Somalia Is In The Dark Ages Banking

[DR OSMAN]

@Teeri-Alpha your an economist, is this an 'accurate' definition of Interest rate on currency?

According to this theory, Interest is the reward for the productive use of the capital which is equal to the marginal productivity of physical capital. Therefore, those economists who hold classical view have said that “the rate of Interest is determined by the supply and demand of capital.

I am working of that definition and theory because that's what I see also. Why does Somalia refuse Interest rate? you can't perform in a world that 'increases' and 'decreases' their 'supply' of capital. Capital is linked to supply/demand. Warheedhe af somali hadi aad uu bahan tahay in lagu fasiro. Hadi aysan jirin 'baahi' dhinaca suuqa siiba maal gelinta iyo 'ganacsiga', bankiyada waa 'yaraysa' 'lacagta' suuqa la gelinayo ama waa 'lacag' aan loo bahnayn oo meesha ka buuxsamayso sida Somalia ku dhacdo waxayna marki dambe ku dhacayso suuqa 'sicir' wayn iyo lacagta laga shakiyo ileen meel walbo bay iska taala, xitaa niin barakac ah oo aad oog tahay inu liito ba iska wareegayo isago lacagta siita, inkasto uusan ISTAHILIN. Markas ayuu qiimaha lacagtasi jabaysa.

They apply the same model marki 'suuqa' ganacsi iyo maalgelin badan ka socoto sida dhismaha, ganacsi furasho, infrastructure sida laamiyo, ama 'dhaqdhaq' kasto ha noqote ama diaspora, local, dibed, waa inu jira banki oo waxasi 'control' ku samayo si uu lacag ku filan dhaqdhaqasi geeyo ama waxaa yaran doono currency iyo waxaa istagayso suuqi iyo QAYLO Ba dhacayso iyo rabsho runti. Wa ariin xitaa amniga khatar gelin karta hadi aadan bankiyo wanaagsan haysan oo la janqaadayo aduunka.

Ama ii naca Ama II jeclada @Jablibax aduunkani sidas weeye. Interest rate ma aha 'ribo', lacagtasi waa in control lagu sameya ama 'fowdo' bay noqonaysa akhirki, wax kasto aduunka hadi aysan nidaam jirin, fowdo weeye. Lacagta Somalia haloo sameeyo 'bankiyo' ka amar qaato dawlada oo sheegayso 'interest' rateka sanad kasto la saarayo lacagta si ay la janqaado baahiyada suuqa jira ama wallahi amni xumo ba imanayso. Marka garan mayo kelmadani 'banki islami' ah

 

[Farjano-Walad]

@DR OSMAN

abiy meeting ONLF in adis, each ONLF is wearing the Ogadeniya flag inside the palace,

the confidence of the men,

 

[DR OSMAN]

Please explain the theory behind 'banki islami' ah kkkkk. War indho adkaa, hadi aadan theoryga sheegi karin, sidee loo isticmali kara. War bankiyada aduunka it's the same, lacagtada hadi aadan meel ka hakamayn oo interest saarin, u r finished. I am sorry. Interest iyo Ribo isku mid ma aha. Weli ma arag qof sheego meeshay interest rate iyo ribo isku mid yihin? Anigu 100 kun hadan ku siiyo, iyo hadi aad heeshish illa gasho inaad 30 sano ka bacdi ii soo celinaysid. Waan ku qasban ahay in aan hisaabiyo suuqa 30 sano ka bacdi iyo sicirka sanad kasta. Ka bacdi waa in aan 'faido' hela ama maxay taraysa hadan ku siiyo iyo inaad ii soo celisid, jug jug meeshad jog weeye, iyo wax isbadel ah ma dhacayso suuqa weligeed, halkeedi weeye

 

[Farjano-Walad]

let me pray friday prayers insha Allah then we can educate you about riba, give me an hour or so

 

[DR OSMAN]

@DR OSMAN

abiy meeting ONLF in adis, each ONLF is wearing the Ogadeniya flag inside the palace,

the confidence of the men,

Ogaden camp isn't united on their 'strategy' though. Abdi Ilay was very 'friendly' with Tigray as they are 'traditionally' Allies of Muslims for historical reasons to keep 'amhara' down. Their evidence and proof of that like the islamic burial sites, ancient mosques of eritrea, etc.

They were most likely the area they entered and 'passed' thru since the early muslims had tocome in thru the 'sea' and encounter 'tigray'. I can see why 'tigray' wants a Muslim Alliance. It's obvious Amhara are sealed with 'israel' as a friendly ally, I mean they even have 'church reserved' in Israel. It's quite ancient.

They also got the capital of Africa in Addis, there is no denying that and requires a-lot of 'international' support for such thing. ONLF kept warring though, which is odd. They also don't seem to fear 'oromo' like 'ilay' did who wanted a 'kill first ask questions later' which is suspicious. Do they think the 'oromo' are not threat to Ogaden is what I am balancing, like someone la 'wadan karo' weeye we don't need to 'war' with them. Because ONLF immediately stopped 'armed' confrontation when this guy came not when Tigray was there who offered it also. Ogaden is not as united as you think.

They seem to have differing 'views' Towards Ethiopia with ONLF staunchly Anti any Habesha and Ilay more friendly with 'Tigray' who he sees as 4 million and who need Muslims more then we need them to stop 'Amhara' together. It will be interesting what ONLF proposes but their policy of 'secession' is still a 'policy' they haven't changed that but only said the militant side is over. We await to see the outcome. Hawiye 'remind' me of Oromo of Somalia. A clan who has nothing to speak on in history or impact on Somalia like Oromo for Ethiopia.

The only thing they brag about is we had two presidents but when u ask what did they leave behind, ZILCH and they brag 'he passed power on' no joke. They brag on live TV of 'transitioning' power, so they are living proof their type of guy who brags about a job but not what he did in the job. I warn you to stay away from Oromo cause Hawiye as you can see even though not sophisticated can swing so many sides locally and globally their always a 'risk' to anyone who deals with them. Like jabhad groups tried, like so many foreign nations tried, hawiye simply isn't built to understand it's not about winning but SURVIVING, it doesn't matter who wins or loses it about 'ma jiri doona' which means cooperation is mandatory to achieve goals and that means 'tanasul'

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Teeri-Alpha Good luck with your negiotations with Ethiopia. If I was you I would argue for separate nation so you form a buffer on this 'fowdo' nation of Somalia. Yes sorry Somalia, you refuse to be nation, others have a right to take advantage of you for their interest. Meel fowdo ah waa meesha ugu liito aduunka. Imagine if the UN and international law disappeared today? we would be in a world of 'fowdo' like happened in Somalia in 91, but on a global scale. U see but the b22n marehan thinks criticizing a system is geesinimo but doesn't understand the alternative is no system and terrible dark age like happened in Somalia cud happen in the world without the world order. I don't like the way the world order is set up either but you need to work within the 'nidaam' not ask for no 'nidaam' kkkk it just means chaos and from chaos nothing is possible, literally, never seen something out of chaos in the world.

As MJ we respect the nidaam and structure and learn it inside and out and 'swing' to our favor, we ain't creating a 'fowdo' condition waryaa, just cause you don't know how to work within the structures, don't blame me or mj. We work within structure because we know without it, our goals are not achieveable anyways as we entered an empty vacuum and from a vacuum we lose our UN member role and it's back to square one. So Fowdo is definitely not an MJ policy and never was. We got way to much experience to work within structures since the 60s till now and our diaspora are performing well in structures and earning highest spots among somali clans where-as somali clans fail to work within structures and therefore fail and start the racism cry kkkkkk like they do the MJ CRY of rashid iyo razaq inta kale ma roti baa.... made niggas iga dheh

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Teeri-Alpha please do not supply me wahabi or arab content from colonial till now period. Sxb if they were so gifted mentally, we would see the latest drones and all sorts of technology and wonders of the world, we can assume he is ghetto mind, his islam is also ghetto understanding. If he is right, he will impress us like islamic spain/syria/iraq guys did, I dont mind reading their material. But do not bring me modern islam, modern muslim simply hasnt got 4 nobels and 2 are for arafat for f*ck sakes who left no legacy in palestine there is no difference to when he came or left @AussieHustler

4 nobels out of 1.5 billion, statistically you can measure this society and disregard their religious intepretation as most likely 15th century dark age christianity, cause their statistics were similar also. Modern Islam is garbage cause the people who are teaching are not gifted in the first place. Its ok for meel fowdo ah it can only create such environment ama dad faqri ah sida somalida ama dad aad uu liito dhinaca waxbarashada

 

[Farjano-Walad]

Ok @DR OSMAN

one of the things i admire about you is you start topic on serious subjects, unlike some useless people who talk about useless stuff,



islamic has a definition on riba:

so Islamic definition:

riba is divided into 3

but the gist is this,

riba is an increase in quality or quantity

quantify: you lend me 10 and ask for 11

quality: you lend me a camel that is a female 5 years old, i give back a camel female that is 2 years old, or you lend me fresh tasty dates/timir, i give back total variety unripe dates,

western version:

Aristotle and Socrates definitions as well as Plato: sure the ancient Greeks were the first people we know of who discussed riba/interest and banned it (outside of islamic books given to Nabi Muuse, nabi dawud, soloman, ibrahim etc) so the first civilisation that bans riba outside of areas in the middle east where islamic prhets were sent to and God sent books

so no point of mention the roman ban on riba even before rome became Christian since the greeks discussed it and banned it 500 years before them,

there is one Chinese economist from 690 BC ho spoke about it, but unlike the greeks who gave us the word economics and wrote many books he was a one man army intellectually, after he dies no one else (i can provide sources through Murray N Rothbard various articles and books written in the 1950s and 1960s such as A History of banking and money, economic thought before Adam smith, the economics of the ancient Greeks, a critique of Socrates economics, etc, , Austrian Economise, Ancient Economics History,

so between the ancient Greeks until islam came about no one spoke of riba/Interest , inf act no one on the entre human race wrote a book about economics between the ancient greeks until we get muslim giants like ibn khaldun, al-gazali, ibn masri etc, in fact Adam smith called ibn khaldun the real father of eocnomics,


the roman church adopted the prohibition of riba in the bible and did not talk much about it, sure we get the likes of saint Thomas Aquinas speak about it in the late 1200s, but that is centuries after muslim economist, so the first time modern west speaks about it is old boy saint thomas,

riba was not really discussed much until 1800s, sure certain men link Calvin and martin Luther speak about it in the 1500s but it was a very small foot note in a wider context, calvin who started the calvinis school encouraged it, but the roman church banned it till 1912 and the church of england only legalised it in 1860, however the west did practice riba in what we economist call contractum trinius , it was designed to circumvent the ban on usury


so in the western world, we do not really get answers for riba, what is it, why does it exist and should it be banned, no one answers this question, until late 1800s

the first man who gives and provides a context for its existence is an Austrian economist from the austrian school of thought Eugen Böhm von Bawerk in his book :

History and Critique of Interest Theories (1884)

basically in a nut shell, he invented what he called TPT, time preference theorem, someone who wants a loan of 1000 today will borrow and pay back 1100 because he doesn't have it and cannot wait, he can save up but how long will it take?

and someone who lends the money will lend it for he will get back more, otherwise there is no incentive to lend it since he can use it himself, so he is basically renting his money

this is what creates the first praxeological axiom for the existence of riba

 

[DR OSMAN]

Ok @DR OSMAN

one of the things i admire about you is you start topic on serious subjects, unlike some useless people who talk about useless stuff,



islamic has a definition on riba:

so Islamic definition:

riba is divided into 3

but the gist is this,

riba is an increase in quality or quantity

quantify: you lend me 10 and ask for 11

quality: you lend me a camel that is a female 5 years old, i give back a camel female that is 2 years old, or you lend me fresh tasty dates/timir, i give back total variety unripe dates,

western version:

Aristotle and Socrates definitions as well as Plato: sure the ancient Greeks were the first people we know of who discussed riba/interest and banned it (outside of islamic books given to Nabi Muuse, nabi dawud, soloman, ibrahim etc) so the first civilisation that bans riba outside of areas in the middle east where islamic prhets were sent to and God sent books

so no point of mention the roman ban on riba even before rome became Christian since the greeks discussed it and banned it 500 years before them,

there is one Chinese economist from 690 BC ho spoke about it, but unlike the greeks who gave us the word economics and wrote many books he was a one man army intellectually, after he dies no one else (i can provide sources through Murray N Rothbard various articles and books written in the 1950s and 1960s such as A History of banking and money, economic thought before Adam smith, the economics of the ancient Greeks, a critique of Socrates economics, etc, , Austrian Economise, Ancient Economics History,

so between the ancient Greeks until islam came about no one spoke of riba/Interest , inf act no one on the entre human race wrote a book about economics between the ancient greeks until we get muslim giants like ibn khaldun, al-gazali, ibn masri etc, in fact Adam smith called ibn khaldun the real father of eocnomics,


the roman church adopted the prohibition of riba in the bible and did not talk much about it, sure we get the likes of saint Thomas Aquinas speak about it in the late 1200s, but that is centuries after muslim economist, so the first time modern west speaks about it is old boy saint thomas,

riba was not really discussed much until 1800s, sure certain men link Calvin and martin Luther speak about it in the 1500s but it was a very small foot note in a wider context, calvin who started the calvinis school encouraged it, but the roman church banned it till 1912 and the church of england only legalised it in 1860, however the west did practice riba in what we economist call contractum trinius , it was designed to circumvent the ban on usury


so in the western world, we do not really get answers for riba, what is it, why does it exist and should it be banned, no one answers this question, until late 1800s

the first man who gives and provides a context for its existence is an Austrian economist from the austrian school of thought Eugen Böhm von Bawerk in his book :

History and Critique of Interest Theories (1884)

basically in a nut shell, he invented what he called TPT, time preference theorem, someone who wants a loan of 1000 today will borrow and pay back 1100 because he doesn't have it and cannot wait, he can save up but how long will it take?

and someone who lends the money will lend it for he will get back more, otherwise there is no incentive to lend it since he can use it himself, so he is basically renting his money

this is what creates the first praxeological axiom for the existence of riba

Yeh why would I give you 1k and then ask for the same back. I wouldn't even have any incentive not financially, I would possibly loan it to you if you 'were family or friend or clan member' and ask you pay me back the same because your 'close' to me, but to a 'stranger', there is absolutely no business reason for that.

You forgot one area in history, it's always the 'trickiest' to find but u went thru all the giants of the World in civilization like all 'academics' do but there is always one mighty player u forget. The guy who has established our 'religions' for us be it Islam/Christianity, the impact this guy will have is much larger then 'ancient civilization'. I found the key to success in knowledge is going to 'Jews' because our societies are 'grounded' on their systems, you won't understand the 'west' without knowing 'jews' who I consider their 'masters'. No ancient civilization is responsible for the 'ribah' happening today, but we have clear evidence 'jews' 'inspired' it not only thru their 'torah' legalizing it but heaps of 'ancient' texts speak about it being 'banks' for locals in ancient world. The world literally copied their 'model'.

The words marbit and tarbit, for the form of interest most familiar in modern times, became ribbit (ריבית) in modern Hebrew.[citation needed] The latter word is similar to the Arabic word riba used in the Quran.

It's not just 'money' as you said, it's everything in judaism.

Ribit applies not only to money, but to lending and borrowing items as well. So to borrow a few eggs from your neighbor and then pay her back with a full dozen would be problematic.7

This is the verse they use to justify it

Deut 23:20 You shall not deduct interest from loans to your kinsman, whether in money or food or anything else that can be deducted as interest. 23:20 You may deduct interest from loans to foreigners but do not deduct interest from loans to your country-men, so that YHWH your God may bless you in all your undertakings in the land that you are about to enter and possess.

Lakin Jews are like me in a way I wouldn't do it to 'tolka' and they don't either. I would to shisheeye

If you lend silver (=money) to my people, to the poor among you, do not act toward them as a creditor; exact no interest from them.

'Ribbit' in Hebrew and 'Riba' is Identical, I agree there. Islam was clearly banning 'jewish' type money lending as they saw what they were doing in Islamic controlled territories and most likely residents complaining how 'life' is hard because of the 'jew' loaner kkkkk.

The jews are well known for Money lending and was one of the main reasons besides 'killing prophets' they were 'persecuted' as the locals got 'fed' up after a while, especially when they saw jews not applying the same rules to 'jews' this would've obviosly raised up 'lots of anger' among earlier societies.

 

[Farjano-Walad]

so we have heard any people like you before saying riba doesn't mean interest it just means massive usury charge like 30%, 300 %

king Henry the 8th of england used this, when the pope kicked him out and excommunicated him, he said usury is only 10%, then it was changed to 30% then to 300% all when he was alive,

listen warya, riba wherever the amount is riba, regardless if it 1000% or 0.000001 %

if you lend me a million and you ask back 1 million plus 1 penny its riba

many so called muslim economist like Mohamed something, an Egyptian economist who teaches in southern California Berkeley,

they claim riba just means not charging exorbitant interest,

who decides how such is exorbitant

let me tell you why rib is banned:

it encourages fractional reserve baking, nay ti gives the seed to it,

learn about fractional reserve banking then you will be amazed why Allah banned riba,

it creates inflation, you mention lending money for 30 year it will suffer from inflation, actually no, marginal utility and subjective utility of money goes up if we stick to islam: sue only gold and silver as money as the Nabi SAW ordered us,

it creates mal investment, boom and bust cycle, creates recessions, mass unemployment,

read the theory of money and credit 1912 by ludwig von mises the Austrian economist

all boom and bust cycles are caused by central banks playing around with riba

riba creates a wide dived between rich and poor and makes it expensive for the poor to afford houses, big ticket items since it drains away their purchasing power through inflation,

since you love maths lets play a little maths quiz,

lets say you have an economic with 100 dollars, all of the money in the this economy, and lets say base rate bank interest prime rate is 10%,

if all the borrowers gave back the money they borrowed to the lenders, there is outstanding interest to pay ( in this example 10%) how is this money paid since all money in this economy is 100 $ but interest plus principle is 110$

where does the extra 10% come from? it has to be created, in a non ending cycle of lets keep printing money so we ca just cover the interest on the principle, thus inflation is created

freedman the economist from the Chicago school used to say inflation is a monetary phenomenon everywhere and anywhere, meaning inflation and her seeds lie t the door step of riba

i dare yuo to come with a solution in that maths quiz and show me how you will pay the principle plus the interest, its ad infinitum , you can never ever pay it off,

so since you can never pay it off, it forces the state/central bank to keep printing money year in year out, thus poor people, pensioners, savers suffer as their fixed income is taxed away in what we call hidden inflation tax,

its like scooping tasty meat and veg from the soup pan and replacing it with water to make it look like there is still soup in the pan, its full but it has no nah, no taste,

this is inflation, its a hidden tax on money

this very tactic is not only sued on individuals, its also used on nations by the IMF, world bank and BIS, year after year, add money riba, burden them and then demand this or that resources, make them poor, so the nation that borrowed 100 million ends up paying 5 billion,

siad barre borrowed about 500 million in 1989, today the riba alone is around 6 billion and this is owned by the Paris Club, an agency of the IMF and world bank,

what affect will this have on somalia if it wanted to rise up? its a sword on your head, to enslave you,


lastly, riba is so dangerous most humans do not understand it, most people do not really understand how it has become a massive weapon against the poor and weak nations,

oh doctor you have no idea

but there are solutions in islam where we can lend money with no riba, both parties do not suffer, and no money is inflated,

the US Constitution said in 1789 the sate must use silver and gold and no central bank is allowed and that banks are more dangerous than standing armies


amazing, in the Quran, we are warned abut riba and the only place Allah says i will personally fight them, in judgement day those who make money from riba will come with snakes in their belly

Before there was John Kenneth Galbraith or Joe Stiglitz or Nouriel Roubini, or Simon Johnson or Niall Ferguson or Occupy Wall Street-- there was one of the Founding Fathers, Thomas Jefferson giving an advance warning of 2008 some 200 years ago. An awesome foreboding it was, too.

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies," Jefferson wrote. " If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around(these banks) will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."

"The issuing power of currency shall be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robert...on-about-the-power-of-the-banks/#2b8fbd2b2b18

 

[DR OSMAN]

@Teeri-Alpha You probably missed my argument because I didn't clarify my position. I am not saying it's a good thing, I am just saying it's how the world markets are and for us to defy it, I don't see a working model. While the world increases and decreases and profitizes from it's currency capital based on physical capital(assets), your sitting there arguing we should not do it and play along the same rules and 'begin modern banking.

Is it ideal no, would I like the world to go back to normal economics without interest, yes, will it happen unlikely. It's like the 'war' scenario, I know it's morally wrong to kill, but hey I need to do it if I want to survive right? so my morals of right and wrong really go out the question due to 'survival' interests. Riba and Interest based economies are reality if we are ever to 'grow' our economy following the international economic order, not create our own 'little vacuum' due to global trade being such 'huge' dimension now, we don't live in our own isolated kingdom anymore to do such thing.

Plus I find this verse very wise in the quran which ironically the last verse revealed

Prohibited for you are: carrion, blood, the flesh of swine, and those upon which (a name) other than that of Allah has been invoked (at the time of slaughter), animal killed by strangulation, or killed by a blow, or by a fall, or by goring, or that which is eaten by a beast unless you have properly slaughtered it; and that which has been slaughtered before the idols, and that you determine shares through the arrows. (All of) this is sin. Today those who disbelieve have lost all hope of (damaging) your faith. So, do not fear them, and fear Me. Today, I have perfected your religion for you, and have completed My blessing upon you, and chosen Islam as Dīn (religion and a way of life) for you. But whoever is compelled by extreme hunger, having no inclination towards sin, then Allah is Most-Forgiving, Very-Merciful.

The part that interest me the most in that verse is if your forced to hunger, you can break islamic laws even 'ribah'. I am arguing from the point we are now in world order structure, so I don't think allah will hold it against us, since we didn't create it, and if we don't abide by it, we end up like poor countries who end up eating 'ribah' as long as your using the dollar or any western currency which is the global trade currencies your in 'ribah' since it's printed and managed from ribah based nations. So your argument I won't do ribah but will use it, is an oxymoron. If u don't use the dollar or any western currency, you can't trade in the world. I say it's time for reason to prevail in Islam, you can't create your own 'economic order' when it's already fuckin defined, it's like saying i want to create my own nation when the nations are defined in the UN. You just go into a damn vacuum. This discussion needs to be had. Ribah has to be done WARYAA or we end up on NGO lists as our currency is not manipulated like the chinese do because now 'currency' is a fuckin war, it should be classed as 'war category' in global economics not a business category in ISLAM, it's re-defining so we are not under business rules of Islam but 'war rules. Ribah banks is my dream, I can see Somalia catching up in 30 years then

 

[Farjano-Walad]

Yeh why would I give you 1k and then ask for the same back. I wouldn't even have any incentive not financially, I would possibly loan it to you if you 'were family or friend or clan member' and ask you pay me back the same because your 'close' to me, but to a 'stranger', there is absolutely no business reason for that.

You forgot one area in history, it's always the 'trickiest' to find but u went thru all the giants of the World in civilization like all 'academics' do but there is always one mighty player u forget. The guy who has established our 'religions' for us be it Islam/Christianity, the impact this guy will have is much larger then 'ancient civilization'. I found the key to success in knowledge is going to 'Jews' because our societies are 'grounded' on their systems, you won't understand the 'west' without knowing 'jews' who I consider their 'masters'. No ancient civilization is responsible for the 'ribah' happening today, but we have clear evidence 'jews' 'inspired' it not only thru their 'torah' legalizing it but heaps of 'ancient' texts speak about it being 'banks' for locals in ancient world. The world literally copied their 'model'.



It's not just 'money' as you said, it's everything in judaism.



This is the verse they use to justify it



Lakin Jews are like me in a way I wouldn't do it to 'tolka' and they don't either. I would to shisheeye



'Ribbit' in Hebrew and 'Riba' is Identical, I agree there. Islam was clearly banning 'jewish' type money lending as they saw what they were doing in Islamic controlled territories and most likely residents complaining how 'life' is hard because of the 'jew' loaner kkkkk.

The jews are well known for Money lending and was one of the main reasons besides 'killing prophets' they were 'persecuted' as the locals got 'fed' up after a while, especially when they saw jews not applying the same rules to 'jews' this would've obviosly raised up 'lots of anger' among earlier societies.

they corrupted that verse of charging riba to non jews, and the Quran corrected it, in fact they did that after death of nabi sulayman AS, it was the first thing they changed,

jewish scholars became like somalis where they created various groups and would take money to give people fatwa for anything as long as they paid,

just the way fake shiite so called scholars will take money to say you can marry a girl for 3 hours and divorce her, a systematised prostitution ninyahow,

even the book given to nabi ciise AS banned riba and corrected the torah the jews corrupted

 

[DR OSMAN]

they corrupted that verse of charging riba to non jews, and the Quran corrected it, in fact they did that after death of nabi sulayman AS, it was the first thing they changed,

jewish scholars became like somalis where they created various groups and would take money to give people fatwa for anything as long as they paid,

just the way fake shiite so called scholars will take money to say you can marry a girl for 3 hours and divorce her, a systematised prostitution ninyahow,

even the book given to nabi ciise AS banned riba and corrected the torah the jews corrupted

Your letting him win hands down in the economics as your not playing inside the economic world order and structures, your creating 'vacuum' for yourself and his like 'got u where i want' you gonna now be dependent cause your currency is gonna be weak as it's not manipulated like the rest of the world for supply/demand/profit on physical assets, it's basically not growing or declining like other economies due to living in your own 'outside' this world reality due to 'quranic verse' that was most likely intended for when Muslims had POWER and could create 'structures' along the quranic line, those days are gone, and u still haven't evolved to the reality you don't create the structure, your within it nigga. I at least 'acknowledge' you and preparing strategies, your in denial mode. I say class 'riba' out of business category of laws 'Islam' and into 'war' category where anything is now open. Yes 'economics' is a war and there is many arguments in favor of that theory.

I want to wipe the 'smirk' of this guy face but our ppl are not willing to 'adapt' to the realities of the world and I can see his victory and grip of mankind won't end. His looking at @Teeri-Alpha saying wat u gonna 'waryaa boy teeri' u think the world is defined by 'wat u want' fuckin dreamer, there is structure, it's called economic world order and it's on jewish principles, yeah you heard that RIGHT NIGGA, ON JEWISH PRINCIPLES. While @Teeri-Alpha sits their SHOOK

 

[DR OSMAN]

Come @Teeri-Alpha to the House of Zion as they tell u wats up.

The economic world order is defined and it's all interest based, noone is changing it, cuz you don't have another economic model for anyone to 'switch' or 'transition' over too. The other option is the 'vacuum' Teeri and u know noone going there and u know what that means economic chaos kkkkk. Then he pats u on the head in a 'mocking' way and says 'son teeri, you are in my structure' work within it the structure, yes anti semetism is real teeri thats why I made it a law to arrest ppl who spread the truth about economic structure being INSPIRED BY MY TORAH. Teeri then scans the world economies and see it just like the HOUSE OF ZION TOLD HIM. He walks away and goes back to his TOLKA and says 'raggow' nidaamki yahud ayaan ku xiran nahay aduun ahan, meel aan ka baxsan karno ma jiro waa wadan kasto maxan samayna kkkkk

 

[Farjano-Walad]

@Teeri-Alpha You probably missed my argument because I didn't clarify my position. I am not saying it's a good thing, I am just saying it's how the world markets are and for us to defy it, I don't see a working model. While the world increases and decreases and profitizes from it's currency capital based on physical capital(assets), your sitting there arguing we should not do it and play along the same rules and 'begin modern banking.

Is it ideal no, would I like the world to go back to normal economics without interest, yes, will it happen unlikely. It's like the 'war' scenario, I know it's morally wrong to kill, but hey I need to do it if I want to survive right? so my morals of right and wrong really go out the question due to 'survival' interests. Riba and Interest based economies are reality if we are ever to 'grow' our economy following the international economic order, not create our own 'little vacuum' due to global trade being such 'huge' dimension now, we don't live in our own isolated kingdom anymore to do such thing.

@DR OSMAN

you misunderstand me, there is a solution , islamic banking, inf act islamic banking is more stable since we dont have riba and fractional reserve banking by nature is banned from us, thus our institution are more stable

islamic bank is worth several trillion dollars today we can increase it , we just need brain dead muslim leaders to open up markets, because they are slaves to the world bank, IMF, they cannot allow it to compete with western banking and financial systems,

financial markets are super vital, the blood line of the economy, we need it, to fund start up, provide loans to firms, but islam has already created mudarab, musharaka, ijar, lease sale options,

islam is very advanced, in fact most of the banking system today was copied by Italian traders from islamic world and imported to Europe but refined for last 800 years,

sadly muslims have been brain dead, example,w e did not write books on economics between 1520 and 1944, 424 yeasr bro,

we are so brain dead islamic banking is very new, it came bank in the 1970s, and many islamic leadership dont care about it, its like they do not know

we have some very innovative islamic financial methods, even the word check comes from islamic iran 900 years ago,

we have sakuk (bond islamic markets) that are so advanced we can fund industries, markets the blood line of the economy so obviously we need an efficient financial market system to reduced trade barrier,s lower costs and increase productivity and efficiency,


you have no idea how much war and propaganda goes towards making sure islamic banking/finance/economcis is under

in fact most islamic economic and finance books are written today by man named john, david, simon, waa gallo who get massive support from western institutions like IMF, world bank, and on top they have what i call useful idiots of islamic origin who ruin the field and kill it intellectually becaseu they get paid good money from the west

why cant muslim leaders pay them and make them write books from our side, rather than being useful idiots,

 

[Farjano-Walad]

Come @Teeri-Alpha to the House of Zion as they tell u wats up.

The economic world order is defined and it's all interest based, noone is changing it, cuz you don't have another economic model for anyone to 'switch' or 'transition' over too. The other option is the 'vacuum' Teeri and u know noone going there and u know what that means economic chaos kkkkk. Then he pats u on the head in a 'mocking' way and says 'son teeri, you are in my structure' work within it the structure, yes anti semetism is real teeri thats why I made it a law to arrest ppl who spread the truth about economic structure being INSPIRED BY MY TORAH. Teeri then scans the world economies and see it just like the HOUSE OF ZION TOLD HIM. He walks away and goes back to his TOLKA and says 'raggow' nidaamki yahud ayaan ku xiran nahay aduun ahan, meel aan ka baxsan karno ma jiro waa wadan kasto maxan samayna kkkkk

sadly you are right,

in early 1970s Henry Kissinger went to saudi arabia and told saudi sell oil in $ only to keep the US dollar as the wordl reserve currency -de facto and in return we will protect you,

so they did, in 1944 Briton woods agreement, they created the world bank, IMF, the Banking of international settlement was created early by the league of nations,

before colonialism was ended, they made sure of 2 things:

every central banker and finance/economy minister was trained in the west - US and UK and returned to run his nation before Independence, and all economist of these nations were trained by the west and then sent back home just before independence so the software will be passed on as they advised their governments and teach future professors,

only them two groups, look up any nation, in 1950s, 1960s, and even 1940s, they never got Independence with out those 2 groups in place,

we are ruled mentally, no nation can escape from it today, they have almost won, but we are told God will give the musilms a way out, so there is a solution,

 

[Farjano-Walad]

Your letting him win hands down in the economics as your not playing inside the economic world order and structures, your creating 'vacuum' for yourself and his like 'got u where i want' you gonna now be dependent cause your currency is gonna be weak as it's not manipulated like the rest of the world for supply/demand/profit on physical assets, it's basically not growing or declining like other economies due to living in your own 'outside' this world reality due to 'quranic verse' that was most likely intended for when Muslims had POWER and could create 'structures' along the quranic line, those days are gone, and u still haven't evolved to the reality you don't create the structure, your within it nigga. I at least 'acknowledge' you and preparing strategies, your in denial mode. I say class 'riba' out of business category of laws 'Islam' and into 'war' category where anything is now open. Yes 'economics' is a war and there is many arguments in favor of that theory.

I want to wipe the 'smirk' of this guy face but our ppl are not willing to 'adapt' to the realities of the world and I can see his victory and grip of mankind won't end. His looking at @Teeri-Alpha saying wat u gonna 'waryaa boy teeri' u think the world is defined by 'wat u want' fuckin dreamer, there is structure, it's called economic world order and it's on jewish principles, yeah you heard that RIGHT NIGGA, ON JEWISH PRINCIPLES. While @Teeri-Alpha sits their SHOOK

there are many solutions yuo are not aware off my friends

you have no idea how weak their structure is, you can bring it down, but do yuo have the nukes to defend yourself because they will sue the military option once they realised you are awake to their reality,


here is a fact, the US has a plan to invade any nation that threatens the dollar reserve status, an all out war, because it means their death nail if they dont,

only russia can get away with it, but putin is clueless with economics, and only china can stand up but truth is until china can liberalised her markets and allows free capital instead of controlling them they can never show the human race an alternative, so no point in attacking the US and western financial system since china doesn't open her markets due to the fact that they fear its a double edged sword, so china can only take them down if she is willing to go down, Pyrrhic victory

for now, they run the world and any economist who steps out of land, well did you know 90% of economist get their grants from the central bank or a university (which is controlled by these governments in England, US etc) so no economist dares to speak out unless he wants to be fired or blocked from publishing here his peers will label him a quack

its a very tightly controlled hidden system, i have had a taste of it,

 

[Farjano-Walad]

@Teeri-Alpha You probably missed my argument because I didn't clarify my position. I am not saying it's a good thing, I am just saying it's how the world markets are and for us to defy it, I don't see a working model. While the world increases and decreases and profitizes from it's currency capital based on physical capital(assets), your sitting there arguing we should not do it and play along the same rules and 'begin modern banking.

Is it ideal no, would I like the world to go back to normal economics without interest, yes, will it happen unlikely. It's like the 'war' scenario, I know it's morally wrong to kill, but hey I need to do it if I want to survive right? so my morals of right and wrong really go out the question due to 'survival' interests. Riba and Interest based economies are reality if we are ever to 'grow' our economy following the international economic order, not create our own 'little vacuum' due to global trade being such 'huge' dimension now, we don't live in our own isolated kingdom anymore to do such thing.

Plus I find this verse very wise in the quran which ironically the last verse revealed



The part that interest me the most in that verse is if your forced to hunger, you can break islamic laws even 'ribah'. I am arguing from the point we are now in world order structure, so I don't think allah will hold it against us, since we didn't create it, and if we don't abide by it, we end up like poor countries who end up eating 'ribah' as long as your using the dollar or any western currency which is the global trade currencies your in 'ribah' since it's printed and managed from ribah based nations. So your argument I won't do ribah but will use it, is an oxymoron. If u don't use the dollar or any western currency, you can't trade in the world. I say it's time for reason to prevail in Islam, you can't create your own 'economic order' when it's already fuckin defined, it's like saying i want to create my own nation when the nations are defined in the UN. You just go into a damn vacuum. This discussion needs to be had. Ribah has to be done WARYAA or we end up on NGO lists as our currency is not manipulated like the chinese do because now 'currency' is a fuckin war, it should be classed as 'war category' in global economics not a business category in ISLAM, it's re-defining so we are not under business rules of Islam but 'war rules. Ribah banks is my dream, I can see Somalia catching up in 30 years then

well hunger verse is very clear, only if you can not find food , lets not twist words dr, not riba, you are allow to eat unhalal food until you find halal food, but its very clear, only if you cannot find halal food, so lets not exaggerate please, and its not for riba,

doctor you are trying to create an intellectual case to allow riba, not while i am around, wallahi i will fight you intellectually, be prepared,

i have debated with men like you before, backdoor support for the riba system,

its not gonna work, our deen is protected by Allah the most powerful, the most Wise,

"Allah has permitted trade and has forbidden riba.”Qur’an 2:275"

The first and foremost reason riba is haram is because Allah declared it so. It is based on Allah’s infinite wisdom that He deems an action to be obligatory or prohibited, prescribing matters in man’s best interests, in this life and in the Hereafter, as He is the All-Wise, All-Knowing. The scholars of Islam have suggested the following reasons as to why riba is haram:

• Whole nations, dozens of them, large and small, have foreign debts so large that their riba payments on these debts are a crushing burden on the entire country. Debt kills. Some 11 million children die each year around the world due to conditions of poverty and debt. Former President Obasanjo, commented on the debt Nigeria faces:“All that we had borrowed up to 1985 or 1986 was around $5 billion and we have paid about $16 billion yet we are still being told that we owe about $28 billion. That $28 billion came about because of the injustice in the foreign creditors’ (lenders) interest rates. If you ask me what is the worst thing in the world, I will say it is compound interest.” - Jubilee 2000 news update, August 2000
• Riba conflicts with the spirit of brotherhood and sympathy, and is based on greed, selfishness and hard heartedness.
• Riba is one of the major contributors towards inflation.
• Riba causes trauma and depression due to mounting debts.
• Riba is a sure gain without any possibility of loss, hence all the risk is taken by the borrower, rather than sharing the risk and the profits with both parties.
• Riba creates a monopoly in society, where the rich are rewarded for being wealthy, while those who are not are forced to pay extra!

 

[DR OSMAN]

sadly you are right,

in early 1970s Henry Kissinger went to saudi arabia and told saudi sell oil in $ only to keep the US dollar as the wordl reserve currency -de facto and in return we will protect you,

so they did, in 1944 Briton woods agreement, they created the world bank, IMF, the Banking of international settlement was created early by the league of nations,

before colonialism was ended, they made sure of 2 things:

every central banker and finance/economy minister was trained in the west - US and UK and returned to run his nation before Independence, and all economist of these nations were trained by the west and then sent back home just before independence so the software will be passed on as they advised their governments and teach future professors,

only them two groups, look up any nation, in 1950s, 1960s, and even 1940s, they never got Independence with out those 2 groups in place,

we are ruled mentally, no nation can escape from it today, they have almost won, but we are told God will give the musilms a way out, so there is a solution,

Maybe you missed the point of 'house of zion'. Their identical to the ONLF in reality. They really hate other people or consider them a 'threat' at all times due to historical reasons.

The point of jewish economic order is, they need you following an economic structure they have 'experience' well over 2000 years, while as you stated the rest of the world didn't know this system untill the 18th century. The way to beat your enemy is to put him your 'structure' and once in, he knows the structure so well due to 'history' and 'tactics' developed that you don't. So he isn't scared. The jews are for that reason the greatest economists not because their good at it but because they 'defined' the world structure for the economic order and they ensured it wasn't an 'order' they were not familiar with or an order that may disadvantage them. Now all countries adopted it and apply it, he knows how to 'defeat' them when-ever he so pleases.

That's why Anti-Semitism was actually made a 'law' in some countries because a-lot of people know about the 'jewish' economic influence and their 'zionist mindset' combined is quite dangerous. Politically however their 'shit' since they 'lack' experience in 'governance' they never really had a 'state' for long and were always 'refugees'. We can beat them just not in economics. By what u suggested their economic nobels is quite high for a single group well of course it would be since it's their ancient system their working within.

I heard some 'spew' from 'Russia' they were creating a new 'economic' axis outside of this order, it did raise some eye-brows with China to Russia Belt combining or something, I am not sure where that it is, but it's highly unlikely. Once there is economic powerhouse and security power house, many smaller to medium nations can safely transition to this new 'axis' and begin effecting the 'trade' of the old 'jewish axis'. The liklihood of this is very slim though, especially among Muslims since the nations connected to Russia are usually 'asad' or 'iran' and 'shia' in general, so for religious reasons it's going to be hard for sunnis to leave the saudi/american bloc which is as u guessed it following the 'jewish' economic order. There are other nations who are also finding Russia/China axis risky that are not muslim

 

[Farjano-Walad]

Maybe you missed the point of 'house of zion'. Their identical to the ONLF in reality. They really hate other people or consider them a 'threat' at all times due to historical reasons.

The point of jewish economic order is, they need you following an economic structure they have 'experience' well over 2000 years, while as you stated the rest of the world didn't know this system untill the 18th century. The way to beat your enemy is to put him your 'structure' and once in, he knows the structure so well due to 'history' and 'tactics' developed that you don't. So he isn't scared. The jews are for that reason the greatest economists not because their good at it but because they 'defined' the world structure for the economic order and they ensured it wasn't an 'order' they were not familiar with or an order that may disadvantage them. Now all countries adopted it and apply it, he knows how to 'defeat' them when-ever he so pleases.

That's why Anti-Semitism was actually made a 'law' in some countries because a-lot of people know about the 'jewish' economic influence and their 'zionist mindset' combined is quite dangerous. Politically however their 'shit' since they 'lack' experience in 'governance' they never really had a 'state' for long and were always 'refugees'. We can beat them just not in economics. By what u suggested their economic nobels is quite high for a single group well of course it would be since it's their ancient system their working within.

I heard some 'spew' from 'Russia' they were creating a new 'economic' axis outside of this order, it did raise some eye-brows with China to Russia Belt combining or something, I am not sure where that it is, but it's highly unlikely. Once there is economic powerhouse and security power house, many smaller to medium nations can safely transition to this new 'axis' and begin effecting the 'trade' of the old 'jewish axis'. The liklihood of this is very slim though, especially among Muslims since the nations connected to Russia are usually 'asad' or 'iran' and 'shia' in general, so for religious reasons it's going to be hard for sunnis to leave the saudi/american bloc which is as u guessed it following the 'jewish' economic order. There are other nations who are also finding Russia/China axis risky that are not muslim

wallahi yuo are right, it feels like 90% of economist are them, they seem to win 100% of nobles for economics

look at the university professors,cerntainly some of mine, famous economist, IMF, world bank, UN economist, OECD and BIS, all of these groups are run by them

notice how in US regimes, every new president seems to appoint jewish person for the council of economic advisers, for the treasury department, and even the central bank of not just USA but many countries,
heck even the former south african central banker before this current new one was a jewish female,

private banks, all seem to have CEOs, specially investment banks,


son

father