Did the Ajurans ever control the Banadir coast?

[Emir of Zayla]

You are the same guy who used a Wikipedia quote to supposedly refute me. You are one heck of a troll.

I’m pretty sure you got the wrong guy??

 

[HabarSteven12]

Serious question: what got you started on your quest to erase Somali history? Perhaps you can tell us once your trolling phase is over, we would really like to know sometime.

I am not here to troll or erase anything. As a matter of fact, you are the one trying to erase the history and civilization of the Banadiri people. You lack serious reading comprehension. Your personal attacks are a reflection of your own reality. You still couldn't address any of the questions posed to you.

Please provide evidence that the Ajurans ruled Mogadishu. You couldn't provide ancient monuments, mosques, or gravesites with inscriptions pointing out the dates and names of the Ajuran rulers? You don't even know Sheikh Abubakr Qabil. You are just making wild assumptions based on your own personal biases and historical distortions.

No historical or academic documents suggest that Sheikh Abubakr was Somali. Which dynasty was ruling Mogadishu at the time of Sheikh Abubakr? This isn't rocket science. If you just took the time to do a little bit of reading, you would know his ethnic identity was not Somali.

 

[Zak12]

you are the one trying to erase the history and civilization of the Banadiri people

No one is doing this. Everyone here acknowledges that Cads contributed to Somali civilization. Meanwhile you are trying to pretend Somalis have nothing to do with these cities and we were all camel herders.

 

[HabarSteven12]

Pure desperation. There isn't enough good evidence to prove the rulers of Mogadishu were Arabs. Ibn Battuta gives the clearest account of medieval Mogadishu and he flat out states the sultan spoke another language besides Arabic.

The sultan did speak Arabic. Somalis were not even present in Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit. If you just did a bit of reading, you would know Ibn Battuta wasn't referring to Somalis. Do you even know the dynasty that ruled Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit to the town? There isn't a single shred of evidence to suggest that Somalis ruled Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit. You couldn't provide ancient monuments, mosques, or gravesites with inscriptions pointing out the dates and names of the Somali rulers. Why are there Banadiri inscriptions but not Somalis?

 

[attash]

I am not here to troll or erase anything. As a matter of fact, you are the one trying to erase the history and civilization of the Banadiri people. You lack serious reading comprehension. Your personal attacks are a reflection of your own reality. You still couldn't address any of the questions posed to you.

Please provide evidence that the Ajurans ruled Mogadishu. You couldn't provide ancient monuments, mosques, or gravesites with inscriptions pointing out the dates and names of the Ajuran rulers? You don't even know Sheikh Abubakr Qabil. You are just making wild assumptions based on your own personal biases and historical distortions.

No historical or academic documents suggest that Sheikh Abubakr was Somali. Which dynasty was ruling Mogadishu at the time of Sheikh Abubakr? This isn't rocket science. If you just took the time to do a little bit of reading, you would know his ethnic identity was not Somali.

You can tell me that I "lack reading comprehension" all you like, the facts have already been made incredibly clear. There is no point in repeating them to you again because you are not arguing in good faith. Once you get over your trolling phase, you can tell us all about what made you start doing this in the first place. I'm sure it's an interesting story .

 

[Zak12]

The sultan did speak Arabic.

Yes but not as a native tongue.

Somalis were not even present in Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit.

Ibn Battuta literally called the sultan a Somali. Besides that, other writers before and after him said the city was populated by Somalis. Again, occam's razor is in full effect here.

that Somalis ruled Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit

You love ignoring Ibn Battuta' account, huh? I've never seen anyone in this much denial.

You couldn't provide ancient monuments, mosques, or gravesites with inscriptions

We'll get them as soon as Mogadishu and southern Somalia gets properly excavated. Meanwhile, I don't see you posting any proof.

 

[Zak12]

Its funny how @HabarSteven12 contradicts himself so much. He claims the sultan was an Arab yet Ibn Battuta literally says Mogadishu's sultan spoke "Maqdishi" in addition to Arabic. Now why would an Arab ruler speak any other language other than Arabic? More over, there is zero possibility of Maqdishi being anything besides Somali. I've seen Habarsteven12 claim its Swahili or some other Bantu language lol.

 

[attash]

This isn't rocket science. If you just took the time to do a little bit of reading, you would know his ethnic identity was not Somali.

Then what was his ethnic identity? Arab? As I've explained over and over again, Ibn Battuta clearly defines who the Berberah are:

...a town of the Berberah, who are a negro people. Their land is a desert extending for two months' journey from Zayla to Maqdashaw.

Now explain to me how this is referring to Arabs. Let me witness the true extent of the mental gymnastics you are willing to perform .

 

[HabarSteven12]

Yes but not as a native tongue.

Ibn Battuta literally called the sultan a Somali. Besides that, other writers before and after him said the city was populated by Somalis. Again, occam's razor is in full effect here.

You love ignoring Ibn Battuta' account, huh? I've never seen anyone in this much denial.

We'll get them as soon as Mogadishu and southern Somalia gets properly excavated. Meanwhile, I don't see you posting any proof.

The Sultan spoke Maqdishawi and Arabic. The language of Maqdishawi does not refer to Somalis. Maqdishawi was a dialect of Swahili, a lingua franca that no longer exists. The indigenous people of Mogadishu shared the same culture and ancestry as the people of the wider Swahili coast. Ibn Battuta never once referred to the Sultan as a Somali or said Somalis were the majority of the inhabitants.

You are one lying troll. You proved my point. You have no archeological or historical proof to demonstrate that Somalis ruled or inhabited Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit. You keep adding your own historical distortions about the Banadir coast.

 

[HabarSteven12]

Then what was his ethnic identity? Arab? As I've explained over and over again, Ibn Battuta clearly defines who the Berberah are:

...a town of the Berberah, who are a negro people. Their land is a desert extending for two months' journey from Zayla to Maqdashaw.

Now explain to me how this is referring to Arabs. Let me witness the true extent of the mental gymnastics you are willing to perform .

You are mixing two quotes. Ibn Battuta never referred to the inhabitants of Mogadishu as Negros. Wallahi, you are getting desperate. You took his description of the people of Zeila and projected it onto the people of Mogadishu. You could clearly see that Ibn Battuta's description of the people of Zeila was different from his description of the people of Mogadishu. My guy, you are getting desperate.

 

[attash]

The Sultan spoke Maqdishawi and Arabic. The language of Maqdishawi does not refer to Somalis. Maqdishawi was a dialect of Swahili, a lingua franca that no longer exists. The indigenous people of Mogadishu shared the same culture and ancestry as the people of the wider Swahili coast. Ibn Battuta never once referred to the Sultan as a Somali or said Somalis were the majority of the inhabitants.

You are one lying troll. You proved my point. You have no archeological or historical proof to demonstrate that Somalis ruled or inhabited Mogadishu during Ibn Battuta's visit. You keep adding your own historical distortions about the Banadir coast.

Zero evidence that Swahili was ever widely spoken in Mogadishu lmao, otherwise the reer xamar tribes would've spoken it. In Baraawe, they speak a dialect of Swahili, but not in Xamar. Also, ibn Battuta visited the Swahili cities such as Kilwa, if the people in Kilwa and Mogadishu spoke the same language, ibn Battuta would've mentioned it.

 

[Zak12]

Maqdishawi was a dialect of Swahili, a lingua franca that no longer exists

There is absolutely zero proof of this. Neville Chettick said it likely referred to Somali.

The indigenous people of Mogadishu shared the same culture and ancestry as the people of the wider Swahili coast

No they didn't lol. Not only was Mogadishu never considered part of the Swahili coast by geographers, but the places that actually were associated with Swahilis like Barawe and Kismayo have Swahili speaking minorities today like the Bravanese and Bajuni. Mogadishu doesn't.

never once referred to the Sultan as a Somali

Stop this dishonesty. Barbari is a premodern name for Somalis. Plenty of ethnicities/nationalities today have gotten their names recently does that mean they never existed? For example, Amhara were never referred to as such until recently. Does that mean they never populated the highlands back then?

You have no archeological or historical proof to demonstrate

I'm using literal primary eye witness accounts you dolt lmao. You have nothing by comparison exceot dubious manuscripts that aren't contemporary.

 

[attash]

You are mixing two quotes. Ibn Battuta never referred to the inhabitants of Mogadishu as Negros. Wallahi, you are getting desperate. You took his description of the people of Zeila and projected it onto the people of Mogadishu. You could clearly see that Ibn Battuta's description of the people of Zeila was different from his description of the people of Mogadishu. My guy, you are getting desperate.

You seem to have a very short term memory, so let me explain to you again that ibn Battuta said that the Sultan of Mogadishu was Berberah:

You've been cornered, kid. Now do as I told you and explain to me how Berberah refers to Arabs, given ibn Battuta's description of them:

...a town of the Berberah, who are a negro people. Their land is a desert extending for two months' journey from Zayla to Maqdashaw.

Dance for me, dance!

 

[Emir of Zayla]

The Sultan spoke Maqdishawi and Arabic. The language of Maqdishawi does not refer to Somalis. Maqdishawi was a dialect of Swahili, a lingua franca that no longer exists.

Evidence?

The indigenous people of Mogadishu shared the same culture and ancestry as the people of the wider Swahili coast.

Oh so now they aren’t Benadiris but Bantus instead? Habeshit cope festival

Ibn Battuta never once referred to the Sultan as a Somali or said Somalis were the majority of the inhabitants.

He called him a Berber/Barber which is Somali and also said he spoke Maqdishawi which I assume is a Mogadishu dialect or mistranslation.

You are one lying troll. You proved my point.

You’re accusing others of what you’re doing. Gaslighting others on text is crazy

 

[Zak12]

Evidence?

Oh so now they aren’t Benadiris but Bantus instead? Habeshit cope festival

He called him a Berber/Barber which is Somali as said he spoke Maqdishawi which is Somali.

You’re accusing others of what you’re doing. Gaslighting others on text is crazy

He effectively went from claiming Mogadishu was ruled by Arabs to being ruled by Bantus because he thinks the sultan spoke Swahili. Utterly shameless flip flopping.

 

[HabarSteven12]

Evidence?

Oh so now they aren’t Benadiris but Bantus instead? Habeshit cope festival

You are coping. You lack reading comprehension. You are obviously having a difficult time comprehending academic literature. Read slowly next time.

He called him a Berber/Barber which is Somali and also said he spoke Maqdishawi which I assume is a Mogadishu dialect or mistranslation.

You’re accusing others of what you’re doing. Gaslighting others on text is crazy

Your conclusion lacks historical objectivity. You reached a premature conclusion based on your own personal bias. I caught you using a Wikepdia quote .

 

[HabarSteven12]

There is absolutely zero proof of this. Neville Chettick said it likely referred to Somali.

Neville Chittick didn't say it likely referred to Somalis. He explained the different interpretations of the meaning of Maqdishi. Overwhelming evidence shows it doesn't refer to the Somali language. There was no Somali ruler present in Mogadishu during the 13th century.

No they didn't lol. Not only was Mogadishu never considered part of the Swahili coast by geographers, but the places that actually were associated with Swahilis like Barawe and Kismayo have Swahili speaking minorities today like the Bravanese and Bajuni. Mogadishu doesn't.

Stop this dishonesty. Barbari is a premodern name for Somalis. Plenty of ethnicities/nationalities today have gotten their names recently does that mean they never existed? For example, Amhara were never referred to as such until recently. Does that mean they never populated the highlands back then?

The term barbara itself is ambiguous and inconclusive. We don't know for certain who exactly it refers to all the time. The word Barbara is also used to describe a geographical region. On one occasion, it was used to describe a region inhabited by Arabs. The term Barbara is not specific to Somalis. Stop regurgitating that nonsense.

I'm using literal primary eye witness accounts you dolt lmao. You have nothing by comparison exceot dubious manuscripts that aren't contemporary.

You source about Ibn Battuta was debunked. Do you have any other sources? The first contemporary mention of the word Mogadishu was by Yaqut in 1228. He says the people are foreigners and not black in color. So you pretty much debunked yourself by using eye witness accounts.

 

[attash]

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You are coping. You lack reading comprehension. You are obviously having a difficult time comprehending academic literature. Read slowly next time.



Your conclusion lacks historical objectivity. You reached a premature conclusion based on your own personal bias. I caught you using a Wikepdia quote .

"Muyi wa Mwisho"

The hotepping is insane

 

[Emir of Zayla]

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The copium is insane, there is no evidence that all place names in Southern Somalia is of Bantu-origin I can already guess which book you grabbed this out of, and it definitely came out after ‘91. But what happened to the coast all being Benadiri and now you’re claiming it’s all Bantu? How stupid are you?

Your conclusion lacks historical objectivity. You reached a premature conclusion based on your own personal bias. I caught you using a Wikepdia quote .

Since when? I’d like to where I used a Wikipedia quote?

 

[Emir of Zayla]

"Muyi wa Mwisho"

The hotepping is insane .

How much do you want to bet it’s either a Kenyan or J*reerweyn historian and if it was written after 1991