Farmajo refused to integrate 2400 of Puntland's forces (PMPF/PSF) to the SNA

Not surprisingly, no integration of the PMPF or PSF is under discussion. However, the previous Puntland administration of Abdiweli Gaas (President from 2014–18) agreed to integrate 2,400 darwish into the SNA. Yet, despite the existence of a trust fund dedicated to the purpose, the Farmajo Administration failed to pay the integrated soldiers for 18 months after the integration supposedly occurred. When Dani assumed the presidency of the state in 2018, he was at odds with the federal Government over the issue and worried that the darwish forces turning loose or defecting to their communities. At the beginning of 2020, he recalled the integrated soldiers — who had been biometrically registered with the SNA — and designated them a special police force under his control.141


Arguably, the failure to integrate the Puntland darwish has been a critical mistake of the Farmajo Administration, and has set back the national State-building process. If the integration had proceeded well, the SNA would have been strengthened, reducing the number of militias and potentially addressing long-standing centre-periphery tensions. Instead, following the aborted integration process, tensions between the federal Government and Puntland have significantly worsened. This has further contributed to a deterioration of relations between the Emirates — Puntland’s external sponsor — and Mogadishu, potentially making future integrations harder to negotiate.


The combination of an integration mishandled by Mogadishu, and the subsequent decision by Puntland to recall the darwish forces, sets a problematic precedent for Somalia. At the time of writing, both Madobe and the Galmudug administrations were also considering recalling some of their currently SNA-hatted forces, to be renamed “special police” under their control.142


These cases suggest that four key conditions must be in place for a successful integration of darwish forces (or indeed others) into the national security services: (1) Relations between the federal member states and Mogadishu must be on relatively good footing; (2) Federal member states must have a financial incentive to agree to the integration (in other words, they must be unable to afford to pay the forces on their own), and may need additional political payoffs; (3) Integrated forces must receive regular and sufficient pay; and (4) Some alignment between Mogadishu and external patrons (such as the Emirates or Ethiopia) is often required.


https://i.unu.edu/media/cpr.unu.edu/post/3895/HybridConflictSomaliaWeb.pdf
 

Thegoodshepherd

Galkacyo iyo Calula dhexdood
VIP
You can’t integrate maryo calas who have their loyalty to a clan enclave
:manny: That is not how military command works

Farmaajo could have argued that the SNA will run its own recruitment drive in Puntland. Puntland offered trained troops and he refused them. Fine why not come to Garowe and recruit the troops directly? He has no interest in doing that because he does not want troops from Puntland in the SNA. If there are no troops from Puntland in the Somali National Army it is not a national army.
 
Farmaajo could have argued that the SNA will run its own recruitment drive in Puntland. Puntland offered trained troops and he refused them. Fine why not come to Garowe and recruit the troops directly? He has no interest in doing that because he does not want troops from Puntland in the SNA. If there are no troops from Puntland in the Somali National Army it is not a national army.
I agree, if Puntland, and every other regional state are not included then it truly is not a national army. They already move to join though. But first, could you show me evidence that those PL troops were not integrated. A lot of BS is pedal-led on here and the world knows, let alone the Somali world.

Last time I was in Somalia, Xamar in particular, there were a lot of 'Isaaqs' in particular in the army I met personally in Xamar. I cant say much about any other regional state although im sure they were there it wasnt pointed out to me personally. I have direct relatives who are OG from Jubbaland and Galbeed who were there and part of SNA.

Through this forum I have learned Ground forces General Abdihamid Dirir is MJ from PL, I am sure the SNA is filled with Somalis from every region, bc they are guaranteed pay, food, living accommodations, and support for their families etc.


The SNA is being rebuilt, it will be complete soon InsahaAllah.

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Farmaajo could have argued that the SNA will run its own recruitment drive in Puntland. Puntland offered trained troops and he refused them. Fine why not come to Garowe and recruit the troops directly? He has no interest in doing that because he does not want troops from Puntland in the SNA. If there are no troops from Puntland in the Somali National Army it is not a national army.
There is two reasons to why the federal government refused.

Firstly it’s the age and education factor, the federal government is of currently recruiting 25 years and below with college/uni degree.. The vast majority of the pmpf and psf are older than that age and were career foot soldiers with no degrees.

secondly both me and you know even if they were to be Integrated and the law to be broken for their sake: their loyalty will be with the clan enclave and won’t be following the military command chain and take orders.

As for recruitment everyone who has interest in military with qualification can go to turksom military facility regardless of your clan as the federal government has been urging the youth....so it’s not true they don’t want puntland in the SNA... my own cousin is a captain in the gorgor commando unit
 

Thegoodshepherd

Galkacyo iyo Calula dhexdood
VIP
There is two reasons to why the federal government refused.

Firstly it’s the age and education factor, the federal government is of currently recruiting 25 years and below with college/uni degree.. The vast majority of the pmpf and psf are older than that age and were career foot soldiers with no degrees.

secondly both me and you know even if they were to be Integrated and the law to be broken for their sake: their loyalty will be with the clan enclave and won’t be following the military command chain and take orders.

As for recruitment everyone who has interest in military with qualification can go to turksom military facility regardless of your clan as the federal government has been urging the youth....so it’s not true they don’t want puntland in the SNA... my own cousin is a captain in the gorgor commando unit


:salute:nothing but respect, trolling on another level.

Enjoy the next 10 months, because at the end of the day Puntland will outlast Farmaajo.
 

Removed

Gif-King
VIP
Not surprisingly, no integration of the PMPF or PSF is under discussion. However, the previous Puntland administration of Abdiweli Gaas (President from 2014–18) agreed to integrate 2,400 darwish into the SNA. Yet, despite the existence of a trust fund dedicated to the purpose, the Farmajo Administration failed to pay the integrated soldiers for 18 months after the integration supposedly occurred. When Dani assumed the presidency of the state in 2018, he was at odds with the federal Government over the issue and worried that the darwish forces turning loose or defecting to their communities. At the beginning of 2020, he recalled the integrated soldiers — who had been biometrically registered with the SNA — and designated them a special police force under his control.141


Arguably, the failure to integrate the Puntland darwish has been a critical mistake of the Farmajo Administration, and has set back the national State-building process. If the integration had proceeded well, the SNA would have been strengthened, reducing the number of militias and potentially addressing long-standing centre-periphery tensions. Instead, following the aborted integration process, tensions between the federal Government and Puntland have significantly worsened. This has further contributed to a deterioration of relations between the Emirates — Puntland’s external sponsor — and Mogadishu, potentially making future integrations harder to negotiate.


The combination of an integration mishandled by Mogadishu, and the subsequent decision by Puntland to recall the darwish forces, sets a problematic precedent for Somalia. At the time of writing, both Madobe and the Galmudug administrations were also considering recalling some of their currently SNA-hatted forces, to be renamed “special police” under their control.142


These cases suggest that four key conditions must be in place for a successful integration of darwish forces (or indeed others) into the national security services: (1) Relations between the federal member states and Mogadishu must be on relatively good footing; (2) Federal member states must have a financial incentive to agree to the integration (in other words, they must be unable to afford to pay the forces on their own), and may need additional political payoffs; (3) Integrated forces must receive regular and sufficient pay; and (4) Some alignment between Mogadishu and external patrons (such as the Emirates or Ethiopia) is often required.


https://i.unu.edu/media/cpr.unu.edu/post/3895/HybridConflictSomaliaWeb.pdf
If their was qabyalad in the kacaan and before there is atleast 1000x as much qabyalad in this current admin.

It makes sense however that xamar would draw troops mostly from loyal states, I can’t really complain its the choice of each side
 
If their was qabyalad in the kacaan and before there is atleast 1000x as much qabyalad in this current admin.

It makes sense however that xamar would draw troops mostly from loyal states, I can’t really complain its the choice of each side
My closest relatives in the SNA are OG. So no, the SNA is open to all and many travel great distances to join it, I am sure mainly because of the fixed pay and benefits.

@Thegoodshepherd as smart as he seems, is very ideologically motivated. He is a proud qabilist and has said if he ever thought the SNA was being rebuilt he would become a "secessionist" loool.

Interpret his posts based off of that. Then there is the reality.
 

Thegoodshepherd

Galkacyo iyo Calula dhexdood
VIP
Why do you think im immune to facts? Is your crippling qabyalad seeping through or was that a genuine answer? If genuine how so? I try to always deal with facts and reality. Loool help me out apti.

Farmaajo/Kheyre are not interested in having a significant chunk of the SNA come from Puntland because people from Puntland have significantly higher Asabiyah than anyone in the south. A soldier from Puntland will take his check but will always remain loyal to Puntland. Understandably Farmaajo does not want troops whose ultimate loyalty is to their region of origin. If you told a regiment of troops from Puntland to remove Madoobe from Kismaayo, they would probably drag their feet or simply join him. Even if you recruit young college grads from Puntland, their loyalties will remain with their people and will not shift to Mogadishu. Farmaajo understands this and is uninterested in recruiting soldiers from Puntland.

The problem is that the FGS must recruit from Puntland in order to have a national army. But if you recruit from Puntland you are creating and funding a fifth column within your armed forces. It is a catch 22.
 
Farmaajo/Kheyre are not interested in having a significant chunk of the SNA come from Puntland because people from Puntland have significantly higher Asabiyah than anyone in the south. A soldier from Puntland will take his check but will always remain loyal to Puntland. Understandably Farmaajo does not want troops whose ultimate loyalty is to their region of origin. If you told a regiment of troops from Puntland to remove Madoobe from Kismaayo, they would probably drag their feet or simply join him. Even if you recruit young college grads from Puntland, their loyalties will remain with their people and will not shift to Mogadishu. Farmaajo understands this and is uninterested in recruiting soldiers from Puntland.

The problem is that the FGS must recruit from Puntland in order to have a national army. But if you recruit from Puntland you are creating and funding a fifth column within your armed forces. It is a catch 22.
Umm not really. Not from what I know. It would be good enough for the SNA based in PL to rid the region of AS and more importantly secure Sool and Sanaag (or parts of it) but it doesn't seem like the PL admin is about those things. Pay would of course be diff for a soldier risking his life against AS vs one guarding a relatively peaceful region.

I can never tell if you speak like this intentionally to confuse things or you are genuine.
 

Removed

Gif-King
VIP
My closest relatives in the SNA are OG. So no, the SNA is open to all and many travel great distances to join it, I am sure mainly because of the fixed pay and benefits.

@Thegoodshepherd as smart as he seems, is very ideologically motivated. He is a proud qabilist and has said if he ever thought the SNA was being rebuilt he would become a "secessionist" loool.

Interpret his posts based off of that. Then there is the reality.
I didn’t tie my point to his. Their may be Ogadens in that army hell their were apparently Ogadens in the JVA, we are a big tribe its not hard.

I would like you to try and shake away the naivety, if the actual kacaan itself was tribalist (to an extant) what do you think of this current train wreck.

I laughed the day I saw “General Odaawa” are you trying to tell me this man was promoted to the rank of Cali Samatar himself :snoop: I never met the man but he was widely regarded by every person I knew as a literal genius. The fact that a kid became his rank whilst all of the country is in the hands of insurgents with less weaponry and manpower.
 
Also @Thegoodshepherd since you’re such a qabilist and you love facts. You’ve never answered my question about what you think about Majerteens being more related to Garre Somalis paternally then to Darood Somalis? What does that do to your world view?
 
I didn’t tie my point to his. Their may be Ogadens in that army hell their were apparently Ogadens in the JVA, we are a big tribe its not hard.

I would like you to try and shake away the naivety, if the actual kacaan itself was tribalist (to an extant) what do you think of this current train wreck.

I laughed the day I saw “General Odaawa” are you trying to tell me this man was promoted to the rank of Cali Samatar himself :snoop: I never met the man but he was widely regarded by every person I knew as a literal genius. The fact that a kid became his rank whilst all of the country is in the hands of insurgents with less weaponry and manpower.
Idk much about the Kacaans tribalism but from what I read/heard it became that way towards the end.

To compare a country trying to rebuild itself after decades of war to a govt that inherited a peaceful united country with not even 1% of the issues we face today is disingenuous to say the least. That general and all of the SNA are liberating our country and fighting AS and it’s foreign backers.

You’re quick to call the SNA who are literally risking their lives to save our country but never speak about the corruption in JL. Be honest or you’ll trigger me to start calling it out, it’s very easy.
 

Crow

Make Hobyo Great Again
VIP
Also @Thegoodshepherd since you’re such a qabilist and you love facts. You’ve never answered my question about what you think about Majerteens being more related to Garre Somalis paternally then to Darood Somalis? What does that do to your world view?
This is nonsense that defies both history and geography. Spamming it on somali net won't make it true either. I'm sorry to disappoint you but we are not related.
 
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