Nomads Must Pay Taxes Also In Puntland

[DR OSMAN]

PL budget is missing a-lot of areas like a general sales taxes but what's missing the most n hurting us the most is Nomads. These ppl graze on public land, use govt funded water wells, dams, etc and they don't pay a damn cent in taxation. This is unsustainable.

They also are our largest population base. We need to get these guys involved in paying taxes, what models can we use? 1 camel per 100? Im studying how rural ppl pay taxes in other countries. But we must collect on this segment and im pretty certain we will be self sufficient and won't even need 'project support' from donors.

 

[DR OSMAN]

I don't think Nomads will feel ownership untill they pay their fair quarterly or yearly tax to the state. When they are contributors, I believe they will feel ownership and protect. We could collect $1-2 billion in my estimates of the nomadic population using just 1 camel per family.

 

[repo]

Are they not taxed for exported livestock?

 

[DR OSMAN]

Are they not taxed for exported livestock?

Yes they are but they use public grazing land, wells, dams. They living on the land free and not contributing a cent to the govt. Plus they can set aside $1000 a year for the govt in my opinion, even the poorest nomad family.

 

[Removed]

This has been a problem since the colonial era. Its probably why we stayed a primitive society.

 

[𐒁𐒚𐒒𐒂𐒘𐒂𐒗 𐒎𐒚𐒗𐒗𐒒]

We need nomadic governance, the government has to reach nomadic settlements fully, in all ways. Grazing areas that are cordoned off and then rotated to stop overgrazing, police monitoring water sources etc, etc. If these services aren't offered, who will entice them to pay taxes or can even enforce it?

 

[Dima&Damo]

How did the boqortoya of old deal with this issue

 

[Padrino]

Nomads are stingy. One of the reasons they don't like Alshabaab and always fight them in the countryside.

 

[Ragaasi]

I agree with @DR OSMAN on this tbh, if my memory serves me correct 60%~ of the general Puntland population are rural/nomadic. If we can find away to properly tax these folks it'll be beneficial for the state and would be xaq since urban folks pay taxes why shouldn't the nomads? It will boost the state GDP and standard of living.

 

[DubatDiaries]

We need nomadic governance, the government has to reach nomadic settlements fully, in all ways. Grazing areas that are cordoned off and then rotated to stop overgrazing, police monitoring water sources etc, etc. If these services aren't offered, who will entice them to pay taxes or can even enforce it?

especially the grazing. The land needs to be sectioned for grazing/agriculture. I don't think they will allow the government restricting their movement but its better for the environment.

 

[GemState]

We need nomadic governance, the government has to reach nomadic settlements fully, in all ways. Grazing areas that are cordoned off and then rotated to stop overgrazing, police monitoring water sources etc, etc. If these services aren't offered, who will entice them to pay taxes or can even enforce it?

You cannot build a state on a foundation of pastoralism today. It used to be possible, but only if agricultural socities were constantly raided like the Khanates of Central Asia or the Jihad States in West Africa.

Mass urbanization is the only way out.

 

[Burqad]

How did the boqortoya of old deal with this issue

I think they used to take a portion of sheep and camels.

PL budget is missing a-lot of areas like a general sales taxes but what's missing the most n hurting us the most is Nomads. These ppl graze on public land, use govt funded water wells, dams, etc and they don't pay a damn cent in taxation. This is unsustainable.

They also are our largest population base. We need to get these guys involved in paying taxes, what models can we use? 1 camel per 100? Im studying how rural ppl pay taxes in other countries. But we must collect on this segment and im pretty certain we will be self sufficient and won't even need 'project support' from donors.

In Eritrea the Italians I think used to take one camel for every 100, that is too much 1 per 500 is enough, and of every sheep 1 per 300, then sell that to manufacturers of leather/meat etc.

 

[Abaq]

The problem isn’t lack of taxation, it is that they aren’t real participants in the economy. The land needs to be divided into ranches and the nomads settled and taught modern regenerative grazing management. They then need to start rearing livestock for selling and not just for the sake of increasing their herd size only for the drought to kill them all.

Once each nomad on his private ranch starts running his herd like a business, generating yearly profits and surpluses (which the government can take a modest tax from), they can invest their excess capital in the greater economy, boosting the economy overall.

 

[Keep it a boqol]

I think they used to take a portion of sheep and camels.



In Eritrea the Italians I think used to take one camel for every 100, that is too much 1 per 500 is enough, and of every sheep 1 per 300, then sell that to manufacturers of leather/meat etc.

Shouldn’t we tax them enough so it would deincentize nomads to try to slowly become more city people? We need tax revenue and the state needs to build with more economical participation. The nomads are fucking up the land

 

[El Nino]

You cannot build a state on a foundation of pastoralism today. It used to be possible, but only if agricultural socities were constantly raided like the Khanates of Central Asia or the Jihad States in West Africa.

Mass urbanization is the only way out.

Our TFR

 

[Superiorabdi]

Pointless to tax nomads. Puntland needs industries that will bring up their gdp. Start exporting goods other than livestock and frankincense to Ethiopia and the Arab world for change.

As industries grow so will cities and the land for nomads will shrink.

 

[hinters]

Come and get it

 

[Juke]

We need to get these guys involved in paying taxes, what models can we use? 1 camel per 100? Im studying how rural ppl pay taxes in other countries. But we must collect on this segment and im pretty certain we will be self sufficient and won't even need 'project support' from donors.

We should explore the possibility of investing in more 'value-added' products such as processed meats rather than exported livestock to Arabia. Maybe each tol can set up their own food processing plant, tax those. Likewise with fisheries. Sell these more expensive foods to EAC once we're admitted.

 

[Mr. Wabrii]

Yes they are but they use public grazing land, wells, dams. They living on the land free and not contributing a cent to the govt. Plus they can set aside $1000 a year for the govt in my opinion, even the poorest nomad family.

Thats half the cost the 1 camel, some camels cost more than 2,000. But some families would not be able to make that kind of money on their budgets.

The State should tax the Wealthier Livestock owners, and the rich business men, the poor nomads are already having a tough time with the droughts.

 

[DR OSMAN]

You cannot build a state on a foundation of pastoralism today. It used to be possible, but only if agricultural socities were constantly raided like the Khanates of Central Asia or the Jihad States in West Africa.

Mass urbanization is the only way out.

Mass urbanization will put pressure on limited urban resources, it will push inflation upwards, it will result in 'IDP camps' or 'sowetos' in the end, crime rates will soar.

Urbanization cannot occur without ensuring jobs are present. When jobs r present, realistic jobs that pay well, im sure nomads will urbanize on their own. But I doubt they will sell their livestock n convert it to a home and join the unemployed urbanites.

The Budget will take a huge hit also if their no nomad selling livestock to the gulf. Those current urbanites are a burden and not producing anything or delivering a service in return for money.