Arms Embargo Likely To Be Lifted

[bidenkulaha]

Total bullsh*t. Not happening. No atmis is getting removed either as they were signed in to stay 1 or two more years.

If HSM manages to lift somalia's arm embargo and gets atmis out then consider me a HSM supporter from that day. I'd defend him everywhere.

Look at this

In an exclusive interview on January 26 with VOA Somali, Hussein Sheikh-Ali said Somalia has sent 3,000 soldiers each to Eritrea and Uganda in the past few weeks. He said an additional 6,000 recruits will be sent to Ethiopia and Egypt.

"We want to complete making 15,000 soldiers ready within 2023," Ali told VOA in the one-on-one interview in Washington where he met with U.S. officials to seek more support for Somalia.

The first set of troops are now returning from Uganda as of this week. They took a 3 month training course

On the delay, ATMIS is still on the same 2024 schedule. However the first 2,000 pull out was delayed 6 months

Ali said the delay was requested because the troops Somalia is expecting to take over from ATMIS are in training abroad. He also said the government doesn't want to disrupt military operations against al-Shabab in central Somalia, as the areas ATMIS troops would vacate will have to be taken over by Somali forces.

This makes complete sense as Somalia still doesn’t have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. Rather just a few thousands that can go on offensives. Hence why in the past they always had to vacate land they easily captured. So these 15,000 sent abroad will be crucial to allowing them to take over ATMIS bases.

Danab and Gorgor can continue to lead offensive operations with the support of clan militias.

He said the government will have 24,000 troops trained and fully equipped by next year.

"There is no reason for ATMIS to stay or to continue to stay in Somalia," he added.

The biggest problem has always been funding.

The Somali parliament recently approved its biggest-ever budget for 2023 at $967 million, but domestic revenue is very low, and two-thirds of the budget comes from external support. That budget allocates $113 million for the national army.

"To date, the Somali authorities alone cannot afford the army they want," the report said.

Elmi said building an army without a budgetary plan could result in an unsustainable situation.

"An army is more than paying a salary. So many expenses come with it," he said.

"We have only emphasized sustainability. We are not specifying a number. We are saying they must be affordable. That affordability is coming from the capacity of the state."

Hence the UAE deal

The report said Somali army units trained by the United States, known as Danab (Lightning), and Turkey, known as Gorgor (Eagle), are now "reasonably well equipped," but the regular army units are only marginally better equipped than the Ma'awisley, the local clan militias supporting government forces.

"This inequality is so pronounced that officials now talk about the SNA being effectively two armies — one that is mobile, and one that is largely stationary," the report says.

The report also highlights struggles in generating and deploying "hold" forces that can stabilize newly recaptured areas.

"There is an important difference between pushing al-Shabab forces out of areas and holding them long enough to deliver a real peace dividend to the local inhabitants," it said.

 

[reer_ugaas_hussein]

Look at this



The first set of troops are now returning from Uganda as of this week. They took a 3 month training course

On the delay, ATMIS is still on the same 2024 schedule. However the first 2,000 pull out was delayed 6 months



This makes complete sense as Somalia still doesn’t have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. Rather just a few thousands that can go on offensives. Hence why in the past they always had to vacate land they easily captured. So these 15,000 sent abroad will be crucial to allowing them to take over ATMIS bases.

Danab and Gorgor can continue to lead offensive operations with the support of clan militias.



The biggest problem has always been funding.



Hence the UAE deal

Inshallah it will be succesfull. If HSM ends the arms embargo, defeats al shabaab and builds a stable diverse SNA he will be the greatest president in the history of Somalia in my book, we will built him a statue alongside the Sayyid and Imam Ahmed

 

[Prince of HS]

Inshallah it will be succesfull. If HSM ends the arms embargo, defeats al shabaab and builds a stable diverse SNA he will be the greatest president in the history of Somalia in my book, we will built him a statue alongside the Sayyid and Imam Ahmed

That’s all the Somali people need from him . Great security is the first path for stability, growth and development for the country

 

[bidenkulaha]

That’s all the Somali people need from him quite literally. Great security is the first path for stability, growth and development for the country

Guarantee security, invest in delivering cheap energy to all parts of Somalia, legislate for competition in the private sector (enforce this through a strong independent courts system) and the rest will work itself out.

 

[Somaliboqor]

@bidenkulaha @Prince of HS Are you guys saying we have 15 000 soldiers training abroad? and coming back in 2024? How many soldier have we know in ? And what do you think is the total amount of military personnel we need to secure our borders and give lasting security to our people? All my life has been a shithole and I would give everything to it being peaceful without terror and killings.

 

[bidenkulaha]

@bidenkulaha @Prince of HS Are you guys saying we have 15 000 soldiers training abroad? and coming back in 2024? How many soldier have we know in ? And what do you think is the total amount of military personnel we need to secure our borders and give lasting security to our people? All my life has been a shithole and I would give everything to it being peaceful without terror and killings.

Yes 15,000 being trained abroad, should take 3-6 months. They’ll be back this year.

We have 10-15,000 currently, we need to get to 24,000 by 2024 to replace the ATMIS troops that are meant to be leaving.

 

[Waaqmasho]

Look at this



The first set of troops are now returning from Uganda as of this week. They took a 3 month training course

On the delay, ATMIS is still on the same 2024 schedule. However the first 2,000 pull out was delayed 6 months



This makes complete sense as Somalia still doesn’t have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. Rather just a few thousands that can go on offensives. Hence why in the past they always had to vacate land they easily captured. So these 15,000 sent abroad will be crucial to allowing them to take over ATMIS bases.

Danab and Gorgor can continue to lead offensive operations with the support of clan militias.



The biggest problem has always been funding.



Hence the UAE deal

Do you actuary believe this nonsense? Hsm is the guy who in front of museveni told him, "I don't know what farmaajo was thinking with atmis". You're telling us he now wants to enforce farmaajo government time line?

The current military are leaving everyday and haven't gotten paid the past 3 months plus now they are not even getting food. So where's the largest budget approved going to? That's current army, no way extra 15000 will get paid or even stay.

Like I said, if he manages to achieve it, I will be his biggest fan and supporter. Because to do that, he needs to change what's making me an opposition in the first place.

This makes complete sense as Somalia still doesn’t have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. Rather just a few thousands that can go on offensives. Hence why in the past they always had to vacate land they easily captured

This is an important point for me. It's ironic and very funny you say it. You've been around here hailing HSM as a savior for fighting AS. You claimed farmaajo didn't fight AS and "wasted" 5 years. Yet you agree with his plan of having enough forces available before going on an offensive so captured areas won't be easily vacated and troops won't die unnecessarily. Which is why most gorgor, Danab and haramcad were trained during last 5 years. Plus the 5k Eritrean trained troops. All the groundwork done by farmaajo benefitting HSM. You're suffering from cognitive dissonance.

 

[bidenkulaha]

Do you actuary believe this nonsense? Hsm is the guy who in front of museveni told him, "I don't know what farmaajo was thinking with atmis". You're telling us he now wants to enforce farmaajo government time line?

The current military are leaving everyday and haven't gotten paid the past 3 months plus now they are not even getting food. So where's the largest budget approved going to? That's current army, no way extra 15000 will get paid or even stay.

Like I said, if he manages to achieve it, I will be his biggest fan and supporter. Because to do that, he needs to change what's making me an opposition in the first place.



This is an important point for me. It's ironic and very funny you say it. You've been around here hailing HSM as a savior for fighting AS. You claimed farmaajo didn't fight AS and "wasted" 5 years. Yet you agree with his plan of having enough forces available before going on an offensive so captured areas won't be easily vacated and troops won't die unnecessarily. Which is why most gorgor, Danab and haramcad were trained during last 5 years. Plus the 5k Eritrean trained troops. All the groundwork done by farmaajo benefitting HSM. You're suffering from cognitive dissonance.

Gorgor and Danab began training forces under HSM, nothing to do with Farmaajo. SNA began its recovery under Shariif then HSM who signed deals with Turkey and America. But in hindsight I do credit the troops sent to Eritrea but I suspect his motives weren’t for a fight against Shabaab which he couldn’t manage in 5years and allowed them to grow but instead for the opposition in Xamar.

Also HSM was criticising the timetable as had ATMIS left by the original timetable, we would’ve collapsed. We have nowhere near enough troops even after Danab, Gorgor, Eritrean trained troops. Shabaab had already spread all the way to Beledweyne and Jowhar in Hirshabelle, and was expanding in Galmudug. While it controls most of JL and KG and major cities are under siege, having to use planes. So Farmaajo was, yes, beyond a waste of time outside not shutting down turksom and danab.

There was a similar opportunity for Farmaajo to the one HSM has now where clan militias revolted against Shabaab in Middle Shabelle and Galmudug but he sabotaged the operations against them and failed to support them. Farmaajo had no interest in fighting Shabaab. HSM will prove this by defeating them by 2024

 

[Prince of HS]

Do you actuary believe this nonsense? Hsm is the guy who in front of museveni told him, "I don't know what farmaajo was thinking with atmis". You're telling us he now wants to enforce farmaajo government time line?

The current military are leaving everyday and haven't gotten paid the past 3 months plus now they are not even getting food. So where's the largest budget approved going to? That's current army, no way extra 15000 will get paid or even stay.

Like I said, if he manages to achieve it, I will be his biggest fan and supporter. Because to do that, he needs to change what's making me an opposition in the first place.



This is an important point for me. It's ironic and very funny you say it. You've been around here hailing HSM as a savior for fighting AS. You claimed farmaajo didn't fight AS and "wasted" 5 years. Yet you agree with his plan of having enough forces available before going on an offensive so captured areas won't be easily vacated and troops won't die unnecessarily. Which is why most gorgor, Danab and haramcad were trained during last 5 years. Plus the 5k Eritrean trained troops. All the groundwork done by farmaajo benefitting HSM. You're suffering from cognitive dissonance.

Shariif was the one who introduced turkey to Somalia and HSM was the one who signed an army pact with them and the deal for them to train our troops. It just so happened farmaajo was the president when the training started but HSM was the one behind it in 2014. The truth is the truth sxb. i don't like mentioning former president and their past faults but farmaajo did not put any effort into fighting shabaab if we are being truthful here. The only good military step he did was the 5k eritrean troops which i applaud him for. everything else when it comes to the war of khawarij he just wasted 5 years where they became stronger.

 

[Waaqmasho]

Gorgor and Danab began training forces under HSM, nothing to do with Farmaajo. SNA began its recovery under Shariif then HSM who signed deals with Turkey and America. But in hindsight I do credit the troops sent to Eritrea but I suspect his motives weren’t for a fight against Shabaab which he couldn’t manage in 5years and allowed them to grow but instead for the opposition in Xamar.

Also HSM was criticising the timetable as had ATMIS left by the original timetable, we would’ve collapsed. We have nowhere near enough troops even after Danab, Gorgor, Eritrean trained troops. Shabaab had already spread all the way to Beledweyne and Jowhar in Hirshabelle, and was expanding in Galmudug. While it controls most of JL and KG and major cities are under siege, having to use planes. So Farmaajo was yes beyond a waste of time outside not shutting down turksom and danab

You're having a hard time answering me saaxib . Somalis call this, "ila mareeyso". I'm not interested in distractions and tangents. I hoped my point was clear but apparently not. I didn't ask you to give me history lesson on danab or history on turksom building date; I know the dates. Since your cognitive dissonance is strong I'd ask you simple yes or no questions. Again, yes or no. And then you can add your reasons.

I applaud you for your begrudging acceptance of the 5k troops, btw. I know it's hard to accept.
Here comes the questions:

1. Did we need to train more troops before we engaged in offensive against AS in 2018?
2. Did gorgor appear during farmaajo's term?
3. Was most gorgor trained during fsrmaajo term?
4. Was most danab trained during farmaajos term?
5. Would it be easy to hold into newly captured area with our troops number in 2018?
6. Was most haramcad trained during farmaajos term?
8. Were most waran trained during farmaajo term?
7. Did troops increase exponentially from 2017 to 2022?
8. Are gorgor/danab more well trained and equipped than other sna?
And finally, the mega opus question.
9.. Was farmaajo right to wait for troops number to increase before engaging in a war against AS so he could hold captured ground?


Go ahead.

 

[Waaqmasho]

Shariif was the one who introduced turkey to Somalia and HSM was the one who signed an army pact with them and the deal for them to train our troops. It just so happened farmaajo was the president when the training started but HSM was the one behind it in 2014. The truth is the truth sxb. i don't like mentioning former president and their past faults but farmaajo did not put any effort into fighting shabaab if we are being truthful here. The only good military step he did was the 5k eritrean troops which i applaud him for. everything else when it comes to the war of khawarij he just wasted 5 years where they became stronger.

Refer to the above questions. I'd like to hear your answers too. Although I first need to ask: do you agree with this?

This makes complete sense as Somalia still doesn’t have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. Rather just a few thousands that can go on offensives. Hence why in the past they always had to vacate land they easily captured

I also want to make you understand, fight against AS is multi-faceted. And every effort put to stabilizing the government and making it better is an effort towards fighting them. As they can't stay in a strong country. Includes financial reforms and military reforms.

 

[bidenkulaha]

You're having a hard time answering me saaxib . Somalis call this, "ila mareeyso". I'm not interested in distractions and tangents. I hoped my point was clear but apparently not. I didn't ask you to give me history lesson on danab or history on turksom building date; I know the dates. Since your cognitive dissonance is strong I'd ask you simple yes or no questions. Again, yes or no. And then you can add your reasons.

I applaud you for your begrudging acceptance of the 5k troops, btw. I know it's hard to accept.
Here comes the questions:

1. Did we need to train more troops before we engaged in offensive against AS in 2018?
2. Did gorgor appear during farmaajo's term?
3. Was most gorgor trained during fsrmaajo term?
4. Was most danab trained during farmaajos term?
5. Would it be easy to hold into newly captured area with our troops number in 2018?
6. Was most haramcad trained during farmaajos term?
8. Were most waran trained during farmaajo term?
7. Did troops increase exponentially from 2017 to 2022?
8. Are gorgor/danab more well trained and equipped than other sna?
And finally, the mega opus question.
9.. Was farmaajo right to wait for troops number to increase before engaging in a war against AS so he could hold captured ground?


Go ahead.

1. No, both Shariif and HSM liberated lands from Shabaab without SNA. There’s always been clan militias willing to free their lands with logistics support. Farmaajo had more troops to support these operations than either of them too as HSM left him a functional SNA something he didn’t have beginning of his term yet in this five years Farmaajo lost lands while under Shariif and HSM most of the important cities today were liberated. Difficulties aside, they still managed to accomplish this task. It’s called leadership

Points 2. 3. 4. So you accept Farmaajo’s only contribution to Gorgor and Danab was he was lucky enough to be there as Turksom and Baledogle opened it’s base? Good to agree on this then.

Credit goes to Shariif and HSM.

5. Go back to my answer on 1. I’ll add that we can generate troops while also liberating lands in conjunction with local forces and populations. Like we’ve seen in Hirshabelle and Galmudug already in the past few months. Newer troops will replace ATMIS. It doesn’t take these troops to carry out offensive operations

6.7.8 are effectively the same question as 2.3.4 and answer to 9 is 5. And 1

You’ve spent a lot of time here waffling, all to avoid explaining why despite the many challenges faced by HSM he continues to liberate lands from Shabaab and your uncle failed miserably. It’ll be even more hilarious when Shabaab are a thing of the past next year while Farmaajo couldn’t liberate a centimetre in his time.

 

[Waaqmasho]

1. No, both Shariif and HSM liberated lands from Shabaab without SNA. There’s always been clan militias willing to free their lands with logistics support. Farmaajo had more troops to support these operations than either of them too as HSM left him a functional SNA something he didn’t have beginning of his term yet in this five years Farmaajo lost lands while under Shariif and HSM most of the important cities today were liberated. Difficulties aside, they still managed to accomplish this task. It’s called leadership

Points 2. 3. 4. So you accept Farmaajo’s only contribution to Gorgor and Danab was he was lucky enough to be there as Turksom and Baledogle opened it’s base? Good to agree on this then.

View attachment 259355

Credit goes to Shariif and HSM.

5. Go back to my answer on 1. I’ll add that we can generate troops while also liberating lands in conjunction with local forces and populations. Like we’ve seen in Hirshabelle and Galmudug already in the past few months. Newer troops will replace ATMIS. It doesn’t take these troops to carry out offensive operations

6.7.8 are effectively the same question as 2.3.4 and answer to 9 is 5. And 1

You’ve spent a lot of time here waffling, all to avoid explaining why despite the many challenges faced by HSM he continues to liberate lands from Shabaab and your uncle failed miserably. It’ll be even more hilarious when Shabaab are a thing of the past next year while Farmaajo couldn’t liberate a centimetre in his time.

Saxib, I just told you avoid history lessons and tangents.

So I take it yes to farmaajo training more troops and no to farmaajo waiting for troops to finish training before capturing land.

However, saying no to waiting means yes to "we have enough troops to hold land". our friend bidenkulaha disagrees.

Somalia still doesn’t have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. Rather just a few thousands that can go on offensives

Ya hear that?

B-but farmaajo why didn't he go on offensive at least? bidenkulaha?

Somalia doesn't have much of an armed forces that can sit in bases. in the past they always had to vacate land they easily captured.

Ohh so farmaajo is learning from previous failures and not killing troops for lands that would just get recaptured?! Thanks bidenkulaha.

From what I got aside from cognitive dissonance is your issue with farmaajo is not arming clan militias and getting them to hold land. I don't think that's a good idea. And any sane person who knows about civil war and 200s Era would agree with me. Ofc there's more reasons I'd expand on it if you want me to later. So let me ask you a final question, take qabiil militia out of the equation. Was fsrmaajo right to wait? Yes or no.

Btw if you think today we don't have enough forces with fsrmaajo training 10k+ well-trained Troops. imagine in 2017. They didn't even get paid for 6 months

 

[Starswarz1]

It's very hard to convince Reer west gedo that their Criminal abo farmaajo was useless and inept that wasted 5 years of Somalia's progressions.

 

[Waaqmasho]

This is abdirizaq Omar speaking about bariire recapture in Sept 2017:

"The Somali National Army isn’t trained to hold, so Danab can capture, but there isn’t a transitional army to keep the city. That has been a problem for a long time,” said Abdirizak Mohamed, a Somali MP, and the minister of security from 2015 to 2017.

Oh btw farmaajo did capture bariire and also successfully defended both bariire and awdhiigle (both fully SNA bases) without atmis support killing hundreds of AS.

 

[Waaqmasho]

It's very hard to convince Reer west gedo that their Criminal abo farmaajo was useless and inept that wasted 5 years of Somalia's progressions.

And it's very easy to write nonsense without defending your points.

You can answer the questions too btw.