Can The Incel Movement Revolutionize Gender Relation

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I think this is inconsequential for the average ethnic man, these niggas can get hitched within a week if they so desire. It has happened to many men I know. Though I am apprehensive about the path they have taken, there is no substance to their marriage or connection. Just some facilitated matrimony by their respective families. This is also possible for women albeit their choice of a husband wouldn't leave much satisfaction 😂😂. We have to applaud women for having standards, I never understood just how entitled these incel mfs are, you aint owed shit or siil.

I do think that the average man or woman is disinterested in marriage though, it has lost its appeal in many ways, that's something that will explain the lack of suitors in the coming years. Anyways, whiners need to stfu.
 

DR OSMAN

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I think this is inconsequential for the average ethnic man, these niggas can get hitched within a week if they so desire. It has happened to many men I know. Though I am apprehensive about the path they have taken, there is no substance to their marriage or connection. Just some facilitated matrimony by their respective families. This is also possible for women albeit their choice of a husband wouldn't leave much satisfaction 😂😂. We have to applaud women for having standards, I never understood just how entitled these incel mfs are, you aint owed shit or siil.

I do think that the average man or woman is disinterested in marriage though, it has lost its appeal in many ways, that's something that will explain the lack of suitors in the coming years. Anyways, whiners need to stfu.

Isnt that the war now in everything, have grudge-agenda-motive-goal, study science and find a scientific base for it, then link it tto human right(so they feel guilty and them the victim), link it to god dimension create movement, go fringe n underground, get media attention to test public appetite, get politician to put up 4 law consideration, game plan done kkkkkk. Enter a world where u can just walk up to women and say i want sex now and she is conditioned to think its human right, scientific fact, plus has religious validity, plus govt has decriminalized rape and over time new generation wont even know what rape iss.

@Angelina @Hodan from HR
 
Isnt that the war now in everything, have grudge-agenda-motive-goal, study science and find a scientific base for it, then link it tto human right(so they feel guilty and them the victim), link it to god dimension create movement, go fringe n underground, get media attention to test public appetite, get politician to put up 4 law consideration, game plan done kkkkkk. Enter a world where u can just walk up to women and say i want sex now and she is conditioned to think its human right, scientific fact, plus has religious validity, plus govt has decriminalized rape and over time new generation wont even know what rape iss.

@Angelina @Hodan from HR
If everything can be perceived as a barter/ transaction, then conditioning is not needed. Everything has a price and humans are the ones that determine this price, this is called praxeology, from the Austrian school of economics. There is one profession that has satisfied this need that you talk about and its the oldest; sex work. And I'm not proud to say but I've also seen some before. It was adequate and a respectful encounter. But anyways, it will always be be demonised by proper society and for good reason too...
 

DR OSMAN

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If everything can be perceived as a barter/ transaction, then conditioning is not needed. Everything has a price and humans are the ones that determine this price, this is called praxeology, from the Austrian school of economics. There is one profession that has satisfied this need that you talk about and its the oldest; sex work. And I'm not proud to say but I've also seen some before. It was adequate and a respectful encounter. But anyways, it will always be be demonised by proper society and for good reason too...

I'll just say 'ibnul adam iskuma fiyowa' hearts r compromised, grudges exist, agendas r rife, and these ppl r in fields of knowledge-politics-business-religion domains and depending on their intelligence and how they craft-present their sickness(not just incel any radical idea) which they would've added a scientific-human right-religious-political backing. This variable isn't measured anywhere 'human flaws' and it's not controlled or put into some strict inspection process which can ruin all these respectable institutions.
 
I'll just say 'ibnul adam iskuma fiyowa' hearts r compromised, grudges exist, agendas r rife, and these ppl r in fields of knowledge-politics-business-religion domains and depending on their intelligence and how they craft-present their sickness(not just incel any radical idea) which they would've added a scientific-human right-religious-political backing. This variable isn't measured anywhere 'human flaws' and it's not controlled or put into some strict inspection process which can ruin all these respectable institutions.
It's certainly not something up for debate on a public forum, but the reasoning as to why it isn't entertained is easy to configure. No one is should have access to another person through a beck and call, we all have labour attached to ourselves though life, sonething must be given to receive something. Even attractiveness has a price if you think about it. Better looking people earn more than the less fortunate looking. https://wol.iza.org/press-releases/...cieties,those considered less or unattractive

But besides that, people have to take accountability and be realistic, have a more pragmatic mindset about the options available despite the 'scientific-human right-religious-political backing'
 

Hodan from HR

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Isnt that the war now in everything, have grudge-agenda-motive-goal, study science and find a scientific base for it, then link it tto human right(so they feel guilty and them the victim), link it to god dimension create movement, go fringe n underground, get media attention to test public appetite, get politician to put up 4 law consideration, game plan done kkkkkk. Enter a world where u can just walk up to women and say i want sex now and she is conditioned to think its human right, scientific fact, plus has religious validity, plus govt has decriminalized rape and over time new generation wont even know what rape iss.

@Angelina @Hodan from HR


While I enjoy the idea of zoomorphism in humans, we can be complex beings. The only scenario in which this might occur is in a dystopian world where all women are enslaved and confined to dungeons. In such a grim reality, it's certain that most will resort to extreme measures, even attempting suicide, than acquiesce to the violation of their bodies by random men without consent and/or compensation.

The approach of using science facts + religious validity won't be effective as such conditioning is unnatural at its basis. When you compare the risks of contracting STDs, facing unwanted pregnancies, and enduring rape again and again, they outweight the pain of death. Death will bring an end to their suffering once and for all.

The gravity of the situation is evident when there's no scientific advantage to ending one's life, and it is considered a sin in major religions. Yet, most women would rather die than submitting to this kind of 'conditioning'..
 

DR OSMAN

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While I enjoy the idea of zoomorphism in humans, we can be complex beings. The only scenario in which this might occur is in a dystopian world where all women are enslaved and confined to dungeons. In such a grim reality, it's certain that most will resort to extreme measures, even attempting suicide, than acquiesce to the violation of their bodies by random men without consent and/or compensation.

The approach of using science facts + religious validity won't be effective as such conditioning is unnatural at its basis. When you compare the risks of contracting STDs, facing unwanted pregnancies, and enduring rape again and again, they outweight the pain of death. Death will bring an end to their suffering once and for all.

The gravity of the situation is evident when there's no scientific advantage to ending one's life, and it is considered a sin in major religions. Yet, most women would rather die than submitting to this kind of 'conditioning'..

Conditioning is scary part becuz u assume they know any better if every woman is going thru it and their no rape law, no religion denouncement, human rights advocating its a male right like free speech is, plus scientifc community all preaching to everyone it's a normal human state and point to animals who even do it. Plus when all women say to each other wat u complaining about this is life and how its intended, U assume ppl will know better becuz U DO due to ur conditioning, but once conditioned it's over sister, unless a miracle happens from god and he sends some reformer and thats if their not killed as their usually are changing the accepted norm which is a hard mountain to climb.

Sis trust me once conditioned its over, u wont think its wrong or crime, u may even compete among women n get medals for it and think ur a good person and society congratulating u.
 

DR OSMAN

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@Hodan from HR please don't assume this dystopian world is limited to gender, it can be over anything such as race where blacks become the standard, dark skin, kinky hair, etc and light skin told u resemble 'neaderthals' who were primitive-archaic and not pure humans, they cud be called 'hybrid' beasts and all their features-color shunned by the globe. But this will need blacks to have 'wealth, knowledge, and weaponry'.

They will then reconstruct all history to favor it's racial narrative to keep its dystopian world order. For example teaching it was MOORS from Timbuktu libraries who exported to spain to civilize them. It was ancient egypt early period where greeks learned also which the west look up too. They'll show how bible lists black nations constantly like kush-ethiopia but never india-china-europe lol cuz they were still 'neaderthals' kkk. This will make the whole world try looking like black race by bleaching kkkkkk, learn their languages, food/diet, art, etc. That's just racial dystopia.

The dystopia can be across religion similar as racial order but flipped for muslim narrative, the world divided into heathen-believer world order, etc. U urself r in white-christian-atheist dystopia world.
 

DR OSMAN

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@Hodan from HR I give mohamed 1 big credit to say blk not superior to white or vice versa, he told em dont start that nasty game of dystopian shit, leads to conflict and limits human potential to race-gender-economic class limiting mankind potential due to its fucked up dsytopian crap. No wonder progress is slow today and thousands of potential einsteins r dying away globally due to the dystopian world disadvantaging them and thus harming human growh as a whole. It's definitely a negative force 4 all and keep us essentially primitive in terms of progress.
 
I think this is inconsequential for the average ethnic man, these niggas can get hitched within a week if they so desire. It has happened to many men I know. Though I am apprehensive about the path they have taken, there is no substance to their marriage or connection. Just some facilitated matrimony by their respective families. This is also possible for women albeit their choice of a husband wouldn't leave much satisfaction 😂😂. We have to applaud women for having standards, I never understood just how entitled these incel mfs are, you aint owed shit or siil.

I do think that the average man or woman is disinterested in marriage though, it has lost its appeal in many ways, that's something that will explain the lack of suitors in the coming years. Anyways, whiners need to stfu.
You cannot write off real problems. Angry online rants don't matter.
Yes, no one is entitled to sex. But that being said. Want a micro penis? Extensive facial burns. A height of 5'2".
Come on, you are not that stupid. Some men are just fucked.
 

Hodan from HR

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@Hodan from HR please don't assume this dystopian world is limited to gender, it can be over anything such as race where blacks become the standard, dark skin, kinky hair, etc and light skin told u resemble 'neaderthals' who were primitive-archaic and not pure humans, they cud be called 'hybrid' beasts and all their features-color shunned by the globe. But this will need blacks to have 'wealth, knowledge, and weaponry'.

They will then reconstruct all history to favor it's racial narrative to keep its dystopian world order. For example teaching it was MOORS from Timbuktu libraries who exported to spain to civilize them. It was ancient egypt early period where greeks learned also which the west look up too. They'll show how bible lists black nations constantly like kush-ethiopia but never india-china-europe lol cuz they were still 'neaderthals' kkk. This will make the whole world try looking like black race by bleaching kkkkkk, learn their languages, food/diet, art, etc. That's just racial dystopia.

The dystopia can be across religion similar as racial order but flipped for muslim narrative, the world divided into heathen-believer world order, etc. U urself r in white-christian-atheist dystopia world.


That's messed up and borderline nihilistic I gotta say 😅


Power's been shifting throughout human history and which ever group is the most powerful at that time is dominant culturally. Still, the less dominant ones may reject and pave their own path because they faced discrimination. And that's how resistant groups and extremists start. The world dynamics is somewhat comical as it is constantly trying to restore balance and redistribute influence. Those who rise eventually fall, and vice versa..


So the question is, how much of our ideas are our own and how much is influenced by our societies and the media we consume. It's crazy when you think about it!


@Hodan from HR I give mohamed 1 big credit to say blk not superior to white or vice versa, he told em dont start that nasty game of dystopian shit, leads to conflict and limits human potential to race-gender-economic class limiting mankind potential due to its fucked up dsytopian crap. No wonder progress is slow today and thousands of potential einsteins r dying away globally due to the dystopian world disadvantaging them and thus harming human growh as a whole. It's definitely a negative force 4 all and keep us essentially primitive in terms of progress.

Black vrs white, women vrs men, religious vrs atheists, conservatives vrs liberals..

The world is full of division.
And you are right how limiting to human potential it is to subjugate one group of people to elevate another. Esp when no one chooses the race, family background and sex they are born with. As for people's religious and political beliefs, we all have free will to choose. Why do we then dislike those who are different from us? Perhaps, there is some evolutionary advantage to this? I don't know. I grew up in a multicultural, multi religion society so I can't judge those who are less tolerant. Who knows I might have ended up like them if I was isolated; having a deep distrust of those different and driven by fear of the unknown..
 
The Incel movement currently is deemed as 'weirdos' by the public, but do some of their arguments hold merit? Why would a movement begin if their is no injustice whether real or perceived is up for debate here. I am sure women will say it's their own 'percieved' injustice. I myself was kinda conditioned by society to look at them as 'weirdos' but I am switching off that 'social conditioning' to assess their arguments.

They argue Women are making it so hard for men to have sex and use sex as a tool against Men. They argue sex is a legit biological need of men and isn't a 'choice' they made and women shouldn't use this 'need' against them. Some argue since sex is a genuine biological need, it should be made a 'right' and women should be prosecuted for refusing to service this need, which means the elimination of 'rape' laws. I find that a bit 'radical' specially eliminating 'rape' laws, but that's what their pushing for.

I do agree with the part that sex is a biological need of men and it isn't something they chose and therefore their needs to be some accomodating by women. Currently women high expectations is potentially isolating them from a partner, their r many women from the feminist wave era who are old grannies who have big regrets about their lofty standards as their dying alone now. Women want looks, personality, money, smartness, some even want 'religious match' on top of that, while most also demand 'time/effort' expended in relationship.

Are these lofty standards going to isolate women from potential partners becuz the amount of men who can 'tick' each requirement is a very small pool and that small pool will be over-grazed by 'females' leading to their 'depletion' and then what's left is all these women disregarding the other potential male pool outside the 'ideal' pool. I am not a woman so I will ask them, do u look for 100% matches across all criterias in men or 50% and above or do some have more weight then others?

So even tho the Incels have some legitimate arguments that sex is a biological need of men and shouldn't be restricted heavily to them, But that's where my agreement with them ends and I don't think it's sane to decriminalize rape. Yes men may suffer sexual oppression by women, but the answer isn't sexual oppression of women either. One injustice converted to another isn't wise at all.

Long story short men have a biological right to get access, in the same way women have a biological right to have their sexual needs met.

So what makes incels feel so entitled, to believe their needs matter more.

Because they think they are “men”.

You sound like an R-word sympathizer, even if that isn’t your intention.

Relationships aren’t a ‘right’ and has never been. Throughout history many men have lived and died single. Claiming that it’s a right, means you believe women should be compelled to sleep with and procreate with men they don’t want. So basically, men should be allowed to gain access to what they want at the expense of women and to the detriment of society.

Even if you take out the emotional or pro-woman stance of my argument, believing that you have a ‘right’ to gain access to a woman is indeed a detriment to society. Weak, entitled men who should be indeed avoided will now be able to pass on their self loathing pathetic temperaments to their offspring ruining the gene pool. Most incels are incels due to their horrible attitudes, some due to hygiene issues, and other factors that are seen as repulsive to men and women. They’re not desirable partners and to make it worse, they’re entitled and refuse to put the work in. We don’t need more of those types of humans. Even families don’t want their children marrying those types of guys and even decent and strong fathers can sniff out those types. Whilst we can argue that sex is a biologically driven, so is the need to preserve our genes and that is more important for overall quality of humanity. Women’s choosiness is a quality that has made humans better. There is a reason why they’ve been created this way and it has allowed humanity to thrive.

Hence, stop being a r-word apologist. You don’t have a right to a woman. If she doesn’t want you, she doesn’t want you and if most women avoid you, it means you need to work on yourself. It’s as simple as that.

Thats exactly why Allah made women to keep quality control, no woman should have to put up with a loser that denies to improve his condition.
 

DR OSMAN

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That's messed up and borderline nihilistic I gotta say 😅


Power's been shifting throughout human history and which ever group is the most powerful at that time is dominant culturally. Still, the less dominant ones may reject and pave their own path because they faced discrimination. And that's how resistant groups and extremists start. The world dynamics is somewhat comical as it is constantly trying to restore balance and redistribute influence. Those who rise eventually fall, and vice versa..


So the question is, how much of our ideas are our own and how much is influenced by our societies and the media we consume. It's crazy when you think about it!




Black vrs white, women vrs men, religious vrs atheists, conservatives vrs liberals..

The world is full of division.
And you are right how limiting to human potential it is to subjugate one group of people to elevate another. Esp when no one chooses the race, family background and sex they are born with. As for people's religious and political beliefs, we all have free will to choose. Why do we then dislike those who are different from us? Perhaps, there is some evolutionary advantage to this? I don't know. I grew up in a multicultural, multi religion society so I can't judge those who are less tolerant. Who knows I might have ended up like them if I was isolated; having a deep distrust of those different and driven by fear of the unknown..

Yep read my piece on Somalis to give up on humanity, it's done. Intelligence is a fatal mutation by mother nature to ensure we eventually end ourselves, its not just a blessing, but a big curse. They will develop enough weapons to wipe out human life and all it takes is a stupid hot head somewhere globally in power to start the end of life extinction process.

Jews r the smartest ppl per capita in the world, even they have proven they cant rise above oppression and doing it to palestine. What u expect if black or muslim had all the power with a far less education ratio and careless leadership to jews, it would be a nitemare.
 

DR OSMAN

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The women have made the strongest argument that Incel are undesirable and if it's allowed to spread could affect all male pool and lead to women not reproducing with any. Women play the strongest role in selection process of mating, their playing the natural selection role to ensure men compete for them and lift up the male potential, if they don't as incels have chosen too, they will die alone and not be allowed to spread their dysfunction. Sorry incels female natural selection on sex doesn't do 'hand outs' or charity either. Unless women will do 'sadaqo' for sex with incels out of mercy which hasnt ever been witnessed in human history. Gee nature is brutal

Plus on the human right ground, the women argument is far stronger, your not ENTITLED to anything besides your own body, your entitlement/rights ends on someone elses body.
 
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DR OSMAN

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I guess the females have won the day. This fringe underground movement has no real TEETH. They want a sexual revolution and believe their sexually oppressed by FEMALES and see sex as a human need and should lead to compassion from females or the 'tough laws' demanding it.
 

DR OSMAN

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Sorry Incels but dont try using media with left wing slogans to appeal like 'sexual revolution now' or 'sexual justice' or 'sexual oppression of males need to end' or political terms 'sexual socialism and redistribution' and getting jordan peterson backing in science. Wats next u want a priest or sheikh to find some vague 'charity' law and link it to 'sex' also for ur own ends/means before politicians craft 'end rape laws its unkind to sexually oppressed males'. Woman fight back before this fringe movement gets mainstreaam appeal if i were u before its to late.
 
Sex is not a biological imperative.

Historically sex has been gatekept from majority of men.
It is imperative for survival on a population level, and it is a rational fundamental physiological need to realize downstream reproduction. Saying otherwise is quite bizarre. Doesn't mean every man has a right to a woman off the street or anything. But people having sex is very important for society and for the individual.

The study you posted does not support the notion that: "historically sex has been gatekept from majority of men."

What the study says is that there is a variational gender-based genetic inheritance skew based on region across time and space. On a deep population history, the sex bias was in favor of females giving more genetic input through generations in a given parameterized genetic drift population because their biological disposition is conditionally distinct from that of males regarding reproductive roles.

One woman cannot birth 4 children from 4 different men in one year as a man could do easily. This means, there is a fundamental cap of symmetry that is somehow not accounted for by you using that study as an example. The study itself makes the case that there was a big variation between regions in these ratio tendencies showing how these things are very much based on practical conditions by humans in response to how they interact with various landscape challenges (socio-culture, tradition, subsistence strategies, systematization of economic structuring, disease, war, societal stratification, etc.) rather than they're just getting gatekept based on some simplistic polygamous demographic mate-selection bias that is marked throughout time or simple Capitalistic inspired hypergamous features.

Furthermore, the quote specifically highlights a special case. Ancestral effective population sizes rarely reflect any long-standing demographic capture - it's usually extremely unrepresentative. They are majority of the time caused by various bottlenecks and founder effects. It does not mean that even at the time of this ancestral population, it was the average tendency throughout where those people lived.

There is also the issue of capturing the true demographic picture, in the case, of gatekeeping practices as hunter-gatherers often traveled across communities on complex grounds to find a partner. The picture is much more complex and you have to take those studies with some consideration of many weaknesses to describe how things were based on the limits the data can expand upon.

The notion that sex has been gatekept from most men for the majority of human history is not sound. An ancestral demographic ratio of an effective population size of 100-30 individuals between women and men (respectively) for Eurasians going back 45,000 years ago has more to do with men dying, reducing their numbers for various reasons or often population dynamics that got to do with social structures and sex-based migration patterns that are very place and time specific.

Gene transfer on a population deep time basis is very variational and this notion that men were simply majority gatekept in all its variation is simply not necessarily true. Many societies did have polygamy but the sex-based biases we see on these calculations don't need to be explained by that as it ignores literally everything else by opting for that convenient explanation. Even the study mentions this.
 
The women have made the strongest argument that Incel are undesirable and if it's allowed to spread could affect all male pool and lead to women not reproducing with any.

No, @Angelina made a strong argument in shutting down your failed attempts, of passively peddling long held incel believes from the black pill community. Give the woman her roses, for dropping such hammer on her long awaited return to sspot.

Women play the strongest role in selection process of mating, their playing the natural selection role to ensure men compete for them and lift up the male potential, if they don't as incels have chosen too, they will die alone and not be allowed to spread their dysfunction.

Now you flip to a blue pill ideology by stating that men should compete for women, what high value men do you know competing for women. Or any man with basic understanding of female nature?

Sorry incels female natural selection on sex doesn't do 'hand outs' or charity either. Unless women will do 'sadaqo' for sex with incels out of mercy which hasnt ever been witnessed in human history. Gee nature is brutal

Throughout this whole thread you have been conflating to complete separate issues.

1. access, this issue is most common with men in long term relationships, who are denied sex because their spouse has either lost respect for them, or their needs are neglected when ever they put out.

2. selection, men who women reject due to awkwardness, lack of masculinity. Boundaries, frame, obsession, seeking validation and acceptance like your doing right now.

Plus on the human right ground, the women argument is far stronger, your not ENTITLED to anything besides your own body, your entitlement/rights ends on someone elses body.

We as human are entitled to that which we have earned and deserve rightfully, not what we desire or wish for and that’s the predicament of an incel.

An incel wants all the rewards without the sweat, blood and time, that one must put in to be successful.

incels fully comprehend this principle when it concerns formal education, work etc… but with women it some how escapes them.
 
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Marriage and kids wouldn’t be that difficult for women if many men weren’t selfish. What’s a shit idea is being saddled with men who only take their needs to account.

South Korea is imploding due to severe sexism mixed with modernization. In one breath women are expected to work due to the economy and in the other breath, they’re not given incentives like cheaper nurseries, paid maternity leave and the list continues.

Refusing to meet women half way, is what creates mindsets like your own. I’ve seen a lot of posts of yours which were unhinged level sexism which is no surprise that your first instinct would be to reduce women’s education and overall well-being with women being the sacrificial lamb so that horrible men can get access.
Isn't that most developed Asian countries? Their countries developed faster than their society could catch up. The result is women living in a first-world, developed nation with a mindset stuck in the 1800s.
 
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