming majority of Oromos, even the acculturated ones that show Semitic-like profile will have a closer affinity to Somalis than a Tigray Habashi or Eritrean are to Somalis, genetic distance-wise. Now, although, on a very smaller scale, the Afar shows their own peculiarity. Linguistically they are Cushitic, on aspect about DNA they, in Ethiopia at least, show no difference from Ethio-Semitic peoples - having elevated Arabian element. But I suspect they, in Djibouti, for example, will have an excessive convergent affinity with Somalis. In this case, it is not too far off to guess that some Afar will be closer to Somalis than some Oromos, even excluding the Omotic-profile ones. One thing with Ethiopian populations is that genetic closeness is dictated more by proximity than linguistic barriers. That is the trend I see on a general basis.

On the matter of Beja. These folks, you sort of have to analyze by themselves because they got a different historical process situating from Egypt, along the Red Sea of the Eastern Desert of Sudan, all the way to Eritrea. So Beja's got influenced by their own set of Cushitic original DNA, gene flow between fellow Sudanese, and northernmost Habashi people of Eritrea. To what level these people got Semitic ancestry, namely of the Peninsular heritage, is dependent on other factors and it varies. But they, in a lot of ways, got high Arabian ancestry. Beni Amer, as an example, carries higher Arab than Habashi people.

Someone should move this thread to Culture & History.

 

[tariq moses]

Sabeans settled in Eritrea and Northern Ethiopa from around 800 BC, North Ethio-Semitic people such as Tigre and Tigrinya people are around 25% Yemeni/Sabean, Amharas are a little less at 20%, in general, South Ethio Semitic speakers have less Yemeni than Eritreans and Tigray Ethiopians because they have since mixed with Oromos. Afar people also have this Yemeni ancestry, the thing is, I'm not sure if the Afar in Djibouti have the same amount but the ones in Ethiopia and Eritrea have similar amounts of Yemeni ancestry as Ethio Semitic speakers. Beni Amer Bejas also have this Yemeni, other clans such as the Hadendowa have a lot less, Bisharins have basically no Sabean ancestry.

Ethio-Semitic people are still largely Cushitic at around 70%, Somalis are around 85-90%.

 

[tariq moses]

These people mixed with local Cushitic populations that were Agaw-like in speech and influenced linguistically as well for them to speak the first Ethio-Semitic language.

The Cushitic element in Tigre(not to be confused woth Tigray Ethiopians) could be closer to Beja than Agaw, I've seen conflicting statements on this but theres a ton of Beja influence in Tigre, some of it is due to intermarriage/close contacts between Tigres and Bejas but the Beja influence is seen in Tigrinya aswell but to a lesser degree, AFAIK Tigrinyas don't have history of intermarriage with Beja so there could have been a Beja/North Cushitic-speaking presence deep in the highlands, South Ethio Semitic speakers don't show this Beja influence btw, I believe its exclusive to North Ethio-Semitic.