Aksumite rule over northern Somalia?

[BidaarBoy]

I'm more mindblown as to why he think Aksum held any land in the coast of the Persian gulf lmao

I think Abraha did get pretty close tbh he lowkey xooged tf out of Arabia ngl
I think he left inscriptions mentioning subjugating tribes right next to the eastern coast

 

[Zak12]

I think Abraha did get pretty close tbh he lowkey xooged tf out of Arabia ngl
I think he left inscriptions mentioning subjugating tribes right next to the eastern coast

Maybe. I'm just bothered by the complete lack of corroborating evidence by Roman, Greek, Persian and Islamic sources mentioning all this

 

[BidaarBoy]

Maybe. I'm just bothered by the complete lack of corroborating evidence by Roman, Greek, Persian and Islamic sources mentioning all this

There are some Arabic/Islamic sources that speak about the invasions, we know Abraha tried to take Mecca and we have inscriptions from Arabia left by Abraha or his men that attest to them getting pretty close, so that verifies him conquering the south/western region of Saudi Arabia. Also there is a tradition that states Abraha marched towards Persia at one point but he quickly turned around, that indicates he probably held land in Arabia close to Persia

 

[BidaarBoy]

Honestly my main gripe with that map is how they mixed up multiple invasions. Abraham never claimed to have taken that much of the Red Sea coast, that was the Adulis king from the 3rd century.

Also they never held that much of Somalia or Nubia, the Arabia part might not be that far off tbh

 

[Zak12]

There are some Arabic/Islamic sources that speak about the invasions, we know Abraha tried to take Mecca and we have inscriptions from Arabia left by Abraha or his men that attest to them getting pretty close, so that verifies him conquering the south/western region of Saudi Arabia. Also there is a tradition that states Abraha marched towards Persia at one point but he quickly turned around, that indicates he probably held land in Arabia close to Persia

Yeah southwestern Saudi Arabia was for sure conquered and while there might have been movement towards Persia, it was likely just that, movements. Expeditions thst yielded no conquests and served to raid or plunder from tribes and small villages.

 

[BidaarBoy]

Yeah southwestern Saudi Arabia was for sure conquered and while there might have been movement towards Persia, it was likely just that, movements. Expeditions thst yielded no conquests and served to raid or plunder from tribes and small villages.

Probably yeah but it’s too early to say either way imo. Simply not enough research or data on the topic.

I lean towards the side that he probably did conquer majority of Arabia or close to majority, as it’s believed Himyar was able to do it before Aksum did and the Arabian desert was largely filled with backwards nomads. Yemen was probably the most difficult part of Arabia to conquer, the rest was mostly devoid of civilisation but I’m not gonna die on that hill anyway, not enough data at this point in time.

 

[Zak12]

@BidaarBoy I found this book that also believes that Aksum ruled over the western coast of Arabia but also stresses that Aksumites engaged in propaganda hence them not ruling over all of Nubia. And of course, nothing about them ruling the Persian Gulf or Niorthern and Central Arabia

Aksum and Nubia

Aksum and Nubia assembles and analyzes the textual and archaeological evidence of interaction between Nubia and the Ethiopian kingdom of Aksum, focusing primarily on the fourth century CE. Although ancient Nubia and Ethiopia have been the subject of a growing number of studies in recent years...

books.google.com

 

[BidaarBoy]

And of course, nothing about them ruling the Persian Gulf or Niorthern and Central Arabia

Yeah that’s page you posted the is about the Adulis conquest, the author is calling it Aksumite but Adulis was a separate polity to Aksum at this time, and based on Sabean inscriptions we can date this Adulis conquest to the 3rd century. Abrahas conquest happened in the 6th, 2 completely different events.


The Adulis text actually mentions conquering Aksumites

 

[Zak12]

Yeah that’s page you posted the is about the Adulis conquest, the author is calling it Aksumite but Adulis was a separate polity to Aksum at this time, and based on Sabean inscriptions we can date this Adulis conquest to the 3rd century. Abrahas conquest happened in the 6th, 2 completely different events.


The Adulis text actually mentions conquering Aksumites

Yep I remember you saying Adulis was a seperate entity.

Btw, do you know of any good Aksumite researchers? I'm trying to find the books Greg Fisher and Scott Fitzgerald

 

[awsaleban667]

"Three deserted cities inland in the former British Somaliland were also investigated, the most interesting of which is Amud. Here there
are from 250 to 300 houses and a temple, which had been converted roughly into a mosque at some later date. It was built of carefully dressed masonry, and the building techniques, pottery, and lamps seem
to suggest a close connection with Axumite sites of the second to fifth centuries a.d.”

This is very interesting, it coincides right with when the text was made, 3rd century AD

Amy’s is exactly like maduna in sool it’s not axumite

 

[Zak12]

Found a source states that Zoskales (Aksumite king) ruled over Northern Somalia aka Barbaria. Is this true? @BidaarBoy @awsaleban667 @Shimbiris

 

[Emir of Zayla]

Found a source states that Zoskales (Aksumite king) ruled over Northern Somalia aka Barbaria. Is this true? @BidaarBoy @awsaleban667 @Shimbiris

View attachment 331485View attachment 331486

He may be confusing it with coastal Sudan that was also called Barbaria, even though “other Barbaria” refers to northern Somalia on this map he could just be talking about Beja lands that were known to have been conquered and ruled by Axum. Take anything that says that Axum ruled Somalia with a grain of salt

 

[Zak12]

He may be confusing it with coastal Sudan that was also called Barbaria, even though “other Barbaria” refers to northern Somalia on this map he could just be talking about Beja lands that were known to have been conquered and ruled by Axum. Take anything that says that Axum ruled Somalia with a grain of salt

Forgot that Sudan was also referred to as Barbaria lol. I automatically assumed Barbaria = Somalia

However I looked into the Rauso again and the inscription mention that they lived in waterless plains. Wiki states that it means the Hawd, Dollo and Nugaal valley but that seems too inland

 

[BidaarBoy]

Found a source states that Zoskales (Aksumite king) ruled over Northern Somalia aka Barbaria. Is this true? @BidaarBoy @awsaleban667 @Shimbiris

View attachment 331485View attachment 331486

No the periplus states that the Somali city states were independent and Barbaria referred to east Sudan, danakil and Djibouti. Basically lowland areas typically inhabited by nomadic cushites.

Barbaria here most likely refers to danakil/djibouti area

 

[BidaarBoy]

However I looked into the Rauso again and the inscription mention that they lived in waterless plains. Wiki states that it means the Hawd, Dollo and Nugaal valley but that seems too inland

Your mixing up inscriptions, this is one is from the 3rd century, periplus is 1st

 

[BidaarBoy]

Also zoskales was most likely a native Adulis king, not Axum, periplus doesn’t even say anything about Axum